I agree - you aren't in revcovery - it's like I no longer claim H & I are in recovery - he is trying in his own way - but trying for him, not for the marriage - this is his personal recovery ,not our marrital recovery.

Recovery is when both of you are putting 100% into it, and working through the hard times TOGETHER.

LM is right.

-dorry

Very well said. This is the essence of many of the problems many face in getting to "recovery". I think trying to save a marriage after infidelity when two people are working together is very hard, it is IMPOSSIBLE to do with only one putting in the effort. The Plan A\B and all that stuff is a "plan" to use when there is only one person is willing to try and save the marriage. It is not a recovery plan. At this point, being "sweet as pie" only enables the dysfunctional cycle to continue.

Caren, I have always got the impression that you would rather be married to your WH in any way, shape, or form rather than be divorced. So if that is a goal of yours, them I am probably wrong, and continuing to be "sweet as pie" may be what works for you to acheive WHAT YOU WANT.

Just my thoughts.

LM

Well that's disheartening to say the least. I don't know what I am supposed to be doing then.

I wouldn't say that I'd rather be with my husband any way he is rather than divorce him, I keep hoping that things will improve, and they were actually a lot better until recently.....so I don't even know whether this is a *false recovery* since I'm the only one doing anything.....maybe it's a deluded recovery.

I can't exactly do much about any of it with no job.....I need to work on the job thing, and keep doing what I'm doing as far as FWH is concerned, I guess I should be in Plan A again....right?

Heck, I dunno.

I do, however, know that my Pastor showed up at my door tonight.....he's uncanny, really. I probably have the most amazed look on my face when he shows up...LOL.

I so want this to work out, I am doing everything I thought I was supposed to be doing.....but I don't know, should I be in Plan A again? I guess I'll probably have to, just to survive around here. I'm sick to death of just surviving...and the days preceding this stupid crap were actually so very close to being normal again.....maybe it's just a bump in the road.....maybe I should stop analyzing it.....I think all I can do is do what I'm doing and pray, I don't know what's left.

-Caren

I agree with Lemonman! History has been made.... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Seriously, I've been concerned about your H, too, Caren?

Do you remember me asking about you being sure about NC?

I sometimes am hesitant to speak about this..

However, unlike my FWH, he doesn't sound repentant. He doesn't sound like HE is trying to change. It seems like you are doing all of the work and he expects you to do that.

I don't think PLAN A is the next step. I think initially you two need to have a serious conversation. Your focus needs to be, like the others have said, on WHAT IS THE PLAN for the two of you to RECOVER your marriage?

Are you saying that you can't talk this over with him? You can't go to him and address your legitimate concerns about how he is treating you?

I agree with what the others have also said about PLAN A or whatever. It does not involve being a doormat, allowing your spouse to mistreat you or to emotionally abuse you...

Caren - I agree with LM too - (heh heh ... David 'agrees' again)... I'm gonna suggest this book AGAIN: it has really helped me, and I am going to plug it for as long as I can: "Boundaries in Marriage".

Caren, you are getting trampled, and all that will do is build resentment, and that will result in a further dissolution of your relationship with your husband. You must set boundaries - places beyond which it is not OK with you for your husband to go. If he loves you at all, if he respects you at all, he will not go past those boundaries - he will help you feel safe around him, which will in turn build up your relationship.

He has boundaries - you can be sure of that. You are even aware of some that you have trampled yourself. We all do that. Part of 'recovery' is building a trusting relationship - one where both partners feel safe to confide in the other without fear of recrimination and further hurt. In recognizing what limits each of you has to what you can take from another person, you set up a garden 'fenced in' - safe from the rest of the world, where you can build your partnership. But unless you each underestand those limits - that is, where the fence is - you will always be hurting each other, and getting hurt in return. And that is, simply put, disaster.

In my prayers as always - - -

David

Caren:

I feel for your dissapointment here. I really do. I think I snese your depair when you say " I so want this to work out, I am doing everything I thought I was supposed to be doing.....but I don't know". It is tough, we know. I think you need to be "honest" and sack up and confront (in a non threatnign way) your WH with the real issues you have.

You are so afraid to "rock the boat" because you fear he will leave again. That is the essence here isn't it. This may happen anyway. You are building a "house of cards" here. Why don't you do things right.

