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Yup, quite the whirlwind. I would not think its possible and would probably more suspicious then I am if it hadn't been for reading about others experiences on this site. I dont know if I will ever be able to understand how one day you can call someone your soulmate and the next drop them like a hot potato, but that seems to be par for the course with affairs. Not to say that I am not cautious or skeptical but I believe it is POSSIBLE that WH is changing, and will give him the benefit of the doubt until I uncover evidence otherwise (which I am always actively procuring :/) . Also, Plan B shields us from the evolution so what feels like a sudden change might have been happening for awhile. WH's family and friends have said they noticed him begin to change in January. As I posted here in March, him being more agreeable in the divorce and more proactive with our kids signaled me that something was up with him, but I didn't place much in it.

Second poly scheduled for tomorrow. WH will go by himself after work, I wont even be there. We'll see...


BW (Me): 39
FWH: 39
DD: 5
DS: 3

D-Day 1: 5/8/17
Plan B started: 6/19/17
For real: 11/13/17-4/3/18
Affair ended: 3/25/18

DD 2: 2/14/20

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Originally Posted by amac
Also, Plan B shields us from the evolution so what feels like a sudden change might have been happening for awhile. WH's family and friends have said they noticed him begin to change in January. As I posted here in March, him being more agreeable in the divorce and more proactive with our kids signaled me that something was up with him, but I didn't place much in it.

Yes! I think you might be right about that. Plan B gives you such a lovely ignorance about everything they are doing that I can really understand they could be going through a lot and we just wouldn't know. Although I very much doubt anything like that will happen to mine!!!

Originally Posted by amac
Second poly scheduled for tomorrow. WH will go by himself after work, I wont even be there. We'll see...

Great! Hope you get the clean sweep you need to feel confident about going forward. But I've been meaning to ask: what about THAT tattoo?????


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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Originally Posted by amac
Yup, quite the whirlwind. I would not think its possible and would probably more suspicious then I am if it hadn't been for reading about others experiences on this site. I dont know if I will ever be able to understand how one day you can call someone your soulmate and the next drop them like a hot potato, but that seems to be par for the course with affairs. Not to say that I am not cautious or skeptical but I believe it is POSSIBLE that WH is changing, and will give him the benefit of the doubt until I uncover evidence otherwise (which I am always actively procuring :/) . Also, Plan B shields us from the evolution so what feels like a sudden change might have been happening for awhile. WH's family and friends have said they noticed him begin to change in January. As I posted here in March, him being more agreeable in the divorce and more proactive with our kids signaled me that something was up with him, but I didn't place much in it.

Second poly scheduled for tomorrow. WH will go by himself after work, I wont even be there. We'll see...

There's nothing obviously wayward or suspicious about him. I haven't seen anything to tingle the radar yet and I know even better radars than mine are looking out for you. That's not a guarantee but he seems kosher.

The most important thing is that both of you are willing to follow through with a second poly. A still-wayward would have clung to the vague result of the poor test and thrown his hands up at the impossibility of ever pleasing you. A BS in denial would have fallen for it and stopped posting.


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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amac Offline OP
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haha the tattoo ended up not being quite what I thought it was. OW apparently got "I love us" tattooed on the top of her foot as homage to WH, and I assumed he got the same thing. Thank god he did not. He got the first letter of her name tattooed on the bottom of his foot (lots of symbolism there haha), however, the bottom of our feet shed so much skin that it wasnt even there anymore when I first saw him again! He also got a small dot on the crevice of one of his fingers that, literally, I can hardly see. I tried to get him to explain it to me and all he could say was that it was supposed to "symbolize their connection." She used "..." alot in email headlines. I thinks its like the "..." you see when someone is typing a message. Makes sense because everything between them was pretty much chat based. Pretty obvious he did not want these things but did these lame attempts to appease her. Certainly does not appear to be the resounding declaration of love that such things are supposed to be. I dont even think or care about the stupid thing.

No resistance from WH regarding the poly today. I sent him off this morning with the cash and confirmed the appointment with the examiner, he will do it after work.


BW (Me): 39
FWH: 39
DD: 5
DS: 3

D-Day 1: 5/8/17
Plan B started: 6/19/17
For real: 11/13/17-4/3/18
Affair ended: 3/25/18

DD 2: 2/14/20

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Thanks Indie, I do take some comfort knowing that you are and the other vets will know the red flags probably before I do.

