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Vibrassa:
thanks for you input. She met him while "clubbing". I am very sure that they only had the two "dates". WW gave her business card that night and he emailed her (I have the email--the messages indicates they had just met). She text'd him later that day and their subsequent first date. Yes, it was a very short lived EA. August 1 to the 23rd with a week where she was out of town (he wasn't there as they were texting then)

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Then she absolutely MUST stop her clubbing. It happened once, it will happen again unless a stop is put to it.


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jal,

Ok, I have been reading along and I think you are missing somethings.

1. Your W had sex with OM, bet on it. she made the comment about comparing her body to younger women and she was cold as ice to you.

2. This was NOT 2 dates. Something happened earlier or there would not have been date #1.

3. Three, she has not expressed any real remorse for what she has done, she feels entitled to go out with the "girls" and she feels entitled to the affair. Her only concern is for the girls and probably only out of embarrassment.

4. She is not through withdrawal and she is in contact with OM probably via work or one of her friends. After all she made contact with him before the "dates".

You need to quit tiptoeing around the elephant in your home. The fact that the pastor came by and there was no fight is not a sign she has stopped the affair.

The fact that she has not apologized on indicated that she actually cares what you think is a sure sign this affair is ongoing even if it slowed down some.

Young man you cannot fix what you don't acknowledge, to quote Dr. Phil. You cannot expect her to address this if you won't.

Running around feeling bad, is not addressing this. What is your plan?

Think about this very carefully.

God Bless,

JL

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Originally Posted by jal7788
susieQ:
Only thing is--she went out two Fridays ago with the same female friend against my wishes. I suspected she was hoping to "bump" into OM. I asked her if she did and said no. She text me a couple of times. her friend found out about the affair and express her displeasure...she could be a ally but not sure
So other than that Friday night, there is no other time unaccounted for? There have been no other outings for the afternoon or evening that you were not able to confirm where she was? No late nights at work, etc??


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Originally Posted by Just Learning
jal,

Ok, I have been reading along and I think you are missing somethings.

1. Your W had sex with OM, bet on it. she made the comment about comparing her body to younger women and she was cold as ice to you.

2. This was NOT 2 dates. Something happened earlier or there would not have been date #1.

3. Three, she has not expressed any real remorse for what she has done, she feels entitled to go out with the "girls" and she feels entitled to the affair. Her only concern is for the girls and probably only out of embarrassment.

4. She is not through withdrawal and she is in contact with OM probably via work or one of her friends. After all she made contact with him before the "dates".

You need to quit tiptoeing around the elephant in your home. The fact that the pastor came by and there was no fight is not a sign she has stopped the affair.

The fact that she has not apologized on indicated that she actually cares what you think is a sure sign this affair is ongoing even if it slowed down some.

Young man you cannot fix what you don't acknowledge, to quote Dr. Phil. You cannot expect her to address this if you won't.

Running around feeling bad, is not addressing this. What is your plan?

Think about this very carefully.

God Bless,

JL


And the CROWD said.......

AMEN!!

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I really just wanted to stay out of this but��..

You stood by and gave her the green light that she can date while married to you. She can talk and text to boyfriends right in front of you in your own house. Even if it really is over with first OM you can bet there will be more. Why? Because you already shown her it�s okay. He was just the first on the club sampler plate.

No wonder she is so happy right now. She lives in a marriage with absolutely no boundaries or consequences. Candy Land. A nice place to come home to see her kids, make sure you fed them and are on top of their homework and still have her date nights.

I don�t know what to say.


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Originally Posted by chrisner
I really just wanted to stay out of this but��..

You stood by and gave her the green light that she can date while married to you. She can talk and text to boyfriends right in front of you in your own house. Even if it really is over with first OM you can bet there will be more. Why? Because you already shown her it�s okay. He was just the first on the club sampler plate.

No wonder she is so happy right now. She lives in a marriage with absolutely no boundaries or consequences. Candy Land. A nice place to come home to see her kids, make sure you fed them and are on top of their homework and still have her date nights.

I don�t know what to say.


MAN another GREAT post!!

Exactly what I thought when I read his post.

I thought to myself, this guy needs to get his balls back from his wife and start taking control of this marriage.

We are only trying to help you, I don't want to be harsh, but please you HAVE to see what is going on??

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Originally Posted by jal7788
SusieQ:
I told them the week WW was gone. All 3 very unhappy with Mom. they all know it's wrong and damaging to our family. WW has assured them she won't continue realized she had to stop flaunting the A and start covering her tracks for their sake (not mine nor marriage).
(Emphasis mine)

We are trying to 2x4 you because you are settling for crumbs and setting yourself up for a FR (false recovery).

I noticed you answered the question about unaccounted time very vaguely and haven't answered it when I pressed you for more.

Agree with JL and am very worried at this point that you are in denial...


