I found out 2 weeks ago that my wife of 7 years is having an affair. My story, albeit most likely similar to most here, is embarrassing, degrading, and shameful to me. My WS found the MB site, and after I came out of my alcoholic fog found by trying to numb a pain so intense, it was like a blast furnace to my soul, I embraced the effort of trying to find out what I did to contribute to the environment that allowed the affair. But first, the embarrassing details of my blind trust, and sub-conscious suppression of what I knew had to be true…

Her OM was a work colleague. She began mentioning him every now and then, and I noticed text messages were frequent. Being as they exceeded her text quota of 20 messages a month, I got her a plan that would allow 200. She used them up in three weeks. I then jokingly referred to him as her “boyfriend” in all subsequent conversations. She assured me he was a friend and they had a lot if interests (insert any “you idiot” comments here). I won’t belabor further details, but suffice it to say they were all as transparent to anyone with a brain as this one was. The problem was, I so completely, totally, trusted her that my sub-conscious overcame rational thought and I didn’t try to discover anything more. Denial is a tremendous force. I finally caught her in a lie that even my own sub-conscious couldn’t suppress and the A was revealed.

The sexual trysts apparently occurred in his office, which made me lose further respect for her for risking her lucrative career along with the family she helped create. See below for more.

In the weeks that followed, we’ve seen a counselor, read affair books together, bought Dr. Harley’s course, and most of all agreed and accepted his policy of Radical Honesty..or so I thought.

Through an unsolicited admission by her of one of their sexual trysts, I uncovered the fact that apparently the policy of Radical Honesty only applies when convenient. The reality of the answers are by her admission.

Question #1 by me: “Did you at least use Condoms”? My reason—Health. Her answer—Always. Reality—Nope.

Question #2 by me: “Was it always in his office”? My reasoning, perhaps flawed—I wanted to gage the level of personalization. Was it just sex? Her answer—his house only once. Reality—She can’t remember how many times she left work or our bed in the morning to go to his house.

Question #3 by me: “When did it end”? My reasoning—Self-preservation. Her answer- Around Christmas ’07. Reality-the last sexual encounter was the day before she told me of the A two weeks ago.

Her story can be found here. MrsZonie story

I don’t want to hijack her post, and I don’t even know if she’ll find mine, but I need to vent and get some input from people who I know have been right where I am now. I left the house and am a hundred miles away for work, by choice. I don’t know if I have the strength or character to go home or go through this anymore. I gave a lot in trying to understand my part in the A and accepted my responsibility, only to have her yet again continue the lies because it was convenient for her to do so. I feel abused, disrespected, and unappreciated all over again. Will it never end?

Mr. Z,

Welcome to MB, glad you found this place but I am sorry you are here.

You have been lied to and then lied to some more. That is pretty hard to take. Further, the person you did trust more than anyone is the one that did this to you. That just plain is low.

You are right you are not unique. Your situation is pretty normal, even her lies after discovery day, d-day, are pretty normal.

I presume you came here for help. What you will get is advice, some guidance, and hopefully help in developing a plan for your future and that of your marriage.

First, let's get one thing straight because I don't really plan to repeat it. You are NOT AN IDIOT for trusting your W. You are NOT AN IDIOT for loving your W. You are NOT AN IDIOT for not picking up on what are now clear signals. So just set this aside, if you don't it will mess up the really hard things you need to do.

I hope you have indeed read all of the articles on this site, if not do so. I would highly recommend Harley's book entitled Surviving an Affair.

What you will find here are the tools to make a plan. You will find that surprisingly all of this is amazingly common, including all of the things a WS will and does say. It is truly one of the most amazing things I have learned on this site in the over 9 years I have been here. It is all so darned COMMON.

So given that here is a rough outline of what you will need to do.

1. Decide if love your W or not.

2. Decide if you want to end this marriage or try and rebuild it.

3. If the answer is to rebuild it, then YOU have to figure out what you contributed to the good things in the marriage and the bad. I know, I know, she cheated and lied and it sounds as if YOU are going to have to do the heavy lifting. At the start, the BS does do a lot of heavy lifting, your W's turn will come and believe me if she wants to rebuild this marriage she will punish herself far worse than you can or will.

4. Once you have figured out the negative things you have contributed, love busters, failure to meet needs, etc, you need to stop the love busters and have a long talk about how to meet her needs. I know, I know this is so counter intuitive that the hurt party seems to be kissing the WS's A$$, but trust me in the long run you will be happy you do this work now.

