<BR>I'm curious as to what the Harley's advice would be in the case of, say, Homer here recently, but a common dilemma. <P>Hiw W is in an A, and the OM's W doesn't know. I know if I were Homer my instincts would be to tell the OM's H immediately and hope that she reined her H in and kept him away from my W. I suppose that she might also bounce him out of the house and that could facilitate two divorces.<P>Sure it would be a major LB, but I think the fact that the motive is to keep your marriage together and that you are fighting for it would come clear after awhile.<P>What is the textbook Harley advice here?

Textbook Harley is to...<P>...stop and evaluate...<BR>...if it is a love buster... <B>Don't do it</B>!<P>Who defines the LB... (it's the WS!)<P>Would this be a LB to the WS... usually... 99% of the time!<P>If there is anyway the OM's W can find out <B>truly annonymously</B>! With <B>zero</B> "connection" to the Faithful spouse(FS)...<BR>...it might be OK...<BR>...but as you've said... if there is a chance that the OM's W throws out the OM... you're a step or 2 back!<P>The focus is again on the Faithful Spouse(FS) becoming the better person!...<BR>...can't go wrong with that!<P> <P>Jim

[QUOTE]Originally posted by NSR:<BR><B>Textbook Harley is to......if it is a love buster... [b]Don't do it</B>!<P>Again, this isn't in my personal experience, but I guess that if my W discovered an affair by me, part of me would HOPE that she would go totally nuts, not just sort of accept the situation and let it go on.<P>In a situation like Homer's, the OM is sitting in the catbird seat, waiting to pick his future mate, without any guilt or pressure on the homefront. And his W is not even putting forward the best case, since she isn't aware.<P>Anyway, it is just such a common theme here, I was curious as to what the Harley's would say. <P>Thanks, Jim. Have a great trip! <P>

bump

interesting that nine years ago I wqas saying I would hope my BW would go nuts (like I did)...

You realize now that you were right, don't you?

Dr. Willard Harley: "I'm in the process of rewriting "Surviving an Affair" to add information about plan B. Some of the main points are as follows:

Whether in plan A or B, the world should know about your husband's affair. All of your relatives, your friends, your children, and the licensing board for your husband's lover. In some states a licensing board will revoke a license if a counselor is having an affair with a married person, client or not. This is because it's well known that affairs hurt families, especially children. And counselors know better than to have an affair.

The reason for the wide exposure is not to hurt the unfaithful spouse, but rather to end the fantasy. Your husband's secret second life made his affair possible, and the more you can to to make it public, the easier it is for him to see the damage he's doing. Keeping it secret does damage, but few know about it. Making it public helps everyone, including the unfaithful spouse and lover, see the affair for what it really is.

<snip unrelated>

When I first started recommending openness about an affair, I wasn't sure what would happen. But I did it because I knew it was the right thing to do. Now I know that for most couples it marks the beginning of recovery." here

Well, I contacted the radio show twice because of my concern about my husband's relationship with this woman.

The first time was an email sent on 9/24/01 and answered on 10/1/01. Harley told me to call the woman's husband and tell him what I knew -- that this woman had propositioned him in May, that she had given him a birthday present in September, etc.

I didn't. My husband used -- of all things -- the Policy of Joint Agreement to say I should not call because he wasn't seeing her and I would betray his trust if I did.

What I didn't know was the first kiss was on 9/11/01. I am reminded every year.

I called the radio show again on 4/22/02. I was concerned because my husband had brought up going to a work party where he knew she would be (at his old department). I asked if he would talk with her, and he said he would because "people knew we were friends." My heart sunk when I heard that.

This time I called Harley's show and followed Harley's advice. I pressed the button to disconnect from Harley and then dialed the husband's work number.

I told the OW's husband I didn't think that anything was going on because my husband was so ethical, but I was concerned about the relationship being rekindled.

How naive of me. He was the one who got the truth out of her and told me.

I wish I had followed Harley's advice the first time. I have probably aged an additional 10 years because of his affair. I have a problem with trusting not just him but others as well. I am recovering now years later, at least somewhat, but it is hard to think what could be more traumatic than losing a child.

So -- if you are asking what Harley advises, it is to call the other spouse. What I have heard him say many times is "Mold doesn't grow in sunlight."

Cherished

The only problem with exposure is that it makes the WS ANGRY. And there are many spouses who are terrified of their WS' anger. I have never been able to figure that out, but we see it quite often around here. I have just never seen such FEAR!!

