BBG93, I feel the pain you are in. I don't know what to tell you. Just keep the faith and God will lead you though what ever you feel you have to do. Like I said he never intended to see us unhappy and with his guidance we can get though the hardest of times. Of course like I told a friend when I filed for D last year. God can't file them papers for you. You have to pray about it and feel like thats what you feel God wants for you. I know he wants you to be HAPPY. I haven't heard you smile for a long time now and I am sorry for your pain. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> I wish I could come and just slap him in his head for you, and tell him this is the best thing you ever had or will have and your blowing it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> God did not put us here to be abused, taken advantage of, or for us to live in a place where we couldn't grow as a person. It seems like some people have to get down to the bottom and loose everything they have to look up to him and see what he wants for them. Sounds like he is almost there. I know mine had to get to that place before he started noticing what was important and what is stupid, selfish, and no good. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> (((((HUG)))) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> You need it and I hope you feel better w/ your ashma.

Sorry--I haven't had time until now to post--work was hectic and I was processing payroll for 240 people.

Sunnydale-

I so glad to hear that you had an excellent weekend. Isn't that so nice--enjoy while it. I'm so excited for you.

Babygirl93-

I encourage you to try the contract thing and not to give up quite yet but do what you have to do--myabe it's time but I don't think so--so please don't give up.

KrisM--what's happening??

H worked graveyard Friday night. He came over around noon on Saturday and hung out and slept most of Saturday until 7:00pm or so and then went to his apt.

He said he would come over Sunday and he was their by 9:00 and stayed until 5:30 or and then went and help a friend move some wood. Sunday we picked up around the place outside and I did yard work--we watched amovie took a nap and went and looked at travel trailers--no real reason just for the heck of it--had a bunch of fun and tonight we have a dinner date at our house and I haven't decided what we are having--spaghetti I think--I think this weekend kind of surprised him--I have just charged ahead with things and made plans and picked paint colors etc., and planted a ton of flowers and I think it sinks home a little that I just keep moving forward--he seemd great--seemed like he enjoyed himself.

OW never calls--not our issue right now however mid June is approaching and that is when OC is due.

I'm thinking of all of you--you are in my thoughts & prayers.

KT Happy Belated Birthday--hope is was great.

Albany

Thanks ladies,

I will try the contract thing, my faith is just about gone though. First & foremost he has to file a petition for visitation, and write OW a no contact ltr. except for cases of p/u d/o or an emergency. I refuse to keep living with him running over to her house all the time to "see OC".

I don't see him doing either of those things, he will most likely feel like I am trying to tell him what to do, control him like she does, & I don't have the right. You are right Sunny, God won't file the papers for me so when I come to that conclusion I know he will see me thru it.

It is so funny, my mom told me yesterday that she forgave H for what he has done to me & my dad is not filled w/ hatred & anger at him anymore either. She said they talked about it & decided that as long as I can forgive him & I am happy, who are they to hold a grudge. She then asked how we were doing & I said alright, which is far from the truth. I hated lying to her but if they had an inkling of what was going on all they were have no understanding.

So I will see what tonite brings. Thanks for your hugs & words of encouragement.

Good Luck tonight--my thoughts are with you and remember whatever you decide is your choice--it is your life and just think their could be soemthing much better out their--just trying to say do what is best for you and I support you in whatever decision you make.

Look forward to hearing from you in the morning. Just remember live for you. I will honestly tell you that if I didn't have a child with my H--I would have been done without a fight this time even though I love him so much because walking away would have been really easy--the family thing really keeps me more focused so <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I understand how you have reached a point of just thinking it is time to walk forward on your own. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I will let you all know how tonight goes with dinner, etc. I hope it goes well-it is almost like we are dating--still a little tense every once in awhile--mainly when he talks of going home--maybe just tense on my part--lots of emotions always flowing through my head that I try to keep under wraps so not to LB.

By the way the weather stinks here--rain and wind-not looking dry until Thursday--true Oregon spring weather--Easter weekend was very unusual--sunburn on Easter--not typical spring western Oregon weather--unfortnately we are due some rain.

