Good Morning Everyone,<p>It's been awhile since I've been here.
I've known for almost 2 years about oc.
In all this time we have never known for sure
if oc is really my H's. We have struggled to
get our marriage on track. Honestly I can say that
my H is a wonderful man, husband and father to our
children. We've gone up, down, over, around and thru all the issues and possibilities...
After waiting and working on ourselves, is it
understandable that I can not go any further without finding out the truth of the dna test?<p>In our case the ow lives a couple miles down the
road and that has been one of the biggest struggles for me. She was a onetime mistake/bad
choice that my husband made 7 wks before our
wedding. She was and remains married herself.
She came to my H 3 times wanting money for the
child she says is his. She has not been back since
I confronted her with dna test forms...then she
said she didnt want to disrupt her child's life.<p>I have tried to lay this to rest for the benefit
of everyone. I can not. I feel we have a Right to
know. We have young children...I want to know if
they have a half sibling living down the road.
What about the future? We are prepared to start
a trust fund if the test is positive. I've already
looked into laws regarding our situation.<p>I've come full circle in accepting my H's
responsibility in this painful mess...we just
want closure now. What is, is. That can't be
changed now. <p>Are we wrong for needing to know?
I can see my H's remorse and pain in his eyes
for being the cause of such heartwrenching pain.<p>On the other hand, the ow was nasty and unapologetic. I can not imagine being so mean
if I were in her shoes. I want to know if her H
knows of anything...what a horrible mess of lies
if he does not know. I don't see how this can go
on without a resolution.<p>Please try to bear with my jumpy post...there
is so much on my mind. One thought leads to
another...<p>I am looking for some help. We have outlined
a letter to ow and her H. Legally we cant push
dna test because my H has no rights, but we are
hoping to reason with her H. All we want to do
is find out the truth. We dont desire a relation
ship with oc...only to start a trust fund and
to prepare ourselves for the future possibility
that he'll come to us for answers...which we will
give him. <p>I'm tired of hiding my head, feeling shame for
something I didn't do. <p>Does anyone understand? If you are going to bash
my H for not "stepping up" sooner...don't bother.
I've already bashed him one to many times!
Those days are over...it's time to move on.<p>I just want to say this board if full of wonderful
people sharing some of the most painful parts of
their lives in hopes of finding a way out of the
grief. You are all in my thoughts and prayers for
success in these struggles.<p>Hi to all my old friends! Hope you all are well.

Dear Fluke,<p>I used to be Mrs. Job. Glad you dropped by.<p>I am not exactly in your situation but I have a suggestion. Why don't you start that trust fund anyway? I think that there are now educational tax-free funds that you can set up that can be used for any of your children--yours together, his, yours from a previous marriage. That way, if maybe-OC ever comes around the money is there.<p>Also, look into the laws in your state. I'll bet that exOW is about to pass that point where she can pin paternity on your husband. If so, I would count my blessings. You won't have child support for the next 21 years, you won't have to decide on visitation. The worst that can happen is 16 years from now a young person may show up wanting some answers. Your answer can be "we thought you might be Mr. Fluke's child and we tried to convince your mother to get testing done so we could be sure and meet our (Mr. Fluke's) financial obligations, but she refused. It appeared to us that your parents were trying their very best to mend their marriage and since you had a Dad the best that we could do was pray for you and hope you had a good life."<p>I am sure that the not knowing is difficult, but on the other hand the knowing isn't really any better. My BIL has cancer and probably will not live more than a couple of years. <p>Two years ago, my H had a facial tumor that required massively invasive surgery and plastic surgery to repair the damage. There was a 40% chance at the time of surgery that it was cancer. <p>I was talking to my SIL, the one whose H has cancer. I said "Well, at least this awful waiting will be over in a couple of weeks. Knowing one way or the other has got to be better than this constant worry." <p>She said (no offense intended) "Don't be ridiculous. If it is cancer you would gladly go back to the days of worry when there was at least a possiblity that everything was going to be OK."<p>I am not trying to be dismissive of your feelings or your situation, but I think that you and Mr. Fluke are about to slip under the wire--the wire set up by most states for establishing paternity. Soon. Mr. exOW will be the legal father for all eternity. He either doesn't know what his wife has done or is willing to forgive her and move on and raise this child.<p>Shalom,
MJ

Fluke,
I understand completely. We don't know if OC is my H. THough OW is not married. And the father on the BC says unknown. MY H asked her for paternity testing and she just hung up on him. We don't know what OW plans are if she changed mind or what. I keep thinking what if anything happens to my H or me can OC get anything? Will they take DNA from one of our kids.<p>SO, is OW H's name on BC? It is hard not knowing. But everyone seems to think here that we should just count our blessings that we don't have any CS. OC in my case is only 7 months old. Soemtimes I am o.k. with that but then the fear factor sents in.<p>Dawn

