How old were you in 2001? Thats when MelodyLane joined this forum. Do you know how many thousands of couples she has worked with here? Do you know how many of them have said the same thing as you and then discovered they were mistaken?

Does your wife have male friends?

Do you have female friends?

What are you going to do if she does not do what you are saying she has to do?

Would you like to hear how well Dr. Harley's track record was back when he used to try to save marriages by talking to couples about commitment? (Hint: marriage counselors fail when that's their plan. So did Dr. Harley.)

Have you read this page?

How Dr. Harley Learned to Save Marriages

(Hint: when you signed up you clicked a box saying that as a condition of joining the forum you agreed to read Dr. Harley's basic concepts, and this is the first link in Dr. Harley's basic concepts. Did you read it all?)

This book makes wives miserable - it doesn't save marriages.

My wife tried it.

Dr. Harley's talked about it on the radio.

Wives don't need to be doing the love dare.

Yes, we saw FIreproof. No, this book won't save your marriage. Don't make your wife do this.

Yes, there's a very fresh perspective here. If you as a husband follow the Marriage Builders plan you are very likely to save your marriage.

You can get an hour of free radio help from Dr. Harley every day if you'll install the Marriage Builders app and use it to listen to Marriage Builders radio:
https://www.marriagebuilders.com/app/

Hi Markos,

So your recommendation is to get this book: https://store.marriagebuilders.com/...-of-love-busters-and-his-needs-her-needs

And do the exercises together with my wife? I believe at this point she is willing to try anything which is a breakthrough in our struggle. For example it took a couple months for us to get past the anger and resentment at which point she did not want to do anything. I had to stop love busting and love her unconditionally until her guard came down. The good doctor here actually has the same recommendation, despite what previous posts said. Just be careful not to jump to conclusions.

Where we are at right now is that we both eliminated all love busters with the exception of her not wanting to be intimate physically at all. She keeps saying "she doesn't have the feeling" and the counselors don't seem to be helping or challenging her. For example, the doctor's article on Sexual Aversion seems to be very relevant here. For years she has been giving me duty sex and when it didn't come on time I was demanding about it. I believe this may have caused sexual aversion.

There are at least 4 sources of information that I reviewed that suggest this process takes at least 6 months. We're approaching month 3.

Given where she is at in her head, do you think we are ready for the workbook?

What about the emotional needs questionnaire? I feel like that may cause a problem since it has a question about sex which is obviously off the table right now.

I don't want to present the wrong exercises because I'm only going to get one shot at asking her to do something and if it doesn't work she'll feel hopeless.

Umm no, Dr Harley would tell you to snoop first and expose the affair. You have not done that. Recovery comes AFTER that is done, not before. The advice we give here are DR HARLEY'S STEPS, not our personal philosophies. It comes from going through his program and listening to his radio show every day for many years.

He won't advise you to sweep the affair under the rug as you are trying to do.

If you feel I am giving advice contrary to Dr Harley's I invite you to notify the moderators because that is a violation of the TOS.

You can also reach Dr Harley directly and ask his opinion at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com. [its free]

Right but like I said, I already debunked the affair, but you won't accept it. I spent a solid 6-8 weeks carefully monitoring the situation to be absolutely certain that I wasn't tricked. Can we not accept that newcomers to the forum may be in the middle of a given process already? Or are we just trying to sell GPS monitoring devices.

Continuing to look for an affair that is not there will: waste time, make me apprehensive, possibly get caught snooping (for which my wife will make that the nail in the coffin).

Being jealous and un-trusting to me is a love buster.

I trust my wife, I validated her feelings, and I'm being supportive in her getting over the sexual aversion for which I was the cause of. But, she tends to get "stuck", not just topics like these but all things in life, and as the leader of the household I want to bring the right exercises and next steps to build her confidence.

Or are we just trying to sell GPS monitoring devices.

Disrespectful. Please refrain.

The plan works if you rule out a possible affair. If you post how you did that the good people here can help you see if you've made a mistake or not.

The plan doesn't work if you skip this step. I skipped it and my wife started an affair while I was trying to work the plan. Go figure. Happily married today though - we followed the plan!

The plan doesn't work if you assume you
Get that book ... but send Dr. Harley an email and talk to him on his radio show. It's free. And listen to the show daily - for most people who show up here walking through the steps in that book is not so easy.

You might want to read this:
https://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8110_ul.html

Why would you need to buy a GPS monitoring device if you "carefully monitored her?" Wouldn't you already have one? And no, I don't sell GPS units, I work for a soft drink company. Yes, we can accept newcomers who are in the middle of the process. I don't believe you are there. I DO believe you want to sweep the affair under the rug because you are SCARED.

I suspect your wife has threatened you about snooping and it worked. She has successfully scared you off:
What spy resources are you using right now?


No, it wouldn't, it would do the opposite of making you "apprehensive." It would build your trust and make you feel safe to see she was being trustworthy. In fact, Dr Harley recommends that you snoop for LIFE once you have caught a spouse. Nor would it end your marriage. A spouse who has nothing to hide doesn't hide.


It is not a lovebuster. It is not a lack of trust that ruins marriages but a lack of boundaries. Nor is being "jealous." Being "jealous" is a natural reaction to a risk.

Please list out what spy resources you have in place today.

here

Trust is a REACTION, not an action:

here

Markos, I skimmed the table of contents and I�ve actually tackled most all of that stuff like love busting, demanding, being needy.

Do I make my wife read the book or can it be done alone?

