I'm going to try to shorten this as much as possible. If you have any questions just ask. So, about 3 years ago my wife became obsessed with facebook. She was either on the pc or on her phone on facebook all the time. The last thing she looked at at night and the first this upon waking. I tried to talk to her about it. She would get very mad, tell me she needed to unwind from the kids, we have 3, and facebook helped. In Feb. 2012, after suspecting for a while, I found house and vehicle keys in her purse. I knew right away who it was. I talked to his wife, but it didn't phase anything. In the summer 2012 I hired a PI and lawyer and filed for divorce. I did everything I knew to do. She involved the kids in this from the start and told them what to say to me to "keep Dad from getting mad about their friend." Kids are now 13, 10 and 4. In Nov. 2012 she moved out into a house he bought for them. She started telling me 2 weeks later that she wanted to come home and repair our marriage. From then until just 2 days ago she has told me every excuse in the book and then some for not leaving that house and coming home. She says she wants to go to counseling with me, repair our lives, meet each others needs, and wishes this never happened. He divorced his wife and we were divorced in Oct. 2013 after a year waiting period. Her words sound great on what she's willing to do to rebuild us. Everything sounds almost textbook. Except one thing...when I ask her when she is going to leave OM and do this she always says the same thing..."I can't tell you that honestly because I really don't know. It could be in 2 hours or it could be next week. I just can't answer that." When I ask why she would stay if she wants all this with me she says "I guess it's just fear or dread, I really don't know." I would love to rebuild my family, but I just don't know what to do here. I feel I have run out of options. She says there is no love at all for OM and she doesn't want to stay there. Any advice?

First off, have you exposed the affair to everyone?

And secondly, you really need to go into Plan B and get custody of your kids. Your wife is in her glory by having 2 men meet her needs. She has made her choice: the OM *AND* you. If you would remove yourself from the scene, the affair would fall apart eventually. But by staying in touch, you are inadvertantly propping up the affair. And destroying your mental and physical health in the bargain!

Yes everyone has known about the affair for over a year. We have joint custody of the kids. You are right about driving it driving me crazy. She tells me that she loves me all the time. Says she just has to get the courage to leave om. I have read surviving an affair, his needs he needs, and his needs her needs for parents. Nothing I have tried so far has worked. Plan b is hard to do with the kids, but its what I need to do. What do i say when she starts about coming home and says she loves me?

You won't know when she starts talking about coming home. You will cut her off completely until she ends all contact for life with the OM. I would go read up on Plan B and come back and we can help you with next steps.

When you say it is exposed, do you mean everyone knows the TRUTH? Do your children know the truth? Does the OM's entire family know what he has done?

Are you divorced?

Yes, divorce was final in Oct. 2013.

Yes his family knows. This guy is distant kin to me. I never was around him but he is kin. My kids also know the truth, they have lived in the middle as she involved them from the get go. Plan b is gonna be hard swapping the kids. I don't know how I can cut off all contact with 3 kids.

Ok, I would do this a little differently. I would tell her you aren't going to wait around for this and to not contact you anymore unless she has ended all contact for good and is ready to discuss reconciliation. And THEN you will make a decision about whether or not you are interested.

See, she has been keeping you around as an option so she won't feel so guilty. That helps prop up her affair.

I would find an intermediary and have all pertinent information passed through that person. That person would act as a SPAM filter. When you do child exchanges, either have thee children meet you in the drive way or find some other way to do it. [exchange at school or a friends house]

Send her a letter that goes something like this:

Dear WW, I have given this much thought and have decided it is time for me to move on. You must know how much suffering I have endured because of your affair. Because of that, I have decided to end contact with you for now. Until your affair ends I will avoid seeing you or talking to you.

Our friends, ________, have agreed to help make arrangements for you to see our children on a schedule that is mutually convenient. If you want to communicate about the children, it will have to be through them.

When you end your relationship with JoeLoser, let me know and we can discuss possible reconciliation. I cared for you when we married and I continue to care for you right up to this day. But I cannot be with you or help you as long as you are in this relationship.

All my best, allicantake

Oh no, you don't cut off contact with the kids. You cut off contact with HER. That is not that hard.

Do your kids and family know she left to pursue an AFFAIR? Or do they know the lies the waywards told?

No I didn't mean cut off the kids. I meant it's going to be hard to avoid talking to her when we have 3 kids and have to co-parent. I have told her exactly what you wrote I should say more than once. Every time I do that, in a couple days, she starts feeling me out by saying she's going to come home and telling me she loves me. Lately, when she does this, I focus my attention on getting the kids in my vehicle and leaving without communicating with her. I told her there was no "us" as long as he's any part of her life whatsoever, and there will never again be an "us", until she gets rid of him for life. And we swap the kids at a neutral site, I'm not going anywhere near that house. We just meet and swap the kids.

What gets me is that she says the words she needs to, almost identical to what I've read in Dr. Harley's books. It's just that she always says she has to get up the courage to leave OM, that fear and dread keep her from leaving. She says there have been some things said that she took as threatening. Notice I said "she says" as I cannot vouch that there is any truth to this.

