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Joined: Aug 1999
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Zack,

You know, I have been around for awhile (on this board and on this planet), and I have noticed something about people. They really only have problems until they get sick of them, then they solve them or they walk away from them.

So what path are you going to take? IF you want to solve the problem, then you need to address you and your inability to forgive, your inability to avoid thinking she did this TOO YOU, your inability to discuss this with her. If you want to walk away, the HONORABLE thing to do is divorce her and seek your happiness with another woman, better suited to you.

It seems to me YOU created this standard of celibacy for yourself. IT was something you were proud of, something you felt you should and wanted to bring to the marriage. You married a woman that did not bring this to your marriage. She clearly did not value her virginity as you did yours, yet you married her. Now you want to hold her up to your standards.

Yes, she went with another man, but if you want to get technical she did NOT cheat in your marriage. From all of the data she has been consistently honest in her vows. She has not strayed from them. Technically, she did not cheat, but she did betray your relationship BEFORE the marriage.

So you have a problem that really only you can address. Do you stay or do you go. Rest assured YOU will be the cheater in your marriage if you seek out another woman. YOu will be the wayward spouse, you will be the man who has lost his honor and broken his vows.

Let's get honest here, YOU are the one thinking about cheating NOT your W. She has honored her vows. So let's talk about you and what is inside you.

You see while you think your virginity was/is a gift, I think keeping ones vows is a far greater gift, and I think little of your morals, your ethics, your honor if you feel that defiling them is going to somehow help YOU or your marriage.

Time to face the real problem NOW. It is YOU.

Please think about this. I am NOT swinging a 2x4, I am swinging a damnnnn beam. WAKE UP.

God Bless YOU,

JL

Last edited by Just Learning; 05/13/09 08:36 PM.
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Spot on JL! Swing that beam...


3-DDays, 4-OMs*, Plan-D May 9, 2009, final Dec 2010 (FREEDOM!)
Custody of DDs / new job(s) / "I'm alive...and well"
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I'm confused. He said 3 years since D-Day. Was there a D-Day (+ affair) or not?

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She had a "last fling" before their marriage, but Zack didn't find out about the fling until 3 months after they were married.

So JL is absolutely right. Zack is holding his wife to HIS standards, not standards she had (and was honest about) before the wedding date. She's honored her vows to forsake all others "from this day forth".

Zack, you need to decide if you can live with the knowledge of the fling with integrity. If you cannot, then you need to D your wife.

I think perhaps the best thing you could do is sit down with your wife and POJA some boundaries for her. For example, she only drinks when you're around. Or she only drinks at home but not social events. Something like that. It seems that her use of alcohol is a huge trigger for you and it needs to be addressed.

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You mean you're afraid.

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Originally Posted by zackmorris55
Its not necessarily unfair, considering I had the opportunities to have more experiences however I chose to keep that part of myself for someone I was in love with.

This is an honorable man. You achieved this goal. The real question here is do you want to remain an honorable man, with good morals. If so, you are veering down the wrong path. If you want to be a selfish, morally lacking, cheater then you can continue.

Originally Posted by zackmorris55
Its not that I want to experiment with other women as if it would be a regular thing and lifestyle for me. I'm just saying that if the opportunity was to arise (have to be with the right person), I question if could resist temptation and I think I might be open to gain a little NEW life experience, on a limited/one time deal, and this could be done with little or no regret. But hey I could be wrong.

We assume that if the opportunity arises, most people cannot stop themselves. Obviously in the past you could, but now you may you have no reason to stop (i.e. what would my W do...oh wait, she would NOT stop so why should I).

However, we do not gain happiness from others. We gain it from within. How would you feel about yourself if you went through with it? What if your W killed herself? Would you feel bad then? Although I doubt it, adultery wreaks havoc upon all parties. Just because she did it, does not mean it would not hurt her. Then you have to live knowing the pain you inflicted on someone else...

P.S. I also used to know I could never cheat. Had opportunities but never took them. Now, I also KNOW I would cheat if placed in the right position (b/c the 'special' has been annihilated). Therefore, I keep myself out of those positions b/c I do not want to risk everything that is important to me!


Me: 32 BS DDay: 9/14/08
Slowly coming to the realization that I
am one of those who can't get past it.
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"Technically, she did not cheat, but she did betray your relationship BEFORE the marriage."

They had an exclusive relationship, she banged another man. How is that not cheating?

