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#2897442 04/18/17 01:44 PM
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(sheepishly steps up to podium)

Hi, I'm M, the wife and the BS. I never knew what an EA was until recently. For 11 years, my husband, R, has been involved with one of his former coworkers in another state. Yes, you read the year count correctly. And yes, he is going to take a polygraph to answer how far it got beyond the EA because, like many of you reading this, how could 'nothing' have happened in all that time.

I'm not a jealous person. I have opposite sex friends who are also friends of the marriage. By that, I mean that I don't see them without hubby. I share any and all correspondence (there isn't much as most live in other cities). So I wasn't too alarmed when hubby mentioned in passing that he'd had dinner while he was away to the corporate office out of town. Yes, I know better... NOW. It's hell being trusting. Sigh.

What I didn't know: that she had left the company. That she had tried to get two other married men to join her for dinners and that they declined. That hubby didn't. That they were having dinner alone. That it happened every time he went to Colorado. I also didn't know that she called him about once a month (he swears he never called her from his work line here - believe it? I don't). That she emailed him humor with him as the only recipient. That she also emailed him at his work email to just chat. Hubby works from home, btw.

Spidey senses kicked in late 2009 when he called during a two week trip there and told me that he and AP had been to Estees park that Saturday and he'd seen elk and wolves. Wait. Just the two of them? Yep. Can you say highly inappropriate? So I asked what was going on with AP. He said nothing - just friends. I questioned him and he admitted that it was just the two of them, that he'd also gone to dinner with just her a few days ago. I explained that this was no longer appropriate and that he should not see her again. He insisted that they were just friends. We fought.

When he came home, he assured me that my fears were unfounded, that AP was nothing to look at, just a friend and that was that. Silly me. Over the next three years, whenever he had to go to the Colorado office, he met with her and had dinner. Alone. We fought some more. I yelled, I reasoned, I cried. He said I was being silly, that she was just a friend and nothing more. He couldn't see how it looked.

From 2009 to 2017, there have been two years where he didn't go to Colorado at all. For some reason, he thought that by showing me the humor she sent him would alleviate my fears. We still fought. He insisted that if I'd just come out there and meet her, I'd see they were just friends. In 2015, the last time he went out there, we had a doozy of a fight. He admitted to having dinner planned with her the next day. I insisted he cancel. He wouldn't. We fought. Next day, he calls and pretends nothing happened. I beg him to cancel. I cry. I mean I'm bawling. He doesn't. I call when I know he is at dinner, he tells me they'd just been seated and he'd call me after he got back to his room. I told him I loved him. He just hung up. He did call me about 2 hours later and insisted that nothing happened. Just dinner. Just friends. I'm angry as hell.

In January, he was scheduled to go again. I'd recently had surgery, so I couldn't travel with him. Before he left, I asked if he was planning on seeing her. He admitted they'd already made dinner plans. I hit the roof. I just wasn't going to take it anymore. I know, what an idiot I've been, right? But you want to trust them. Anyway, I told him to cancel. He wouldn't. I gave him three days and more arguments, reasoning, etc. Nope. He wouldn't cancel. So I told him that if he didn't, I was leaving him. I'd file for divorce.

Boom.

He ended up talking to his sister who said that she could definitely see my side. He hung up the phone and said, he'd call AP the next day. I insisted he call right then. In front of me. He did. She seemed a little confused, but seemed okay with it. He told her that I didn't like them spending time alone. I had asked him to tell her their friendship was off - that he could never see her again and why - that it was not appropriate. He said he forgot, that he was nervous. He called back and this time, I was listening in. He initially didn't want to do that as he felt that if she ever found out, she'd be upset. Insert a million expletives here because since he wasn't ever supposed to be in contact with her, WHY did he care? Besides, I was the one falling apart.

He told her that they couldn't be friends anymore, that I didn't like it, that I thought it was inappropriate (yeah like he couldn't have agreed by this point, right?). She asked, "Why now? Why does she have a problem now?" He told her that I had a problem from the start, but he just hadn't been listening. She said, "Okay. Okay." and they hung up. She called back a minute later (I'm still listening), and she asks if it was something she'd said or done. He repeated his story but told her, no - that she hadn't done anything (grrrrrr!!!!!!). They hung up.

