Hi. New poster here but I've been reading on the site quite a bit. I'm posting here in the recovery section because my wife's affair is over and I am trying to recover the marriage. D-Day was September of 2011. Here is some background:

My wife and I are the same age - 36. We met in college and dated for 6 years before we were married. We have now been married almost 13 years. We have two children, one who is 5 and another that is almost 2.

Back in mid September 2011, I discovered my wife was cheating on me with a man she works with. She is/was a school teacher and so is/was he at the same school. I found this out after she came home late one night (3 or 4 AM) after a girls night out. I saw she had a new text on her phone so I looked to see what it was.

The text message was from a "friend" along the lines of "How did it go with him", and my wife had responded back with the details of what had happened (Oral sex in his truck).

Lot's of TT later I found out they had been in the affair for about 10 months.

Well, you all know how this goes. She promised that she would end it and I found out a few weeks later that she hadn't.

She changed her work email password but I was able to figure it out and this time I decided to just monitor her conversations with the "friend" so I could determine what she was really thinking and doing. Well it turned out that not only was the affair still going, but the "friend" was having an affair as well with yet another man that works at the same school. The "friend" is married as well with two children.

Most of the conversations were about how they planned to entice their APs into the next encounter and talk about when they were successful and when they were not. Meanwhile, at home she was playing actress with me supposedly trying to work on the relationship. She even agreed to go to MC with me which we did.

After several weeks of spying, I couldn't stand it any longer and confronted her again. this time, I got a "total confession" from her about the affair.

She told me that it was/is kissing, manual stimulation on her, and oral pleasure by her on him. At first, it was every day at school, but that turned into once a week on the weekends to once every two weeks or so, to now where she is pursuing him all of the time and is frustrated that he only wants it every couple of weeks. She was depressed because she was in love and he doesn't seem as interested in her as he was in the beginning. She says she tried to get him to have sex with her but he wouldn't because he considered that cheating. While this sounds far fetched, I believe this narrative in general because it matches up with the secret email conversations she had with the "friend" when she didn't know I was reading them.

I called the OM on the phone before she could talk to him at school and threatened to expose the affair to everyone I could tell it to if he didn't end it with her immediately.

And if you hadn't figured it out by now, all of this started right after she became pregnant with the younger child.

Sorry this is so long.

FTF,

Are all of these waywards still working together?

Actually not so long you broke it up into easily readable paragraphs in mostly chronological order.

God Bless
Gamma

So continued...

I ended up demanding that she quit the job and lose all of the work friends. It was too painful for me as many of them knew about the A. The one friend even encouraged it. The whole job and firends there was a secret second life as far as I am concerned.

She left that job last December (2011). The OM has since moved away, and as far as I know she no longer tries to contact anyone associated with the previous workplace, although they do occasionaly try to contact her.

We went through a period of about three months after she left the job where she was still secretly communicating with the one friend that was having an affair too. I discovered it and that has since stopped as well as far as I can tell.

I'm still paranoid though, and I still check up on her phone and computer, etc. I think I just got burned too many times over a course of months, so even though she isn't doing that stuff anymore, I don't really trust.

We've spent more time together in the past year, but I still feel angry a lot of the time and think about it all of the time.

The biggest issue for me since has been her stance that she is not sexually attracted to me. I think she believes that she has never been attracted to me and the OM woke something up in her that she had never experienced before. This has been a major blow to me because even if she has sex with me now, I know she doesn't really want to.

When she told me that back at the beginning I thought it was just fog talk and it would go away. Now I'm not so sure anymore.

They were when she left there. I eventually ended up telling the OMW (About 6 months after I discovered it). They moved away to another state. So at least he is gone. I don't think he had a lot invested in the A anyway.

The last I heard from the one enabler friend was her calling my W to let her know I had told OMW. She was afraid I was going to out her too.

You do need to tell the enabling friend's BH. Wouldn't you have liked to been told about Your WW's affair.

I know, I've been told this before. It was a mistake for me not to say something a year ago, but I know that will bring her back from the dead so to speak and I don't want her around anymore.

I really only added the A background stuff so you would know where I was coming from. My biggest question for this board is how to deal with the whole "never sexually attracted" thing.

