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Originally Posted By: NeverGuessed
(We later set a one-page limit to each transaction; I can get verbose.)


No. Way.

Really, this is a great suggestion on how to keep communicating very volatile information during a volatile time, I think. And doesn't present an opportunity for random lovebusting to occur (well I guess you can do that in writing too, but it is probably a tad more controlled).

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WAW, You seem to have a lot to say on other threads (mine specifically), but are really quite guarded about your own story and struggles. Why is that? What are you afraid of? We are, afterall, just anonmyous online posters who you can run away from with the click of a button.

The more O&H you are regarding your situation on here, the more help you can receive. So why would you not want to lay it all out there? Is it because your H reads your thread too and you are afraid of some sort of backlash? If so can he commit to not reading your thread for awhile so that you can get some help with your situation?

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Hello, hammer!


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Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE
Originally Posted By: SugarCane
There is something that you are not revealing here.


Yes, you do not have the full history and it is harder to help. I understand that is wasting your time. I have gotten the encouragement I need to move through this next step. I will make a plan and act so we can move on through recovery.



To a degree the history can be irrelevant, as the MB plan is rather straight forward.


So - what does your plan look like?

Have you provided your husband with a written list of EP's?

What EP's have you implemented?

Have you done the ENQ and LBQ yet?

Are you going to begin scheduling UA time?


"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr

"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer

"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE
Originally Posted By: wulffpack_girl

Where you must make a distinction is between a.) actual abuse and b.) normal human reactions to betrayal. Indie's and Sugar's points are if you can elaborate a bit, folks will be able to give you help targeted to your situation. If you are truly afraid of his reaction/response to revelations/answers, then I would suggest doing so in a safe environment, with a third party present.


I understand what you guys want but I am not giving the history of the first year. It is over but it still makes me overly emotional and irrational just to think about it so I won't. Having gotten past that I am now dealing with normal human reactions to betrayal.

Since my BS does not want others involved I am thinking that written communication will make me feel safe.


WaW, if you're saying he WAS abusive then Dr Hs plan to separate still applies.

His behaviour right now, doesn't matter - if its there its there. And it makes no sense that an abusive spouse has simply switched into being non abusive.

An abusive spouse must undergo a years separation while undergong anger management therapy.

If he has EVER been abusive, then that must be dealt with FIRST before recovery from an A.

And I still hear no answer to my question regarding alcohol.

Quite frankly Waw, I struggle to credit your reasoning.

Telling us basic facts such as whether he ever yelled, put his hands on you aggressively, threw things, made you feel in danger or is dependent on alcohol will not make you fall apart.

We are not asking for a blow by blow script but for basic facts.


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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The problem, Trip, is that he's evidently not yet received what he deems to be his JC's. Without his satisfaction in that area, it would be difficult to effectively start the MB-engine.

We've seen the probable results before, of a resentful FBS resorting to, "Sure, you're putting on a good show now, but I know it's all an act!" There's a poster on SAA right now that heard that pronounced to their MC, I think yesterday.

Trust (or at least a quiet skepticism) is the sine qua non of almost the entire program.

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Trust...is the sine qua non of almost the entire program.

Well, if there are those here who don't think there are powers at
work on our issues, they need read no farther. I was trying to
fabricate a way to expand on that closing line from the prior post.

Today is the Feast of the Exultation of the True Cross in the RC
faith. Our Priest was addressing the many skeptics who maintain
that if all the identified pieces were assembled, there'd be enough
wood to a housing development, or a flotilla of yachts.

His words stayed with me, and may likely do so for a while:

For those who want not to believe, there is no proof possible!

If "believe" and "trust" can be set as highly similar, the sentence
then becomes "For those who want not to trust, there is no proof
possible!" You might want to determine, probably without direct
questioning, whether Mr WAW actively wants the full recovery
not to work. He would not be the first BH here to feel that way.

None of this changes the efforts or direction of your MB-recovery
program. It might, however, give you another tool for your task.

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WAW what happened to you? Where did you go?

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Originally Posted By: unwritten
WAW, You seem to have a lot to say on other threads (mine specifically), but are really quite guarded about your own story and struggles. Why is that? What are you afraid of? We are, afterall, just anonmyous online posters who you can run away from with the click of a button.