He goes to Colorado. I'm a wreck. He calls 3-4 times a day. Puts me on video so I can see his room, see he is alone. He knows I'm tracking him with the phone GPS. He gives me his email password on his work computer. I go through all his mail. It looks like he was the one initiating the dinners, not her. But I do see where she has emailed him more frequently than he says. Emails are pretty benign except for one years ago where he asked for her cell and said they should get together for dinner or something when he came out next time. She sends him email telling her when her birthday is, he responds with a simple happy birthday. She sends him emails talking about her work, layoffs, her car, her health. Some have responses. Some have been deleted. One reply, she says he sounded pretty down last time they talked. He tells her he's been down, no big deal, but hey - good news is that he'll be there X date. They should get together for dinner or something. No reply. I'm assuming they spoke after that. Always his work line, never his cell unless he was out there. Another found email upset me - she emailed saying that he shouldn't freak out if he sees an email from email acct X, her private email because sometimes she wants to have privacy from the work servers. I check his private email. Nothing. I find a second gmail acct of his. I can't get into it.

I am devastated. He hadn't told me about ALL the dinners. He and I talk about this. He admits to having dinner with her once, every visit where he has been out there for his one week trips, twice when it was a two week trip. He didn't tell me about most of them because he knew I wouldn't like it. He still insisted they were friends. He said that HE knew there was nothing, so he thought I should've believed him. Yeah, you know I went off on that one. He apologized, said he knew how it looked - now. That he was sorry. That he wasn't seeing her this trip. That she hadn't called him. I checked the cell records and at least she wasn't calling his cell and he wasn't calling her via it, either. He swore he wasn't using the hotel phone or a work phone. I checked his email - nothing from her there, either. He insists he doesn't recall setting up the other private gmail acct, never remembers using it, and asks if by chance I did since I'm the one usually creating all our accounts. I do not recall doing it. I have used every password I can think of and cannot access that acct.

He comes home from trip. We go to therapy where we were told to read Surviving an Affair. He is still insistant that they never had sex, never fooled around, never kissed, never held hands - nothing. Nada. It was just a friendship. I ask if they'd been elsewhere other than the park. He says he thinks the park was with the male coworkers and doesn't recall it being with her, but differs to me since apparently, my memory is better. Does admit to taking her to two movies and he went to one of her softball games. I'm back to being more than devastated and angry. He says he didn't tell me because - you guessed it - that I'd be upset if I knew. Admits that she came to his hotel to pick him up for dinner, movies, etc., but insists that she never came to his room because he says THAT would be weird. WTF? And why couldn't she just meet him at the restaurant? He says that she'd just offer and they'd ride together. Double WTF. And he didn't think there was anything odd or wrong about it at the time. Understand now that it was. Says that looking back, he got the idea she was interested - not because she or he ever said a thing or talked about it - but because she started combing her hair and wearing makeup. I ask why he didn't end it then. He said because he wasn't interested and since she wasn't flirting or asking him for more, he just let it go. (head desk).

He sends the NC letter to her. She explodes with a reply - downright nasty, telling him that whatever is wrong with me is not her problem and that she's totally innocent and a Christian. Riiiight. Because proper Christian women go to dinners and movies and stuff alone with married men traveling out of town. She says she's hurt and has more pride than to allow me to accuse her of an affair. That they were friends. That he was a mentor. That I need help. That she never wants to hear from him again because as his friend, she deserved better than the NC letter he'd sent. I notice that she has taken my email out of the cc portion and inserted his work email address as well as just replying to our combined personal email account.

I'm livid. I show him the email where he proceeds to explain how she must be taking it. Really? REALLY?

He swears it's done. Says he can't imagine what he was thinking. Still insists nothing happened - not even flirting (yeah, right). He has cried many times. Swears he felt nothing for her - nothing. Says there wasn't anything special at all about her except that he had someone to go to dinner with. Uh-huh. Like going out with any of his present coworkers wasn't enough? Anyway, he seems to be bending over backward and says it was because he liked being a teen again - no room to clean, no dishes to wash, no bills, no worries. That he sees now that he was dating her, but didn't feel like that then. Just friends. He's beyond sorry and will do whatever it takes to set things right, that he was a shi***y husband and he can't say he is sorry enough. I still have access and passwords to all emails, all devices. He asks if I'd like to go through his browser history everywhere including his devices and work machine. No problem going through anything he has without asking - ever. Swears they have had no contact since the NC letter.