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jal7788 Offline OP
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all other times accounted for--in fact, WW is phoning me, texting me regularly. We are going out for meals, drinks, etc more frequently than before. With the exception of that one Friday--no other outings.

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JAL,

There is tough love here. These posters are all correct. You let this (and it is far worse than you are making it sound) occur right in front of you in your own house. Time to take charge and make it end, for your marriage, for your children and most importantly, for yourself.

OM works 20 minutes away. I would not be surprised if there have been lunch meetings and conversations from the work telephone.

AM


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Originally Posted by jal7788
all other times accounted for--in fact, WW is phoning me, texting me regularly. We are going out for meals, drinks, etc more frequently than before. With the exception of that one Friday--no other outings.
Well, then you need to get a GPS/VAR in the car. It is the only way you will know for 100% sure.


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jal7788 Offline OP
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Thank you all for your input. I will invest in an VAR but the most important thing I can do is forgive WW and move forward improving myself and investing more into this marriage. My head is metaphorically, out of sand now as trust has been broken and I need to be on alert. I am looking forward to reading the books I ordered and putting them into action.

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Why would you even consider forgiving someone who has no remorse, has not apologized, and continues with weak boundries and selfish behavior?

Good luck, because without a plan to end the A and re-build the M, you're going to need lots of it.

AM



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jal,

You are getting the cart before the horse. Has she requested your forgiveness? IF she has what has she asked you to forgive?

jal, before you get to forgiveness you need to have some very very long and hard talks with her. You need to know why she felt she could violate her own moral code, the moral code you apparently are trying to teach your daughters and do it right in front of you and them? You need to understand what she feels you did to justify her affair. You need to understand if she is going to forgive YOU for whatever it is that she thinks you did to justify her cheating on you.

Son, if you were walking away from this marriage, then I would encourage you to forgive her now, so that you can get on with your life. If you intend to remain married, then forgiveness now is simply a good way to have this happen again. You don't even know what you are forgiving nor has there been any effort on either of your parts to address the conditions of your marriage. You are so far away from forgiveness right now it is silly.

Please think about this carefully. I am not saying you should not forgive her, but you should not forgive her for things you don't know about or understand. I mean really are you forgiving her for wearing white after labor day? Are you forgiving her for an EA or a PA? Are you forgiving her for her independent behavior which clearly has threatened your marriage, what exactly are you so ready to forgive her for?

Think about this.

God Bless,

JL

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Quote
My DD 14 year old is furious with Mom. She is also furious with me for allowing it. I tell her, what can I do, sweetie? The only alternative is for me to move out.

You need to go back to your 14 year old daughter and praise her for being so wise. Promise her that if her mom continues to go on interview dates for an adultery partner it is not you who will be leaving.

Quote
The only alternative is for me to move out.


Please at least tell me you no longer believe that after today.



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No she hasn't requested forgiveness. She has admitted she has "crossed" the line but shows no real remorse for it. She is not even sure if she wants to stay in the marriage or if she loves me anymore. So what do I do? Leave? Rub her nose in her bad behavior? She has told me she has had NC and I have been able to verify, to some degree, this is the case especially through her actions and behaviors. I believe this was an EA. I could be wrong. What difference would it make? Shouldn't I forgive for my sake? Otherwise, I will make myself crazy.

I would love to get answers to all the questions you pose. I am still perplexed as to how it came to this and why WW actually crossed the line this time. What was the trigger? Is now the time to do it? Maybe get some positive structure into the marriage before asking? I'm thinking maybe six months down the road after I've had a chance to inject some positive characteristics into the marriage, then go into detail as to the whys and wherefores.

If it happens again (hopefully I learn how to affair-proof my marriage from the good Dr.'s book) then I will need to evaluate my next move.

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I am very thankful for the wisdom of my DD 14 year old!

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NO - YOU don't leave the house. EVER!

It isn't an option.

However, if she persists in her marriage destroying behavior, you ask her to leave and file for separation.

You need to expose this - to her friend that is a potential ally and to anyone else who your wife respects. Let her know that you expect FULL transparency, you want her to delete and remove any items that are linked to OM. She cannot go out clubbing anymore.

She must agree to explore Extraordinary Precautions to affair proof your marriage and to commit to a program of recovery.


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No, agreed, I won't leave the house. I believe she has stopped all bad behavior. She doesn't know that I have access to her one business email where she hasn't yet deleted the 3 messages from OM from a month ago. I am afraid to confront today as I don't want to blow my cover. If she is to communicate, I believe she thinks this in the one "safe" place. Until my M is on more solid footing, shouldn't I wait to confront her on that and EP? Believe me, I want to tell her I've seen them and how hurtful they are to me. but the timing is not right.

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If you wait 6 months there will be no need for EP's because you will be divorced.

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