His WW then further cheated on Zach by witholding this information til after they were married.

His selfish WW took away Zach's decision and right to decide if he wanted to marry a cheater.

Zach is not holding his WW to his standards on virginity. He knew she was active before they married. He acepted that. Zach's problem is how she cheated before they married then the way she chose to bang the OM, she chose to withold the truth from Zach.

Total deceit from before the I do's. WW took away his ability to say I don't by cheating then hiding it.

I will tell Zach that forget the RA. They never solve anything. Only causing more problems and more hurt.

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Originally Posted by HURTandSHOCKED
Originally Posted by zackmorris55
Its not necessarily unfair, considering I had the opportunities to have more experiences however I chose to keep that part of myself for someone I was in love with.

This is an honorable man. You achieved this goal. The real question here is do you want to remain an honorable man, with good morals. If so, you are veering down the wrong path. If you want to be a selfish, morally lacking, cheater then you can continue.

Originally Posted by zackmorris55
Its not that I want to experiment with other women as if it would be a regular thing and lifestyle for me. I'm just saying that if the opportunity was to arise (have to be with the right person), I question if could resist temptation and I think I might be open to gain a little NEW life experience, on a limited/one time deal, and this could be done with little or no regret. But hey I could be wrong.

We assume that if the opportunity arises, most people cannot stop themselves. Obviously in the past you could, but now you may you have no reason to stop (i.e. what would my W do...oh wait, she would NOT stop so why should I).

However, we do not gain happiness from others. We gain it from within. How would you feel about yourself if you went through with it? What if your W killed herself? Would you feel bad then? Although I doubt it, adultery wreaks havoc upon all parties. Just because she did it, does not mean it would not hurt her. Then you have to live knowing the pain you inflicted on someone else...

P.S. I also used to know I could never cheat. Had opportunities but never took them. Now, I also KNOW I would cheat if placed in the right position (b/c the 'special' has been annihilated). Therefore, I keep myself out of those positions b/c I do not want to risk everything that is important to me!

Thanks for the positive comments. The main thing relates to a post I made several months ago about a conversation i "Overheard" whereby she was mentioning sexual details regarding her affair (with her friend while they were drinking) and this is 3 years post DDAy and she claims to hold anger and animosity toward the OM. Tough things for any husband to hear. Hearing those comments seemed to change something in me, I still love her but I dont hold the same perspective on loyalty that I once did.

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Listen Zack, EVERY SINGLE INDIVIDUAL that becomes a WS comes up with "the straw that broke the camel's back" in order to justify the affair, but the truth is, there is NOTHING that justifies it...N-O-T-H-I-N-G...So even though what your wife said hurt you, and rightfully so, that still does NOT give you license to have an affair...

You have MANY choices besides having an affair...That will NOT take away your hurt...That will make your life FAR worse...GUARANTEED...I'd hate to see you divorce, but I'd rather see that than to see you have an affair...

How about calling Steve Harley? How about going to the next MB Weekend Seminar? (I believe the next one is in August - click on the link at the top of the page and see)...Try to fix what is broken in the correct manner...Whaddaya say?

Mrs. W


FWW ~ 47 ~ Me
FBH ~ 50 ~ MrWondering
DD ~ 17
Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered

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Zack,

Have you talked to your wife about your feelings? Have you sat her down, looked her in the eyes and communicated not only your deep hurt to her, but ALSO the fact that you are now considering an affair? (I so know you haven't of course)...

Zack, do you know what I would give to have sat Mr. W down and said, "Look, you are never home...this leaving for work at 7:30 am and not returning until after midnight is killing me - when I call and you blow me off it hurts me so much...And I'm also ANGRY...When you told me that we could move back to my hometown and then pulled it out from under me, it REALLY tore my heart out - I feel like that was "the straw that broke the camel's back"...It made me want to DIE - I was considering suicide - planning it...And now that I've been talking to my ex-boyfriend and he's been paying attention to me, listening to me and flattering me, it feels so good...We've started recalling old times and that is stirring feelings in me that I haven't had in so long...And we've talked about meeting when I go to visit my parents for Spring Break."