I would first find an intermediary and when you do the swaps, have the kids just come out to the car. You can also send the kids out to the car without speaking to or SEEING HER. Another option is to do your exchanges at a friends house, where she drops them off and jsut the friend/relative sees her.

You do not have to "coparent." That is a very bad idea for you and for her. There is absolutely nothing that can't be communicated via a 3rd party.

And this time if she says "I love you" and all that you won't be able to hear that. In fact, I would add the condition that she move out of the OM house and end her affair before you will even speak to her. You can't hear that if you are not in contact. Your IM should NEVER relay that message to you. Your IM should tell her to move out and end her affair FIRST and then we will see.

It is a mistake to go by her words. As you can see!

What is your current custody agreement?
Does her lover have a criminal background?

Please read.
Parallel Parenting
Intermediary Training School

Jedi, we share joint custody of our children. And except for traffic violations, there's no criminal background.

Brainhurts, thanks for the links. Good reads.

Melodylane, Yeah, I heard that. 2 years worth of words and not a single action to go with them.

Go no contact with her

I have been no contact at all for 5 days now. We'll see what happens now.

Ok. So I'm back after 3 more years of the same thing. Thought I'd just add it here so everyone would know the whole story. Nothing ever changed between my ex wife and I from my first post here in 2014 until the present. She still lives with OM and she's still saying she loves me and wants to come home. Just last week I met someone and went out for the first time since this happened. Yes 5 years later. My ex told me Friday that she would be home on the weekend. I told her let's hold off on that. She knew right off I'd met someone. Now she's escalated the talk of coming home saying she'll share everything, passwords, phones, use gps on her car, etc. She's saying she can't believe I might throw away our past 21 years together to take a chance with someone I don't know. The lady I met is really understanding and open with me. She's been great so far. But it's not fair to her if I can't give her everything I have because of my ex. I'm really struggling with what to do here. Do I take a chance with my ex? Or do I take the chance with this new person? My ex has only used email, and very limited at that, to contact me this whole time. She feels threatened by this new person in my life and says she doesn't want to lose what we had. I know I did a lot wrong during her affair and should have cut all contact long ago, but I am where I am, so does anyone have any advice for a guy that needs it badly right now? I may not have listened before because my heart wouldn't let me, but I will now. Help!

Just one more thing. This is her third affair. First one in 1999 lasted 4 months. Second was a distance affair, so to speak. I found a prepaid cell phone she was using around 2003. Then this one from december 2011 to present. she wants to come straight to my house from OM house with my guarantee it will last on my end. Says she doesnt have anywhere else to go.

I guess I know what I need to do to move on. I know this is a forum that supports marriage and reconciliation so I thought I'd post here to see if anyone thinks there's hope after 5+ years of this or if I'd be better off just going on.

Did anything change?

WE don't support marriage at all cost. Dr Harley says if the affair hasn't ended in 2 years, you should move on.

So she has been out of contact with you and living with another man for 6 years and she doesn't want to lose you?

Sorry for laughing, but Wayward is as Wayward does.

This is a woman who has no regard for you or for the POSOM that she's hooked up with.

Do you want to spend the rest of your life like a yo yo and committing to someone who has no regard for you? You don't deserve that.

Marriage is a vow and a lifelong commitment, so I understand why you are considering this. But, no. you don't need to be in that kind of prison.

Your ex wife is a serial cheater and has been wayward for most of your M. She's not going to change. She will probably never be happy with just one person meeting her ENs.

Even if she followed through on her promise to come home, do you really want to be with someone will likely never give up their independent behavior and secret second life?

You need to go dark Plan B(no contact with an IM) with your WXW, like we've told you many, many times. She knows she holds you hostage and this is just more of her games with you.

No nothing ever changed. She has kept saying she was coming home and I was her home, the love of her life, and no one could change that. She still lives with OM as I type this. So, no, nothing has changed with her at all, but she's saying I've met someone now and I'm going to throw away my family and 21 years we spent together for a woman I don't even know. I don't know this new woman, true, but I'm not doing that, she did 5 1/2 years ago.

And I should have did exactly this 5 years ago. I didn't and have allowed her to control my life this entire time. Now she says this new person I met must be something else for me to consider walking away from my family for. That's not even halfway right. I devoted over 5 years to trying everything I could to save our marriage. I'm afraid if I let her come back she'll stray again later on even though she says she'd never and she's truly learned her lesson. I've not seen that, it's only been emails. I just don't want to do something I'll regret later. I want and deserve happiness and peace after all this.

You must not believe her words only her actions. How can you believe anything she says when she writes you and then is sleeping with OM? She has already given you her answer, 5 1/2 years worth. She's not serious at all.

She enjoys cake eating from you and OM.

You should move on. This contact with your ex is unhealthy and is holding you back from experiencing a more fulfilling relationship.

It was an honest mistake to marry WW the first time.