Albany

Everyone thinks I am crazy for not walking away too, I even question it, since there are no children. I know it is because I love him & this is my second marriage, I don't want to be divorced twice but I have to face the fact that it may come to that. Only God knows for sure, but you are right I have to live for me. I know I have done all that I can do, I am a damn good woman & if he can't see that by now, shame on him.

As Sunny said maybe he needs to hit rock bottom to see what is for real & what is not. Losing me will maybe be his rock bottom. I can't continue to worry about this though. It is costing me too much.

Hey everyone - I've been enjoying the sunny weather with the kids, so I haven't been on the computer until now.

Sunny & Albany - I am so happy to hear things are looking up for the two of you. I hope it continues.

BB93 - Hang in there. I think the contract idea sounds worth trying. Who's idea was it? If it was H's, maybe he is trying to make an effort. It can't hurt to spell out all your expectations and see what happens. Don't let it be all negative. Also, maybe let him know what things you are willing to change/compromise on. Remember its a give and take thing. Doesn't seem fair with everything we have been put through, but let him know you are willing to do your part to - which I know you are. Keep the hope alive. I think there is a reason that you are not ready to file yet. Maybe back off and take some time for yourself so you can refocus, but don't give up.

As for me, Friday night was great as I said in my earlier post. However, there was nothing else happening over the weekend. Only a phone call to see how much I spent on groceries. Tonight when I got home from work, H seemed a little distant. It always makes me wonder if he has had more contact with OW. All these questions go through my head. Was I the only one who felt good about Friday? Was he just using & abusing me to get what he wants? Or is he having feelings again and is just confused? Please, someone give me the WS manuel so I can figure it out!! As always, I am just taking things one day at a time, one moment at a time, one breath at a time. And I am really trying not to read more into things (positive and negative) then what I should. I am just trying to take things for face value and not second guess so much. It is just so hard not to always wonder what is happening when H is not at home.

Talk to you all soon.
God Bless,
Kris

Hey Kris,

Of course the contract idea was mine, any idea about "saving us" is mine. He just walks around oblivious to my needs & wants, neglects me shows my son nothing of how a real man conducts hisself and shows remorse or tries to make amends for his wrongful act - real great role model.

My best friend, who introduced us just told me to have faith & not give up. She felt that I should't even ask him about legal visitaion & cutting contact w/ OW. That I should ask for smaller things. Why should I put off another day asking for something that should have been done over a year ago? I know full well that he most likely will not do either of those things but how long do I wait for THEM to stop making my life a living hell? So I am not backing down on that, enough is enough.

I know how you feel about being with your H & thinking is was really great & him acting distracted & non-chalant. I went through that it was really tough. You can get thru this though, at least you can still feel love from him, even if you question his motives, that is something. Like you said one day, one breath at a time. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

BB93 - Are you still trying plan B? Sounds like your H needs to be aware that you are not joking around with this. As much as I want you to reconcile with your H, maybe it is time for total plan B. Get him out of the house and start living life without him. Explain to him the purpose is to preserve what love you have for him. Tell him that what is happening is not working and until he is willing to make an effort, then tell him to get lost. You need to go out on the town with the girls and show him that you do not need him to be happy and have fun. Show him that your world does not revolve around him and then maybe he will see how lucky he is. If not, you will begin to recover without him and you can begin to move on.

Listen to me, I am not the one to really be telling you this. I don't think I could for one second do a plan B without giving in the second H made a slight hint of hope. I get sucked in so easily.

However, a good plan B without giving in may be what H needs to be forced into making some changes. Right now it sounds like he comes home to you when he wants, but then runs to OW/OC just as easily. Until one of you (you or OW) take a stand, then he will continue. I learned that the hard way. Remember when my H took the weekend trip w/ OW and then lied. It took me confronting OW and then H for something to happen. Luckily for me, the OW ended things - at least so it seems. If I hadn't done something, I think H would have continued to run back and forth. He was truly living the best of both worlds. And when he needed to escape from both of us - he had his apartment to run to. Such a lucky guy!! Anyway, I am rambling. Maybe it will take something drastic like finding his clothes on the front porch to get him to see you mean business. Then again, he could just run away and never look back.

You will know what you feel comfortable with. Its like I keep telling one of my friends, I get so tried of bending over backwards for H just to get kicked in the a$$. Its time to do something about it and stand up for yourself.

Take care and know I am praying for you.

