Hello all...

I've been a delinquent to the boards these past few weeks, heck, months! My apologies...

The situation for me is still the same... YUCK! Okay, I've been in this duplex thing with H living upstairs now for ONE YEAR and still no change, no divorce (not even papers drawn), no reconciliation, no words of hope towards this...

So, I've still been looking for a more secure job (currently a consultant) for the past year.

I've found a real possibility but would require a move to DC (currently live near Chicago). H is open to it, and his company is open to his relo and doing the job from there.

I'm now feeling ambivalent. What are the pro's and con's...? What I would love to hear from you wise posters is YOUR OPINION?! Many of you do know my story... no KNOWN affair (at least not physical)... We are the parents of three boyz. Two years ago, H separated from me physically/ sexually and moved into his own room. Last year we bought a duplex together and he's upstairs... It's been real hard emotionally sometimes - but in the spirit of Plan A - I thought this would demonstrate love to him and give me a chance to meet his emotional needs. Yes, it did, but it's not reciprocal.

I'm left with a decision... Here's my list or analysis... whatcha think?

Pros:
* good job/good pay
* great relocation package - closing costs on selling house and buying new house covered, moving costs covered (they come in and pack and move and unpack in DC)
* chance to start over - do I do another duplex thing?
* better job market and international environment
* good schools

Cons:
* ME making the decision instead of waiting for HIM to make up his mind. (funny that I think this is a bad thing)
* Moving our three children to a 3rd school in 3 years (Remember we lived in E. Europe for six years until Dec 2000 when all h#ll broke loose)
* Finding a new home - what type of home?

So, this is the starter.... anyone have anything that I need to consider?!

Thanks for your thoughts...

Ciao,
Nicole

Dear Nicole,

Of all the situations on the boards, your's has always confused me the most. I don't understand what is going on in your H's mind (then again I didn't understand mine either when he left!).

The whole situation has pros and cons but what have the children said? Do they know? The third school in 3 years, well, that's not the greatest experience but I know a lot of people who had to change schools a lot, they weren't happy, but they survived. If anything, it teaches them how to handle change and make new friends.

I would worry more about the effects of the living arrangements on the children then the move. It is not the normal healthy relationship kids should see, but it's not the clean break yet either.

I think that if you are ok with the living situation and he is willing to move, in a way, that's great, at least he's a part of the kids life. I have to give him credit for that, and credit for not living in the same house (you know what I mean) and just staying in an unfulfilling relationship for the kids. It sounds like he might want to be apart from you and not the kids. That is a hard thing to think about, but I still think it's good he's involved with the boys.

The job market is terrible right now. If you can make more money and get help moving (I'm assuming it's the same company paying you to move?) well, I'd move.

You'll have more control of your own life if you earn more money and when YOU decide what you want out of this marriage, you'll have the finances you need to stand up for yourself, rather then be left behind like a lot of us were.

Is your H seeing women now? What will happen when he (or you) wants to start? I can't imagine either of you be very happy with this set up forever???

Hugs, and good luck. I'm in the process of relocating, selling house and all, it's scary at times, but my friend just reminded me yesterday, hey....you've been thru worse!

Good luck, hugs, Dana

((((((((Nicole))))))))

I am not sure what I want to say with this one. I am all for you getting a new job, more pay, and so on. Even the children moving schools is not that big a deal. It actually does teach them to be more resilient, as I have seen with my own. In fact, with my last move, I was so amazed at how they all just seemed to make friends so quickly again, and become involved in their new schools.

I wonder about whether your H should come with you however. He has never really experienced life without you, nor you him, and while it is a convenient situation, it is really not good for the children, because they surely know that the situation is not normal.

I don't think as graciously as DanaB does when it comes to this living arrangement you two have at his request. To me, it shows a distinct lack of b***s on his part. He doesn't want you, but he doesn't want the inconvenience of you not being there either. He can happily live upstairs without ever appreciating the full consequences of what it would be like to lose you.

You have been in Plan A for a long time now, and I am wondering how YOU feel about him these days...do you love him, want to grow old with him, or are you losing love and respect for him, and need to be away? As you live now, you can't do a Plan B at all, and for YOU I think that is sad. You must see no end to this nightmarish way of living. It is stagnant, not moving in either direction.

So I guess my question is......"Nicole, what do you REALLY want to do about this?" Because we can give our opinions until the cows come home, but it is YOU who has to live it.

My only advice would be to do what ever it is you truly want, and nothing else.

Love and light,

Jacky

((((((((((((((((((((((OvrCs)

Careful on the right side, I cracked a rib.

