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Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Originally Posted by apples123
Have you seen a doctor?
Would you please answer this?


Yes, I've seen a doctor.

I requested a testosterone check from my family doctor and that came back with normal levels.


I should also note that I was experiencing ED issues. My first doctor prescribed ED pills and said that they would boost confidence.

I also went to a urologist at the suggestion of my doctor. The urologist said that all of my issues were psychosomatic and stress/anxiety induced, and also prescribed me some ED pills.

The pills did boost my confidence for a little while, but that didn't last long because I could never get my wife into the mood for actual sex.

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Originally Posted by unwritten
I am confused as to who it is that is stopping you from having sex. Your first couple of posts made it seem as if she is not enthusiastic. But since then, it appears it is her #1 EN and you are not enthusiastic about it.

Do either of you instigate? It would seem if she is preparing to divorce you for a lack of sex, she would be trying to have sex at some point, and being rejected by you. Or is she also not trying and is more wanting you to court her and instigate?


I have tried over and over to meet her need. However, she's not receptive. My attempts come off in her words as "goofy, immature, etc". She does not, will not, and feels like she should not have to initiate sex. She is in the latter category of wanting me to court her and initiate. I'm fine with that, but I'm just confused in general. I take her out to nice dinners, activities, etc, and it never ends with sex. The transition from awesome date to intimacy just doesn't happen for some reason.


Originally Posted by unwritten
Are you concerned about meeting this need for her? What have you done to get over your 'confusion' about sex and meet this need?


I'm 100% concerned with meeting this need. I've seen doctors, I started going to marriage counseling, and I've read books. I've done everything she has asked me to do with an open mind.


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Are you going to email Dr. Harley?


FWW/BW (me)
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Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. When your email question is chosen to be answered on the radio show, you will be notified by email directing you to listen to the rebroadcast. If you would like to consider being a caller, include your telephone number. You will be called by us to explain the procedure to you. Every caller will receive a complementary book by Dr. Harley that addresses their question.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted by whitespot
[
I have tried over and over to meet her need. However, she's not receptive. My attempts come off in her words as "goofy, immature, etc". She does not, will not, and feels like she should not have to initiate sex. She is in the latter category of wanting me to court her and initiate. I'm fine with that, but I'm just confused in general. I take her out to nice dinners, activities, etc, and it never ends with sex. The transition from awesome date to intimacy just doesn't happen for some reason.

What are you doing on your awesome dates?

There is a required 15 hours of UA (Undivided Attention) time to maintain love, and 20-25 to create love. Are you spending at least 15 hours of time courting/dating a week? These hours should be undivided attention, meaning, watching a movie does not qualify. Riding in the car while talking on the phone to someone else, does not qualify. They should be filling the 4 intimate emotional needs: RC (recreational companionship), AF (affection), IC (intimate conversation), and SF (which is I know why you are here). Is the time you are spending filling at least the other 3 needs?

I ask this because Dr Harley often says that SF often falls into place when a couple is meeting the other needs and is in love.

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Originally Posted by whitespot
I have tried over and over to meet her need. However, she's not receptive. My attempts come off in her words as "goofy, immature, etc". She does not, will not, and feels like she should not have to initiate sex. She is in the latter category of wanting me to court her and initiate. I'm fine with that, but I'm just confused in general. I take her out to nice dinners, activities, etc, and it never ends with sex. The transition from awesome date to intimacy just doesn't happen for some reason.

It sounds like the way in which you are attempting to meet her need is not working. And by this I mean the way you are courting her and/or instigating SF. Does she communicate with you the way in which she would like to be courted/warmed up for SF?

If she says your attempt is goofy or immature, ask her how she would like you to attempt. You can use her information to do it differently the next time.

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Originally Posted by whitespot
Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Originally Posted by apples123
Have you seen a doctor?
Would you please answer this?


Yes, I've seen a doctor.

I requested a testosterone check from my family doctor and that came back with normal levels.


I should also note that I was experiencing ED issues. My first doctor prescribed ED pills and said that they would boost confidence.

I also went to a urologist at the suggestion of my doctor. The urologist said that all of my issues were psychosomatic and stress/anxiety induced, and also prescribed me some ED pills.

The pills did boost my confidence for a little while, but that didn't last long because I could never get my wife into the mood for actual sex.

This post leads me to believe that your wife is not frustrated with the ED, as much as she is frustrated with the lack of or way in which you court her. I would continue the ED medication while you work on the ways that you court her, so that if/when the opportunity for SF occurs you are able to satisfy her need. But you need to simultaneously work on the 'getting there' part which is the bigger issue.