God Bless,
Kris

Kris,

I am not in any plan at the moment, I would love to Plan B wrote a ltr. 2 weeks ago, he ignored it basically. He won't leave on his own, I coould file for D & have him removed from the house, but I don't have the $ right now. I have threatened to throw his stuff out, leagally I can't put him out & he knows that.

I go out all the time now, did this past weekend, he got upset cuz he thought I was w/ a man, ain't that hillarious! He couldn't stand the thought of it but it is ok for me to accept & forgive A & oc. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

IF he still won't leave I can do the best plan b I can with him still here & in Aug. I can file. He is a real piece of work, I keep telling him a person can only take so much. I get sucked easily too, can you tell???? I tell him to leave & he says I dont' want a D, & I am the one who wants to give up & I go for it for about day or two cuz nothing changes. I am now having 2nd thoughts about the "contract". It is gonna be a waste of time, I really feel all he wants to do is keep having it ALL.

Thanks for the prayers, I am praying for you too!

BBG93------what are you speceifcally asking H for that he is NOT doing? Is he still continuing C w/ OW? Excluding you from visitatin w/ OC?
What? What is it SPECIFICALLY?

So when is our ship leaving? Has anyone decided?

BG93 needs to get away and I think we should all party on her behalf.

Seriously, BG93, is there maybe some place you could go for awhile since H won't leave. Not that I would suggest giving him your home, but maybe you should get away for awhile. I don't know what to tell you. I would think it would be hard to plan B while living together, but I suppose it is possible. I just think that while he has the freedom to do whatever he wants and you get to witness it on a day to day basis, that any love and hope you might have will die. That's the purpose of plan B - to preserve what love you have for H when all else fails. I just don't know what to tell you. You know my philosopy for the moment is to not give up, but I know you have been through alot and been doing it a lot longer than I have. My H left of his own free will and now I need to have patience for him to come home. It just drives me absolutely crazy that our lives have taken such different paths at the moment. I am just continuing to have faith that God is going to take care of me and my BC. I trust God will join my H's and my paths in the end. Have faith, trust God, surrender all your problems to Him and live your life - this what I tell myself time and time again when I think I can't handle this. I pray that God will move both our H's to the right path that will lead them back to us.

God Bless,
Kris

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">------what are you speceifcally asking H for that he is NOT doing? Is he still continuing C w/ OW? Excluding you from visitatin w/ OC?
What? What is it SPECIFICALLY? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Both of the above KT, he does not have legal visitation, brings OC to our home maybe once a month, hides it from OW. Sits in OW's apt. on a regular basis to see OC. Plus he spends no quality time w/ me working on our M. I have put up with this for a year with promises that it will get better & it hasn't.

Kris, I wish I could go away & not come back, in a real financial bind right now, so a vacation is out of the question. I won't leave my home & him in it w/ my son so I am kinda stuck right now. God will provide a way of escape - soon I hope.

BG93 - Believe me I understand being in a financial bind. If H didn't continue to pay household bills, I would be living with my parents right now. Okay, so maybe that is part of your answer. You are not meant to escape. If that is what God wanted for you, you would have the means. So that must mean that you continue to fight for your marriage. We just need to figure out a way for your H to give a little.

Why does he not bring OC around you? I know it is probably the OW. But if he is serious about your M, then OC will be apart of your lives for along time. You need to have the opportunity to bond with OC. I don't understand his thinking. This is his child too, so if OW is saying NC w/ you then so what! My H told me a few nights back that OW says that at first he can visit OC at her place. She is afriad I will resent OC. The more I thought about this the more upset I got. 1. Does OW honestly think I will harm the child? No. I, unlike her, am a caring and compassionate person and realize that this mess is not the fault of the OC. 2. Why didn't H stand up for me? H knows I would not harm this child or any other. It is just part of their evil plot to steal our lives.

I am rambling again. I think that the point I was trying to make is that there is a reason you can't leave and that H is staying. Listen to what God is telling you and pray that you find a way to reach out to H.