The problem is my wife finds self help stuff to be hokey and she prefers to live life by feel. She would prefer to �let things happen�. By geeking out I feel it is a huge turn off.

Have you ever heard of this objection?

mo, almost everyone who comes here has a spouse who is reluctant to do the program. That's the situation I found myself in when I got here.

Your wife's feelings about this can change, as my wife's did, but thats only likely to happen if you leave no stone unturned in learning and implementing the program.

So - I mentioned Dr. Harley's radio show. Did you leave that stone unturned? If you are going to be working to persuade your wife to upgrade your marriage with you, you are going to be in this for awhile, and you are going to need all the help you can get figuring out how to deal with your situation.


Yep, literally all the time. Been there, done that, bought the T-shirt, listened to the radio show.

Hi Markos,

Yes I hit the radio show about a month ago, got good advice. I also read the entire his needs, her needs book plus this site.

Regarding the affair question people keep bringing up, my wife is not having an affair. She is basically in a holding pattern, wanting to be in love, but not wanting to divorce or split up the family.

Through a deeper discussion I initiated last night I finally uncovered some truths.

She feels we went too fast in the beginning, got married too fast, and that this was a mistake. As for the future she doesn't really know what to do and just sort of wings it every day.

As a previous poster mentioned the love bank is closed to me. She says she recognizes the nice things I'm doing, but obviously doesn't want to reciprocate.

Do I keep taking what I can get in terms of love deposits (which is limited because I can't touch her and she also asked me to stop writing love notes and letters).

Or is it time for a divorce busters 180.

Sir, I'm somewhat in your shoes, except that 6 weeks ago I discovered (busted her with proof) that she had an emotional attachment to an online man from out of state. I ave conviction that she never met the man, or another men for that matter, but I am equaly convinced that she has an emotional affair. I also heard the same things about IILWYBANILWY, and a lot of criticism and comparisons of what I do not do for her. She's a good woman, but we both depleted our love for each other with every and each of the love busters and none of the "his needs her needs" part.
Yes, she never got down to consumate her affair, but in her head she fell in love with her "friend". Your wife loves this coach. That is also very common, as I heard two other cases of people I know. Both cases the wives moved in with the coaches, and both coaches eventually left them for other women. Quite not surprizing, but telling. Your wife is in f=danger to consumate her affair, in spite of what you think. Defend your marriage, and bring her into the MB concepts.
I just am a newby here and cannot advise you further, but your wife does have an emotional affair with the coach, and perhaps she had not yet the guts or opportunity to realise her desires. That would add another layer of complication and hurt to both of you. Stop it as soon as you can, but please think about how you can aknoledge the affair.
Best of luck, and let's keep helping each other here.
God bless you and your wife.

Hi marriedonce,

I actually registered to reply to your assumptions and for other silent readers. I come from hurtful experience. I hope, you still check in here from time to time and your marriage is still worth it.

My exH did not have an affair either. He just told me a lot about a certain colleague that I did not consider a threat as she was not physically attractive whatsoever. Besides she was in a relationship herself.

My ex left the house and came home at usual hours that would not have allowed for extramarital activities. However, this female colleague established a workgroup meeting every Friday after work. Ex would always call me from there so I could hear the pub noises (without me asking for it), be jovial and tell me he would be home soon. Which he was. Reliably so. I never suspected anything as he still kept telling me he loves me. Much later I found out that the after work meeting was only initially with colleagues but soon turned into meeting just him and her. She was the driving force in this and actually reeled him in with several other brilliant actions.

Ex also closed the love bank to me, gradually. By the time I noticed, he was gone (in love with the colleague). No sex with you means she has sex with another man, in her head or already in his bed.

I tried counteracting intuitively. I wanted to move closer to his workplace so he would not see colleague on train. So we sold everything and ready for the move in 4 weeks. Home comes ex from work telling me he could not do this anymore. He got involved too fast and should not have married me. He needed alone time, live on his own which he'd never done and basically he didn't know what to do. He even considered going back to his country of origin. I felt I should support him (ok, that's just me in absolute stupid denial). A week later I got some insulting statements that summed up to that he must have been in a fog to have a relationship with me for 10 years and get married. He had feelings for his colleague but she wasn't interested. I still played nice and helped him pack so he moved in with a male colleague.

I finally started snooping more and found a way into his fb account. Hidden there were pics of our Xmas meeting with his work mates, except all of the pics had her in them, and only her. Only 4 weeks after he'd moved out he outed himself at work that he and colleague were together now. My SIL confirmed to me that they were planning this. They are now married and have a child together.

This is 10 years ago. Today I wish I had found marriagebuilders early on, when I had a gut feeling something was off, when I got sick a lot, exhausted and depressed. My body and soul were screaming emotional affair but his words said differently and I believed him more than I did myself.

Keira, thank you for signing up and posting your story. I am sorry this happened to you. It happened to me too in my last marriage. My XH came to me with Iloveyoubutamnotinlovewithyou, etc etc, and I was clueless. I was completely blindsided. He was in an affair the whole time. I desperately did not WANT to believe it so I dismissed people who mentioned it might be an affair. If I had not been in denial I may have had a chance to save my marriage.

I have been on this forum every day for 18 years and I have seen this happen time and time again. The signs are SO obvious to those of us who know the signs and who have an objective view of the situation. It is sad when people won't listen and take action. It is exhilarating when they do listen and are able to save their marriages. <---that is why I am still here years later paying it forward.