No denial here, thats for sure. I think I see the reality of my situation pretty accurately.


BW (Me): 39
FWH: 39
DD: 5
DS: 3

D-Day 1: 5/8/17
Plan B started: 6/19/17
For real: 11/13/17-4/3/18
Affair ended: 3/25/18

DD 2: 2/14/20

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amac Offline OP
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Failed again.

Now I just have to assume he is lying and there have been others. I can see 2 reasons for him not be wiling to come clean about the past:

1) He does not want to admit he is a sex addict or be labeled that way because of shame, and thinks that if he can prove himself from now on it won't matter in the end, and he doesn't believe me when I tell him it won't change my willingness to move forward now

2) If I know everything I will be more vigilant, and although I believe he is sincere in wanting to never do these things again, I think most addicts don't want to be addicts, but the addict part of them has to leave a tiny crack open, in case of emergency so to speak.

WH is still adamant there has been no one else. I tried to use a ruse and tell him I had proof, he said he knows where he has been and what he has done so he could explain it. He said "If there is a god at the day of reckoning then you will know I'm telling you the truth." He says he is not going to lie to say that he did something he didn't do to close this issue. Ugh, zero progress.

I have spent all morning going over EVERYTHING. Looked at over 8,000 emails going back to when we met in 2008. Searched his ENTIRE internet history going back to 2008. I have 50 pages of searches for porn and chatting throughout our relationship. I just wish I had solid evidence of another sexual encounter that I could show him to make him come clean, but nothing.

I dont think I can kick him out and say no I won't move forward because of the past. I will do that if something happens again. But it is going to make any potential recovery, SO MUCH HARDER because I dont have the clean slate and peace of mind I was hoping for.

I have been advised that I need to make the decision to put the past away and just move forward, accepting in my mind what I believe all evidence points to and put in place all necessary precautions, but to let it go. That feels really hard right now, I do not like the idea of having a lie still exist. Is it even possible to recover that way?


BW (Me): 39
FWH: 39
DD: 5
DS: 3

D-Day 1: 5/8/17
Plan B started: 6/19/17
For real: 11/13/17-4/3/18
Affair ended: 3/25/18

DD 2: 2/14/20

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Hi Amac,
I have followed your post from the beginning. I had high hopes for the lie detector, I am sorry. Please do not let your emotions rule here. Please use your intelligence. One lie is many. If he thinks he is getting away with it, he will continue, just get more careful. I've been there, recovery isn't going to happen without honesty, TOTAL honesty. Please listen to Melody Lane, SuzyQ ,Indiegirl and the others. It's a tough road to recovery. He is just getting his way. Tell him you know a lie when it's a lie. Get strong now. The pain will just be worst next time. And in my experience there will be a next time and a next time after that.


Married 1980
PA 1980 lied confessed 2016
DD 2nd PA Jan 17,2016 3yr PA OW 22yrs old single
2nd DD PA May 16, 2016
WS 25 yrs addiction to porn
Me 63
WS 60
DS 44
DD 39
DD 36
DD 34
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What question did he show deception on?


Ddays 2007 and 2011
Plan B 6/21/11
Divorced July 2012
2 kids
How to Plan B Correctly
Parallel Parenting in Plan B
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Do you have a keylogger on his work computer?

ETA:
Do you have a VAR/GPS in the car?

Last edited by SusieQ; 05/04/18 05:09 PM. Reason: ETA

Ddays 2007 and 2011
Plan B 6/21/11
Divorced July 2012
2 kids
How to Plan B Correctly
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Originally Posted by amac
1) He does not want to admit he is a sex addict or be labeled that way because of shame, and thinks that if he can prove himself from now on it won't matter in the end, and he doesn't believe me when I tell him it won't change my willingness to move forward now

2) If I know everything I will be more vigilant, and although I believe he is sincere in wanting to never do these things again, I think most addicts don't want to be addicts, but the addict part of them has to leave a tiny crack open, in case of emergency so to speak.

The problem with a wayward who has had a SSL (secret second life) for a period of time that it becomes a habit that is very hard to break.

He could be lying about several small things. He could be still having contact with the OW or he could be hiding something BIG. It could be all of the above. It is hard to know at this point.

