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She met OM at her job. That is the reason I don't have transparency. She has the authority at work to invite anyone into a meeting room. (OM does not work there, and has nothing to do with the firm, W invited him)

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She met OM at her job, but he can only enter the building with her approval. Records of visitors are kept, so I'll have proof if this happens. He's not a co worker.

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OM does not have any business at her office and does not live nearby. The only reason he went and met her at her office is because she asked him to come over.

It sounds like you are trying to talk yourself out of feeling threatened by her job. You tell us that you don't have transparency at her job, BUT then list reasons why you seem to think you SHOULD feel secure.

The fact is, he's a threat at her job. She will need to change jobs. And, really, to give your marriage the greatest chance of recovery, you will need to move. You will need a fresh start, somewhere new.

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The chance that she will walk in to him in the city is a greater concern for me. Moving is not an option for me.
Find a way to make it an option.


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15 hours of UA are not a problem.
We're going out for dinner, walking, lot's of talks about our love busters/deposits, doing things in the house.
Do not count time discussing lovebusters/deposits as UA.
UA = no relationship talk


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Originally Posted by Prisca
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15 hours of UA are not a problem.
We're going out for dinner, walking, lot's of talks about our love busters/deposits, doing things in the house.
Do not count time discussing lovebusters/deposits as UA.
UA = no relationship talk

Correct. Do things together that meet the important emotional needs you both have. Have you taken the EN survey?

Also, plan getaways on weekends. Actively schedule weekend trips and mini-moons together. These things make massive love bank deposits. Got to make sure you step out of the daily routine to keep things fresh.

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Originally Posted by AlexF
I have no clue what all the abbreviations in your last posts mean.
IC?
NC?

Some of this has already been covered in this thread (??). I would take the time to re-read the thread if you haven't already. When I first got here, I re-read my thread multiple times.

IC = individual counseling
NC = No Contact


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Originally Posted by AlexF
I need help writing another exposure letter to OMW.
Still no reply, pretty sure she didn't get/read it. I tracked down her work email instead of her FB.

I have very few evidence to back up my story.
How should I go about this?

The EA was happening in my W's fantasies. I have no proof of that. She admitted this to me and I have read her secret journal. That journal is destroyed. (Yes, that's a mistake, but I can't take it back...)

They had a lot of contact/talks via social apps and mail. The mails on itself were playful but acceptable among close friends, depending on your morals.

They met up a few times behind our backs. My W admitted this to me but I have no proof whatsoever this actually happened.

So the 'hard evidence' are my W confessions, and a few social media talks that I could have too with female friends. (no worries, we adjusted our views about opposite sex friendships by now).

What should I write her?

You don't need to provide evidence to her. Tell her that your W and her H engaged in an affair, and if she has any questions, answer them honestly. You can tell her that your W admitted to the affair and has agreed never to see or talk to her WH again but that you wanted to make her aware of this so that she could watch from her end.

They had a secret romantic relationship outside of their marriages. That is an affair. Don't make this more complicated than it is!


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Originally Posted by Prisca
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She met OM at her job. That is the reason I don't have transparency. She has the authority at work to invite anyone into a meeting room. (OM does not work there, and has nothing to do with the firm, W invited him)

Quote
She met OM at her job, but he can only enter the building with her approval. Records of visitors are kept, so I'll have proof if this happens. He's not a co worker.

Quote
OM does not have any business at her office and does not live nearby. The only reason he went and met her at her office is because she asked him to come over.

It sounds like you are trying to talk yourself out of feeling threatened by her job. You tell us that you don't have transparency at her job, BUT then list reasons why you seem to think you SHOULD feel secure.

The fact is, he's a threat at her job. She will need to change jobs. And, really, to give your marriage the greatest chance of recovery, you will need to move. You will need a fresh start, somewhere new.

Quote
The chance that she will walk in to him in the city is a greater concern for me. Moving is not an option for me.
Find a way to make it an option.

W will always (need to) have a high end job in order to pay for our bills. Having the authority to move around and invite people to the office is a perk that comes with a job on that level. That's a variable that will not change when W works for another company.

I'm not going to demand that she's going to work in (with all due respect) a local book store. We all have certain ambitions in life that make up for who we are. When you lose those dreams and ambitions, you lose much more than your marriage, you lose yourself. I married my W because I like her drive and ambition, locking her up at home, monitoring her every move is not a reality I want to live in.

There's always theory, the advice you're giving me, and reality.
I'm looking for the best of both worlds. I'm not going to give up my business that took 20 years to build, or move away from my family because of an A.

