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Hi, Waywards! I have some questions I know have been asked a million times here but want a current update and specific answers from Waywards.<P>1. Is this like being an acoholic? Hi, My name is FreshStart and I'm a Wayward? HI, FRESHSTART! ? [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P>But seriously, do we live by this label forever? I know that is what we have been and just wonder. I guess the truth hurts. How do you feel?<P>2. How many of you were abused in some way in childhood? Physically, emotionally, verbally or sexually. Please specify.<P>3. What was your marriage model like? What kind of marriage did your parent have and how was your home life?<P>I may not get a lot of time to reply this week as my kids have spring break so computer time could be fun but I'm online alot so will likely get here most days.<P>Thanks for any input you have.<P>Oh, and 4. How long were/have you been married?<P>------------------<BR>Fresh Start

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Freshstart -<P>I don't know if I can answer your questions or not but I'll try. For the record, I am an ex-WS (kind of like an ex-prom queen, just another "label" I've given myself, but I'll get to that.)<P>1. But seriously, do we live by this label forever? I know that is what we have been and just wonder. I guess the truth hurts. How do you feel?<P>As you notice, I called myself and ex-WS, like someone would call themselves an ex-addict or something. I don't feel as if I'm labeled. The fact is, though, I had an affair, I was wayward. A lot has happened since the A ended. I have grown alot spiritually - so just because I was wayward once - well, it just seems like all of that happened to another person. I will never forget the horribleness of the mistake I made, but I know God has forgiven me, my H has forgiven me, and ultimately I am sorry and have forgiven myself. So, it's kind of like that song - Amazing Grace - "I once was lost but now am found." So, the label doesn't bother me - as long as my head is on straight.<P>2. How many of you were abused in some way in childhood? <P>I was not physically or emotionally abused as a child. I don't want to get into details, but I think some things in my past probably contributed to my lack of self-esteem, which ultimately culminated in having an A. It's a long tale to tell - otherwise I'd be happy to give details. I guess I finally came to the realization that sometimes bad things happen to good people, and sometimes you, yourself do bad things, make bad decisions. It's not so much what happened to you, or how things happened, but how you deal with them that matter. I came to realize that I didn't handle quite a few things very well, and it haunted me for quite a while.<BR> <BR>3. What was your marriage model like? What kind of marriage did your parent have and how was your home life?<P>I was raised in a Catholic family - both parents are Catholic. My parents are still alive and have been married 37 years. They had some rocky times - I remember a lot of arguing as a kid, but they always stuck together. I had a very good home life.<P>4. How long were/have you been married?<P>My H and I - happily - will celebrate our 5 year anniversary this coming November. The A occurred after our third anniversary.<P>

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1. Is this like being an acoholic?<P>Yes and no. At first it is like an addiction. You have to go through withdrawal after cutting all contact. Once you have a "fix" by renewed contact, it starts the cycle all over. Once out of withdrawal, I did not feel the same towards the OM. <BR>I will not cheat, ever again.<BR>I do identify myself as a WS as well as a BS on this board. <P>2. How many of you were abused in some way in childhood? Physically, emotionally, verbally or sexually. Please specify.<P>I was abused in all ways. Physically, emotionally and verbally by my father. He is an alcoholic. Emotionally abused by my mother, to some degree. Sexually by another relative.<P>3. What was your marriage model like? What kind of marriage did your parent have and how was your home life?<P>Lousy model! See above. <P>4. How long were/have you been married?<P>I have been married 13 years, it was 11 years when I betrayed my husband with an EA. He was the WS early on in our relationship and we had never fully recovered from that. <P>I hope this helps, and please feel free to ask more questions.<P><BR>

