Unwritten,

I would HIGHLY recommend you contact your MB Coach and tell them you are both ready to get bac to work and need some help on where to begin.

Dr. H's Program is a very detailed and very specific program. He will give you the path and the plan, but you must mae every effort to seek the guidance from them that you require.

OK!

So when are you going to contact them??

I HIGHLY recommend this too;
RC Inventory

Since you purchased the online program, you have access to the Weekend Forums....

You can both post questions, anytime, to Dr. Harley, about any subject.... Please utilize this option.

She said they purchased the "home" programme, HPB, not the online programme. The Home Study Course is the online programme without the online bit - without the coach. That is how it is possible for you to work through it "randomly" - because there is no coach guiding and prompting you through the steps.

This couple needs to upgrade and use one of the MB coaches. It will make a great deal of difference.

It is an easy matter to upgrade from the do-it-yourself Home Study Course to getting a coach. I can't remember how, but the details are here on the website. The cost of the Home Study course that you have already purchased is deducted from the cost of the full online course, which is about $1000.

I highly recommend doing this.

Thanks Sugar Cane, I didn't catch that.....


I would agree with you 100%

UPGRADE!

unwritten,

The advantages of the on-line program are many. A personal coach is assigned and you have access to the coach through email and telephone appointments. The coaches meet with Dr. Harley on a weekly basis to discuss progress. The on-line program gives a structure to the order of the lessons - addressing the most important ones first. It also provides accountability about completing the lessons. One of the biggest advantages for me was then whenever we ran into a stumbling block, the coach would talk with each of us separately. Neither one of us was the bad guy, delivering bad news. Well worth the investment.

AM

Thank you for all of your responses. Thank you for clarifying what IC is, I was a little stumped myself! IC has been one of the major things lacking over the last decade, anyone who has had little kids will understand. We have had some of our most intimate conversations over gtalk, where we could not be interrupted! Sad and I'm sure it doesn't count, but it has worked for us to at least stay in communication.

I am going to put together EP's today and post them on here for your advice. I am also going to look into upgrading our home course to the online version. I think we discussed doing that when we first bought the home course but thought we would 'try' the home course first, due to the cost difference. I remember then saying "You know how we operate, we will NEVER hold ourselves accountable to stay on course. This will work if we DO it we just won't do it." Or something to that nature. Clearly, I was right. I think it is time for the upgrade!!!

One of the things I struggle with is that I told my H after he disclosed his ONS that I would not drive the ship of recovery. That HE needed to be the one to initiate recovery. I had for years and years and years been telling him we needed to 'talk about our relationship' and 'find a way to heal our relationship,' I suggested MC for yrs, I discovered MB and pushed us to do a program...after finding out all along he had the most to hide and yet he was the one who was fighting against any kind of recovery process I was resentful. Now I need to see him show some initiative. I need to know that he DESIRES to fix this, and cares about our marriage enough to initiate the work. He has shown such a ho hum attitude all these yrs about recovering our marriage, and obviously things have run a course of further and further destruction. Then, we have this rebellion on my part and this trickle truth and finally a big DDay where he confesses a ONS, it is all very emotional and he BEGS me then and any time I have said I wanted a D to stay and says that he will change and do ANYTHING to keep me. OK, pick up a phone, call an MC. Start doing MB with me again. But he doesn't do any of those things, just goes back to his ho hum attitude about our marriage and seemingly wants to just sweep everything under the rug. Instead it is me, again, on these forums trying to educate myself, gain a new understanding, it is me putting together EP's and reading the REI and asking him to fill out his EN and LB questionnaires and review them with me and...fill in the blank. It is me doing exactly what I said I WOULDN'T do which is drive the ship. I think I spend more hours in a day thinking about how to recover this relationship than he spends in a year. I don't want to be stubborn about who drives the recovery ship, I just want to see the desire he CLAIMS to have shown in his efforts and actions, know what I mean?