The more O&H you are regarding your situation on here, the more help you can receive. So why would you not want to lay it all out there? Is it because your H reads your thread too and you are afraid of some sort of backlash? If so can he commit to not reading your thread for awhile so that you can get some help with your situation?


unwritten,

I had told my husband I was NOT posting on MB so I did not want to give enough information for him to tell it was me. After my last post I told my husband I was posting. He was very upset about my lying about NOT posting. He saw my posting on this website as a replacement for the affair; my new secret second life. I was going behind his back and getting people other than him to meet my "emotional needs".

In the couple days after I admitting to posting on MB, I also revealed more details about the affair. This disgusted him to the point of saying he can definitely never recover. I put the final nail in the coffin.

I told him a couple days ago if he has really given up on satisfying my "emotional needs" and letting me satisfy his needs then I will continue posting on MB.

So here I am. Hoping to continue cleaning up my side of the fence, which is a horrible mess.


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Originally Posted By: NeverGuessed
The BS drives the recovery bus; the FWS provides the power. That's shorthand for what your BS says he needs, he needs. You have no say in whether it's unreasonable, or if your feel you cannot bring yourself to give it (again). If he were here, we could work with him as we have with other BSs in the past, counseling him that eventually the BS will have to admit that any details still missing are not material to the question at hand. We would explain; we would advise; we would counsel; we would console. What we would NOT do is DECIDE - for him - that he has all that he needs. If WE as uninvolved parties would not do that, my friend, you certainly have no standing to do so.



In order to recover he needs me to admit that the reason I had the affair was because I was hunting for a big fat d*** for years and that I liked having the affair. I need to stop mentioning any bad feelings/thoughts I was having because that had nothing to do with having the affair.


Originally Posted By: NeverGuessed

[color:#3333FF]For those who want not to believe, there is no proof possible!


If "believe" and "trust" can be set as highly similar, the sentence then becomes "For those who want not to trust, there is no proof possible!" You might want to determine, probably without direct questioning, whether Mr WAW actively wants the full recovery not to work. He would not be the first BH here to feel that way.

None of this changes the efforts or direction of your MB-recovery
program. It might, however, give you another tool for your task.


At this moment my DH does not believe recovery is possible. I destroyed our bond forever.


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Originally Posted By: SugarCane
Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE
My memories of the affair were suppressed during a year of "abuse". I buried the memories over many nights of sleeping outside on the ground or walking a lone for miles to be away from my husband raging for hours about what a POS I am.

When was the last time he raise his hand to you, or you to him?


I used to post as IHurtHim

forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2632236&page=1

He last hit me in June then I called the police. He is now in mandatory anger management classes.

I hit him with a glass in October of last year. I should also be in classes but he never involved the police. I am working on my skills of not escalating situations.

I understand Dr. Harley has a 1 year separation policy. Please do not kill my thread (like my last) with this conversation. Much has changed since my last thread and I would like to work on my current issues.


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I want to improve my ability to not Love Buster. This includes not responding to Love Busters with Love Busters. I just want to not hurt my husband any more. He does not want me to do anything for him or with him so I just need to not be hurtful.


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Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE
In the couple days after I admitting to posting on MB, I also revealed more details about the affair. This disgusted him to the point of saying he can definitely never recover. I put the final nail in the coffin.

What kind of details, WAW? You don't have to specify sexual details, but what kind? Did you continue contact with OM after you were supposed to be NC, or what?

You knew better than that after reading and posting here. You knew better than to keep details secret. You know what trickle-truth does to a spouse. Why did you do this?


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Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE
Originally Posted By: SugarCane
Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE
My memories of the affair were suppressed during a year of "abuse". I buried the memories over many nights of sleeping outside on the ground or walking a lone for miles to be away from my husband raging for hours about what a POS I am.

When was the last time he raise his hand to you, or you to him?


I used to post as IHurtHim

forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2632236&page=1

He last hit me in June then I called the police. He is now in mandatory anger management classes.

I hit him with a glass in October of last year. I should also be in classes but he never involved the police. I am working on my skills of not escalating situations.

I understand Dr. Harley has a 1 year separation policy. Please do not kill my thread (like my last) with this conversation. Much has changed since my last thread and I would like to work on my current issues.


I remember your thread now. Boy did sparks fly between some fantastic posters. I thought your posting sound very familiar.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted By: SugarCane
What kind of details, WAW? You don't have to specify sexual details, but what kind? Did you continue contact with OM after you were supposed to be NC, or what?