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Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. When your email question is chosen to be answered on the radio show, you will be notified by email directing you to listen to the rebroadcast. If you would like to consider being a caller, include your telephone number. You will be called by us to explain the procedure to you. Every caller will receive a complementary book by Dr. Harley that addresses their question.


Thanks. Yes, I do plan on emailing Dr. Harley later tonight.

Originally Posted by unwritten
Originally Posted by whitespot
[
I have tried over and over to meet her need. However, she's not receptive. My attempts come off in her words as "goofy, immature, etc". She does not, will not, and feels like she should not have to initiate sex. She is in the latter category of wanting me to court her and initiate. I'm fine with that, but I'm just confused in general. I take her out to nice dinners, activities, etc, and it never ends with sex. The transition from awesome date to intimacy just doesn't happen for some reason.

What are you doing on your awesome dates?

There is a required 15 hours of UA (Undivided Attention) time to maintain love, and 20-25 to create love. Are you spending at least 15 hours of time courting/dating a week? These hours should be undivided attention, meaning, watching a movie does not qualify. Riding in the car while talking on the phone to someone else, does not qualify. They should be filling the 4 intimate emotional needs: RC (recreational companionship), AF (affection), IC (intimate conversation), and SF (which is I know why you are here). Is the time you are spending filling at least the other 3 needs?

I ask this because Dr Harley often says that SF often falls into place when a couple is meeting the other needs and is in love.


Awesome dates: "Awesome dates" were her words. She specifically said multiple times she's frustrated that we were "going on awesome and romantic dates that never end with sex." As an example of one of our dates, we went on an Art Walk, looked at art, drank wine, held hands, kissed, talked about art and how fun the night was, etc. It was romantic. However, nothing happened when we got home and the night basically just ended with me kissing her good night in bed and both of us falling asleep.

UA: I do believe that we are spending at least 15 hours of UA time each week already. When I started seeing my therapist, she told us to go do activities together and things will just "click" eventually. Since then, we starting geocaching together, dance classes, hiking, going on dinner dates, etc. All these activities allow us to talk, and I constantly ask her if she's "having fun" and she responds with a "yes" every single time with a smile and a kiss.

AF: I don't think this is an issue from my part, unless I'm mistaken. (A lot of what has been said here so far leads me to question my own perception of things). I give her hugs and kisses many times a day. Earlier in the year when she was frustrated with the lack of SF, she told me "stop kissing me. why do you want to kiss me ALL the time." I scaled back my kissing by about half as a result. (I would kiss her in the morning after making her coffee and breakfast, random times during the day since I work from home, at night when we sit on the couch watching tv, before we went to sleep, etc). Also, there were times she told me out of frustration that she feels nothing when I kiss her now, and that it's like when her brother kisses her. Nowadays, she gives me the forehead half of the time when I lean in to give her a kiss.

IC: I'm going to admit that I'm not sure if we have IC. We talk about things like what we want to do this weekend, birthdays that are coming up, friends and what they are up to, etc. We rarely, if ever, argue. The 4 points of good conversation that Dr. Harley pointed out seems to be everything that we have. We have none of the negative 4 points either.



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Sir getting information out of you is like squeezing a lemon.
You are the classic exit door patient who after the exam, walking out the door, says, Oh BTW doctor my penis has turned purple for a few months.

You didn't post you have ED until recently. That is obviously a major change from your wife not enjoying sex.

Is there anything else you are not posting?
If so please do it now.

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At this point, I suggest you set up a session with Steve Harley.
Would your wife be willing to speak with him?

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Originally Posted by Jedi_Knight
Sir getting information out of you is like squeezing a lemon.
You are the classic exit door patient who after the exam, walking out the door, says, Oh BTW doctor my penis has turned purple for a few months.

You didn't post you have ED until recently. That is obviously a major change from your wife not enjoying sex.

Is there anything else you are not posting?
If so please do it now.



Sorry for the confusion. I mentioned it briefly in my original post. I had erections when trying to be intimate, then lost my confidence and erections when I saw that my wife was not interested in bed. This started after the honeymoon. At first I didn't think anything of it, but then it became an issue. I eventually went to my doctor for a check up and he said my testosterone levels were normal. Then told me that I had anxiety and/or confidence levels and gave me pills to help. I then went to see a urologist who basically said the same thing.


I don't know if she would be open to talking to any more people. She looks like she's determined to divorce and isn't even talking to me right now.

Last edited by whitespot; 09/21/15 02:11 PM.
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I just re-read my original post, and I guess I am leaving something out.

