*As a bit of background on the situation, my husband became self-employed a few months ago. This was a few weeks after I quit my job, as we both agreed that I should focus on finishing school and take on an internship opportunity. The decision for him to quit his previous salaried job, on the other hand, was not something that was enthusiastically agreed to by the both of us. Currently his self-employed job brings in money randomly maybe once or twice a month and the amount it will be is uncertain until the sale is made. We had previously agreed that I would manage our money (as he did not want to have anything to do with it), and we have a joint account in which the money for bills, food, etc., is put so that we can both see the transactions and where money is going. I was also in charge of coming up with a savings plan for our joint savings account. We both knew how much was allocated for what, so neither of us were blind to our cost of living. At his previous job we had agreed he could have a bi-weekly allowance of �fun� money that he could put into his own account (he is a spender and I am a saver). I also had my own account in which I put the money I made from my job, in order to pay my car loan and school tuition/books/etc. Before moving in together it was agreed that I finish paying my personal bills while in school, while he pay for our living expense. My husband knows how much money I have in my own account,but I have no idea what is in his own account.*


There were no issues for the first two years of us living together, but now that there is no �set� amount of money coming in on a regular basis, we are running into some problems. Since he makes the sales, only he knows how much money is really coming in (and he does not tell me about every sale...I find this out later when it slips in conversation or I find a stray deposit slip). Because of this, I have not been able to put money into our savings for us at all, but there has been evidence of him spending money on other things (ex: suggests we eat out, buys snacks, drinks, randomly comes home with bags of food, able to spontaneously go to events with friends that cost money to get into).

We have tried re-discussing ways of dealing with finances, but he wants to have nothing to do with managing money for bills. He feels that it is okay for him to withhold money for himself, and that I do not need to know how much that is because it�s his money. He also says that he retains a lot of money to pay business expenses, but when I ask how much and what for he gives me uninformative generalizations or says there�s no point in talking about it because �You wouldn�t understand�. This is hurting me, as I do not have �fun� money of my own but don�t complain about it, and I take on the stress of feeling like we don�t have enough money to get by at times because I manage the bills alone. He feels that unexpected money should be spent on �fun�, despite us previously agreeing that extra money should first go to paying off our credit card debt and making sure bills get paid on time. We have discussed future plans and vacations that we would like to do, and have agreed on a savings plan to achieve those things, but when it comes time to implement the plans he no longer wants to follow them. This bothers me because I see the capability of reaching our long term goals, but they are barely out of reach. And it also bothers him when those goals don�t happen, but he doesn't seem to understand why.

We have also tried discussing a way for him to have his own �fun� money again, but we both recognize the inconsistent payment of his job, therefore an amount cannot be agreed upon. And regardless, he violates any agreement by keeping the actual number of sales to himself, as well as the amount of money earned off of those sales, thinking I won�t notice.


So my question is, is my husband in the right saying that the money he makes is his as I am no longer working, and he can do as he pleases with it? �Our� money has become �his� money. But then when I am unable to manage it, it is my fault if things don�t work out like they should have. Has anyone else run into such a conflict? What are some ways it could be resolved?

Welcome to MB. Have you read these?
How to Resolve Financial Conflicts and Keep Love in Your Marriage Letter #1
How to Resolve Financial Conflicts and Keep Love in Your Marriage Letter #2

We have talked about implementing the POJA quite a bit and are currently reading Love Busters and just starting the workbook. But, I am unsure how to go about actually suggesting finances follow that same agreement, I guess because I don't work at the moment so I feel like I have no room to say anything. Perhaps I will refer him to these letters and maybe that will help, as they show just how important it is to follow through in every aspect of marriage. We both have a lot to work on, and now I am beginning to understand how much of a difference the POJA can really make.

Thanks for the helpful resources!

This is not valid. You have equal stake in the finances. Merely because you are not working does not change things. All decisions must be made with enthusiastic agreement. It is detrimental to your marriage to assume an inferior posture and not apply the POJA.

As a general rule, all money accounts should be joint.
Separate accounts enable independent lifestyles which hurt marriages.

My husband is also self employed. His income is sporadic and generally I don't know what he makes. I contacted another organization, and they suggested implementing a budget. We haven't done this but it would help you to see where the money is going, how to save and how much each of you are contributing. It's just a suggestion. I married my husband knowing he was self employed, and I never thought in a million years, how this would affect me emotionally. It's been a sore depot for years. He has no benefits, no retirement, no sick days or paid vacation days. It's heart wrenching as a woman to go through those emotions. I totally empathize with you and your plight.

Everything a married person does affects his or her spouse. Everything. That includes all spending.

Good point. I never considered the way I was thinking to be inferior before, I always thought it was just "how things should be". But now I can see that my thinking that way definitely doesn't help either.

I am glad that I am not the only one who feels that way. That is one of my biggest problems with the finances being so sporadic, I worry more about future financial outcomes, whereas he is more concerned with the present. I just flipped through the Five Steps to Romantic Love workbook and saw that there is a section in there based on budgeting and financial support, so I think once we get to that hopefully things will get sorted out a little better so that both of us can agree enthusiastically on how the finances will work.



Just in the past couple of weeks I have noticed that we both tend to say "MY money" or "when MY check comes in then I will make sure to get...". I pointed this out a few days ago and suggested we immediately both start thinking and saying "OUR money" and "WE can get...". By changing the way we say things out loud we are trying to take steps towards changing the way we view our finances, together.