Instead I did what the typical WS does and dropped what I thought were GREAT HINTS...I said things like, "You are pushing me away". MrRollieEyes I WANTED him to be a mind reader...sorta...I gave him enough in WS speak so that I could tell myself, "See, I gave him a chance to stop me and he did NOTHING! He doesn't care anyway!" All ways that I could justify what I was about to do...So wrong...So unfair...He deserved the whole truth and that is NOT what he got...Not even close...And it cost us so much, Zack...And it was NOT anywhere close to worth it...

I implore you to TALK to your wife...To give her full openness & honesty...It's the ONLY way...REALLY...Becoming an adulterer is a fate that I'd wish on no one...and oh sheesh, PLEASE, PLEASE don't make your wife a BS...NO ONE DESERVES THAT...

Zack, will you please listen to me? You'll be so glad you did...Really...No one EVER regrets doing the right thing...

Mrs. W


FWW ~ 47 ~ Me
FBH ~ 50 ~ MrWondering
DD ~ 17
Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered

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Zack,

I have read some of your past. It seems you find yourself in a relatively short M to an alcoholic. She has admitted to a preM cheating, if you were already engaged then this is the SAME as an actual A. Also you do not know that there was no post M cheating. So, my question is why are you staying?

It may be that you can't forgive this. Well then get a D and move one. Don't make yourself into a cheater. That will hurt you forever, you will have gone from a man who saved himself for his W to a man who cheats on his W. It was easier for me in that I no longer felt the emotion of love for my XWW, but emotions can mislead us.

Are you getting some counseling?



Last edited by 6yearsleft; 05/17/09 08:10 AM.

Me 42 BS
Wife 41 FWW (exwife now)
Divorced 10/14/2008
S 21
D 18
D 16
S, S 13 (twins)
Grandson 8 months
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Originally Posted by MrsWondering
Zack,

Have you talked to your wife about your feelings? Have you sat her down, looked her in the eyes and communicated not only your deep hurt to her, but ALSO the fact that you are now considering an affair? (I so know you haven't of course)...

Zack, do you know what I would give to have sat Mr. W down and said, "Look, you are never home...this leaving for work at 7:30 am and not returning until after midnight is killing me - when I call and you blow me off it hurts me so much...And I'm also ANGRY...When you told me that we could move back to my hometown and then pulled it out from under me, it REALLY tore my heart out - I feel like that was "the straw that broke the camel's back"...It made me want to DIE - I was considering suicide - planning it...And now that I've been talking to my ex-boyfriend and he's been paying attention to me, listening to me and flattering me, it feels so good...We've started recalling old times and that is stirring feelings in me that I haven't had in so long...And we've talked about meeting when I go to visit my parents for Spring Break."

Instead I did what the typical WS does and dropped what I thought were GREAT HINTS...I said things like, "You are pushing me away". MrRollieEyes I WANTED him to be a mind reader...sorta...I gave him enough in WS speak so that I could tell myself, "See, I gave him a chance to stop me and he did NOTHING! He doesn't care anyway!" All ways that I could justify what I was about to do...So wrong...So unfair...He deserved the whole truth and that is NOT what he got...Not even close...And it cost us so much, Zack...And it was NOT anywhere close to worth it...

I implore you to TALK to your wife...To give her full openness & honesty...It's the ONLY way...REALLY...Becoming an adulterer is a fate that I'd wish on no one...and oh sheesh, PLEASE, PLEASE don't make your wife a BS...NO ONE DESERVES THAT...

Zack, will you please listen to me? You'll be so glad you did...Really...No one EVER regrets doing the right thing...

Mrs. W

Thanks Mrs W,
Although I have talked to her before its not much use when she continues to drink everyday. She comes home from work and drink 8-12 beers a night! I not sure we can achieve the marriage i need if she continues like this. At this point I am considering Plan D, so the fling thing may not even be an issue. I can open my heart up but if she doesnt want to change her life what good can it do?

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Alcoholic

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Ahhhhhhhhhh yes, that's right Zack, she's an alcoholic...The MB plans will not work with an active alcohoiic...So what you need to do is get yourself to an Alanon meeting right away...Are you willing to do that? Zack, you are going to have to set firm boundaries with her...You know, requiring that she go to AA - 90 meetings in 90 days or you are out...Zack, you having an affair will NOT solve your problems with her...Do you understand that? Having an affair will only make your life more difficult...I'd much rather see you divorce that do that...

Mrs. W


FWW ~ 47 ~ Me
FBH ~ 50 ~ MrWondering
DD ~ 17
Dday ~ 2005 ~ Recovered

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