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Joined: Jan 2002
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I have been noticing lately that I think that most of our exOW on this board were involved in affairs with married men. In other words, both people in the affair were married.<p>Most of us BSs had a spouse who was invovled with a single person. (Usually a wayward H with a single woman.)<p>I think the big diffence in these two situations is that a single woman usually wants more of an affair than a married person. A single woman is not jeopardizing another life, a family that they love. She doesn't have years invested in a relationship, financial entanglements, shared children, shared history, shared families. The difference is she wants to "get" the married man and pull him away from his marriage. She has no other relationship to divert their attention, no dying mother-in-law, no kids with the flu, nothing to keep her from focusing on her main goal--get that married man out of his marriage. She is more of a threat to the marriage, more determined to destroy it. And she is more likely to become enraged and vindictive when it ends.<p>Tigger, Mo5, CM would you have sought to destroy your exOM's life if he had ended the affair or would you have returned to your own marriage and tried to improve it? <p>I think I have figured out a big difference between the BSs and the exOPs on this board. So when we vent against our exOW (and she was a single woman) please know that we face a different enemy to the marriage than you were.<p>Thoughts?<p>MJ

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Thats interesting,
I havent thought about it much, But I can tell you as many times as my husband has cheated with single women, that was their goal and yes when it was over, they caused many a heartache in my family.
AS far as my self, XOM did end it when he got caught after many years and because I was pregnant, he got scared and he met me told me he could never see me or the baby again kissed me good bye crying an left.
I walked away and did not try and destroy other than what he and I had destroyed already. Only problem, while I thought husband and I were working on the marriage, he was playing with someone else all along, and pretending he was being the loving supportive husband.
I can tell you now that I have contact with xom when I see or notice he is having problems and he tries to share, I back away. I tell him, you made your choice, so make it work, learn to be a good husband.
I think we had both gone through periods demanding the other divorce their spouse, seems none of us did, so I guess we are all where we want to be.
Something I have noticed single women on the net, take great pleasure and seeing how they can hurt a marriage, seems to be a challenge for them.
I am whining and moody this morning and probably dont make much sense MJ Please forgive me. lol

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<<I can tell you now that I have contact with xom when I see or notice he is having problems and he tries to share, I back away>><p>Mo5, <p>I wish that my OW would do that also, but then she is single and has no one to answer to, so lending a comforting ear seems only natural to her. As I have said before, she just doesn't understand the need to give up the friendship. It is an on going battle between H and me. They don't understand that their continued friendship or as H puts it (friendly relationship) even thought the PA has ended is very damaging to our recovery.
Tina

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Your theory is very interesting. During my A, we both at different times, asked the other to leave the marriage. I don't know if the desire to "get" the person is necessarily only felt by single people. I wanted him to leave. Other times, I became scared to give up my life with my H, and then I didn't want him to leave. He said he had the same kind of all over the board feelings. It is hard to have an emotional attachment to someone and not desire to have that person permanantly and openly in your life.
I think you may be right that the single woman or man for that matter, has less ties in other relationships and that must have a major impact on how that person reacts to the affair overall, it's ending or the WS staying in the marriage for whatever the reason. I would imagine too that A's with Single OP and WS, do not tend to be long term because Single OP may be more demanding of WS to leave. I am only guessing on that though.<p>I never sought to destroy my OM life or his family. I could never hurt someone that meant so much to me that I'd have left my H at one time or another for him. But I will be honest with you, at times, I felt very ugly thoughts and wished that he would leave. It was very confusing and heartbreaking for me, because I was very emotionally dependent on him. I truly loved him and so I was torn between wanting him to be happy and not wreck his life, and wanting to be happy myself, with him in a relationship that was out in the open.<p>He did end it once, 3 years ago. I cried, and cried and told him I couldn't accept it. He went about the breakup all wrong, looking back. I got the "I love you and will always love you but I have to stop. Its not fair to any of us". I didn't get ugly, but I sure felt ugly inside. Maybe in part, being married already kept me in line. I don't really know. OM didn't abandon me though and that helped me to see that he didn't want to hurt me. As you all know, it didn't end back then. He came back around and we embarked on an attempt to figure out how to stop the feelings. What I'm trying to point out is that he showed me through his actions that he cared about me and that made a world of difference in how I reacted, I think. The feeling of being abandoned by someone who says they love you is powerful in both wounding a person and in that person becoming enraged. I think that abandoment is a big issue in affairs and why they can be so dramatic when they end.<p>In the end, although it was I who said this is it, enough; he didn't fight me on it. In my mind, he had already made his choice 3 years ago never to leave the M. He tried to hold on a little longer and still does want to maintain a friendship. Its hard to let go but I can't imagine getting all ugly and creating havoc.
My family ties were my investment as you say, but also him showing me that he cares enough about me to want to see me happy, also helped in my situation. Single people and those without children, most likely also lack the insight to see that if the WS left his or her family, life isn't happy ever after. There is CS, mortgages, custody issues, families rejection, etc that then cloud the relationship. As a married person, in the end, I realized all these strikes would be against us and that reality is, love is not always enough.