God Bless,
Kris

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Why does he not bring OC around you? I know it is probably the OW. But if he is serious about your M, then OC will be apart of your lives for along time. You need to have the opportunity to bond with OC. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

OW told H the day he came home that she didn't feel comfortable w/ OC around me, but OC came to visit w/ H while he lived w/ OW. OW doesn't want OC to bond w/ me, I am not supposed to be part of the "fantasy family" they created

</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I don't understand his thinking. This is his child too, so if OW is saying NC w/ you then so what! My H told me a few nights back that OW says that at first he can visit OC at her place. She is afriad I will resent OC. The more I thought about this the more upset I got. 1. Does OW honestly think I will harm the child? No. I, unlike her, am a caring and compassionate person and realize that this mess is not the fault of the OC. 2. Why didn't H stand up for me? H knows I would not harm this child or any other. It is just part of their evil plot to steal our lives.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

I dont understand it either, he acts like he is afraid of OW. I hope your H does stand up for you & not wimp out like mine, that is why we are in this mess now, he should have told her from day one that he would not allow her to dictate to him where he could take his daughter, but he didn't & now I have no idea what they have set up other than dont' include the wife.


</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think that the point I was trying to make is that there is a reason you can't leave and that H is staying. Listen to what God is telling you and pray that you find a way to reach out to H.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I so want to believe that, I just don't know anymore. H is not home yet, I am going to bed, too tired to deal with him right now.

Talk to you tomorrow.
Have a good nite.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

BG93 - I hope tomorrow is a better day for you. Keep the faith. Talk to you later.

God Bless,
Kris

ok so H still spends signifigant amounts of time w/ OW 'supposedly' just to visit w/ OC. He does bring OC to your home about once a month.

Where does OW think he is taking OC during this time? How long is that single visit?

Why don't you go w/ H next time he visits? Just do it, either you go or it doesn't happen.

What would he do? What if he said no but then you followed in your own car and were determined to be involved? What would happen?

What does he say about 'this', his reasons for excluding you? How does he "rationalize" it as something that is "ok" to do?

What is your idea of 'quality time'? Do you suggest going out on a date and he denies you? Does he specifically say he does NOT want to go out w/ you?

Ok let's focus on this/you for awhile. I'm sorry I was so unclear on your situation, sometimes they all become one, big, tragic, blur.

Good Morning KT,

ok so H still spends signifigant amounts of time w/ OW 'supposedly' just to visit w/ OC. He does bring OC to your home about once a month.
**********************************************
I have not seen OC since Feb. when OW dropped her off cuz H had no car & she needed a sitter. Only on that day did she feel comfortable w/ OC in our home & she knew I was there.


Where does OW think he is taking OC during this time? How long is that single visit?
**********************************************
I have no idea, probably says he is going to a relative or friends house. Visits are usually a couple of hrs.


Why don't you go w/ H next time he visits? Just do it, either you go or it doesn't happen.
What would he do? What if he said no but then you followed in your own car and were determined to be involved? What would happen?
***********************************************
He would have a cow, I know if I forced that issue there would be lots of problems, maybe he would leave though or have an accident trying to out run me. I used to know where she lived, working on getting the address again, then I could just show up there.


What does he say about 'this', his reasons for excluding you? How does he "rationalize" it as something that is "ok" to do?
**********************************************
Always says he is working on it, papers will be coming regarding a visitation court date. They haven't come in a whole year, they ain't about to fall from the sky.


What is your idea of 'quality time'? Do you suggest going out on a date and he denies you? Does he specifically say he does NOT want to go out w/ you?
************************************************
Quality time is talking about anything other than the OC situation & of course going out doing something fun. He always says he wants to go but he has cancelled on a few dates, as recently as Sunday w/ no valid excuse.


Ok let's focus on this/you for awhile. I'm sorry I was so unclear on your situation, sometimes they all become one, big, tragic, blur.
**********************************************
I know so much pain going around here & BS. My focus right now is to find some peacce, if that means he leaves than so be it.

See my next post for his "contract"

Well H came in at midnite last nite, was at the "bowling alley." Told me he had written out his contract but left it downstairs cuz he wanted me to accuse him of not writing it & then tell me that he had - does that sound like the mind of a rational person?

He also accused me of seeing someone, I told him if he felt that way he should leave, go back to OW or mommy I don't care anymore. Of course he doesn't want to do that.