Thanks for the recommendation HPB. I did fill out my side of the REI and will have him fill out his side. Our problem though is not knowing what to do together, we have lots and lots and lots of hobbies we do together...we have almost too many hobbies (ok we do just don't want to admit it, ha). However, we also have a couple that are separate, and I know that in the MB principles we should give those up but that is very, very hard for us to do. I am heavily involved in a non profit org and have been involved in this particular 'cause' for my entire adult life, it is a passion of mine and one that he highly respects and supports. As a SAHM it is my 'job' away from home more or less. Also H has been passionate about hunting his entire life. He maintains a relationship with his family through hunting, just last yr DS8 started to hunt with him and as DS8 is a rather difficult child it was GREAT bonding time for him to be alone with his dad, and soon DS4 will start going and it will continue on that family 'boy time.' I would not want to see him give that up! I am trying to incorporate myself into that hobby as much as I can, doing shooting league with him, training dogs with him, etc. but I will never be a 'hunter' know what I mean. So how do we manage all that. I honestly cannot fathom giving those things up, we would both lose a part of ourselves in the process. Back to the positive though like I said we have a LOT of hobbies we share together including one last big one that is very time consuming and one of the things much of our conversation is about, a common passion that we have pretty recently gotten involved in and are both very excited about and can't wait to share our 'ideas' with each other about! Frankly this new mutual hobby of ours will likely be so time consuming it will take over much of my 'cause' time and also some of his hunting time, so this whole separate hobby thing might resolve itself...

I totally digressed there but the REI DID give me some ideas of things to do on date nights, I love going out to a nice dinner but we also are really active and would love to try new things too.

As long as hobbies don't involve members of opposite sex they can be healthy. His sounds safe due to lack of female participation, not so sure about yours. You need to question whether your hobby is worth dissolving your marriage over.....

Oh yeah, also remember it doesn't matter who drives the ship as long as it reaches it's destination. I struggled with this at first myself, but I was told if I improved myself as a husband 100 percent the marriage would be fifty percent better. More than likely he will want to reciprocate and/or meet your needs if you fix your shortcomings in the marriage.

Resentment is a bear. I got loads of it.

Like most types of trauma, I think time will improve this too.

Some of the estimates Ive read say it takes 2 years for a lot of this stuff to be not as enraging as it can be. Ive also read that some are 3-4-5 years into recovery and still they have their moments of resentment.

If you have a spouse (regardless of who cheated) who is committed to the things that make a marriage great like all of the things talked about above, then 2 or 5 years can manageable.

Well, my cause hobby is HIGHLY populated with women, probably 90% or so. H has never felt uncomfortable with this hobby. The hobby we do together is fairly heavily populated with men however, probably 75% men 25% women but we do it together and not only that, are a 'team' and have a very integrated lifestyle because of it. Not sure how that works into the equation.

My marriage and family is more important than ANY hobby. Of course. But we are not a couple who enjoy big houses and nice lawns, we are a couple that are passionate about our hobbies and adventures. It is one of the things we look at now and think, HOW did we screw this up so bad? We have so many common interests and such similar personalities in ways many people would love to have, HOW did we not capitalize on that instead of spend a decade disrespecting each other? Anyway, I can't imagine who I am without the 'hobbies' which I also call passions and are a big part of who I am, who I was pre marriage, pre kids, pre marital destruction, ... Boundaries absolutely. EP's absolutely. But this here is a fine line between boundaries and prioritizing marriage, and giving up some of the other great joys in my life and a part of who I am.

Seriously there has to be some balance between protecting yourself and your boundaries, but not hiding in a closet to keep yourself away from people of the opposite gender.

Since many of my H's infidelities included women from work, and he has and will continue to work with WOMEN because frankly, in todays day and age there are women in every workplace and that can just not be avoided, why is it fair for me to give up a hobby that has men in it. I get it. I am just feeling the sting of injustice here.

When you fill out the RC Inventory, please follow the instructions and it will help you weed out the activities that need to go.

Next start filling out your UA schedule on the weekly calendar. You do this FIRST before scheduling anything else. Make sure the times are NOT TV time and NOT movie time..... You must have opportunities for conversation during UA and TV and movies don't offer that, OK.

After you have 15-20 hrs of UA time scheduled, plot the time you both intend to spend on family time (this will include hunting with the boys) 15 hrs.
The time remaining is the time you have available for individual activities, such as your non-profit work, etc.

ask you husband to come here and login and read/post. SMB and I read together and learn together as a result, it also gives a chance to discuss things that are on the forums.

IP I just got done reading your thread on SF, I struggle with that too and it is one of those things I don't talk about because being the W as the one with a high SF need is not common and I don't find much support. All the 'all women...' advices don't apply to me. Anyway thank you for your candor about all that!

You are totally right. I have to stop and remind myself of that FREQUENTLY. Just sucks to seemingly be the only one who cares. I did have a little heart to heart with him yesterday about this topic. He seemed to understand why I was so frustrated. I pretty much look at it as, worse case scenario if I work my [censored] off at learning about marriage, applying what I learned to be the best damn wife I can be, and he doesn't reciprocate and we end up divorced in the end, I leave as a better woman that I was going in right? In other words, I look at it all as PR as much as MR.