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Tina I dont know your whole story, But I can say that when we first started having contact again, so he could see Daughter, we were always alone,Because his wife did not no yet he was seeing her. I think at first he felt we would fall back to exactly where we were, after all he was sorry and It should be all better now.. I however was offended by that after what he had done, I told him he made his choice deal with it. I think at the time it was because I was angry , not because I cared so much what happened to his marriage, My OWN MARRIAGE WAS just going through another of my husbands affairs.
I will be honest for a min or two, the thought of him holding me so I could cry sounded LIKE the best thing in the world. we had been friends so long. And this was the first we had seen each other in months. But you know, I felt like he ran away made his choice, and I wanted no part of it. I DESERVED better and I wasnt going to do that to my self.
It was just to protect my self.
I back away because , I am just as vulnerable as he is.. and i want more for my life. and I do love my husband and want a good marriage, I am not always sure he and I can overcome all the damage done. Things are not perfect and my husbands habits tell me one day he will cheat again, and when that happens what will I do... I DONT KNOW. Maybe he wont.. But I think after so many times, we keep our guard up.

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I agree with c miranda
I would have never ever done anything to retaliate or make his damaged marriage any worse by causing trouble, he was my friend why would i seek to purposely hurt him. He wouldnt me either. He wanted me happy. I think a single person doesnt understand the committment we have to our families.
Many times he wanted to leave, many times I wanted him to and vise versa. But the end result was, we didnt so we should make the best of our lives, we wouldnt purposely set out to make the other person miserable.
I have had those same ugly thoughts,as has he about my husband.. to this day he thinks I should leave my husband.. however, that is not his business or his choice.

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MJ,<p>Very good observation!<p>Mo5 and CM also bring a new view to this situation.<p>Having read their stories… and reading so many others that are here as well… I also believe there are MAJOR differences in the OP that are married already and those that are single when they engage in an A.<p>Here are my observations. <p>The first difference I see is that the OW/WS is more inclined to be more caring about the OM’s feelings and those of his family. They want to be sure that he is happy.
The OW that is unmarried, generally, only wants to make HERSELF happy.<p>The second difference seems to be that they have had to deal with the pain of their own spouse having an A. (as in Mo5 and Tigger’s stories, I cannot recall if CM said her H had an A) I believe this makes them see even more clearly how the A will affect the MM’s W. And thus makes them more sensitive.
The OW that is unmarried, generally, could care less about the W.<p>I know there are many that will agree… and maybe some that will disagree… none the less... they are my observations…

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CM~You said something very wise....<p>"The feeling of being abandoned by someone who says they love you is powerful in both wounding a person and in that person becoming enraged."<p>This is EXACTLY the wound the BS feels. Abandonment. The WS virtually "left" the marriage ... secretly. It makes any "I love you" messages that occured (between WS and BS) during the A feel meaningless ...nul and void.<p>Hold on to this wisdom. You may need it in the future ... to understand your H's feelings.<p>Blessings upon you.<p>Pepper [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img]

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I know in my situation, the OW began as a married woman but somewhere during A got a divorce, and became a single woman. She had no committments, no children, etc.<p>She cared not what would happen to me and my 3kids if she had the OC-she wanted a child desperately, and even Steve Harley has suggested she used my H to get a child.<p>I think she did not care what having that child would mean to me, my kids, my family, my life, And still doesn't. <p>She also thinks she can still communicate with my H and not hurt our marriage. She has no sense that her attempts at communicating with him is part of the problem.<p>I really dislike her.