My husband seems to be incredibly bothered by me not having a �noticeable� social life, to the point that he always brings it up when he is upset. I always say how I do have a social life and get the interaction I want and need through my classes, phone calls, and spending time with him, etc. But, he feels this is not enough, and says that it burdens him that he is my �only� outlet. To him, I should be out hanging with friends more because I am in college and that�s supposed to be the most �fun� years of life�even though I always remind him that I�m not 18 and single, but am 24 and married, have been in college for years already, and HAVE been having fun, in my own way.

I know that to some point this has to be encouraging independent behavior, and I asked him if he just wanted me to go out more so that he could go out more, but he said that's not why. He says it's just that he honestly thinks it will make me happier to get out more, and purely wants it for my own happiness. My problem with this is that my happiness is not at stake, I get the amount of social interaction that makes me happy. However,I know that he does not, for various reasons. He complains that he never gets to go out and do anything, because he always feels bad that I stay home. By doing �anything�, this specifically means hanging out with his friends. He has invited me before, but I have told him that I feel like I can�t relate much to his friend group as they are all single men, so either he goes alone and feels bad that I stayed home, or doesn�t go at all and blames me for never getting to have fun. We have talked about finding couples friends many times, but haven�t figured out a way to actually meet people.

I know that we are supposed to be each other�s favorite recreational companions, but it worries me that won�t be possible, as he places much more value on having a social life than I do. I guess my question is (If this makes sense): Is it possible to really want your spouse to partake in independent behavior for selfless reasons? Or is it usually in an attempt to get away with your own independent behavior? Also, is it really possible to become your spouse�s favorite recreational companion, when they place such a high value on having a social life with their friends?

How much UA time do you get each week?

What do you do during your RA? Are they things you both enjoy?

Welcome to Marriage Builders Pink Polish. Its really commendable you have arrived here having already recognized the foundation you are building your marriage is an important adjusting period you want to work together in negotiations. You want to build a compatible foundation. Learning MB principles can really benefit your marriage immediately and long term.

I've learned through MB just how important it is to frame out 15-20 hours per week of undivided attention, spending the time to meet one another's top emotional needs for recreational companionship, intimate conversation, affection, and sexual fulfillment. If you have yet to adjust to one another and figure out how to manage this, other activities that are independent should not be planned. Ultimate you want to be one another's #1 recreational companion through out your marriage. And its a really good idea to meet all the above four needs during the four scheduled blocks of time. I've personally found this important because otherwise you sort of place your relationship in the friend zone more so then the romantic partner space. Sure you want to be friends but you don't want to be one of the guys either.

Getting on board with this notion can really make a difference in perspective even for an IBer. Perhaps your husband is fearful of your dependence on him so is resistant to actually building a more interdependent lifestyle. Whereas you actually simply want to build and adjust to one another in a more interdependent way.

The thing you want to have these 'hot dates' and have quality and the quantity it takes to remain "in love" and build a lifestyle that is protective of your marriage through respectful negotiations.

Building a foundation based on IB will ruin a good thing and good things to come.

It seems you have been reading up on MB principles. Have you read His Need Her Needs or He Wins She Wins? It would really help for your husband to get on board at this early point in your marriage. You will need to sell him on the idea!

Here, The Critical Importance of Undivided Attention

We haven't been setting UA time yet (next week will be our first week and we are aiming for 20hrs/wk). We usually spend 2-3 hrs a day together during the week, and most of the weekend, but that time is usually filled with running errands, watching movies, playing video games, or doing separate things in the same room...so I don't think any of that falls under "undivided attention". Also, our time together during the week is usually after 7pm, which makes it harder to find things to get out and "do", and just talking together is too "boring" for him as we do not meet the same need for conversation. Occasionally we get out and spend time with his family, but that turns into "girl" time and "guy" time, so again I don't think that could fall under UA time.

Overall, we tend to prefer different activities. I like to get out and about with one-on-one time, whereas he likes to do things that involve what I feel are distractions from each other (like video games, us hanging out with his friends, watching tv, surfing the internet, etc.). We have talked about doing various things on weekends such as hiking, taking a fitness class together, going to parks, weekend getaways, even ice skating, but my H is not particularly fond of planning, so it is hard to find activities we can both agree on without discussing them ahead of time.

Ultimately, I am unsatisfied with how we currently spend our time together, while he is satisfied with that, but unsatisfied with his lack of friend-time.

That is exactly one of our main problems that we discussed before beginning the MB program. I felt he was being too independent, and he felt that I was being too dependent. We have read the first half of LB and also a few chapters out of HNHN, but one of our problems seems to be that our needs and interests don't align at all, therefore it is hard to agree on things to do. Perhaps we will try planning actual 'dates' like you suggested, rather than just trying to find activities to do, that way we can get a nice mix of both. He is on board for the MB program and has been interested in the concepts and information, it is just that when it comes to actually applying what's learned to real life, there appears to be little effort if it is not to his sole benefit (at least that is how it seems to me).

Thank you for that link, I am going to show it to him before we sit-down and schedule our UA time this weekend.

On a side note, although we both enthusiastically agreed to scheduling UA time, I worry that it may also cause him resentment, even if we are both happy during our time together. I feel like I am being selfish by wanting to schedule so much time with him, which he could be using to do other things he feels are also important (like extra work for more money, and spending time with friends), so I will be waiting to hear the 'social life' argument come up again if he gets upset. I know that our marriage is more important than anything else, but I am not sure how to get him to see that, or at least understand why I feel that way.

Once you build a romantic, integrated marriage he can do those things after all your UA time is met. When you both become each other's favorite recreational companion you will want to spend all your time together and hate to be apart.

It would be good to ask the moderators to merge your threads. You will get better advice by staying on one thread. It makes it easier for others to understand what you are dealing with.

Just hit the Notify button at the bottom this message window, and ask for your threads to be merged.

Threads merged. Please stick to one thread.

Aren't you his WIFE?