It just destroys me. This is a top EN for me and I'm not sure it will ever be satisfied in a real way if in the back of my head I feel like she is comparing her sexual attraction me to me vs OM.

On the radio archives are two segments I have summarized for you. If BrainHurts can link them in her own special way , that would be even better, so you could hear it for yourself. They are from July 25th, 2006, segments A & B.

In these segments, a woman had been married for 16 years and had never liked making love with her husband. The problem never got better. She read books, used testosterone cream, and tried showing her husband how to please her, but none of these things made any difference.

Then, in the 15th year of her marriage, she had an affair, and found that she enjoyed sex with this OM. By the time this woman called the show, she had been NC with the OM for just one week.

Here was Dr. Harley's advice, which I shall take the liberty of reversing the situation to match yours:

Have you asked your wife specifically what it is about you that she finds unappealing. What is it that makes you sexually unattractive TO HER?

For most women, sex is not what makes her fall in love with a man; rather it's that the man is meeting her need for intimate conversation and affection. Once she is in love, a woman finds sex is very easy to do, because her emotions cause her to want to make love and also to enjoy it.

Your wife is either not in love with you or not in love with you enough to enjoy sex with you.

Are you being affectionate with your wife, in the way she enjoys? Are you avoiding all love busters, like arguing and demands that will ruin your relationship?

Has she tried showing you what to do that pleases her? Do you follow her guidance and instruction in this area so that she has a great sexual experience? Men need to be trained in how to make love to a woman.

The Five Steps to Romantic Love has worksheets that offer each spouse a chance to specify their needs and desires in making love.

A big problem in marriage is the contrast effect--contrasting sexual experiences outside of marriage with those with your spouse. With your W's A in the recent past, she is most likely comparing you unfavorably to the OM.This kind of comparison is going to be a distraction.

Your basic physical characteristics are unlikely to change. Is there something that she finds unattractive in your appearance that is under your control to change?

A great sexual relationship CAN be created. A woman MUST train her husband how to be a great lover for her.

He recommended the linked article called "Changing Willingness to Desire." ----> Changing a Willingness to Make Love into a Desire to Make Love

I am sorry you find yourself in this place.

What are your wife's top 5 ENs? It is important to meet them and spend at least 20 hours a week together to fall in love agin with each other.

Are you affectionate with her? Do you have good conversations and listen to her? Do you tell her how much you appreciate her and what she does? Women need to feel a connection with their spouse in order to feel sexually attracted to them. Keep making those love bank deposits, avoid lovebusters, and she will fall back in love with you.

I would cOnsider divorcing her.
If she is providing oral sex to other men and actually tells you that she isn't attracted to you then you need to decide if you want to live your life with someone like that.

hi, ftf, and welcome to MB. my first question is: are you working the programme? the MB M recovery programme?

i ask this, because if you're not, you'll find your M back in the unsatisfactory pre-affair state.

you have done well to kill the affair and have your WW at home. but now you need to start true martial recovery. i'll hold other comments until you've replied.

oh - how many children do you have, and how old are they?

I have asked. She doesn't seem to know. Just that she doesn't feels the same way she did about OM and doesn't ever remember feeling that raw passion for me.

Yes this hurts to hear.

I did try asking another way... What do you find attractive? She says big arms and chest. Well, I've never been a body builder. I think she is just describing OM to be honest.


I've considered that what she got from OM was probably conversation. She said his classroom had been across from hers the prior year and they talked everyday. Mostly about their kids and school. She says she started having sexual dreams about him during this time. She says that has only happened once before in her life with this guy that walked her dwn the asile at a friends wedding. That would have happened 2 years prior to OM.

After his classroom moved away from hers, their luch periods were at the same time, so she started going to eat lunch with him every day.


I changed some of the things she complained about when the A was discovered.

She complained that I laid in bed too late in the mornings and did not get up to help with the kids. This was true, so every day since D-Day I have been up early.

She complained that I left my clothes on the floor near my side of the bed. Again, I have corrected this.

She complained that I came in after work and went to the computer to play. I've stopped this.

Just some examples. Most of it FC things so I have made it a point to do a good job in these areas.

To be honest though, I don't think it has really helped.