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So you are choosing a job over marriage. That's your preogative, but at this site we give marital advice, not job tips.

Leaving a job and moving does not mean giving up a career.

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Originally Posted by Justthe3ofus
Leaving a job and moving does not mean giving up a career.
And it doesn't mean locking your wife up at home. MrRollieEyes
NO one said to do that. Stop with the hyperbolics -- they don't help you none.

You don't have transparency. You won't as long as you stay where you are, doing what you are doing. You admit you fear your wife running into OM around town.

We're not talking "theory" here. This is very much a "reality" that many of us have had to live through. And the reality is, the road to recovery is very narrow. If you don't follow it closely, you will fall off the path and never reach the goal of a happy, romantic marriage that is far better than you can imagine.

Moving is a reality. Changing jobs is a reality. This is what it will take to make it.

If you don't move, your marriage will likely never recover.



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Agree with Prisca.

Actually, I think the affair still continues given your W's fogginess and because it would be SO EASY for her to continue contact at work.


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And because the OMBW still hasn't been exposed to...

The list goes on and on. Back with more...


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Originally Posted by AlexF
My W wrote an emotional end contact letter to M. I was gaslighting myself that this was fine. She did tell him that she needed to break off contact, but that she will always love and miss him. Should she write a new letter, this time following the rules of dr harley? Or will this stimulate contact?

The NCL is an EP and part of just compensation but it also can be indicative of the WS's seriousness about ending the affair.

The fact that your WW wrote a love letter is a red flag.

It's a red flag on her and a red flag on you. It says something about you that you allowed that to be sent with your approval, a note telling her affair partner that she loves him and will miss him. You should have put your foot down and said, no, I don't agree with that, that would be incredibly disrespectful and hurtful to me.





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Originally Posted by AlexF
W will always (need to) have a high end job in order to pay for our bills. Having the authority to move around and invite people to the office is a perk that comes with a job on that level.

Your WW has this high level job, however, you can't afford a poly?

That doesn't make much sense.


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Originally Posted by AlexF
W will always (need to) have a high end job in order to pay for our bills. Having the authority to move around and invite people to the office is a perk that comes with a job on that level. That's a variable that will not change when W works for another company.

As long as you have this attitude, you should just accept the OM will be part of your M. He's already been part of it for the last 10 years and there's nothing to stop it from continuing.

Don't believe me? If you ever do poly your WW, ask her if NC has been broken. I would be willing to be real money the affair continues.

This is probably my last post on this thread. I can't continue posting to people for weeks and weeks who are not serious about following Marriage Builders.



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You have given a lot of conflicting information on this thread. I know because I painstakingly just went back through and read it.

1) Does OM live 'thousands of miles away' as you originally said, or does he live in your town (since you are concerned about running into him)?

2) Did she meet OM in college or did she meet him at work?

These are things that would impact our advice on whether she would need to quit her job or relocate, obviously.

3) If he does live locally (which you seem to indicate with your concern he could stop in at your wife's work or show up around town), then why are you having such a hard time exposing to his wife???

I have already pointed out that your responses to the list of EP's I posted on Page 1 are inaccurate. Something is just very fishy about the information you are giving us...

You have been fighting with posters since page 1 about what you 'can't' do. The bottom line is that you are choosing to sweep some of these things under the rug to maintain the status quo in your life. For instance, you are willing to negotiate a lack of transparency at W's work in order to maintain your current lifestyle. That's your choice. You know what they say, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. Posters have spent 14 pages leading you to water, but you can make the choice whether to drink or not.

It is very telling that you don't know abbreviations or even what 'UA' stands for. It means you have spent little to no time actually learning this program.

I, like SusieQ, would bet real money that your wife is still in contact with OM, or will be in the near future. You have made it clear to us AND HER that you are willing to cut corners and negotiate your marriage for a variety of reasons. This IS going to come back to bite you.

Good luck.

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Your environment has a great impact on your emotions and thinking. Your memories are tied to your environment.

Every time she goes to work, a part of you will wonder and worry. You may try to shake off those feelings or bury them, but they will remain. There will always be doubt in your mind.

That alone will hinder your recovery -- the affair will be at the forefront of your feelings from here on out. Nevermind the real and dangerous possibility of her running into OM again.

Even your home and your job is full of memories of the affair ... The first place you learned of her affair. The many places you fought. The place where you sat by yourself while your heart wrenched and tore itself to pieces while thinking of what she did. That one place where she said that particularly awful and painful remark. It will all linger over you like a dense cloud.