5. Forget revenge, forget making her hurt for what she has done to you, forget expectations that she will be your slave in order to make up for what she has done. She cannot make up for what she has done. No way, no how. The only thing she can do is be a better W in the future. This is part of your decision in step 2. Do you want to be married to her, do you love her enough to give her another chance?

There is much more, but please think about these things. I am not saying you should trust her. I like Reagan's old statement "trust but verify". Harley, even claims that one should never trust their spouse blindly. Oddly it looks like inattentiveness and people do fail. We all do to some degree or another.

Also while you are reading the articles on this site, have a look at Harley's two main policies: The policy of joint agreement, POJA, and the policy of radical honesty. Further, read Harley's four rules for a good marriage.

You have just found out this terrible thing. You have been lied to multiple times but you are only 2 weeks out on this. You are looking at roughly a 2 year time scale for your marriage to truly recover. It will get much better sooner than that, but there are many triggers you will have to deal with and overcome.

In your considerations of all of this, remember there is simply NO EASY WAY OUT OF THIS. You can leave and divorce and you will be hurt. You can stay and fight, and you will be hurt. However, if your W possess qualities that you love, like and respect, it is often best to stay and see if the marriage can be saved.

I have given you much to think about, please do so, and ask lots of questions.

God Bless,

JL

Zonie,

Welcome to MarriageBuilders...I'm so sorry for the betrayal that brought you here.

You will find you are not alone. Not even close. What you are feeling, thinking, believing...experiencing right now...many have gone through.

Go through it with us.

Have you read "Surviving an Affair" by Dr. Harley? I know you said you've read affair books together...I didn't know which ones. Please understand the timeline involved in recovery. Learn what a wayward state of mind really is--does not excuse...it explains.

I couldn't tell from your post if you've decided to stay in the marriage or not. Making that decision...even if it is to work on the marriage for two years...is where I advise you start.

When you set your own goal, about you, for your desire...if it is to heal, to recover, to rebuild a thriving marriage...then you can take the next steps. Each one helps in your healing process...slowly and surely.

Have you gone for STD testing yet? Doesn't sound like a step to healing when I ask it like that...it really is...both you and MrsZonie need to go and get tested. It's part of the reality packet...I think it's important for her withdrawal and your ascertaining truth on your own. Helps peace of mind, as well.

The wayward state of mind IS about lies...first, lies to self, then lies to partner and lies to everyone. The web is difficult to dismantle...which is why radical honesty doesn't start from DDay...a WS practices self-deceipt minute by minute...begins before the A begins...and escalates from there. Each truth told helps to break down that web...takes time and commitment.

Hurts like crazy, too...and the lies that continue hurt intensely, as well. You guys can heal from the pain...I promise. What you cannot do is heal without owning your half...not of the affair, but of the recovery. You had no part in the affair. Her affair wasn't about you...which hurts to the bone...until you understand it began and ended with her.

And she chose you. She also chose herself again. Scary to know we have no control over our partner's choices...terrifying. Blind trust is an fantasy...a false safe harbor. So when she speaks, listen and repeat back what she says...she's saying. Doesn't mean it's true or not true...means your half is to choose to believe that one thing or not...and right now...hearing her stuff, not banking it, not betting on it or discounting it would be something new for you. That's my perception. It was my experience.

Please keep posting...venting...considering...understanding...identifying what it will take for you to heal...have you read "Joseph's Letter" yet? I don't know if the search feature is working well enough yet...it explains to the WS why the BS needs to know the answers to questions...and you choose how many details you want...what level...because those will be in your mind, your heart...and you will trigger from them.

There's no way around infidelity when it occurs...only through it. You don't have to go it alone. You have a remorse-filled WS right now...that's a lot more than many here after two-weeks into it...it gets better. It gets worse. Your choice is to go through it together...even when you are choosing to do so for The Marriage...not for you or your WW...just as you have honored your marriage even when you didn't feel like it before. And when you did.

There are no words to heal you right now...you may yearn for an instant cure, a do-over...a never-done. Understandable. Separating yourself physically as you have done may feel protecting to you...as if your pain would be worse being at home. Understandable. Find out what is real, though...as BS, you are the bearer of reality...you bring it...because she's lived in fantasy for a long time...don't expect someone else to know it if they haven't been there in so long, 'k?