Have you ever seen the car a mechanic drives? Typically, a mechanic who can work wonders on any automobile that comes into his shop drives an old beater held together with bailing wire and duct tape. So what the heck does that have to do with you? Sweetheart you are probably the nicest, most honest, loving person that I’ve ever had the good fortune a chatting with. Whenever I have a “moral” dilemma, I don’t call Dr. Laura because I don’t have too. Yet, I sit here and watch thinking to myself that you are settling for something held together with bailing wire and duct tape.

Children such as yours are extremely resilient and yet at some point that must wear off. The social ramifications may be great but that’s not something we can judge until later in life. You can slap me if you think I’m out of line here but I have to ask, WHEN IS IT TIME? When is it time to throw in the towel? Over the past year, has your husband given you even a glimmer of hope, I don’t think so. Is continuing in this setting “healthy” for the boys, again I don’t believe so. Have you settled for bailing wire and duct tape, I think so.

So whether it’s a move across the street, across town, to D.C., or closer to me (wink! wink!) I totally support it and think that it is in everyone’s best interest. As long as that wire and tape are holding things together, there is no motivation to fix the problem. You know what I’m saying, healing can’t hardly begin let alone cycle until the adversity is faced.

So let’s look at your Pros and Cons, heck for fun I might even throw a couple of my own in:

Pros:
* good job/good pay – Who’s gonna argue with that?
* great relocation package - closing costs on selling house and buying new house covered, moving costs covered (they come in and pack and move and unpack in DC) – Again, who’s gonna argue with that?
* chance to start over - do I do another duplex thing? You know that answer….
* better job market and international environment
* good schools
* Opportunity to heal
* Opportunity to “break the cycle” and lead by example
* Opportunity

Cons:
* ME making the decision instead of waiting for HIM to make up his mind. (funny that I think this is a bad thing) – It is a bad thing but it is something that must be done and if not by you then by whom.
* Moving our three children to a 3rd school in 3 years (Remember we lived in E. Europe for six years until Dec 2000 when all h#ll broke loose) – Their lives are disrupted at this point, though I think continual disruptions are not good, this disruption has the chance to lead to stability.
* Finding a new home - what type of home? A big red one….

Dear, you know that you’re the only person that can put the cost on your emotional well being but personally I think your selling out. I hope that I didn’t offend you, I’m just offering my opinion and you know what they say about opinions?

Maybe it’s time. May the good Lord hold you and your family in the palm of His almighty right hand and guide you through these times. During the storm, may He provide shelter under His wing until it passes.

Hugs (Watch that rib), Thoughts, & Prayers

I work and live here in the DC suburbs. There are some things that you may want to consider.

I would do a through check of the schools. I failed to do that and wound up in the system second from the bottom.

Also I want to make you aware of the housing market here. It is very tight and very much a sellers market. Often homes sell within hours of being on the market. (The townhouse I bought was on the market a total of six hours.)

My advise is to do what you feel you need to do for yourself and your children.

<small>[ July 09, 2002, 10:22 AM: Message edited by: trina1 ]</small>

I think the answer is right there in your own signature line:

"NOW in another holding pattern until H gets his US citizenship... then he says he'll file."

Sounds to me like you are simply his ticket to getting his US citizenship, and then you get thrown out like yesterday's garbage. The only issue is do you want to enable that, or take care of yourself. Plan A is all about taking care of YOURSELF, as you know...

AGG

Dear all...

Thank you for your words of wisdom...

The fact is, the marriage is over, but we still are a family unit - mother - father and three children. So, how do we best facilitate the emotional, social, physical development of the children? This is my question.

My other question is, how do I heal under these circumstances... the answer is slowly...

DC - I do need to research the schools... how does one do that effectively? How did you find out it was the 2nd lowest trina1? I will need to work near Union Station... what's a good area to look to live?

Dana, Jax, Bill, AGG... I don't feel "good" about making this move by myself. But neither do I feel "good" about waiting around here until he decides to "dump" me either. He's not seeing other women - to my knowledge. He is having the conveniences of having me around, as you say Jax Ninatoo... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He doesn't want you, but he doesn't want the inconvenience of you not being there either. He can happily live upstairs without ever appreciating the full consequences of what it would be like to lose you. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It's absolutely true... I guess I'm wondering what needs are being met in me that keep me in this situation? I am enabling him. I must be co-dependent.

But Jax, just as honestly, I don't want to have the full consequences of losing him either... but for gosh sakes, it's been this long! I've seen others have a break through when they least expect it. So, part of me still holds on to hope.

As I have read up on Plan A, this is a normal way to feel. I've been told by so many of you to get a plan and move on. It's just not that easy and yet it's not that terrible either.

So, here I sit... I guess I'll move forward with the job thing... and see how it all comes together. I guess I can just refuse the offer or it may be the answer I've been waiting for (just not wanting to actually hear).

Thx...
Nicole

"DC - I do need to research the schools... how does one do that effectively? How did you find out it was the 2nd lowest trina1? I will need to work near Union Station... what's a good area to look to live?"