To not divorce WW would not be a mistake only stupid.

all I can take,
how long did you actually go TRUE No Contact with your ex-wife? (days, months, years, not at all)

In your last post years ago, you stated that it had been 5 days at that point (but then you just went MIA).

Curious if you've ever actually tried to do something different then what you've already proven doesn't work for anyone involved.

Thanks and take care.

[quote=top rope]all I can take,
how long did you actually go TRUE No Contact with your ex-wife? (days, months, years, not at all)

In your last post years ago, you stated that it had been 5 days at that point (but then you just went MIA).

Curious if you've ever actually tried to do something different then what you've already proven doesn't work for anyone involved.

That 5 days was about it. With 3 kids involved with no real help to exchange them between ex and I it was pretty much impossible to go total no contact. I have left her coming back up to her this whole time. Told her she could if she wanted to and knew she could do the work it would take for us. That was insane of me. I just let her control my life for almost 6 years. I read the book No More Mr Nice Guy recently and it helped a bunch. What really made me see the light was meeting someone new and seeing that I don't have to put up with being treated like that. But, the new lady thinks I might let my ex come back someday and she's not willing to risk that and be hurt again like she has before. I don't know how to get her to see that's not going to happen, but she says she knows I've not dated in 5 years so I must be still hung on my ex. It sucks, I feel like I make a step forward and then get set back a mile.

You can go NC if you really wanted to. We have parents with young kids do it all the time. You just have to want to.

Did you ever read these?

Also, I don't blame the new lady because she has watched your actions and you've never cut contact with your XW and so any smart woman wouldn't want to sign up for that. Sorry to tell you.

Why don't you finally go NC?

I used to really care and it bothered me what my ex was doing, but I couldn't care any less right now what she does or doesn't do. As far as going NC, I haven't spoken to her in 2 weeks except to set a time to swap the kids. I'm tired of this ruining my life.

So are you going to get an IM so you don't have to talk to her at all?

Hi, Let me encourage you to explore all options.... You really can go no contact with an ex and I would show your new lady all the steps you are taking to prove that you are not going to go back to her.

1. How old are your kids. At some point, mine can walk into a restaurant by themselves and the ex picks them up from there, we never see each other as the oldest has a phone to contact the ex to let them know they are there.
2. If the kids are young, every police station or library many times have special swaping places for these kinds of situations- check them out.

3. A friend can be an IM and pass along to you only the (can we switch weekends, I can't get kids until this time etc) but you tell them what to respond so you are still never the person to respond to them.OR
4. At this point my oldest is IM. I am to hear nothing about my ex at all except for times/dates on exchanges, all communication goes through him. If a time needs to change, my child and I discuss it and I just tell him what to say back to my ex. It has worked beautifully.


I would also say that as a woman, I wouldn't date a guy who spoke to and saw the ex the way you have. However, if he showed me how far he would go to protect me from the two of you getting back together- then I might give it a shot.

(think about it like this: if you meet an amazing woman but she let her ex hang onto her the same way you have- would YOU feel safe???)

This x10,000.

Plan B her and never see or talk to her again.

Reconciliation, marriage-saving...these things are for people that are REPENTANT and this woman is not. She is your past and she needs to stay there. You will only feel reminded of the affair and divorce any time she contacts you or you see her. It's a recipe for continual misery and it will last as long as you allow it to.

Allicantake.

Thank you for posting and updating, it has inspired me to stay true to my plans, because it's easy to fall back into our spouses/ex control.

My wife of 20 years also had multiple affairs. I always forgave her because I am madly in love with her and I take my vows seriously

I still want her back, but I can no longer allow this bad behavior in my life. I spent the past 11 years trying to meet her needs and waited for her to reciprocate, with only enough effort from her to keep me stringing along in our marriage.

We just separated last week. While I would absolutely take her back. It's no longer healthy for me to keep waiting. Time is very limited in our lives and it seems the only time she made an effort is when I didn't wait anymore and I moved on.

Easier said then done, but my hope is that unless she puts 110% into fixing our marriage. She will have to wait on me, as I create a new life. Because waiting on her the past 11 years created a lot of unneeded self destruction in my life and was not healthy

Thanks for mentioning the book "no more mr nice guy". Looks like it has potential

I pray that everything works out for you, because I feel your pain and it is not fun

Nobitterness, you hit the nail on the head. I always forgave my wife also because I loved her even though she obviously didn't love me the same way. I ruined a budding relationship with a wonderful lady because of stupidity of believing my ex again. That won't happen anymore, but I've tried to work it out with the new lady to no avail. I'm reading another book currently. It's called Boundaries. I have realized that the first, and maybe only, boundary I ever set was when I filed for divorce in 2012. That's unhealthy and I know it is. I'm like you, I hoped my ex would put 100% effort into reconciliation, but I don't think that'll ever happen. I wish you well, because you're right, it's very painful and definitely not fun.

It's extremely painful, But I'm learning from your post that I need to set limits. I can't place my life on pause waiting for her to "come around". Especially when I have already been down this road several times before

Not to sound cold, because I am madly in love with her. But I am emotionally exhausted

**EDIT**