The Cat - Marriage Builders® Forums

About a year ago we adopted a 5 year old cat.It hadn't REALLY been abused, neglected, or ignored. It had come from a house with a lot of active kids, and some bigger, tougher animals. No one there meant to hurt it, but it had never felt safe. It had one tattered ear. It was slightly chubby....I suspect that food was its only comfort.At its core it was a loving creature, but the hard years had built up its defenses. Any movement around it was interpreted as a threat. Any attempts at affection it read as an attack. It looked on our house's two adults, three children, one dog and one other cat as frightening monsters. It spent all of its time hiding in my son's room, usually under the bed.Everyone made an effort to be especially kind to the cat, but it mainly hid out, afraid of any interaction. Occasionally a romping dog or loud child at play would frighten it further. There did not seem to be any progress for months.Everyone's instinct was to pick up the cat, stroke it, make it play with yarn, interact with it the same way we did with our other cat, who is very Type A and robust. I think we all thought if we could just hold it down, stroke it, make it purr, it would heal. But it didn't. It would escape at the first chance, and then be gone for another few days under the bed. So we stopped trying the overt affection. We continued to feed it, let it see we meant it no harm, but it really wouldn't allow any petting or the affection or the play one associates with a normal pet relationship. The cat seemed miserable. We discussed the value of keeping a pet that didn't meet any of the needs of the family. My W said let's wait and see.Then, one day, my son and I were sitting in the living room watching TV and the cat walked into the room. My son and I looked at each other and silently agreed to be nonchalant. The cat made its way across the room stopping and twitching twice at false alarms from non-existent noises, and then settled on a chair in the far corner. It could see everything, escape quickly if need be....but it wanted to be with the rest of the family. Over the next few months the cat continued to come out of its shell. Now, it is the most affectionate creature in the house, human or animal.It HAS to be on a human's lap at all times. It HAS to sleep on someone's bed.The first six months we had that cat nothing was going to fix its soul, no counseling, no food treats, no playtime, no hugging, no sex, no meeting its needs. It needed peace, it needed the pain to stop. It needed time. This is not an off-topic post.

Good post, Mike. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] Kathi

Boy if that doesnt make you think I dont know what will!!!! Good post Thank you !!!

I like it too, and it reminds me of a book sent to me by a very caring MB friend, called Praying with Katie, by Don Holt. Katie, if you haven't guessed, is a cat.By spending time with Katie and watching her... the author realized that spiritual truths could be found in her daily routine. For example, Katie would sometimes sit at his feet and look up at him, in contemplation... almost as if she were quietly trying to figure him out. How often should we BE STILL (as the Bible says too) and sit at God's feet, to watch him and listen.Anyway, I liked your cat experience, and I'm a super-duper cat person myself... so I thought I'd share...

Not really off topic at all...your cat was a prime example of how you can't force someone to love you. I'm glad it finally came around, you would have really missed out on a terrific pet if you'd returned him/her to the shelter. Your story actually made me want to run to my local spca and adopt a kitty. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]
Take Care...Toni

Mike - enjoyed your real life story of your cat. We have a cat that turned out to be one of the most loving attentive cats. She was at the human society, I was getting our big boy pupppies neutured at the human society. My mother in-law said lets look at the cats, a sister cat to the one cat we still have got killed on the road just a few days earlier. This was the ugliest cat, scrawny, infested with fleas bites and ear mites. I picked her up and she knew what to do, gave me kisses and hugged my neck with her 2 paws. Of course the next day I took her home, it was a Friday, and found out by the end of the day, that she was very ill. Pneumonia had set in, and she had diarrhea and vomiting. Of course the human society was closed until Monday, kept her upright against my chest inside a scarf tied around my neck. I slept in a recliner so she would be upright to sleep. Took her in Monday, and they kept her for 3 days, hooked up to IV with antibiotics and fluids. When we took her in Monday they wanted to put her to sleep, but we said no. To this day, she is such a lover. Love cats too.

Bravo sir. Point taken. Nicely put!