You get the hero's role...even though you didn't want it...I promise if you choose to recover, you can learn so much more than you imagined, feel deep love for WW again...and have a stronger marriage. Takes your commitment to healing and ownership...and knowing and bringing reality.

LA

Oh, and Zonie? Always listen to JustLearning. That's a requirement.

Seriously.

The man saved my marriage. He rocks.

And we simultaneously posted.

I think you caught that.

LA

Has your wife made it possible for you to verify NC.
Wife must find a new job she can not work for or with the OM.

Having more time I will state some more:

WW's hold back the truth for it hurts them to tell what they did because they now have to admit what they did was have an affair.

After seeing your pain from finding out that they had an affair they now have to pile it on some more by giving you the details and watch you get crushed to new lows.

Better late than never they want to protect their BH and not hurt them any more. So they try to hold back the truth. WW's don't realize how important knowing the truth is for us to heal.

Next many affairs are not exit affairs. The WW does not want the marriage to end. Fear of losing their BH fills them with such a dread that they hold back the truth. Afraid that the truth will lose them their BH and children.

Experience shows that your emotions will be on a roller coaster. You will not know whether your coming or going for six months.

That is why you should not make any major decisions six months.
I think it is also best that you go home soon as you calm down enough. Your wife and you need each other at this time.

Thanks to everyone for the support. It's invaluable at this point in my life, and made more dissapointing that people like me come here every night for the same support.

LovingAnyway- You asked the question whether I've made the decision to stay in the marriage. A week ago the answer was "yes". Now, I'm too hurt to know that it's the right thing to do. I haven't read "surviving the affair" by Dr. Harley, but I've tried soooo hard to read and become educated on what I've done wrong, I can't take anymore, especially when it's treated with the disrespect shown to my efforts as of late.

JL- Your screen name threw me off- With 12,000+ posts, you have to see my situation as "old-hat". I'm shocked at the number of BS here that might be going through the same situations. However, the "newness" of the wound to the unexposed Betrayed Spouses is a knife to the heart of the our being.

I love my wife. I loved what we were. I don't know if I have the emotional fortitude to support a marriage based on the continued lies and deceptions as recent as 2 weeks ago.

I'm 100 miles away from home, and oddly feel an emotional solitude in my loneliness much the same as I felt the day she told me of the A and it's subsequent lies.

I can't confide in my friends, because I'm embarrased of what what she's done to her character, so oddly enough, the comfort of strangers is more satisfying. Thanks all.

Mr. Z,

Yup, I have seen your situation many many times on this site. Yet, each time the feelings are the same. Each situation is a little different, but fortunately for you the patterns are very often the same, and I say fortunately because it means IF you decide you want this marriage to last, it can. But, more importantly it can be better in many ways that it was.

I have learned many things while on this site and I have learned how truly strong and heroic the posters here can be. What may surprise you is that often the most heroic are the wayward spouses, WS's. You don't see how this could be now, but in time you will see and learn from them things you can only imagine now.

Let me tell you about one poster who still comes around here from time to time. Unfortunately with the new upgrade last week the search feature is not yet working so I cannot point you back to his posts. But I will give you a thumbnail sketch of his situation and what I learned from him

His name here is K. His W had an affair. He counseled with Steve Harley, Dr. Harley's son, before these boards even started back in 1999 or 1998. He and his W had two children and he wanted to keep the family together if he could because he loved his W. He feared she might become pregnant and in fact she did. He viewed this news with deep pain as you might expect but also came to see it as an opportunity. Yup, that is right and OPPORTUNITY to save his marriage and his family.

He accept this child who is now 10 or so. He saved his marriage and he has nursed his W through a variety of medical problems including a stroke.

When I first read his story I was shocked. When I found out he viewed this as an opportunity, I could not wrap my mind around it. But, as time went on I learned something. OPPORTUNITY is where you find it and where you make it.

You are very raw right now. As a previous poster just said, don't make any decisions right now. But, my friend start to consider that this failure on your W's part and it is a FAILURE not a mistake is an opportunity for both of you to learn and grow. It is an opportunity for your marriage to reach a level of intimacy that it has never known. Why? Well, what is there to hide from one another now? What emotion do you need to hide from her? What emotion does she need to hide from you?

You need comfort from what has happened and she needs your comfort and guidance to become someone she was not. You see she can never make up what she did and you really are her main path to becoming what she clearly was not before a strong and loving woman.