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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Pepperband:
<strong>It makes any "I love you" messages that occured (between WS and BS) during the A feel meaningless ...nul and void.<p></strong><hr></blockquote><p>It does even more than that. It pollutes any good memories during the time of the affair and it left me feeling like a complete idiot to have been so blind for so long. It takes a lot of hard work to recapture those warm feelings.<p>MJ

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"It pollutes any good memories during the time of the affair..." AMEN<p>"The feeling of being abandoned by someone who says they love you is powerful in both wounding a person and in that person becoming enraged." EVEN true when the word "love" is NOT SPOKEN!!<p>"...love is not always enough." <p>"The OW that is unmarried, generally, only wants to make HERSELF happy."
I might edit that: "Some individuals only want to make themself happy (married or not)!!"<p>EXCELLENT points, ladies!! Keep up the great work!! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Jenny<p>"Chance cannot change love,
nor time impair,
for love is more than a feelings...
love is a decision,
a commitment
to care forever."

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unhappy wife
I think you have every right to dislike her. It would be unrealistic to think you should do otherwise. <p> I think if we look at inside an affair, neither partner cares what this is doing to the others family. Because when you have an affair you are selfish.. I hate to speak badly of my self [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] But I was selfish. He was selfish. He spent many a day covincing me to leave my husband and how much better he would be with my children than my own husband. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] It was all so we could have more time together.
No one expects you to like her, XOM'S wife is only nice to me, for her husband she knows if she wasnt My daughter would not be in there home, and then her husband would be angry at her.. I am only nice to her because my daughter is in there home and i want her to feel no tention and feel love and it makes a better situation for all.
We have our moments still.. I dont think every one can have contact.. I can say once in a while I wish I did not have contact... He isnt a bad person, he is great with daughter, Just ever once in a while, It would be easier if we didnt have as much contact as we have. I would imagine it would be easier for his wife as well, as I see her insecurities coming through... I dont like being a part of that but know that I am.
He on the other hand thinks its great and has no problems with it what so ever. That is starting to bother me. too much time to think I guess.

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<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by MaryJanes:
<strong>...The difference is she (single OW) wants to "get" the married man and pull him away from his marriage. She has no other relationship to divert their attention, no dying mother-in-law, no kids with the flu, nothing to keep her from focusing on her main goal--get that married man out of his marriage. She is more of a threat to the marriage, more determined to destroy it. And she is more likely to become enraged and vindictive when it ends...
Thoughts?
</strong><hr></blockquote><p>Hmmm... Interesting comments, MJ... <p>I agree with you that desperate, single OPs who consider themselves emotionally involved with the WS would be a bigger threat to a BS than an OP who already has a marriage that can be fixed with a lot of willingness and effort.<p>I also agree with Stacia-Lee that SELFISHNESS plays a role in many cases of OPs who CHOOSE to sleep around with married people when there are PLENTY of single people out there to choose from!<p>Another thing to consider is what the WS is telling the OP. In cases where the WS might be leading the OP on and telling the OP that they love them, I can see where an OP would easily believe the WS's lies and get emotionally entangled and VINDICTIVE when the OP discovers that the WS is back at home with their BS and working on fixing whatever went wrong! Then, the OP is left there, feeling jilted!! Yikes!<p>I guess when you find out that the person you have been sleeping with has been lying to you about their true feelings, it hurts regardless of whether or not you are married to that liar or in an affair with that liar. Both of those actions are hurtful to whomever is on the receiving end--single or married.<p>In cases where there is no emotional attachment, and purely physical affairs, I don't see an OP as a big threat, even when there is an OC in the picture.<p>[ June 20, 2002: Message edited by: BINthereDUNthat ]</p>


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