Those who are ruled by their FEARS usually don't make it, IMO.

Haven't read this whole thread, but this is a no-brainer.

YES,you should contact the OP's spouse. WTF WOULDN'T YOU?!?!?!

To have that back-up is priceless. OW in our case was divorced (wonder why, eh???)...I did my d*mnedest to contact her XH since they share custody. Does he want his children being raised by a wh*re? (apparently she LIKES to [censored] men she has met on the internet...must be the only ones who will have her).

Don't know if he ever got my emails, pretty d*mn sure he did. He was probably just too embarrassed to admit that he was once married to that. Bottom line is I would have liked that support. I would have taken it, no question.

LOL There it is in a nutshell.

Exposure, as honesty, always the best policy.

To me contacting the OPS is a no brainer and to me it was intuitive. Even before I found MB, on D-Day it took me less than 2 hours to find the OWH, his phone number and call him. Not only was he not surprised, he was very helpful. My H told me he had ended it 4 days earlier, but the OWH said he did not think so since OW had been out of the house the day prior. Turned out to be true. They had met to "cool things off" and of course ended up in the sack.

After that, for several weeks H fed me lies and OW fed her H lies. But because OWH and I were talking, it bacame too difficult for my H to lie. OW kept lying, but I think while I was assuming EYERYHTING my H said was a lie, her H really wanted to believe whatever she was saying.

In any case, I think the benefits definitely outweigh the anger that the WSs exhibit. It certainly ended the fantasy, showing that this "wonderful love" was just another sleazy affair.

AM

One other aspect of exposure that I don't see brought up quite as much, is how much RELIEF the BS gets by contacting the other BS. I know when I exposed the skank to her boyfriend, I felt a HUGE weight lifted off my shoulders - and it totally caught me off guard! I was sad that he was in as much pain as I was of course, but I think as Melody has said - you now have two sets of eyes on the relationship. Just that knowledge brings some comfort. I think feeling proactive (rather than just victimized by the A) is partly what brings that sense of relief too.

Actually :-) I was just sort of playing to the irony of my post NINE years ago.

I exposed to everyone within an hour on d-day, her sisters, my kids, her cousins, pastor, her mother, OM's W, etc.

I guess I'd been waiting nine years to execute the strategy, huh? :-)

Yes - that idea of the WS being angry if there is exposure just ticks me off. The WS should danged well be sceeerd of MY anger, and better be bending over backwards to make sure he doesn't screw up again!

But that is the difference between someone who NEEDS the relationship to feel worthwhile, and someone who feels worthwhile no matter what the circumstances!

Kayla must be a Texas gal!

Strange.......... This thread has caused me to realize how much this forum has changed since I arrived here 8 years ago.

Back then, exposure was discouraged as a "lovebuster" and saying "disrespectful" things about adultery - to anyone here - was a "disrespectful judgment." It was ok to chastise a devastated BS but never ok to speak a truthful word about adultery and risk offending a wayward.

When I was a NEWLY betrayed spouse on this forum, I was called out on a call out thread and berated by LEXXY ["Just what exactly are you willing to hear from WS? Only repentance, apologies, and [censored] kissing?"] for telling an obviously repentant WS, ChazButler, that it was nice to finally see a recovered WS on this forum. I was told by others that was a "disrespectful judgement' to other [remorseless] waywards on this forum to point out that some WS's were actually remorseful.

Waywards were never challenged for the most cruel, hateful remarks to a BS, but betrayed spouses were quickly shouted down and shamed for not showing respect to disrespectful, sick opinions.

I was NOT supported here, but the most flagrant waywards WERE. They were given sympathy and understanding. I was treated badly and called on the carpet. It astonishes me that I even stuck around.

My, how the times have changed.........

Melody, my memory isn't that it was that stereotyped back then.

As you can see in this thread, only one person gave that advice.

I think exposure had always been a basic MB tenet of discovery of an affair and that has always been recognized by the majority on the board.
===================================

EDIT: You are right! I went back and read the thread I was reacting to "Homer" and it was 6 pages of Plan A and don't LB. He even talked to OM and didn't expose to OMW. I was the only one that said expose to OMW.

I also said "If my W had an affair I would go nuts and expose to everyone"...well, that was prescient :-/

Interesting...

Except that my husband broke my arm when I threatened to call OW. He totally lost it when I said I thought I should call OWH. This was when I was concerned about the relationship.

Sometimes people have reason to fear.