I know all of this sounds pretty "mushy", "touchy feely", etc.

You are hurt, and the sad fact is that your W cannot heal you, only you can do that. It will take time and patience no matter what.

Mr Z. you said

I don't know you but I do know this. You DO HAVE the strength and the emotional fortitude to do whatever you want including supporting this marriage. I won't be based on lies or deception by the time you two are through, I can promise you that.

As for trusting her...don't. As for believing what she says...don't. As for loving her...if it is in your heart do.

Harley claims that blind trust has no place in a marriage and President Reagan once stated, "trust by verify". You should do both. You should also watch the actions of your W and see if they match her words. For awhile they may not as she shakes the addiction of the affair, and in many ways it is like a drug addiction with even withdrawal like symptoms.

Mr. Z, the call is yours. As you dwell on things, consider if you would like to be married to your W as she was before this, if so why? If not why not? If you decide to give your marriage a try and I hope that eventually you will, you will need a plan, this site has the information you need for a plan.

Let me explain about plans for recovering a marriage, they are NOT like my diet plan. I "plan to lose 20 lbs", unfortunately I have had that plan for years. The reality is that I don't have a plan, just a wish. A plan calls for action items, points of evaluation, feedback, goals, and milestones on the way to goals.

You are far too new to this right now so give yourself time. If you W wants to work on this marriage and she establishes no contact with OM, I think you should strongly consider rebuilding this marriage. I will say rebuilding a marriage is NOT FOR WIMPS. It is tough stuff.

So cut yourself a break, give yourself some time, and realize that there is a way to address this that can not only recover your marriage but make it stronger.

God Bless,

JL

Thanks to everyone for the continued support. I have little doubt my WS is reading this post, but I have been so emotionally devastated by her continued deception that I have nothing to hide in my tortured response.

I am hundreds of miles away from my WS, and have enjoyed the solitude of my pain and not having to confront my own responsibilities of creating the environment that allowed her to stray and continue the lies. I read Rummikub’s posts Rummikub's story and I feel humbled that there are men like that in this world, and I can only hope to aspire to. I have a wws that WANTS to recover. I’ve lost hope, trust, and I feel that men like Rummi deserve to know that the results of his words, his actions, his persistence have made a difference in my life. It may not have worked out for you Rummi, but you might have given me the inner strength to pursue what you were denied. I thank you for that, and for being the man that you are. God Bless, my friend.

K (my wws), if you are in fact reading this, you must know that the pain you chose to give me is an affliction to my soul that I didn’t even know could be caused. I own the responsibility for not making you know that you had this effect on me. You own the responsibility for not caring enough to find out. I don’t know the way forward, and I don’t know if my pride will let me find it. I owe men like Rummikub the opportunity to let you convince me you I should try.

I love you and one day I’ll come home. You have to let me know I’m welcome.

I can relate so completely to your words especially when you mentioned pride. I want to share a story with you that a friend told me when I was on the edge of divorce and it was the beginning of many changes for me, one of which was letting go of my pride.

My friend, who is a 36 year old married woman with 2 children, said to me that she thought her parents would never have divorced if they had been able to get past their pride. She pleaded with me to not let my pride get in the way of my marriage and the family I had created. These words came when everyone else was telling me I could do so much better and that my H was scum for what he was doing. But the act of really looking at how my pride was stopping me from doing what I wanted to in my heart was really eye opening. I knew I would always regret it if I did not fight for my family. It has been one year and it has been a struggle, but I can honestly say I am so grateful for my friend who had the strength to tell me what I needed to hear. Of course at the time I acted like she was crazy for what she was saying, I have since thanked her for being such a great friend.

Just don't make any big decisions right now, take it one day at a time, and try to look at what your life would be like with and without your family. This is what I did and I did not like the picture of my life and my daughters life without my husband here with us everyday.

Ah Mr. Z.

It is not only pride, there are many other battles raging in you right now. You are perfectly normal. I will offer you my thoughts on this. You will battle more internally with yourself and your expectations of yourself, than you will with what Mrs. Z actually did. I know that sounds odd, but you will come to see this. I would ask you to consider if those expectations are realistic. There was a discussion about this, actually there have been many many over the years. One recent one was in the Recovery section with MyRevelation. You might want to read that.