I didn't read it til this morning;Things I want U to do for me

1. Do not go in my car no more

2. Do not go in my pant’s pocket no more.

3. Please do not want to hear about old thing’s going to the court house, telling me I can't go see my Baby Girl, getting mad when I go to my mommy house.

There is more….. but he didn't write it all out.

So ladies H & I have a stalemate. #'s 1 & 2 I could do if he would be honest & accountable.

#3 is out of the question, he either gets visitation or he can go plus the other items I stated on my contract which I will give him tonite. As for getting mad about him being in mommy's house, he can live w/ her for all I care at this point. This has to end one way or another.

okay you guys were all very busy last night.

Bbygrl93--I'm at loss as of giving advice to you right now except to say hang in there if you can and keep some faith.

Last night was good-H brought our son over after picking him up from daycare. I made spaghetti and salad--we had a good dinner. He thanked me for it and he stayed until about 7:30pm and then he left--I didn't spend a ton of time with him--after dinner which he helped clean up and put away all leftovers I thanked him and then gave our son a bath.

After that we just hung out by the fireplace and played with our son. He then left. He called me at about 9:00pm and asked if I was watching the TV we watch at 9:00pm and I said yes and he thanked me again for dinner and said to call him at 6:30 or so because he was going to come over to our house in the morning and spend the day with our son--H's last day off is today and then he works 4 twelve's.

I called him to wake him up--he is horrible at waking up--called at 6:35am and by 7:05 he wasn't at our house and I just knew it--he had not gotten up and had fallen back asleep--mind you I have to be to work at 7:30--We live about 5 min. from where we both work and his apt. takes about 10 min. to get to our house. Called again and he told me he was on his way but he didn't sound like it--he called 5 min. later after he had looked at the clock I'm sure and said okay I fell back asleep and didn't want to tell you and I'm just leaving and said to leave if he didn't get their because he was on the way--our son was still asleep in his crib--I diddn't want to leave and then he said well it is 7:15 I should make it and he did.

He seemd a bit grouchy when he came--at himself I asked for a kiss and he let me give him a kiss on the cheek--I don't think he had even brushed his teeth. I'm thinking that is why he didn't give me a kiss--at least I hope because one can be intimate but not give a kiss????

Anyway I though it was nice that he called and said goodnight and thanked me again for dinner etc last night.

He apologized for falling back to sleep--I didn't scold him and give him the 5th degree like I use to when he screwed up--I just said okay I have to run--I didn't LB--and i haven't for quite awhile--he never seems to know what to do when I don't fly off the handle and yell at him.

KrisM--glad to here things are looking up. Want to hear more.

Sunnydale--keep us posted.

Babygirl--I said an extra pray for you last night.

Give me any thoughts, feedback or advice etc. All thoughts are welcome.

Albany

So he wants no accountability. He doesn't want to feel like you are 'checking up on him' or do not trust him, understandable? yes, earned? doesn't sound like it.

But that seems like it should be easy to counter w/ your contract.

Wants to be trusted? then gives acconts of where he is @ all times. If he is telling you everything then there is no need for you to check up on him now is there?

Both the car thing and pocket thing is just stupid. Why would he specifically not want you in his car, and everybody knows you HAVE to go through pockets when you do the laundry. It's more about him feeling like you trust him and you feeling like he is trust-worthy.

Your contract would say, including you w/ OC, you are her STEP-MOTHER. OC is how old now? Old enough for daddy time w/o mom!

You guys could come to a mutually agreeable contract. LIke this, I will do 'A' if you do 'B'. Even w/ consequences, If you do 'c' then I will be forced to do 'd', you get the idea.

He includes you in visits, you lay off the court talk.

Why would he be cancelling dates w/ you? Come one, any sane man knows you treat a woman nice, take her out, romance her and what do you (the man) get????? hmmm.....So why would he want to avoid that? Total LB for you!!!!

It sounds like neither one of you are getting your needs met @ least not by each other.

ok I get it now, no wonder you are so frustrated. But then if H did not want you why did he move back home? He could have just stayed w/ OW and had this little fake family of theirs.

Ok and you were doing plan A and nothing changed?

I'm so sorry. This IS so frustrating. What did H say about your contract? Did you guys even discuss them or what?

I completely understand wanting to give up. Really. We have all been there.

We're here for you.