I've tried asking her what she wants. Mostly she doesn't want me to touch her or ask for sex. Seriously though, I think she is in a mindset where she is not even open to this really.


I haven't read that one yet. Not sure if she would even be ready to go into that. I'm reluctant to bring yet another book to the table.


By distraction, do you mean something that will distract her or something I should ignore and not get distracted by? It's difficult to ignore because it is painful. She is not mean enough to say "he was like X and you are not" but I get it indirectly like for example telling me she likes a big arms a chest. Or telling me dress pants are sexy. I know who she is talking about.



Maybe. Not sure.



thatnks for the link. It's a good read. Just need her to read it though I think.

it sounds like it's not that she's not attracted to you. she's just not in love with you (you mentioned her "feelings.") the good news is you can remedy that! i think you said in your first post that you have HNHN? that's a great start. the formula is really simple. avoid LBs, meet ENs. when the top ENs are consistently met, romantic love develops and deepens. the result will be the SF you desire.

i know that appears too simple. but it works. the trick is knowing what the top ENs are, and how, specifically, to meet them. do you know what your WWs top ENs are? IC is obviously one of them. do you now how to meet that in a way that is pleasing to her? women typically require affection and IC, lots of it, in order to be interested in SF.

I hope you can recover your marriage. If you don't already have the book Surviving An affair by Dr Harley you ned to get it ASAP.

You need to expose WW's cheating friends affair to her BH. Once done that toxic friend will be out of your lives for every.

Now if you have not heard of the phrase trickle truth it means WW's will only admitt to what their BH can prove and or to admitt some of the truth then claim she has told her BH everything to get the BH to stop asking questions.

Your WW claims they did not have intercourse. All WW's claim that because they know their BH's are willing and hoping to believe that his WW did not give up the ultimate physical betrayal. Also I have to point out is that WW's when they get to the point that they had sex, will claim a condom was used.

As common knowledge WW's always try to minimize the damage so if the admit sex they will lie about the fact that condoms were used.

This is why you need to have a DNA paternity test done.

Here are the clips LWFH was talking about.

Radio Clip on Wife Never Liking Sex
Segment #2

Tell us what you think.

We did do the EN Questionnaire shortly after the A was over. I remember she listed IC as her #1. FC was in the top few. FS was listed too but she said I needed to earn twice as much. I think that one was really more reacting to the fact she had to give up her job.

We should probably do it again now that things are further out from D-Day.

I know ALL about TT. The truth is I'll never really know if they had intercourse or not probably. I know she wanted to. I know she complained to her friend that he wouldn't. I'm not sure it makes it any worse either way actually. It's bad enough what she DID do while pregnant.

As for my child. Well, she looks just like the other kid. I'd say 99% sure it's mine. My W offered to have the test done, but she is my kid now either way.

We have started to schedule UA time together and we have read and watched some of the free stuff on the site. We have both read HNHN.

She is not really enthusiastic about it though. I seem to be the one to have to suggest this stuff.



Probably. But even if that's the truth, I don't think she really believes it.

Hi, FF, welcome to Marriage Builders. I have read through your thread and I will just tell you that the problem is that she has fallen out of love. You don't spend enough time together to sustain the love in your marriage. And that is the ENTIRE reason she is not attracted to you and does not want to spend time with you.

If you spent 20+ hours per week of UA time with her, she would fall back in love again. But you have to really do it. Bring the body and the mind will follow. It will take 8 to 12 weeks for her to fall in love again if you do this.

I would order the workbook, Five Steps to Romantic Love [$11 on this website] and tear out the UA worksheet in the back and make copies. Start scheduling 20+ hours per week with your wife. Find fun things to do; write out the dates, times, etc. Spend that time meeting these the top 4 INTIMATE emotional needs of conversation, affection, recreational companionship and sexual fulfillment. That will make the most radical changes in the shortest amount of time.

Do you have the book Surviving an Affair?

The Policy of Undivided Attention

Women need 2 things to desire sex: an emotional attachment to the man and the prospect of enjoyment. Women don't want to make love to men they are not in love with. You can change all that if you use this program. Here is another article that addresses this problem.
The question of the ages:
How can a husband receive the sex he needs in marriage?