Sorry that you are going through this. Hugs to you.


Ddays 2007 and 2011
Plan B 6/21/11
Divorced July 2012
2 kids
How to Plan B Correctly
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Originally Posted by amac
As I posted here in March, him being more agreeable in the divorce and more proactive with our kids signaled me that something was up with him, but I didn't place much in it.

This isn't just for you amac, it is also for lurkers who don't post - you cannot tell if a wayward is "changing" just based on their outward behavior. You really can't. Waywards waffle - that's very normal. They can act remorseful. They can seem to "defog" and then easily slip back into bad habits.

You have to look at EPs and the elimination of the SSL. That's all that really matters.

Last edited by SusieQ; 05/04/18 05:17 PM.

Ddays 2007 and 2011
Plan B 6/21/11
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2 kids
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I am a bit hesitant to post this, because I am speculating and not based on facts and I don't want to poison your thoughts with bad scenarios.

Could it be something unethical took place between him and a client? Being honest about that could potentially be a dealbreaker for you (resulting in a divorce) and damage his career (his most valuable asset after divorce).

When your WH wanted to reconcile, my first thought was he is a lawyer and knows how bad he made things for himself while in the fog. His first priority now the fog has lifted a bit is damage control. The possibility of a divorce is still there and because of his fogged behaviour, the advantage is yours if you file now. Reconciliation is financially his best option at this moment.

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Have you had sexual contact with anyone besides Amac and OW during you relationship with amac? Sexual contact was defined for him as intercourse, oral sex, anal sex and he suggested to the examiner that it include intimate kissing.

He has passed all questions relating to contact with OW.


BW (Me): 39
FWH: 39
DD: 5
DS: 3

D-Day 1: 5/8/17
Plan B started: 6/19/17
For real: 11/13/17-4/3/18
Affair ended: 3/25/18

DD 2: 2/14/20

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I doubt that. WH cares very much about his imagine. All of his online stuff/affairs have been total strangers out of his normal life. Anyways, he knows if he did something with a client and had to admit it to me, I would not hurt his career with that knowledge. It would be bad for me, I need him to be employed for child support.

My divorce is still pending. I will not dismiss it until the post-nup is signed, signing that is not financially the best option for him. The post-nup will give me the house and my pension; he will get basically nothing. Divorcing now he would be entitled to 50% of the house and my pension.


BW (Me): 39
FWH: 39
DD: 5
DS: 3

D-Day 1: 5/8/17
Plan B started: 6/19/17
For real: 11/13/17-4/3/18
Affair ended: 3/25/18

DD 2: 2/14/20

Joined: Jun 2017
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amac Offline OP
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Thanks SusieQ, I will get the VAR for his car. I will look into a key logger for work. If its possible to do it I will.

I highly doubt he has anything with OW. Would be very hard for him to hid that from me with everything I'm doing now. She is not my fear and never really has been. Its him starting up again..


BW (Me): 39
FWH: 39
DD: 5
DS: 3

D-Day 1: 5/8/17
Plan B started: 6/19/17
For real: 11/13/17-4/3/18
Affair ended: 3/25/18

DD 2: 2/14/20

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Hi Amac, I'm so sorry! My worry after reading all of these posts from yesterday is that it seems to be YOU in the position of desperately trying to make sense of evidence (the poly fail) while WH is just saying "i don't know how it happened. I am innocent" - which, to be honest, is what they all say. My WH said that when I showed him the picture of his penis i found in his whatsapp sent items ("I sent it to myself! It wasn't for her!"). I found it really difficult to focus on the objective evidence when he was doing his whole wide-eye, 'i'm totally sincere' act, while also distracting me by saying things like "if I was really having an affair, you would KNOW because you are so good a monitoring everything I am doing and I am always at home, aren't i?" Cheaters are extremely skilled a deception and hiding stuff. I don't think that we as BSs can be confident that we are covering all bases when the mechanism of protecting the marriage is that we put in the work to check they are not leaving evidence of cheating anyway.

Is there a way to turn this around on him so that HE is doing the work rather than you? Don't you want to say to him "I won't accept you back unless you can pass a poly test?". Then it is all on him.