Found out through questioning that she had given him a pirated copy of a album. WHAT? He hadn't mentioned this before when I asked him about gifts. But now, he remembers. I tell him he can't keep presents. I buy him an honest copy from iTunes. He agrees to toss it but doesn't throw it away. I tell him to throw it away. He apologizes and says he should have done it right then when I asked. He tells me he'll delete her copy from our library and download mine. I wait. I wait 10 days. I explode. He instantly apologizes and does what he should have done to start with. Swears it just didn't occur to him that this was a sore spot. REALLY? Ugh!

Now, he writes down amends. Initiates topics. Asks to read more books. Asks for triggers so we can talk about them.

Some days I feel crazy for even trying to stay. I feel foolish. Some days I believe part of what he's saying. Other days? I don't think I can ever believe him or trust him again.

Thanks for listening. I know so many of you have been where I am. We are both in therapy.

Last edited by BetrayedHeart; 04/18/17 02:02 PM.
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Hi, BHeart,

Do you have Dr. Harley's book Surviving an Affair? There are a lot of checklists for recovery in there you are going to want to follow.

Has your husband made it impossible for OW to contact him again? Neither one of you needs to hear her spew her opinions any more.


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Yes, we've read it (along with Shirley Glass's Not Just Friends, and another book who's author escapes me at the moment - Worthy of Her Trust).

Checklist. He can't change his work email or his work number without telling his work why. He can't tell them he can't come back to Colorado, so from here on, I'm going with him.

As for traveling, it's a catch-22 situation. I can't always go with him everywhere, but will when he goes to CO. He could find another job, but then he wouldn't be working from home and that might put him into a worse situation. He has agreed to allow any and all tracking software on his devices. I can add any listening software, too.

We have enthusiastically agreed upon a 3-minute call back. I can call him at any time and he will answer or call back in under 5. He knows I will call him in the middle of the night via FaceTime and that he should answer immediately.

He agrees to take the Mike Pence stance of never being alone with a woman - ever, under any circumstance. That he cannot strike up non-business emails with other female coworkers. That I see all emails, even the deleted ones from here out. He won't delete browser history until I have seen it and am with him.

He's still taking the poly, though. I'm not buying that they 'didn't even flirt' and that if he'd had a video and audio of every contact, I'd see that.

ETA: He travels SO infrequently, too.

Last edited by BetrayedHeart; 04/18/17 01:59 PM.
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Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
Checklist. He can't change his work email or his work number without telling his work why. He can't tell them he can't come back to Colorado, so from here on, I'm going with him.

As for traveling, it's a catch-22 situation. I can't always go with him everywhere, but will when he goes to CO. He could find another job, but then he wouldn't be working from home and that might put him into a worse situation. He has agreed to allow any and all tracking software on his devices. I can add any listening software, too.
Okay - but what's to stop HER travelling to any of his other travelling places - the ones where you won't be?

Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
We have enthusiastically agreed upon a 3-minute call back. I can call him at any time and he will answer or call back in under 5. He knows I will call him in the middle of the night via FaceTime and that he should answer immediately.
How will you know she hasn't just stepped out of the room while you FaceTime?

Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
He agrees to take the Mike Pence stance of never being alone with a woman - ever, under any circumstance.
How will you know that he is doing this when he is travelling?

Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
That he cannot strike up non-business emails with other female coworkers. That I see all emails, even the deleted ones from here out. He won't delete browser history until I have seen it and am with him.
I can selectively delete my browsing history, so that some disappears and the rest is visible. How do you know he won't do this?


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Short term affairs are tough enough to bust up, but if you do want to save your M, then you will need to take NO shortcuts, and go way overboard on building EPs (extraordinary precautions) so that you will be truly safe from ever experiencing this pain again.

Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
Checklist. He can't change his work email or his work number without telling his work why. He can't tell them he can't come back to Colorado, so from here on, I'm going with him.

Is there some reason why he is not willing to tell his work why? That is a big redflag that tells me that he is not serious. He needs to change the work number and all emails. He needs to block ANY way that she can contact him. If that is impossible, then he needs to quit that job.

Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
As for traveling, it's a catch-22 situation. I can't always go with him everywhere, but will when he goes to CO. He could find another job, but then he wouldn't be working from home and that might put him into a worse situation. He has agreed to allow any and all tracking software on his devices. I can add any listening software, too.
You won't recover unless you agree to never spend another night apart. Dr. Harley has stated that there is a very narrow path to recovery from an affair, and you cannot cherry-pick and use only the recovery steps that are comfortable.

Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
He agrees to take the Mike Pence stance of never being alone with a woman - ever, under any circumstance. That he cannot strike up non-business emails with other female coworkers. That I see all emails, even the deleted ones from here out. He won't delete browser history until I have seen it and am with him.
It is good that he SAYS this, but with waywards, we need to watch what they DO. How will you KNOW that he DOES this when he is away from you? How will you KNOW that you have seen the deleted emails and browser history?
Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
He's still taking the poly, though.
I would schedule the poly this week. Do it yourself and then announce the appointment to him.


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Welcome to MB.

It is great that you are having him take a poly. You are right that none of us buy into the assertion that he never had any physical contact with OW in all that time. I am very sure there is more you don't know.

Give him a list of questions, on paper, everything you want to know about the affair. You can only ask 3-4 questions on the actual test, but he doesn't need to know that or which questions will be asked. This is a way to get an answer for all of your questions. It is not uncommon for more information to come out literally 5 minutes before the test, so be prepared for this.

You really need to take the EP's regarding his work more seriously. Even if you could monitor his every move when he is traveling (which you can't), realize that every time he travels you will be constantly triggered and thinking about the 'what ifs.' This will make it impossible to recover, and will cause so much mental anguish to you. Is that what you want? That is not worth his job.

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Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
Y
Checklist. He can't change his work email or his work number without telling his work why. He can't tell them he can't come back to Colorado, so from here on, I'm going with him.

Did you expose his affair?


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Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
Checklist. He can't change his work email or his work number without telling his work why.

You should tell them why. "Don't tell people what happened" isn't on the recovery plan.


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

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My wife would call my job and let them know that I'd had an affair while traveling for them and let them know that she was going to divorce me if I continued to travel or wasn't able to change my number. And she'd talk to a lawyer about the possibility of suing the company if they in any way facilitated me having an affair.


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

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SugarCane:

Q: Okay - but what's to stop HER travelling to any of his other travelling places - the ones where you won't be?
A: Spyware on his phone, for one. I could also hire a detective.

Q: How will you know she hasn't just stepped out of the room while you FaceTime?
A: If she can get dressed and out the door before he has to answer, that'd be pretty impressive. BUT I will also have spywear on his phone where I can just turn on the audio at any time.

Q: How will I know he is doing this while traveling?
A: I suppose the spyware audio. While I won't have it on ALL the time, he won't know when.

Yes, he can selectively delete browsing history on his work computer. But Since I also work from home, I have now moved my office next to his. I can hear his calls. I can take a peek at his computer at any time. Yes, he might have a few seconds to hide the screen, but that would throw a flag and I've told him that.

Blindsigthed:

Q: Is there some reason why he is not willing to tell his work why? That is a big redflag that tells me that he is not serious. He needs to change the work number and all emails. He needs to block ANY way that she can contact him. If that is impossible, then he needs to quit that job.
A: They'd probably fire him and my income can't support us. He has blocked her via his work email. He's blocked the number on his office phone. Sure, he could remove it. Now that my desk is next to his, I'd hear her voice. As for the email, sure, he could unblock that, too. But he doesn't know when I'll ask to see the email rules. If that's turned off, I'll know. As for our disposable email, she's already been blocked. I didn't block her from mine just to see if she will try something from there.

Q: You won't recover unless you agree to never spend another night apart. Dr. Harley has stated that there is a very narrow path to recovery from an affair, and you cannot cherry-pick and use only the recovery steps that are comfortable.
A: True. He could essentially start something new elsewhere, or she could show up where he is. But there's the spyware and I could essentially hire a detective.

Q: It is good that he SAYS this, but with waywards, we need to watch what they DO. How will you KNOW that he DOES this when he is away from you? How will you KNOW that you have seen the deleted emails and browser history?
A: I ask him to perform a recovery on his deleted emails - Outlook shows deleted emails that sit on the server. As for the browser? Nothing really to stop him, I suppose. Regarding what he does when not with me, I can't be everywhere all the time. But the spyware can.

And yes, I already have the questions lined up and am in the process of selecting a qualified and hopefully trustworthy polygraph tester in our area.

Unwritten:
He has seen 10 questions. He doesn't know which 4 I will choose. He's answered them. But we know about that, don't we? He is insistent that they both were perfect angels at all times except for the appropriateness of being alone to start with. Uh huh. There's an interstate in GA for sale, too. Slightly charred. I call [censored] and lies. He wouldn't have fought me so hard for just a friend fo so long. He wouldn't have left me bawling on the phone for just a friend. Well, unless he's the most heartless [censored] on the planet, which is a whole different situation.