The other thing that will make recovering your marriage a challenge in the long run is actually a surprising one. If your w has really seen the error of her ways, if she truly loves you, then a major problem in recovery is often the guilt of the WS. Yup, sounds odd doesn't? But it is true. You are a long way from seeing this now or worrying about it, but it will come.

Mr. Z doesn't alot of what i have said and other have said, plus what you have read on this site, seem counter intuitive? It is and yet it works. It also explains why many counselors and our own KNOWLEDGE of how we would handle the situation or would expect to handle the situation are failures.

You are deeply hurt. You obviously can express yourself well. You have also been reading and learning. There is every reason to hope that if your W is serious about rebuilding this marriage, that it can be rebuilt. Will it be perfect? Probably not.

But, years of a good marriage often outweigh a few months of seriously flawed decision making such as your W has exhibited.

Just thoughts. Keep reading, keep learning, and you will keep growing. I think you will regret not giving recovery a chance even if you do give it a chance and it does not work out.

God Bless,

JL

Mr. Z,

Hang in there. I just had to take the time to resond to your story as it is nearly the exact story that I wrote for myself just 2 months ago. Blind trust, co-worker that she sometimes mentionned, the first D-Day being a total scam, the weeks of lying afterwards...it's all the same.

My first thought was to run just like you did. I even had a spot picked out a few hundred miles away - a place where I could just be by myself and just think. I didn't have the guts nor the time to do that, though. I stayed home during the whole time and absolutely dreaded coming home every night to find out what other lies needed to be shared.

I am 2 months in and it does get better. It doesn't get easier, but the pain starts to numb. I still think about the A hourly, but it doesn't hurt nearly as much as it did in those first 4 weeks. My FWW told all the exact same lies to the exact same questions that you asked. It's eerie how similar her answers and her truths are to Mrs. Z. But, like your W seems to be, my FWW wanted to stay. She wants me home with my two young boys and she wants to make our M the best it can be.

If you want to stay, go back home and face reality. It sucks for a while. But, if you love your W, it will get better and you will love her deeper than you ever had before. Every once in a while, I'll get a glimpse of that in myself and I just have to believe that it is now real. If we have nothing else left to hide from, I can actually love the real wife...not the fake wife. It turns out that it has been a long time (if ever) that I've loved my real wife. Now that she doesn't have to pretend anymore, she has opened herself up to trying to be truly happy.

I don't have the veteran advice to give you right now, but I just wanted you to know that I am one of the many men you were talking about that couldn't ever imagine being on a site like this. I only beat you here by a month, but it has helped me out a lot. The vets here know what they are talking about.

God bless.

What a great post, Balin.

Thank you for being here on MB.

LA

Thanks all, Balin, JL, LA and others. My WS is using terms of addiction to her lover, to alcohol, to her needs for affection in order to justify her actions. I guess that anything that prevents the acceptance of responsibility is a safe haven at this point. I accept mine, but that’s a cold comfort when it’s framed in the denial of betrayal by my WS.

I read the posts of strangers and assume my situation is salvageable because of past successes with MB. However, I can’t get over the fact that my best friend gave me an unsolicited and indescribable pain that words cannot express. I didn’t see it coming, I don’t deserve it, and I don’t know if I’m “man” enough to overcome it.

One day I’ll get over the “pity-party” and realize that the definition of a man is to overcome insurmountable obstacles, and to recognize that self-respect is the true measure of a man, and that other people (wws) do not define that character. Until then, I’ll continue to grow until I can meet the EN of whatever life-partner chooses to be with me. I just wish I knew these lessons earlier. You guys rock, and I’ll continue to come here for support!

Mr. Z,

You said
The difference between justification and reasons are very slim and take months to sort out. I don't think she is using addiction as a justification. IT is a term used on this site by Dr. Harley himself to explain the pull of the affair and the difficulties a WS has in ending the affair. Just as in AA one is never to drink again, Harley strongly suggests that the WS have complete NC with the other person. By the way Harley has done a lot of drug and alcohol addiction counseling so I tend to think he knows what he is talking about. In fact it is known that an affair triggers endorphins in the brain similar to what happens with drugs, alcohol, and yes exercise. It does take time for those to get out of the system and for the brain to retrain.

I have read your W's posts and I think the fog is clearing. I think she is starting to really see what she has done. I don't think she is denying that she is at fault or that the affair was her fault at least not now.