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SKM and Raskal, thanks.<P>SKM, I have really hoped to connect with you. From JustLearning and also from reading your SKM Chronicles post, I see we are a lot alike in some ways.<P>I have been married for 17 years as of Jan/2001 and my A began in August although the friendship grew rapidly beyond bounds emotionally in May. <P>I was sexually abused by an 18 yr old neighbour boy when I was around 9. <P>thanks, SKM for your insight about being an x-wayward. My H tells me this will be so for me in time, too. <P>Raskal, your answer to question one also helps me. I, too, will never ever let an A happen. I don't want the hurt and ever to go through all the frightening things happening to me right now ever again. Plus I will never lose sight of how precious my H is.<P>I hope more people will respond. I'm really glad to find both your replies and the comment about withdrawal because to my surprise that is bugging me again...I definitely want no contact (if I did, there would be contact to a certain area and I'd be in court along with all the other trouble I'm in!) but keep wondering if OM still lives in same place. I have resisted finding this out as what difference would it make anyway? Right? I thought I might have "seen" him tonight--we were driving home late and a woman in a car beside us at a traffic light was staring at me. The car was pulled up so driver could not be seen. OM used to do that with me. He always drove my car and wore a black coat or jacket-the driver was in black but I couldn't recognize the hands. Maybe I'm just paranoid. Anyway, that doesn't have anything to do on this topic. I took a sleeping pill so if my replies seem weird, that's why tonight!<P>Thanks again for your answers and insights and honesty.<P>SKM, I'd like to talk with you about OM not letting go--that happened to me, too. <P>------------------<BR>Fresh Start

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Hello freshstart, I'm an alcoholic and my name is unbelievable, I'm also a WS, father, friend, co-worker, son, uncle, etc. The A and alcohol are similar in many ways to me, however, I don't consider myself an Adulterholic. I had 1 A, and no matter what happens with my M ( and I know that we will recover) I'll never under any circumstance have another A. Alcohol is something that I know I won't drink for today.<P> I am the older of 2 children, my parents were strict, I've been in and out of counseling since 16 years old. My lastest C thinks that my parents being what they are and me being what I am gave me 1 of 2 choices to protect myself as a child, learned behavior if you will, either I conformed or I rebelled. I choose to rebell which is what I still do today.<P>My parents were married 39 year prior to my Dads death in 1985, Mom died 10 years later, they seemed suited for each other, altought there was some of the usual crap(arguements) in there marriage, you know money kids etc.<P> As of today we are married just a bit over 28 years, I met the OW on line last April, turned to an EA last May or June and became a 3 week PA the end of July. It was my only PA, although I did have at least one EA prior.....

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Freshstart -<P>Sometimes, I don't get as much time as I'd like to go through all of the posts on this site. If you want to email me, I'd be more than happy to share more details of my experiences. It's up to you, but my email is skm_mb@hotmail.com. I usually try to answer email first, and then I pop over here if I get some free time (which seems hard to come by these days). I would like to hear more about you, and if there's any way that I can help, well, you just let me know. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