I learned about ONS in August of 2010, so it is over 1 1/2 yrs in. VERY resentful for the first yr, did not provide ANY EA's except SF because it was also one of my needs, even that went from Giver to Taker. Major LBing. And I really DIDN'T CARE if his LB (oh wait is LB love bust or love bank??? lol) was depleted, I was just hurt and resentful and didn't care. But I snapped out of that. Now I am committed, but I also have triggers of resentment and days of major resentment and it just sets me back. One of the best things for me in getting over resentment has been MB making me look myself in the mirror and own up to what I have done to destroy this M, he hasn't been the only culprit. Easier to forgive him when I know he has things he has to forgive too.

When adultery has visited a marriage, ordinary precautions no longer apply..... That is why Dr. H recommends EXTRAORDINARY PRECAUTIONS.

Read here; EP Thread

TV time is EVIL, it sucks the hours of the day away before you know it, with no feeling of accomplishment! Maybe we should just get rid of our tv...food for thought.

I was about to say I have asked my H to come here and read the forums because they have been so helpful to me, and because I would like him to take some initiative of course, but that I would not hold my breath. But then he texted me just now to say that he hopes its OK he is reading my thread so... Hi honey, love you! (tried to do a little smiley there but haven't quite figured that out yet)

Read your thread on EP's. Had some questions/notes on the first 'immediate' list, the second list I might as well copy down verbatim. Q's are what is a post nuptial agreement? Also, I have read talk about getting rid of triggers. Impossible to do with everything of course, but specifically clothes, other tangible items you might have in your home. Is that something you would write in the EP's?

My EP's so far (I know these need a lot of work...)

1) NC with any AP. Since these were past EA's this has already been put in place, but I think I do still have contact info for the last one that I will make sure is gone.
2) Give H access to passwords for all cell phone, emails, FB's, etc. I had a separate email acct during the last EA that is already gone, have never done anything on my regular email acct. And I think H already knows the PW's for all of them. Oh I guess I used CHAT a lot with my last EA, so should I get rid of chat? H can see who I have on my chat, which is now down to about 3 people him included, no one of concern. If I get rid of it then I can't chat with him either. Whats your advice on this or should I ask him what he would like me to do.
3) Do a poly if he wants me to, so far he has said no but I am willing if he wants me to.
4) H recently put GPS on my phone I think, he is welcome to put software on my comp. I am not techie AT ALL and have no idea how any of that works, maybe he has already done it...

As far as other things, I am a SAHM. H manages all of our money/bills. I really don't have money of my own or anything secret other than what I can do online during the day I guess. He has access to cell phone records, etc. and pays all those bills. Not trying to make him sound controlling or like its 'his' money just that he has historically been responsible for all the money management. So I don't really need any EP's regarding money/bank statements/phone bills, etc. I could really not pay for anything that he didn't know about.

What else, seems short. Oh ya I will add the entire list of 'long term' EP's from HPB's thread too. Just a cut and paste there.

Also, from HPB's EP thread:

A) I will protect my spouse and their feelings above all else.
B) I will not participate in any one-on-one meetings with anyone of the opposite sex.
C) I will not discuss my personal marriage issues with anyone of the opposite sex.
D) I will not attend clubs, strip joints, or any such establishment
E) I agree to use POJA as a basis for all decisions.
F) I will be open and honest with my spouse at all times about the past and present.
G) I will provide my spouse a daily schedule of all appointments and contact information.
H) If I need to make an adjustment to my schedule, I will notify my spouse of the change immediately.
I) I will make my spouse�s phone calls my highest priority by answering them or returning them immediately.
J) I will avoid all chat rooms, porn, member sites, etc.
K) I will trade phones with my spouse at any time they request, NO questions asked.
L) I will leave my phone accessible to my spouse at night/or anytime I�m home.
M) I will commit to at least 15 hours of undivided attention with my spouse to meet each other�s ENs every week (time working together does not count toward those 15 hours).
N) If AP finds a way to make contact, I will immediately end the contact and notify my spouse about it immediately after.
O) I will install a keylogger, GPS, or any other tracking system my spouse may request.
P) Anytime I have the thought, �I don�t want my spouse to know about��.�, I will call my spouse immediately and tell them my thoughts.
Q) Anything else my spouse wants as a boundary.