Hey there, Fluke,
Do you both want her H finding out this way?
If you do HE may wish to establish paternity even if the time limit has passed.
Here in Ohio, no matter how much time has passed, a MM can request paternity at any time if he suspects c isn't his, and he won't be made to pay cs in a divorce. Relatively new law.<p>Trust fund sounds better. If oc never shows up it'll be your savings! If he/she does show up...again even though so late, do paternity.<p>As for not knowing it may or may not make you crazy,,,,apparently does. <p>Maybe let it go.<p>If all has been quiet I'd drop it. Especially if she (like ours) is still married.
Ours has been quiet for about 1 1/2 mos. <p> You did nothing wrong but I used to feel shame too. No more.
She parades w/oc as if no one knows and the whole town talks about her.<p>Best wishes.
love
Debi<p>[ May 30, 2002: Message edited by: gemini1 ]</p>

Fkuke, I understand your pain of not knowing, but I wish I were in your shoes.Since I pay nearly 1200 a month for CS , about 250,000 over 18 years, I wish paternity had never been established.<p>Right now, the only father that child knows is the OW's H. Keep it that way.<p>If child comes up years later, wanting to see the father who donated sperm, you can choose to meet child or not.<p>The sperm donor doens't make him daddy, in my opinion.<p>If saving money for child makes you feel better, o,.k.<p>I suppose it is always possible OW could come down to see you later about child, but I doubt it.<p>I envy your no contact, no CS position .<p>I would leave it alone and continue to live your happy life.
Trust me, knowing this is the most awful thing. I often wish I didn't know. It never goes away, even without contact.<p>Leave it alone,that is fortunate for you.

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by unhappy wife:
<strong>.Since I pay nearly 1200 a month for CS , about 250,000 over 18 years,
</strong><hr></blockquote><p>
Where in god's name do the courts come up with these outrageous child support figures????
My XH has to pay 890 for our two daughters, and his income is nothing less than very healthy,we also live in a higher cost of living state? Why is a child born out of wedlock deemed more deserving? Not that I want anymore, infact we're renegotiating his CS ,due to the fact we're moving to a lower cost of living state. CS should not be finacially crippling..fair is fair!!!!

It's no secret that I think the CS some of you guys pay is outrageous but what I want to know is how do they figure it out. I get $90/week or $360/month for my daughter. xOM is single, has no other children and makes at least $40,000/yr. The judgement was originally for $120/wk but he managed to get it lowered. He still always complains to me about how tight money is for him. He owns his own house, two new vehicles and assorted toys. I on the other hand have a $50,000 mortgage, a car payment and a 15 yr old broken down truck. I'm not sure he really knows the meaning of money being tight.

want it back
What state do you live in? How did the judge figure $90 per week. Just wondering. It seems your judge was not out to get your ex-OM.<p>Dawn

I think WIB brings to light another very important point of view. Its not all about the poor guy who made a "sperm donation" and then gets raked over the coals by some ow. These affairs affect us all, not only the BS but the OP too. It's sad to me that a woman is being talked about because she chose to keep her child. What about the other half? I'm not suggesting that it's a bad thing that no one is talking about the WS who fathered that child, just seems like so many doublestandards going on with all of this. Why does the guy get off so easily in these situations? It seems in what I read here and in my life experience that the BS and OP suffer the most and the WS's in particular, somehow dodge the bullets.
It is mostly the BS's & ex-OW's here siting their suffering,which I do not doubt to be very real and very powerful. I'm just very frustrated with how these things work out. In the end, its every person for themself and it does bring out worst in us all. If only people could see where they'd end up after the A. I'm just venting my frustrations today, please don't take any of this personally.

I live in Maine. CS was figured using a standard worksheet. When payments came to $120/week xOM argued that the amount had been figured using his previous years earnings in which he worked a lot of OT. He said he would not be working that much OT in the future(guess what, he still is). I can not contest this amount for another 2 1/2 years now so there's nothing I can do until then.