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freshstart,<P>Hi. I just stopped by to try to answer some of your questions. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P>1. You asked if I will live by the WS label forever. Well, I have no intention of being labeled as a WS forever. Yes, I WAS a WS, but I'm not now. Yes, I made a mistake, but I learned from it. I've grown spiritually since that time. Now, I know what the pitfalls look like and I'm ever so careful.<P>2. You also asked if there was physical, emotional, verbal or sexual abuse as a child. Yes, I was physically and verbally abused at times by my dad. Although, my case was definitely not as severe as some. By verbal abuse I mean that my dad called me stupid, idiot or would just humiliate me in front of his adult friends. By physical abuse I mean that he would say, "I'm going to shake you until your teeth rattle." And, of course he'd shake me and then spank me, but he never left marks or "beat" me. And of course, there's the infamous softball incident in which I was dressed for my game and my dad was determined to make sure that I could catch the ball. I was little. He would throw the ball hard and of course I would miss. He got sick of being "patient", so he decided to throw the ball AT me instead of TO me. He said that if I didn't catch it, I'd just get hit with it. He threw the ball HARD, and of course I got hit with it. And of course, I cried. <P>3. You asked what my marriage model was like. Well, when I was in second through fifth grade, my mom drank alot. My dad was verbally abusive to my mom over their 13 year marriage. He had also been physically abusive at times (not all the time as my mom has stressed). My dad kept my mom beaten down emotionally so that she couldn't function. For example, he would let her take me and my brother to buy new clothes, but he wouldn't allow her to buy new clothes for herself...he'd call her stupid if she had difficulty balancing the check-book...stuff like that. When my dad wasn't verbally or physically abusive, he was neglectful. He would take "business trips" and stay gone for a week or two at a time. Whatever. Fortunately, I do remember happy times during my childhood. I have happy memories of me with my mom and happy memories of me with my dad. I have happy memories with my brother. But I don't have happy memories of a family life or with both of my parents together. I'm not sure if that made sense or not.<P>4. I've been married for 8 going on 9 years.<P>And, NO...I do not use my parents' poor choices in my childhood as an excuse for my poor choices recently. Both of my parents have grown spiritually since my childhood. My dad has mellowed out and grown closer to God. My mom is an awesome woman who has been sober for years. She's my spiritual mentor. My mom and I have talked openly about her mistakes/alcoholism during part of my childhood. There is forgiveness present.<P>I hope this helped.<P>Jill<P>P.S. Folks, you'll see the note that I've been edited my reply. I did this because I caught some typing errors...I'm not a fan of typing errors. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P>[This message has been edited by Jill (edited March 27, 2001).]<p>[This message has been edited by Jill (edited March 27, 2001).]

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Jill, thanks for your honesty! Yes, your answer was very helpful.<P>I'm glad to know that while I am Wayward now--although my mistake can't be changed-I can so one day I will be an x-wayward.<P>SKM, hope you got my private email. I know you are busy getting ready for your trip so just write when ready.<P>Thanks, everyone!<P>------------------<BR>Fresh Start

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Hi Jill-<P>I'm was a WS, too. I haven't been around much lately. I've been trying to see if lurking on these boards is helpful/not to me. I took a break. <P>Answers:<BR>1. I have a hard time with this question. I uderstand I made a mistake, and I have been forgiven. I bbelieve that my M will survive. I also believe that I madde a terrible mistake that I must never forget. My H thinks I need to put the whole thing behind me more. This is something I struggle with.<P>2. Never abused.<P>3. My parents had a storybook, happy marriage. They were great parents.<P>4. We have been married for 13 years.<P>So, no classic childhood reasons for me. My H has tried to be a good partner. We got very distant. I made a huge mistake. I have no one remotely to blame but myself. We have a very strong M still, and will survive this. I am personally having trouble, a year later, forgiving myself.

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Hi, Jill! <P>Hi, Unbelievable!<P>Hi, Clouds!<P>Thanks for answering my questions. I am not even entirely sure why I want to know...is it curiosity or more (I think this is more likely) to help find my own healing and become equipped to help others when I am well again.<P>Clouds thanks for your candor about both Question 1 and forgiving yourself. I have forgiven myself (again this week [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com] ) but wonder if I will ever cease to be mad at myself. Some days I wonder if I will ever feel anything but anger in normal ways again but most days are good right now, even though scary.<P>I had no idea how much trouble I was opening up by involving myself in A. I knew trouble would come but guess I thought I'd just get out of it magically..anyone else think that during A?<P>Anyway, thanks to all who have replied and who will reply in future if they wish. I am posting another question I've always tried to understand on General Questions II here tonight-this morning? <P>At first I cowered being a wayward and posting at this website. Now it is an important place to visit right now and I appreciate the honesty amidst the pain and esp the hope proffered.<P>I wish there was another message icon like a rose or dove on an olive branch for posts that are intended for outreach or friendship.<P>Have a beautiful day, all! <P>------------------<BR>Fresh Start

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Hi Freshstart. Welcome to the board! I'm reluctant to answer your questions because I don't feel qualified. I'm the WS too (EA, on-line, stupid) but I'm only recently in recovery so my wisdom is likely pretty flimsy at this point. I just wanted to support your decision to come here as a WS. My withdrawal and recovery (hey, maybe even my life) couldn't have been possible without this place. I still come here several times a day just to read and be supported and reminded and to find my courage. I recommend coming here every time you feel a bit discouraged or down, even if it's a hundred times a day. You won't be attacked here for making mistakes.<P>Stay close to SKM - she's helped me more than I can explain. Stay close to Jill, too. Her insight and wisdom are great resources. The good news? Life goes on and gets better. Cling to it.<P><BR>Clarity?

