I don't mean any disrespect to the Harleys by asking this question. But has anybody ever done any research to show how many people have had success in reconciling by following Dr. Harley's plan?<P>Again, I have had a few sessions with Steve and have received what I believe is a lot of good advice. On paper, this Plan A/B thing sounds extremely logical and I want to continue with it. It is just that I don't see any confirmation of any past results. Especially on this board.<P>I guess I'm just being a cynic. But if I'm going to keep shelling out the bucks, I'd like to see if this program has actually succeeded in the past.

Always Hopeful:<P>There have been lots of "success" posts in the past (dozens), and occasionally people will pop their heads in to offer testimonials.<P>Dr. Harley is setting up a "not-for-profit" MarriageBuilder's corporation to do a few things, and one of them is to set up an appropriate statistical sample of how well this methodology works.<P>The Plan A/B program worked very well for me in saving my marriage. But there's also the successful application of the Plan A/B technique in a marriage that ends up in divorce: the party that puts the effort into learning these marital skills often recovers from a divorce much faster, and has a better chance for success in a new relationship (ancedotal evidence only...)

I doubt my H & I would be together now if we hadn't both used MB principles. I did draw from other similar sources--Conway, Wheat, Weiner-Davis, Kriedman, Chapman, Dobson, Harris...the list goes on and on with similar behaviors being named with different labels, example: Plan B = tough love = last resort.<P>Success stories don't necessarily stick around, sometimes being reminded of the bad times by the situations of new posters strikes too close to healing hearts.<P>I don't know what the stats are either, but there is evidence in all of these programs that when the marriage fails because of infidelity or MLC that if the one spouse can keep her/himself at the point of reconciliation, within 2 years there is a good chance that the WS will want to attempt a reconciliation. Plan A & B are ways that the betrayed spouse may stay at the point of reconcilation.<P>Of course, a couple months ago when I offered my H & I as an example of MB success, the poster told me I shouldn't be so sure, she didn't consider us a success, just yet, as we separated so many times... ...8 months back together and counting.<P>------------------<BR>Lor<BR>"Whatever is true, honorable, just, pure, lovely, gracious...think about these things." Phil 4:8

alwayshopeful,<P>I know without a shadow of doubt that if it wasn't, for the Harley methods (not discounting God here either) my H and I would not be togehter today. It was his analysis of an A in his book SAA that really hit home for my H. We even went to his weekend seminar and it was great! My H told Dr. Harley, himself, that his philosophy was the only thing that got through to him. <BR>I am not saying that it makes things easy. There is a lot of work to be done. It does give you the tools and what you do with them determines the end result.<P>cleo

I just thought of something else....<P>When you are doing good, you are not as motivated to come here. I mean sometimes this place can be a little depressing. On the flip side, I have found far more support here for such a private matter than anyplace else.<BR>

Hi there,<P> I've been on this board for about 2yrs. and implemented the Harley principles "by the book" and with counseling with Steve H. It blew my mind how predictable my H's affair was, the confusion, the continuing on, the "I'm not in love with you" talk.....I did Plan A and then Plan B strictly and we are now reconciled . We even followed Steve's advice to move. <P> Don't get me wrong , it's been hard and various things have cropped up but we are together and I would bet we wouldn't be if I hadn't found "Surviving An Affair" when I did. One counselor who saw us early on said he never saw someone who was so captivated with a person like my H was with the OW, and to prepare for a divorce.<P> I really believe that the Harleys give you the best shot at restoration....and if not, at least a plan to cope with the trauma of it all......Good luck, there is nothing wrong with questioning!......LU

Always Hopeful,<P>My husband and I are a success story. <P>The world blew up in Jan 99 and it took until Nov 99 to get headed in the right direction. We've been going strong ever since. We are not without troubles, however, we've really tried to work together to resolve them. Does he sometimes frustrate the heck out of me and I him ? oh yeah....but we're on the same page again and speak often of being old together.... <P>I agree with the other posters that the techniques in MB were the cornerstones of keeping "ME" going until the fog could clear for my husband. He strayed but I help make it possible.<P>One reason that I faded away from the MB Board.....was that I really needed to focus on the health of our life in general. Part of my husbands' position was that I had too many "other" things going and he simply didn't matter or get the attention he felt he needed. The status of our marriage at the time required that I not debate or justify what I was doing ..... but that I start "filling that ole bucket of his".<P>I'm sure I was no busier than many other people but....I began working less hours, I began putting the kids to bed without falling asleep by them, I no longer led school parents' groups, I cut back dramatically on the time I spent with kids and girlfriends and I began planning many events that our family could do together. Additionally, every moment that I sensed my husband wanted to be with me....I made my self available and I began to NOT make it so easy for him to work late or work on weekends (I tried to do this nicely). <P>I realize this may be selfish and I certainly apologize for what resulted in a self-serving use of MB Principles, however, I really did end up with NO Extra Time available.<P>I've promised myself that I will respond to Harley's request for "the story" in the near term....I know that it was extremely encouraging to hear of "successes" when I was at my darkest hour.<P>Truly, I wish you the best !<P>Tina

Dear Always Hopeful:<BR>I think your question is that of a prudent and thoughtful person. I'm always posting people to counsel with the Harleys, because I see successes and improvements posted here, and because the stages of an affair are so well-defined on Harley's posts, including the "fog". <P>I think their methods work if both parties implement them. If only one person is pulling the sled and the other is meandering in circles or sitting on the sled, progress is a lot slower. (That's us.)<P>It makes sense to wonder whether a method (of cleaning a bathroom or teaching a child to read) works by finding out a timetable or stages to expect, and a success rate.<P><P>------------------<BR>Belle, Domestic Goddess

Thanks for your replies, everyone.<P>It might make sense for the monitors of this website to create a category entitled "Successes" under the Infidelity section.<P>Cleo,<P>As usual, you are very perceptive. I DO seem to visit this site more often when I am having a bleak period. I guess you can tell how the past day or so has been!<P>Thanks...<p>[This message has been edited by Always Hopeful (edited January 04, 2001).]

Tina and Lu: Nice to see you drop by!!!