C Miranda, I am sorry, I take exception to the fact the OP and BS are the ones in pain, not the WS. <p>Forgive me, but I think the OP should be experiencing some pain for her decision to keep a child and then expect her decision to force a family to change their income, their way of life, etc. If I were not working, my H would be very hard pressed to provide for all our needs, due to our outrageous child support. OUr CS is high because H earns good income, OW is uneducated and doesn't, and that is what they decided. I do not think my H ever suggested income should be lower since we have 3 kids.<p>The OW is now using our money to pay for extracurricular activities for her child. How lovely. I resent every penny she gets-because she "wanted child." There were years I chose not to have kids, despite wanting them, because I did not think I could afford care of child. I did that thinking of denying my needs for needs of child and betterment of any future child I would produce. But the OW didn't care she couldn't afford a child-she didn't have any, she wanted one, she got one and then crucified us for high CS. I have suggested she reduce CS to us-she refuses. No wonder I am angry.<p>I had recent thoughts before discovery of quitting job and staying home with our 3 kids. For me to do so now is nearly impossible.WE too live in high cost of living state-- and even apt . living is outrageous. <p>
Do you think OW cares? no-just cares about herself and oC.<p>I resent the price my kids and I are paying for the selfishness of OW and H. AT least I know H didn't want child, wanted her to abort or adopt, but OW didn't want to do that. Said she would do this all on her own.<p>Ha-she even lies to herself. I see no reason why I should pay price for the wrongoing of others, especially of OW.<p>I really do hate her.

Dear MaryJane, Dawn, Gem and Unhappy Wife,<p>Thanks for your replys...I realize our "luck"
in this situation compared to some.
If it weren't for the close proximitiy and
the fact her family knows ours...I'd let this
drop. But I know that it'll come out someday
and I'd rather face that storm sooner than
later.<p>As for life being too short...I know all too
well. We just lost my 39 yr old brother to
skin cancer. He did know his was terminal but
never acknowledged that and kept a positive
attitude up until the very end. Watching
him waste away without anything we could do
to help him will always haunt me. It's one
reason I am not going to stay in hiding
regarding oc. There is something I can do
about that situation. <p>I knew that many would advise me to let
sleeping dogs lie...and when I see how
unjust cs can be in these cases, it makes
me sick. Does it make any sense that I don't
want to live this lie anymore?
She opened this can of worms and then changed
her mind...what is stopping her from doing
that again? Are we supposed to wait and see...
I am tired of waiting.<p>Thanks again for your responses.
This board sure has changed.

fluke
I am sure the others who posted here as well meant you no harm... sometimes it helps to see things from all sides.

Hey Fluke, did I offend you? I certainly didn't mean to and I am sorry if I did. I tried very, very hard not to sound dismissive our your situation. I did not want act like the amputee who goes to a hangnail support group and tells them all how lucky they are. [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Again my apologies if I came across differently than I intended.<p>MJ

Fluke,
I understand what you say. OW told everyone that my H was the father and asked him for money to pay some medical bills that had nothing to do with her pregnancy. She saw the dr. before she even knew she was pregnant. AT least, that is what she said. She needed to get her seizures meidcation. She did not have the money to pay for the dr. visit. I did not know this until after my H payed the bill. So, then I told him no more money until paternity is proven. But now, she won't take it. I know she is not rich and living in low income housing. <p>So, what is going to stop her in the future to ask for money? It is like waiting for the bomb to drop. Then again, she may never ask for a dime. I do not know. <p>It must really hard on you if you are close to her family and living so close to her. I can see why it is so hard on you. I can see why you want to get the test done. I really want to know if this OC is my H. <p>Dawn<p>[ May 31, 2002: Message edited by: Dawn71 ]</p>

I'm confused...I didn't realize that there was a time limit for declaring paternity. I heard of one case where the man found out about the child ten years later and was socked with 10 years of back child support, plus interest! Are there some states that put a time limit on this?

UW,<p>I understand you hate her and with that, you are biased toward the other point of view. Its not wrong or bad and neither is the other point of view, which as you know by now, is where I tend to approach these issues from.
That is what I said in my post yesterday. I was recently a WS and OW. I do know that WS suffer, but it's more about suffering over the pain that we cause the people we love, all of them, BS, OP, and our children.
As a OW, I go so far to say that ow feel many of the same feelings that BS feel. That may sound crazy but that is what I've discovered reading the BS reaction to affair. Of course the betrayal aspect doesn't apply but, so, so many of the other feelings do. I don't expect BS to feel sympathy for OW, of course not. What I want to bring to light is that everyone involved with the WS suffers from the affair. Thats all, just my take on things. I don't want to debate over it, I just want to share my view.
Fluke says she wants to know if child is her husbands. I personally feel she is wise to address the issue now rather than hope it just goes away.. I know from my own A that OC just don't go away and the consequences of that are far reaching.