So yeah. Polygraph. And he might have to take one every year for a while to ensure he stays on the straight and narrow. Expensive, but probably worth it.

Triggers. Where to begin? I have anxiety attacks at night now, with him in the house. It makes me go back to every night he's out there, regardless that I could see his location on the Find My Phone app. I still thought she was there.

And yes, I exposed the affair big time. Friends, family, neighbors, and a coworker of his.

Last edited by BetrayedHeart; 04/18/17 04:06 PM.
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Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
And yes, I exposed the affair big time. Friends, family, neighbors, and a coworker of his.

Kids?


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

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Did you expose to anyone on OW's side?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Have you listened to the clips in here?
Dr. Harley on how to deal with triggers


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Hello BH, welcome to Marriage Builders. I am sorry for the reasons that have brought you here. If you are serious about recovery, it will take extraordinary precautions to prevent an affair. In order to create romantic love in your marriage, you will need to be together every night. That means he either finds a job that keeps him home or you go with him every time. None of the "precautions" you mention will save your marriage. Your plan is an impediment to recovery. Unfortunately, you cannot cut corners and recover your marriage. [believe me, many have tried] Please read this checklist:

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.





"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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And I'm absolutely not defending him. Not a chance. Anyone who could omit facts like that when they knew the reasons why their spouse didn't approve, that anyone could let someone they love cry and plead not to do something and then do it anyway? Yeah. There is NO defending that. And anyone who could do that is capable of anything else.

So no. I don't buy for a second that he fought me tooth and nail over a friendship (and if he did, what does that even say?)

Then there was the OW and how she handled it. If it'd been me? Well, I wouldn't have been spending alone time with a married man. But, if I did have a meal with one once and the wife said something? I'd be SO apologetic. Not defensive.

Last edited by BetrayedHeart; 04/18/17 06:39 PM.
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There are no children on either side. OW is single, never married. Neither WS nor the OW have any social media accounts. Hubby has always hated them and not very technical. OW says she's a Christian, but I have no idea what church or denomination she is.

I would have LOVED to expose the affair on her side, but without social media and without family member names or a pastor to tell, who would I tell?

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Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
There are no children on either side. OW is single, never married. Neither WS nor the OW have any social media accounts. Hubby has always hated them and not very technical. OW says she's a Christian, but I have no idea what church or denomination she is.

I would have LOVED to expose the affair on her side, but without social media and without family member names or a pastor to tell, who would I tell?
Did you already google her name (with and without her hometown and/or company name), email address and phone nr? Google might surprise you.

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Originally Posted by BetrayedHeart
Q: Is there some reason why he is not willing to tell his work why? That is a big redflag that tells me that he is not serious. He needs to change the work number and all emails. He needs to block ANY way that she can contact him. If that is impossible, then he needs to quit that job.
A: They'd probably fire him and my income can't support us. He has blocked her via his work email. He's blocked the number on his office phone. Sure, he could remove it. Now that my desk is next to his, I'd hear her voice. As for the email, sure, he could unblock that, too. But he doesn't know when I'll ask to see the email rules. If that's turned off, I'll know. As for our disposable email, she's already been blocked. I didn't block her from mine just to see if she will try something from there.
You say that they'd probably fire him and that your income can't support the two of you...well...I was in the same boat after my H had a twelve year sexual affair. After six months of a (worse than the original discovery) gut-wrenching FALSE recovery, which happened to be four months after I had ovarian cancer surgery...I finally grew some ...errr...confidence in myself (with the help of this forum) and declared that he quit his job that DAY or he leave. He chose to quit. laugh

I say this in the kindest way, since your husband's A was also long term...Have you considered that since your husband can see that you value income above your marriage, that he may be using that to gaslight you into submission?


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I've thought of this. And oddly, I'm more about getting my ducks in a row while I also peek over his shoulder several times a day. He says he's done. Says he's relieved. Do I believe it? Not taking his word for it, that's for sure.

I am so sorry to hear what happened, BlindSighted. Ovarian cancer. Wow.

And yes, I've Googled her name, her phone, her email. She's fairly off grid. Probably because she's done this crap before.

Is it mean that at least I can say that the ONE photo I found of her online (I DID find where she works) that she's hideous looking? I know, doesn't mean a thing, but it's the small pleasures, I suppose.

Now, it's been three months since D-Day. No contact that I'm aware of despite digging. Are you guys suggesting I should email the manager of the Hyundai dealership in Boulder?

Anyway, I feel it's no coincidence that she chose yet another job where there are more men than women.