What about MC? What about IC? What about rules of recovery including mutual respect, and just plain common decency? You short changed yourself and your marriage for all of this in return for getting your WH home. Untll you do things differently, you will continue getting the same results. Your WH may not be cheating again, but he might as well be....because it appears that things are "pretty much the same". I am sorry for your pain. Hopefully someone here can help you.

LM

Caren,

While I agree with what everyone is saying, I can't stop myself (just can't!) from saying a couple things that might seem contradictory to those very same things that I agree with.

You definitely deserve better than what you're getting now, and you ARE carrying all the weight... and you know what normal is, and you know you have a struggle in front of you to get back to whatever normal means.

If "normal" could be sustained forever -- are you happy with that?

What makes me HUGELY sad, is when someone (you perhaps, me perhaps, countless others) is put in a position where they feel they should, or are told, or surmise they have to... to question their love for someone. SHOULD I love them? Is there something wrong with me because I DO love them? Is there some line in the sand that I'm SUPPOSED to see as bright as day... and beyond that line... loving my WS is wrong, or unhealthy, or foolish, or pathetic, or... ?

As long as you are honest with yourself.... and being honest with yourself can be one of the very hardest things to do...

You deserve happiness, and fulfillment, and to feel loved and cherished and appreciated for who you are!

And it's OK to love when others WOULD not. It's OK to love when others say you SHOULD not.
As long as you respect yourself first... and as long as you are honest with yourself....

YOU decide where that line in the sand is drawn, and feel GOOD about it!

ps. in spite of the fact that you refuse to go to Idaho with me...
I pray that your H figures out what's truly important in life... and he sees that a big huge part of it is right under his nose.

Caren,

This question may have been asked and answered already, but what is your husband (who is very fortunate that you are willing to work on Recovery with him) willing to do to work towards Recovery?

Is he willing to read or study with you? Is he willing to post here? Is he grateful that you are still there, trying so hard?

I wish I had some advice for you on the job situation, but I don't. I could use some help at my salon...but the commute would probably be pretty expensive. Also, the pay is crap and the boss is a walking zombie. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

You're in my prayers,

Froz

I really appreciate everyone's prayers and concern.

I had computer problems AGAIN right after I typed my post....how cool is that?

I don't feel like re-typing it all, hell, I can't even remember it all, so let's see if I can give you an abridged version.

I have never brought the MB subject up, or really discussed any sort of recovery *plan* with him, I was under the impression I was supposed to let him go through withdrawl first, I musta read it wrong.

Today he is being okay again, back to *normal*....someone asked me if "normal" all the time would be okay.....heck yeah it would be, normal would be fantastic!!! Our normal is very good.....normal would be getting my needs met too....oh if I could get to the place where it was normal all the time.....*sigh*.

So, in short, I guess I will re-read the sections on recovery, possibly print some stuff off and have a discussion on what our *plan* is.

MC is sorta off the table, since my insurance will soon be null and void......when I get another job I'll drop that bomb.

I used to work at a restaurant, before the hospital, and I left there on good terms, so I'll probably go back there until I find a real job with benefits. I always worked lunch....the money isn't as good, but the hours were far better.

Well, I'm off......I planted some flowers today, and now I'm going to do some other miscellaneous housework, and I think I'll clean the windows...this house has those nice once that you can tip in to clean. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

-Caren

No plan means going nowhere. As Just Learning told me when my wife came home...seek professional help. Both of you. This is not done by amateurs. As hard as the fight to save your marriage was, recovery is twice as hard. Take it from someone that knows!! Get help, see MC. Read. Your husband MUST join in. If he slumps into the chair and does nothing, you go nowhere. Bring him here...we'll help him.

But remember, your "Normal" led to this mess. Has to be a new normal, right?

Why not knuckle down and get that RN while you work. My wife is making an insane amount of money now that she is an RN. We suffered while she went...but we are much better off because of it. I know your finances are a mess, and he doesnt make a lot. So, sit down with your "leader" and come up with a plan. Show him what it will take, and what the benefits will be at the end of the two years (or less if you already have some of the schooling). Then, ask him to help you come up with a plan. Maybe that is he has to work second job, and you have to work too. But, the short term pain of extra hours will be worth financial security two years from now, right? Stop thinking about the next paycheck...start thinking about the rest of your lives!!

In His arms.