You knew better than that after reading and posting here. You knew better than to keep details secret. You know what trickle-truth does to a spouse. Why did you do this?


The details were sexual details. It was not about about additional contact.

By the time I found MB, we already had an abusive marriage. The abuse had to end first.

For me, the memories of the affair were buried by the abuse. I took a day to uncover some memories for my husband but there was no value in doing that and I will never go there again.

For my husband, the memories of my affair and things I have said will never fade.

Last edited by WhoAreWE; 10/30/12 09:55 AM.

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I am glad to see you back WAW.

Have you given your BH ALL the details he needs now, and been completely O&H with him about your A and/or any other inappropriate behaviors or A's you have had. You know you will have NO chance at recovery if you don't. None. Zip. Zippo.

If you do not feel physically safe when giving him the information, have someone else present or call him from your car or send him a letter, but he NEEDS to know the truth to have any chance at healing from this, and you need to know that you have been honest for YOU to heal from this regardless of the outcome.

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Would your BH come here and post himself? There are some posters on here who would be excellent resources for him, Markos comes to mind, regarding the AO's etc.

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Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE
By the time I found MB, we already had an abusive marriage. The abuse had to end first.


When was your husband's last angry outburst?


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 17 years, who is a beautiful angel.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE
Originally Posted By: unwritten
WAW, You seem to have a lot to say on other threads (mine specifically), but are really quite guarded about your own story and struggles. Why is that? What are you afraid of? We are, afterall, just anonmyous online posters who you can run away from with the click of a button.

The more O&H you are regarding your situation on here, the more help you can receive. So why would you not want to lay it all out there? Is it because your H reads your thread too and you are afraid of some sort of backlash? If so can he commit to not reading your thread for awhile so that you can get some help with your situation?


unwritten,

I had told my husband I was NOT posting on MB so I did not want to give enough information for him to tell it was me. After my last post I told my husband I was posting. He was very upset about my lying about NOT posting. He saw my posting on this website as a replacement for the affair; my new secret second life. I was going behind his back and getting people other than him to meet my "emotional needs".

In the couple days after I admitting to posting on MB, I also revealed more details about the affair. This disgusted him to the point of saying he can definitely never recover. I put the final nail in the coffin.

I told him a couple days ago if he has really given up on satisfying my "emotional needs" and letting me satisfy his needs then I will continue posting on MB.

So here I am. Hoping to continue cleaning up my side of the fence, which is a horrible mess.


I didn't read your entire previous thread, but enough to see that he is definitely NOT on board with posting here.

I am curious what the veterans think about this. If a BS states that a WS should NOT expose, NOT seek MB guidance, etc. and that is non negotiable, what should a WS who is attempting to use MB as a guidance for recovery do???

It is a real shame that he is not on board with the MB forums. If he read for even a small amount of time he would see that it is not a coddling forum to WS's, and that you would be held accountable for your actions more so than anywhere else IRL.

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Originally Posted By: WhoAreWE


In the couple days after I admitting to posting on MB, I also revealed more details about the affair. This disgusted him to the point of saying he can definitely never recover. I put the final nail in the coffin.

I told him a couple days ago if he has really given up on satisfying my "emotional needs" and letting me satisfy his needs then I will continue posting on MB.

So here I am. Hoping to continue cleaning up my side of the fence, which is a horrible mess.


I would highly recommend the following actions.

1) Provide your BH with every last detail about your A. Do not leave anything out. Come clean, once and for all. I think it was obvious by reading his post to your previous thread, that he felt there were still stones left unturned, and he was right, there were. This is HAUNTING for a BS. This trickle truthing has got to stop. You are right, it is likely the nail in the coffin. Stop hiding behind his 'reactions' to things for your reasoning for the continued trickle truthing. There are methods for you to be honest but in a safe manner, use them.

2) DO continue to clean up your side of the street. First and foremost, become an honest person. And keep attempting to meet his needs and build his love for you. Will he accept it? Maybe not, you have hurt him deeply. I know I went through large portions of post DDay time when I would not accept anything my WH did for me, I still find myself disregarding his attempts well into recovery. It is a defense mechanism, don't let yourself fall back in love with the enemy. KEEP DOING IT ANYWAY. Show him that you are in this, and that you want to make just compensation to him. If he doesn't respond according to the way you would like or expect, by also meeting your EN's and investing in your M, DO IT ANYWAY. If your M ends in a D, then you will know you did everything you could at the end.

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