Moving to a new environment will be like wiping the slate clean with a fresh new start.


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Originally Posted by unwritten
You have given a lot of conflicting information on this thread. I know because I painstakingly just went back through and read it.

1) Does OM live 'thousands of miles away' as you originally said, or does he live in your town (since you are concerned about running into him)?

He lives in Europe and visits our home state/town a few times a year to visit relatives.


2) Did she meet OM in college or did she meet him at work?

She met OM in college and they had a meeting at her workplace.

These are things that would impact our advice on whether she would need to quit her job or relocate, obviously.

3) If he does live locally (which you seem to indicate with your concern he could stop in at your wife's work or show up around town), then why are you having such a hard time exposing to his wife???

He does not live locally. He's in the country a few times a year. The chance they walk in to each other would be small but troubles me nonetheless.

I have already pointed out that your responses to the list of EP's I posted on Page 1 are inaccurate. Something is just very fishy about the information you are giving us...

You have been fighting with posters since page 1 about what you 'can't' do. The bottom line is that you are choosing to sweep some of these things under the rug to maintain the status quo in your life. For instance, you are willing to negotiate a lack of transparency at W's work in order to maintain your current lifestyle. That's your choice. You know what they say, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. Posters have spent 14 pages leading you to water, but you can make the choice whether to drink or not.

You have the illusion that I will have more transparency when she changes jobs. That is not the case. She can find another job and invite OM there too if she really wanted too, so what's the difference? I do not believe, at this moment, that she will do that, but it is always a possibility. OM can't even get in to the lobby without security clearance.

It is very telling that you don't know abbreviations or even what 'UA' stands for. It means you have spent little to no time actually learning this program.

I just ordered Dr Harley's book, I will become more knowledgeable very soon.

I, like SusieQ, would bet real money that your wife is still in contact with OM, or will be in the near future. You have made it clear to us AND HER that you are willing to cut corners and negotiate your marriage for a variety of reasons. This IS going to come back to bite you.

She cut off contact and changed all of her contact numbers and closed her social media accounts. That's all I can do.
If she goes to an internet cafe, registers an anonymous hotmail account, and types in hisname@hotmail.com, she can contact him anytime without me ever finding out, and all of your advice would be useless...

It all comes down to her motivation to stay in a relationship with me. You can't force someone, her motivation has to be intrinsic.

She's been working really hard on rebuilding herself and our marriage. I'm guilty for being paranoid and perhaps have the right to be according to everything I read here, but some of the measures you are proposing seem very naive to me.

If I had an affair I would easily be able to bypass all the measures you want to build into a marriage and never get caught. And yes, I realize this makes me sound bad... Your advice is great for people who don't know their way around computers. Anyone who's somewhat knowledgeable about IT can find a way pretty easily. That's why I'm so paranoid.


Good luck.

Thank you...

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Originally Posted by SusieQ
Originally Posted by AlexF
My W wrote an emotional end contact letter to M. I was gaslighting myself that this was fine. She did tell him that she needed to break off contact, but that she will always love and miss him. Should she write a new letter, this time following the rules of dr harley? Or will this stimulate contact?

The NCL is an EP and part of just compensation but it also can be indicative of the WS's seriousness about ending the affair.

The fact that your WW wrote a love letter is a red flag.

It's a red flag on her and a red flag on you. It says something about you that you allowed that to be sent with your approval, a note telling her affair partner that she loves him and will miss him. You should have put your foot down and said, no, I don't agree with that, that would be incredibly disrespectful and hurtful to me.

She send it without letting me read it.
I asked before if I should let her write a new NCL? Care to know your advice.

She told me after the situation cooled down a few weeks later (after sending the NCL) that she regrets not sending a strict NCL and I'm pretty sure she'll agree to sending a new one, but I don't want to send a mixed message to OM (make him think she wants to reach out to him)

We made a lot of progression since D-day. I'm very confident she wouldn't send that type of NCL today, but what is done is done...


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It all comes down to her motivation to stay in a relationship with me.
It all comes down to extraordinary precautions, not willpower or motivation.


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**EDIT**

Last edited by Denali; 02/08/17 06:55 AM. Reason: TOS disrespectful
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This thread has become a needless distraction to our forum. If you are not here to use Marriage Builders concepts and plan to continue to mock and disrespect posters, we will lock this thread.

Did you have a question about the MB program? If not, we will lock this thread.


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