I submitted this post while I was still out of town. Since then, I flew back home on Friday and tried to talk to her. She was insistent that I move out and kept asking me, "have you found a place to move yet?" She asked for the third time on Saturday morning and I finally lost it and told her, "I told you already! I'm not moving out. I want to try and work on this ONE MORE TIME! IF IT DOESN'T WORK THEN I WILL GIVE YOU A DIVORCE." (I have never lost my temper like this and feel really bad). That was Saturday morning. She has not talked to me since then and is completely avoiding me. I try to talk to her, but she ignores everything I say and doesn't respond. (I even made her a pot of coffee yesterday morning before she woke up. The first thing she did was dump it and furiously made a new pot.)

It's a very hostile environment right now. I even spotted her looking for divorce lawyers on her ipad.

Not sure if any of that is relevant, but I'm posting it anyways.

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Do you look at porn?


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Originally Posted by whitespot
Awesome dates: "Awesome dates" were her words. She specifically said multiple times she's frustrated that we were "going on awesome and romantic dates that never end with sex." As an example of one of our dates, we went on an Art Walk, looked at art, drank wine, held hands, kissed, talked about art and how fun the night was, etc. It was romantic. However, nothing happened when we got home and the night basically just ended with me kissing her good night in bed and both of us falling asleep.

I would look at adding affection into the mix of what happens on those dates, because for most women sex needs to happen in an environment of affection.

I would also look at becoming more sexually flirtatious during the date. That can be tricky to get right and will probably be awkward for you for awhile and your wife might be very judgmental about it until you get it right, but I would make it clear during those dates that you intend to finish this evening with a sexual experience with her. Don't be crude or demanding - be flirtatious.

It sounds to me like when you initiate sex she feels like it's just being dropped on her out of the blue. Sex for women has to be a part of the romantic relationship and she has to feel connected to you. It doesn't matter that you've been thinking about it all day - you need to treat her in a way that makes her love bank feel full to brimming so that she feels connected to you.

And for goodness sakes don't lose your temper with her. You can't afford love bank withdrawals like that if you want her feelings toward sex with you to change.


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 17 years, who is a beautiful angel.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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Quote
and I finally lost it and told her, "I told you already! I'm not moving out. I want to try and work on this ONE MORE TIME! IF IT DOESN'T WORK THEN I WILL GIVE YOU A DIVORCE." (I have never lost my temper like this and feel really bad).
You don't feel as bad as she does.
Losing your temper is a sure-fire way of destroying any love she might have left for you. If you want to recover your marriage, you must never, ever do this again regardless of what she says to you.


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Originally Posted by whitespot
Originally Posted by BrainHurts
Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. When your email question is chosen to be answered on the radio show, you will be notified by email directing you to listen to the rebroadcast. If you would like to consider being a caller, include your telephone number. You will be called by us to explain the procedure to you. Every caller will receive a complementary book by Dr. Harley that addresses their question.


Thanks. Yes, I do plan on emailing Dr. Harley later tonight.

Stop and do it now instead of posting on a message board. wink


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 17 years, who is a beautiful angel.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
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How much do you travel?

How proactive are you in general? Does she usually plan dates or do you?

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Whitespot,
Sorry I have been away...

I have a hunch that your urologist and doctor are wrong. A quick search done on the internet will show from multiple sources that men who have low normal blood levels need more testosterone to function properly and feel healthy. When your drive is healthy, you will forego sleep in order to have sex.

Can you please call and have your doctors send you copies of the labs? You need to know your total and free testosterone levels. Can you find out that number please? You NEED to know what it was.

Also- Please be honest- Have you had a long term habit of porn and masturbation? That causes ED.

One thing is for sure- a woman knows when her man wants her. He usually pushes a bit by trying to get to the "next base". Do you really crave her? Are you left wanting passionate sex after your date or do you feel ambivalent?






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Another point is that if your wife thinks that your levels are normal, then where is her hope of a change?

I agree with the others who made suggestions about affection and intimate conversation etc... But for a woman who is frustrated by lack of sex, what she wants is to be DESIRED. A confused man has trouble DESIRING something without a strong craving for it. Of course, rejection and performance anxiety add to the problem.

However, once you get testosterone levels up a bit, your cravings, stamina, and ability to function during the act improve, and your anxiety will be overridden by the craving.

From there, consistent, imperfect but positive experiences are all you NEED to improve things progressively. Am I making sense to you Whitespot?

Have you ever asked your wife point blank, "What turns you on?"

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Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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