My suggestion would be to start with websites. I live in Maryland outside the beltway. I moved last month to get my kids in the best school system in the state. So they will have been in 3 schools in 3 years. The Department of Education in the state is part of the state website and contains information about the test score for school districts. (Virginia probably has something very similar). There are four counties that border the district they are Montgomery county (MAryland), Prince Georges (Maryland), Fairfax County (Virginia and the wealthiest county in the country), and Arlington (I believe and that's Virgina as well.)

I live in Howard County in Maryland which is north of the beltway. I would suggest Virginia (Alexandria or Fairfax County). If you are considering MAryland then I would NOT consider Prince Georges County. The schools are horrible but better than schools in DC. Consider Montgomery County if you need to be close or consider Howard if you are willing to consider public transportation or a longer commute. (A word of advice anything outside of the beltway school wise will be better than inside.)

If you have ever been to Washington you'll know that there is a subway stop at Union Station. If you live in the outer suburbs there are commutter trains available (MARC in MAryland and VRE in Virginia)

Sorry to be so long but I wanted to give you as much information as I could.

Thank you Trina1 - this was very helpful. I was thinking of Maryland. Are the houses more affordable?

I don't want a long commute, but who does? When you need affordability, you need a long commute. I'll be working for a not-for-profit, so money won't be plentiful.

I guess I will go back to looking at VA... just need a metro or train to get to town... and that feature always means $$ for real estate! Okay Whom do I trust?

Thx again...

Nicole

Nicole...

Make a list of the pros and con's of him going with you..

Yes, the number 1 would be that your 'still' a family..but what kind of family??

"I" think something you should discuss with your husband is about what behavior you can expect from him..if he goes then things should change..
he should be more a part of the family structure..
meaning mom and dad actually living together as husband and wife..not seperate lives in the same house..I mean if it's a new start..then it should be a new start for you two as a couple as well..
but thats just my opinion...

Make a list of what having him around now gives you..and what needs it doesn't meet..and see which are most important..TO YOU!!!

TR, THANKS! GREAT question... I just wrote him an email stating </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I have to ask. Would you consider this...

If we make a new start in Washington DC, would you be open to consider a new start with our marriage?

Love,
Nicole</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My guess he'll write back with one word: "no"

Then I'll make my list and move on from there... In the meantime, I don't have the job, not even the offer yet... so I'm going to apply and take the next step in that direction and keep evaluating along the way...

Thx again,
Nicole

"Thank you Trina1 - this was very helpful. I was thinking of Maryland. Are the houses more affordable?"

Of the suburbs I believe Maryland is the most affordable. I live in Laurel, MD which is in three counties. Depending on what time I leave home and traffic, I can be to the metro in 15 minutes then you add time on the train. There is also a MARC train station in Laurel that takes you right into Union Station.

Try looking at www.realtor.com to get an idea of where you can afford to live. House prices here are insane so be prepared.

Waiting with baited breath for his answer Nic....

Well ...

He hadn't read it... I asked him if he had. So he went to look for it. Then he said, </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What do you want me to say to that? I am not sure. Why do I have to go over it again and again? You already have the answer. The reason I don't say it is because there are always questions and accusations that follow.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">So after I say I will not say a word following he replies... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Here is your answer... no. OK? R U happy now? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">... to which I offer no reply as promised.

Okay, this is it then. I will make my way forward alone (with my boyz) on this 10th day of July. My feelings? Bewilderment but not shock. I knew this... just didn't want to know it. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

Thanks all for giving me your insight... I have some thinking to do and lists to make. Take care! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Nicole

((((((((((((((OvrCs))))))))))))))

(((((((((((((((((((Nicole)))))))))))))))))))

(((((((((((((((((My Friend))))))))))))))))))

Hope, whether real or perceived, is a terrible thing to loose. You and the boyz are high up on my prayer list....

Hugs, Thoughts, & Prayers

I love you Nic, you have my number. I rarely sleep and the kids won't wake up if the phone rings - so anytime honey.

E <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Nicole,

You shouldn't rely depend upon our answers, ESPECIALLY ones from mostly divorced people, and mostly divorced against their wills. . .
we would almost always be saying that life is better. . . but that is our case, not yours.

I think you should be sitting down with your own personal, individual counselor, and coming up with your own, custom tailored plan for nicole. . .

then that way, you have a well thought out, discussed plan on what you should do and how to handle the situation. . . in depth conversation and detail so that the counselor can help you out in finding your own personal plan . . . .

good luck,
but i know I have recommended a plan, but always recommended a counselor to do it with you. . .

wiftty

Dear Nicole, the move sound great. Can I ask you where is your husband from? The differences in culture might attribute to whatever is going on. I am from E Europe myself and know first hand how it can affect a marriage. Take Care of yourself, you have something to look forward to.