We've gone through the checklist. We've even come up with a list of things that are considered over the line, things about to cross a line, things that he's never to do. He signed it. He's offered up signing a post-nup as well.

With me working right where I can see what he's up to and full access to his devices, he's going to have to be beyond devious in contacting her. Not to say he can't, but if I honestly have to follow him to the bathroom or not allow him to access a device without me present for fear he'll contact her, then she can have him. I refuse to play the pick me dance anymore. Treat me like a queen, I'll treat you like a king. Treat me like a game and I'll show you how it's played. Depends on what he wants to lose. Me? If he does it again, I lose a cheater. No big deal.

Yeah, as you can see, I am still very very angry and hurt. It's going to take a looooong time. He will never ever have my full trust again. Not even close. He keeps asking how he could do such a thing - be cruel and betray his wife, his best friend. I keep telling him I'd like to know the answer to that as well, but he's the only one with the answer.


Last edited by BetrayedHeart; 04/19/17 08:18 AM.
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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Hello BH, welcome to Marriage Builders. I am sorry for the reasons that have brought you here. If you are serious about recovery, it will take extraordinary precautions to prevent an affair. In order to create romantic love in your marriage, you will need to be together every night. That means he either finds a job that keeps him home or you go with him every time. None of the "precautions" you mention will save your marriage. Your plan is an impediment to recovery. Unfortunately, you cannot cut corners and recover your marriage. [believe me, many have tried] Please read this checklist:

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.

Hi Melody! Thank you. Yes, I'm serious about recovery and I hope that he's telling the truth when he says he is, too. What we've done on the list:

*He has revealed info (but how do we EVER know it's complete?)
*He has made a commitment and promised he'll never contact her in any way ever again and will immediately tell me if she does the same. I must see all correspondence, too. All emails (but he has blocked her, so unless he UNblocks her...) She's blocked on his work line. Cell is changed. I monitor his other personal account and she's blocked there, too.
*He wrote an incredible NC letter. Blunt, to the point, and spot-on. When she replied and threw me under the bus, he asked permission to email her back with me sitting there and told her that she WAS equally guilty, that it WAS inappropriate, and that he insisted that she respect me and my feelings and to bugger off - what didn't she understand about NC? No reply from her after that.
* We both work from home AND are spending evenings and weekends together. I can call him ANY time if he's away - even to the store, and he must answer. We are working on doing more enjoyable things together. He knows he must court me again and says he's enjoying it very much. Do I believe that? He seems like he's having a great time. He's doting. But we'll see if he can keep up the courtship over time.
* I do all the bills. Look over every statement. Every call. Everything must go on a charge card. If he can't and does spend cash, I have to have the receipt. Once a year, I'll go over his credit reports from all 3 bureaus for due diligence that he's not opening up accounts elsewhere.
* We are spending lots more recreation time together. I've challenged him to find fun ways to court me again.
* Since he doesn't work in the same state and he works at home, I think it's best to keep the current job as I know where he is 99.9% of the time here and that he's not in an office with other 'temptations.'
* We are avoiding (not eliminating) overnight separations. He is pushing back on ALL travel and it looks like he probably won't be going anywhere in 2017. If he does, it's one state over and there and back by nightfall. No different than a day job on those occasions.
* Full technical accountability to the best of my ability. Spyware. All passwords. Access to accounts and devices and VM at any time of my choosing.
* Affair exposed to everyone he cares about.

* He also has to go to therapy with me and without me.
* He has to pass the poly.
* He's been tasked with ways to date me, ways to show me he is serious (the once a year poly and the checking of his accounts etc, the credit report checks were actually his idea).
* When family comes to visit, he has to sit down with them and talk about what he did. Not me, him.
* He must take notes of my triggers and then 'make amends.' In other words, he has to write down what happened, how he thinks I must feel, why he did what he did that caused the trigger, an apology, and how he sees the future with this trigger based on actions he has/will take.
* He has to work on his selfishness and lack of empathy issues and talk to me about his therapy on this.
* He has to demonstrate changes.
* We have weekly meetings to discuss progress/set backs, emotional needs, discoveries, etc.
* We are going through books/podcasts on better communication in marriage, other ways to improve marriage aside from the affair issue.
* We are looking for a hobby that we will BOTH enjoy doing together.
* Post-nup
* Exercise together (it's supposed to help with oxytocin - the bonding chemical).

Last edited by BetrayedHeart; 04/19/17 08:55 AM.
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