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Hi freshstart,<BR> to start with I am a BS and wanted to also answer a few of your questions. <P>1)I can not answer this from personal experience but from observation of my WS. I think while A is occuring it seemed like an addiction, WS would do anything to be with OP. WS also went through withdrawels just as an alcoholic would if they had been cut off (cryng jags, depression, mood swings, appetite lose). As for carrying the label around, I know WS still feels the label but I don't ever say it or even feel that way.<P>2)WS was never abused as a child by family but does carry self-esteem issues from childhood due to weight problem as a child. I on the other hand was sexually abused for approx. 7 years from step father. I feell that all the other form of abuse go hand in hand with this one, but I have never had an A and know that I never would. Abuse is blamed for so much lets not blame an A on it also.<P>3)WS parents have been married for almost 50 years, talk about perfect marriages. My model was a mother married 3 times and divorced 3 times but as before I am faithful.<P>4)We celebrated (if you can call it that) 12 years in January.<P>With all that said and done let me say that my WS and I are into recovery and trying to piece our relationship back together. So as you can see history doesn't always play a part in an A or even who will have the A. If history could be an indicator then the A would have been mine. <P>Hope all will work out for you but do not carry the label around because no one can tell by loking at you that you had an A. You have made the decission to end A and will probably never have another so quit kicking yourself and start healing.<P>------------------<BR>Healing in NC

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Hi Freshstart,<P>My name is PlainJane and I am a WS. While I hope that I do not live with that label forever, I do believe that my A's were the result of being an addict. I am a drug addict/alcoholic/sex and love addict, now in recovery. I am no longer wayward, I am trying to rebuild my marriage, it was an addiction, that took me further down than drugs or alcohol ever did. I should also mention that I relapsed onto drugs, and just shortly after began my spiral downward with sex, by acting out. So, I must remember daily that I am an addict, and I cannot act out. I may not call myself a WS, but I will call myself an addict till I die. I know that God has forgiven me, and I am starting to forgive myself, forgiveness comes with acceptance, I have finally come up with some kind of acceptance for my actions. <P>I just finished treatment for Sexual Compulsivity, and they go back to childhood, and how our behaviours reflect what happened to us then. I was verbally and emotionally abused by my mother and stepfather. I was abandoned by my biological father. I was physically abused from time to time as well. I was also married before and was physically abused by my first husband, in addition to verbal and emotional abuse. Possible sexual abuse during childhood, but I have no clear cut memories. I won't rule that out though.<P>The marriage model I had was poor. Broken home, I was provided for but, there was no love, lots of secrets. Home life was lousy. I was very alone. No support. Started overeating after mother got remarried, drinking and drugs at 14, not a pleasant childhood.<P>I have been married for 12 years. We are still together, but it was very hard in the beginning. We are approaching seven months of the first discovery, and it is getting better each and everyday. I am doing a lot of work on myself and trying to make amends for the damage that I have caused.<BR>PJ