BW (me) 40
WH, serial cheater, 41
Four children:
DS1 8
DS2 7 (from one of WH's previous affairs, lives with me)
DS3 6
DD 2

D-day Jan 4 2017
Plan B (first attempt) Feb 21 2017
Plan D Aug 28 2017
Plan B (properly) Aug 31 2017

"If you can keep your head when all about you are losing theirs - and blaming it on you....or being lied about don't deal in lies..." IF, by Rudyard Kipling https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/46473
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Originally Posted by amac
My divorce is still pending. I will not dismiss it until the post-nup is signed, signing that is not financially the best option for him. The post-nup will give me the house and my pension; he will get basically nothing.

This is a wise move and a win-win for you. Is he dragging his heels about signing? When I caught my XH cheating a second time, I told him that he had two years to straighten up and that one of the conditions was a post-nup. He foolishly then spent the two years negotiating a postnuptial contract that attempted to strip me of assets. He had not considered the possibility that the two year clock started immediately, not after the post-up was signed.

The process was extremely helpful, it told me everything I needed to know. Dr Harley says a truly repentant WH will give his wife everything.


3 adult children
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Originally Posted by amac
, I do not like the idea of having a lie still exist. Is it even possible to recover that way?

Nope. So sorry mate.

He's failing this question for a reason and it's easier for him to figure out the reason than you. He knows.

I've seen other situations where the wayward failed a question and the polygrapher very confidently showed the betrayed spouse the test questions and the level of failure on the given question. Is it possible to have that conversation with the polygrapher? Not that it matters. A fail is a fail.

I can't shake the feeling he's testing you. If you let this go, you might let other stuff go. A SSL remains possible. In his shoes I'd be going back to the polygrapher until I passed this. It should be important to him too not to have it hanging over.

Originally Posted by amac
I doubt that. WH cares very much about his imagine. All of his online stuff/affairs have been total strangers out of his normal life. .

So does everyone who has a workplace affair. They sleepwalk into it. His marriage was important to him too, right?

I agree with the need for surveillance.


Originally Posted by chalkncheese
Is there a way to turn this around on him so that HE is doing the work rather than you? Don't you want to say to him "I won't accept you back unless you can pass a poly test?". Then it is all on him.

This is another great option.


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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This just isn't enough for me to throw him out. I think its going to be a process. I hope that with counseling he will accept the reality of his addiction and then be able to come clean about the past. If we can't get to that point the marriage will fail anyway, regardless of the polygraph.

I will throw him out if he doesn't sign the post nup, we have a tentative target date for it to be done by 6/1. I will throw him out if I find evidence of current cheating or chatting. I will do anything I can to find any available evidence in this regard. Those are the deal breakers for me.

Keylogger at work might be hard because there is an IT department that strictly monitors their computers. All their time is logged because it is used to calculate billing hours for the clients. He showed me this on him computer when I visited his work. Also, I know for me, I can't even install anything on my work computer, everything has to be done through my IT administrator? Does anyone have any experience with this?

I'm looking at VAR's to put in his car. Being sound activated, it looks like music would even be recorded? WH always listens to music when he drives so I'm afraid I will just get alot of recordings of music. Has anyone heard of one that can differentiate between music and voice?


BW (Me): 39
FWH: 39
DD: 5
DS: 3

D-Day 1: 5/8/17
Plan B started: 6/19/17
For real: 11/13/17-4/3/18
Affair ended: 3/25/18

DD 2: 2/14/20

Joined: Jun 2011
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Originally Posted by amac
I'm looking at VAR's to put in his car. Being sound activated, it looks like music would even be recorded? WH always listens to music when he drives so I'm afraid I will just get alot of recordings of music. Has anyone heard of one that can differentiate between music and voice?

I think you'd just have to listen to whatever you got. If I wanted to make phone calls I'd probably do so as soon as I got in the car, but before I started driving, particularly if they're sexy phone calls (sorry) so you could concentrate on the start of drives. Or use GPS to see if he ever parks up. Totally possible he's calling while driving though.

Its worth thinking about what phone he would be using and where it would be kept. Have you tried searching his car for a burner phone?

You could also try handing him some rope to see what he does with it. Like put a few VARs or nannycams around the house before you have to go out for some made up reason, then monitor what happens when you're not around. Presumably he is less likely to be listening to music.

My concern is he's doing this from his workplace though and you usually need their full cooperation with no honesty concerns to cover that goal.



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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