Dear MJ,<p>Sorry, no you didn't offend me. I'm sensitive
about this...I haven't taken it lightly. If I
were you or Unhappywife...I'd be telling me to
leave it alone and count my blessings too.
I wish it were that simple to put aside.
I truly appreciate your insight.<p>Unhappywife,<p>I feel much the way you do about the ow.
I see how torn you are...and what a fighter
you are. I have sat on my hands for 2 years
about this, always worrying about the day
it would all come out. I am trying to not make
a rash decision that will jeopardize my family.
Thanks for sharing your story.<p>Dawn,<p>Sounds like you've been playing the waiting
game too...some days it's doable and other
days you feel like I can't take this one more
minute. I completely understand why we are
the lucky ones in that we don't have unjust
cs going to the person who made a horrible
impact on our lives, while they get the gift
of H's child. It still cuts me in half to
picture oc. Op's family isn't very close to
mine, her aunt & uncle knew my H and my oldest
brother way back when...we've distanced ourselves
from the aunt and uncle. I keep waiting for the
day they'll come to us and say Hey, so and so's
kid looks an awful lot like you...
I wish I could see the child for one minute...
maybe that would tell me. My babies strongly
resemble my H.
Thanks for understanding. It feels like damned
if you do, damned if you don't. <p>Mariachimom,<p>Apparently there are time limits in some
states for disputing paternity, not establishing
it. In our case op was and remains married.
As oc will be 3 very soon, the time limit for
her H has passed. Not to mention the importance
of their relationship together, if any...we just
don't know what their domestic situation is.
When op had sex with my H, she had told him
she was in an "open" marriage...how nice, huh.<p>Laws are changing quickly though and I feel
the mothers need to be held more accountable
for the lies they tell the men. I've always
felt I am responsible for MY actions, even if
that means getting pregnant by having casual sex.
I would feel like a heel demanding payment for
my own stupidity. If the op in our case has
presented fradulent paternity to her H, I'd
be the first to tell him to throw the book at
her. <p>Hey mom of 5, I do appreciate hearing all sides.
That's why I posted my dilemia. I just want
peace of mind. I responding to those that
replied to my situation. Take care.

Fluke I can understand perfectly why you no longer want to live a lie.
I'd perhaps arrange a meeting between her H and you and your H and ow.
Write to let them know you need to talk about something. It'll be up to ow to tell her H before that meeting.<p>As far as CM goes....
CS is a way to penalize a man and reward an ow who MAY have been out for revenge when things don't work out.
HEY KEEP THE KID!!! But using the courts to make MM pay for a life ruining situation is hard on everyone, WS, BS, C of marriage, and OC in the future, especially when no visitation is wanted and all the MM wants is to forget the A ever happened.
Ow here in OUR CASE said not to worry she'd do it herself....then all of a sudden when things didn't go as SHE planned she screwed H another time in another way...legally.<p>Laws need to change, period. They need to take into consideration if an ow has a trust fund, is married, how she supports other kids of marriage, etc....it all needs an overhaul, cs system helps women out when they spread their legs for a man not their H. IT NEVER HELPS THE MAN WHO WAS INVOLVED.... perhaps if he could charge OW for 18 years for helping destroy many lives then it would be fair. Many times cs in these situations hugely deduct from existing family and future plans.<p>How 'bout OW PAYING MM for the wonderful child they love? For the privledge of using MM sperm for such a wonderful thing?
Now that's fair.

Gemini,
I see you are very bitter. I think that you should remember something in your bitterness. You are very insulting. I won't give in to my initial instinct to comment about he man who was willingly servicing the OW.
My affair, which is my experience, wasn't about just sex. It wasn't what you are telling yourself it was. That is what scares BS. The emotional ties. We can go ahead and pretend they don't exist and cut to the chase.
Charge me for OM sperm? To get in the dirt for a moment with you, umm, it was given freely quite often. So, that doesn't make a bunch of sense to me.
Charge OW for destroying your life? I would go for this. Except for the small problem that she didn't act alone. She didn't have a chain around the man. She didn't pay him, she didn't force him. In my case, OM persued me more often than not. Blaming OW for all the problems of the affair is fine but I don't see where it has gotten you anywhere. Its no different than the FOG you all accuse the WS is in. Your post clearly shows how bitter and angry you are.
I don't mind if you don't agree with me, but I won't debate ridiculous remarks. You can make them but please don't address them to me. My responses will only sound as (for a complete lack of a better,nicer term) just as dumb.<p>Its the OW right to 'KEEP THE KID'. Thanks. Just as it was the OM's right not to have sex with a woman other than his spouse that subsequently produced a child. If OW out there need to force a man to pay support, unfortunately, so be it.
I do feel the system needs an overhaul. Yes, some CS is outrageous, but there has to be a system in place to protect OC from people with your mindset.