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Hello, Clarity? and HealingNC.<P>Clarity, thanks for the encouragement to keep coming here. I did at first and felt really dumb asking my questions or starting to tell my story. But JustLearning helped me through that. I do not feel qualified either so I am asking lots of questions now to try to benefit from others' wisdom and experience. I really appreciate people saying how things are for them now, too. It gives me hope.<P>HealingNC, thanks, too for talking about your WS. I don't want this label and like your spouse will maybe carry it in a sense forever but I also am a Christian so for me knowing God and my h forgave and the people in my church--so many--forgave-that has helped me start moving past the forgiveness. Do you know what I mean when I say it's harder still to move past the shame?<P>Healing, I do not blame abuse or these other things I asked..just as a survivor of it and now hopefully a survivor of A, I am trying to understand myself and those who have experienced similar things.<BR>I am sorry for your pain of the past but have to praise you for putting your spouse first and working on recovery now. It sounds like maybe it's still not easy for you (celebrating 12 years "if you can call it that")--I hope you both will find true celebration in the future.<P>Unbelievable, I just re-read all the posts here and want to apologize for being insensitive to any alcoholics for my dumb wording of Question 1. Sometimes i use humour to try to help myself cope but never thought of those words being disrespectful or hurtful to others. I am really sorry for this.<P>Thanks again for all the answers and insights. [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<BR><P>------------------<BR>Fresh Start

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PlainJane, your post came in just after I composed my reply to Clarity? and HealingNC.<P>You have had a rough life. You deserve love and happiness within yourself and your M. I am so proud that you went through the intensive therapy for Sexual Compulsions and you know yourself and are working with God to overcome the past and make today a better place.<P>Do you sometimes feel like making amends takes forever? How do you keep yourself positive in those times when making amends takes more of your time than you want..in other words, when you feel you have hurt several people at once? These days I feel I will need to atone daily for the rest of my life but then I feel so much better and clean again inside when I muster the courage and make myself apologize. I just did that with Unbelievable in my previous post as I felt I was disrespectful in the way I worded Question 1 to him.<P>It's amazing as everyone answers how things come to light for me. I'm not sure my mom abused me horribly--maybe it was just a mistake since I'm the firstborn and only girl?-who knows--but she was always angry in my memory and used to call me "dumb article" (weird name, I know) repeatedly so much so that I sometimes still believe that is who I am now. I did work alot of that out in the Sexual Abuse Survivors group and in therapy but it lays around in my head still, I guess. <P>You guys are all so amazing and helping me so much. I appreciate being able to try to return the support, too.<P>------------------<BR>Fresh Start

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Hey freshstart, no offense taken!!! [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com] Was just trying to point out that there are lots of labels out there, some good, some not so good, and some well....Anyway, I'm all those things that I listed and more, but I do them all as an alcoholic. Didn't much like that at first, but have come to understand it, whether I drink or not I'm still alcoholic and must live my life around that fact. Take a drink get drunk, don't drink stay sober, easy concept....I however still suffer from alcoholic behavior, and that is what gets me into trouble. I forget sometimes that recovery is a we process, whether it be from alcohol or affairs or whatever, I can't do it alone...so thx for posting [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]

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Thanks, Unbelievable.<P>Ah, alcoholic behaviours there's a whole new survey! [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]Don't worry I'm maxed out on surveys and can't handle it tonight. Today was really hard for me.<P>I suspect although I have never been drunk in my life (but boy have I thought about it lately)that my parents' parents affected their parenting...try to figure that line out [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P>Both of my grandfathers were alcoholics, and my husband's father was into drinking as a young man. God turned him around to set up an amazing rescue mission and a camp to help men in particular find serenity.<P>Being in ministry and attracted to alcoholics and deeply troubled souls (OM is an alcoholic-recovered), I know well the dangers and damage of drinking and how it ruins lives so I choose not to drink not only due to my vows to God but also for common sense sake. My first sentence doesn't sound right..my husband and I both seem to attract hurting people and are attracted to helping them. Also, all my adult life I have been fascinated by alcoholic men personally (even had crushes but done nothing about it while married.) Not sure why.<P>Thanks for sharing with me.<P><BR><P>------------------<BR>Fresh Start

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Oops--just to clarify that last post...I am not sure why I have had the interest in alcoholic men romantically..I did not mean I don't know why I never pursued them before!I never planned my A to happen, of course.<P>told ya it's a bad day! [Linked Image from marriagebuilders.com]<P>------------------<BR>Fresh Start


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