Zonie, only a close friend or best friend or lover can hurt us as you have been hurt. It is part of getting close to people. I do think you will find that as time goes on her accepting full responsibility for her choices will be "cold comfort" as well.

What will be better is if she figures out how to be a better wife and you figure out how to allow her to be that wife while you become the husband she needs.

I will say that apparently your behavior in the last few weeks, has opened her eyes to what your marriage could be and I think it is exactly what she desires.

There is no painfree way to do this, but I do think you have a repentant wife, and someone who is willing to do the work. If you read the posts here you will find that in this respect you are a lucky man. Whether you choose to work on this is really your call.

Please think about it.

God Bless,

JL

Well, I’ve come home. I am physically and mentally drained but it’s good, or should I say bittersweet, to be here. I will be completely honest and say that the reason I am back is because of these forums and the support I have been given in my darkest hours. To read, experience, and try to relate to some of the most gut wrenching, soul crushing stories on these boards, by men with far more inner strength than I would have, compelled me to come back home. Now that I’m home, I realize that there are more reasons to be here than the forums, but you guys were the catalyst. Thank you.

I dropped off the rental car today at the airport where she works, and proceeded to walk around the airport trying to find the new building where the OM has now moved. I was in a dark place and was trying to somehow call him out. Ark’s post about “be still” helped me work through it, and I left after talking briefly with WS. Of course this was before her attempt to reconcile the lies she told me after the A was revealed by offering to bring me in to the office where the sexual trysts occurred to prove there are no hidden reminders. Some things are better left alone sweetheart, but thanks for trying.
Back home, we talked and then talked some more. I realized that I missed doing that, and that also is her biggest EN. I was being honest and exposing my feelings, and perhaps more of my sensitive side than my perception of manliness had previously allowed. We talked a lot about the A, the addiction, the times that I really KNEW that there had to something going on and chose to ignore it, etc.. The point was, we talked.
I’m replying to my own post because I think I’ve started to answer the topic question. “When does the pain stop”? It doesn’t. It just might get easier to bear, or we get numb. I’m just not there yet, but am hoping that the vets here are right. “When does the lying end”? When we help create an environment that it’s safe NOT to have to lie. Again, I’m a looonnngg way from there, but am working on a plan to get there.
I’m dreading the upcoming months, only because the sage advice of posters here that say I will hit new lows in the upcoming months. I can’t bear to be any more low than I have been lately, but at least I know it’s out there in front of me and can prepare.
Finally, MrsZonie will continue to post here too, and I will read her posts and she will no doubt read mine. I can’t NOT do that. I have become the man I never wanted to be and now distrust all her actions and snoop and pry. I wish to God I had trusted my instincts and done it sooner. In time this may fade, but I will continue to “verify”. I just can’t trust yet. The good thing is, I will have nothing to post here that I haven’t already discussed with her first. Shame on me if I do. The reason I will post is because the advice here has given me the strength to try and save this marriage, and I will need MUCH more of it during the absolutely grueling periods of work we will have to do. I don’t know if it will work. But I definitely know it won’t if I don’t try.
It’s late and I need to go cuddle with my sleeping wife now. Sorry honey, I just couldn’t sleep until I wrote these fantastic people to thank them for giving me the strength to try.

Z,

You are doing the bravest thing a man can do right now. You are facing your fears head on in order to do what is right and good and there is nothing more brave than that. I have to say that I am proud of what you have done and I will pray for you to have the strength needed to work on what you want.

There will be lows in the future like you said. However, I don't think you have to worry about being lower than you have been. To me, there was nothing lower than those first 4 weeks. There are lows now, but nothing that compares to the first realization of the truth of your life.

I happen to be in a low right now, so the timing of your good news is a very welcome one to me. There is no way of predicting when those lows are going to take place. They will come and the best thing I can do about mine is to talk to my wife about them. She will help if she wants the M to work. She's the best one you can talk to.

I will keep track of this thread and we can try to help each other through these times. They aren't fun, but I still have the hope that this will all lead to a better M than the one I thought I had.

Keep that hope - you'll need it for the down times.

Mr. Z,

I am proud of you. You are doing something you should and will be proud of. YOu are giving your spouse a second chance.

I know you will be low, but as Balin says, it is unlikely you will get lower. Further, as time goes on 1-2 years the feelings that you now associate with the memories you will always have will disconnect and begin to fade. That is part of what one sees here all of the time, healing. Have no doubt it will occur.

You said a few things I thought I would comment on
Mr. Z I always knew women liked to talk. Heck I had sisters and a mother as well as female friends, even a W. But until I came here I never truly appreciated the power and the necessity of talking. I grew up with a military father, was in the military and work in a mostly male profession. Most of my friends were athletes. Who KNEW, that communicating on the level you and Mrs Z are now doing was so important. I thought everyone liked the "strong silent" type.

Communications is the key to a good marriage. It is the key to your happiness. It is the key to her happiness. You don't know it but you have also learned a lesson I did not know until I came here. We should not trust our spouses, it is really a form of neglect. You should be integrated into her life and her into yours so that trust is really not something that is required. And if it is required it should be POJA'd.

How do you integrate one another? You communicate. Please reread Harley's four rules for a good marriage, and then reread the articles on his policies of radical honesty and joint agreement, POJA.

You should check up on her, it is the ONLY way she can prove that she is not lying and that she is doing what she says. Many BS's and WS's don't realize that "verifying", "checking up", "snooping" is really a good thing. It allows the WS a avenue to PROVE what they say and do is true. You both need data. Get it.

As for the coming months, let me offer you my take. There are a few things that seem to happen with great regularity during the recovery period.

1. About 6-8 months out (give or take a little) the BS "exhales" and anger shows up. It has been speculated that this occurs when the BS realizes the marriage will make it, and they start to let out what they have held back trying to win their spouse back. The good news for you is that your W's affair is OVER, and you did not have to fight with that, but expect to "exhale" a few months from now.

2. About 1 year the BS often goes into another tail spin. Again speculation varies as to why, but many think it is do to anniversaries. Last year at this time WS was doing..., I was doing.... I was feeling this or that. Once a year has passed, when you remember back to last year you remember your spouse in recovery. Two years out your remember even better things from the previous years.

3. Your W is very likely to go into an emotional tail spin as your recovery moves along, maybe about a 6-12 months out as the enormity of what she has done really really hits her. You may not realize or understand this now but her guilt is likely to be a big stumbling block to really rebuilding intimacy with her. She will feel she does not deserve you and try to distance. Your job is to see that her guilt (which is a paralyzing emotions) some how turns into remorse and then acceptance of herself (remorse leads to actions).

Finally Mr. Z, look forward to many good times, many deep times, many very intimate (emotional and physical times). What the future holds for you is NOT a bad thing. It is something you should look forward to.

Oh, and the thing about her office, consider taking her up on it.
Years ago a lady used to post here. If I recall correctly she had had an affair (perhaps it was her H don't recall), but she came up with the idea of visiting every hotel, motel, resturant, that the affair had occurred in. And they "reclaimed" each and every places as THEIRS. Apparently they had a lot of fun doing it, and it really changed both of their outlooks on things as well as removing triggers each time one or the other drove by a hotel chain where the events of the affair had transpired.

I think your W offering to take you the office is something you should consider when you are ready. It should be her office and YOUR office if you get what I mean.

Must go.

God Bless,

JL

JL,

That is an interesting idea about "reclaiming" triggers. My FWW and I have had experiences with that a little bit, but not in some areas that still really hurt.

We had fun reclaiming the new couch I that I bought to replace an old one. But, most of the A occured in vehicles in various fields between our town and OM's town. A few weeks ago, we had to go to her parents house, and the only way to get there is to drive down the highway through OM's town with those fields on both sides. That was one of the biggest trigger moments I've ever had.

I could not ask my FWW to reclaim those places without feeling like she would be reliving those experiences. But, if she ever offered to do it for us, I'd take her up on that right away.

Every time I feel a trigger, I also have this idea in my mind that OM has a lot of power over my life. I am getting closer and closer to getting sick of it. Why should OM control what I feel about fields that I am driving through? He should have NO power over my life. Am I that weak?

Z, if your wife is asking you to reclaim a place that is a trigger for you, I think it might be wise to take advantage of it. I think JL has a good idea with this one. The more triggers that you can reclaim, the less pain you're going to feel.

Balin,

To put this subtly, I would be "plowing" some fields if I were you. You may have to explain this to your W, but first explain your triggers to her. Let her know when you trigger, and then discuss possible solutions for these triggers rather than the ever popular "get over it."

The idea is to build new memories. Heck it may take several visits where is that eek emoticon when I need it? The one thing that was clear from this ladies post was that they decided to have "fun" doing this.

God Bless,

JL