I like it!! [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img]

<blockquote>quote:<hr>Originally posted by Toni_29again:
Not really off topic at all...your cat was a prime example of how you can't force someone to love you. <hr></blockquote>oohhhhhhhh....... [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Sometimes Mike I think you're picking on me [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]

Yeah, I know. Regardless of what I may think about cats ....[ January 23, 2002: Message edited by: Dan-O ]

bump.

thankyou man! whew.you took the words right out of my mouth. [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] We had a similar experience with our cat. All of our pets have been hand me downs or strays we've saved from the destruction or abandonment. Our dog was part of an abandoned litter and found us one day when we were out for a walk. Our cat came to us from a family with a bunch of dogs on a farm and the dogs were going to kill it. I have watched and worked with the pets in effect practicing massage therapy on them as if they were people with ptsd. I've learned alot about ptsd from working with the cat and alot about abandonment issues from working with the dog.At the same time the cat WANTS to be petted it won't always sit still for it or allow it. So it asks for petting but won't allow only the most superficial back rub or head scratch and it then prances around and walks or saunters is more like it...away from contact.All this has led me to what I consider the primary need for someone or an animal which ever the case may be that is coming from an abusive or stressed situation. (aren't we all animals on some level? [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] on this basic instinctual level I don't see much difference between humans and other animals)The primary unmet need is safety and security both physical and emotional.I watch horrified as I see some people here starving and clamouring around spouses for SF who refuse to recognize that their spouses fall in the category of people who suffer from post truamatic stress (ptsd).Demands, stands, justifications, and ridicule aren't going to address the need for emotional safety and sense of being secure that their spouse NEEDS to begin to open up to affection and THEN sexual expression.I know because my wife and I have been thru these phases with her. It's not just the cat in our house that has come from ptsd. There was a phase years ago when my affectionate overtures were perceived as a threat just like your cat. All that time I largely had to accept and go thru the pain of feeling rejected and abaondoned emotionally in terms of physical interactions and marital relations. It did no good to blame my wife or myself. It did no good to rant or demand that MY needs were important. You can't get blood out of a turnip. You can't force a traumatized person to feel safe. Sure I had unmet needs but so did she and until I accepted the importance of her needs as well as my own and stopped putting the heat on her demanding she buck up and put out for me we were deadlocked. Taking it personally didn't help matters either. It wasn't all about me. I had to learn that and remind myself of it from time to time and realize that I could either be a part of the problem or part of the solution and then make a choice.I've stated repeatedly here on this site the need for emotional safety to people who aren't getting what they feel is "their fair share" of getting their needs met and seemingly my words just bounce off them. They don't get it. AND they ironically aren't getting THEIR emotional needs met even when they GET the sex they clamour for so much because this emotional security need doesn't just up and disappear because they get their way and get to put their body together with their spouse occasionally. It's rather an independent factor that has to be addressed on it's own terms.why won't some people wake up and admit the true nature of their situation rather than insist on making judgements about themselves and their spouses and get defensive and defiant and all that goes with it, the labeling and name calling. It's all so counterproductive and harmful and if you understand the true nature of the problem it's precisely the MOST damaging thing they could do in terms of destroying the emotional safety of their already traumatized spouse.makes me cringe and empathetically I really hurt for people and also because I know from my own life what it's like to have been there and done that myself. Now I cringe for how I behaved when I didn't know any better either.sigh. [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img] thanks again for a good third party story that hopefully those in the situation can and will hear. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] it's not off topic at all. it's right on the money. Let's deal with reality shall we? [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img][ March 07, 2002: Message edited by: Kasey1 ]

I don't like cats, have never liked cats, they don't like me, and we have a mutual agreement to avoid each other at all costs... [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] But I have a tear in my eye now. Thanks for sharing that cat story, Mike --- I printed it off for my friend the cat lover... I don't know why ALL my friends love cats...! [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img] That was definitely a post of understanding others... Thanks.Jan

Bump...

Great post Mike!

My wife sounds like the cat in this story! She keeps telling me to stop trying to fix our problems and give her some space. Ok maybe I will give it a try. It is difficult for me to do that because my thinking is you need to try to fix the problems not ignore them. Maybe I will do what she has asked for years and back off. My question is how do I get over feeling like ignoring the problem is not going to fix the problem? I want the problems fixed NOW. I know I am not very patient.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Want Love:
My question is how do I get over feeling like ignoring the problem is not going to fix the problem? I want the problems fixed NOW. I know I am not very patient.well.....I don't think it is a question of discontinuing an effort, it is a question of channeling it into an effort to 1. not lovebust at ALL, and 2. meet the ENs your withdrawn spouse is comfortable with you meeting. Oftentimes a withdrawn spouse doesn't want affection or SF. If you find one that doesn't want FS, FC, and DS, let me know, and I'll alert the media. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] The point of the story is that a cessation of lbing and a meeting of basic needs, and time, is sometimes not only WHAT is needed, but it is the ONLY thing that is needed.Also, as a precaution, have your wife wormed.[ May 22, 2002: Message edited by: Mike C2 ]

bump!

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Takola:
bump!<hr /></blockquote>hey, i was going to go look for that thread to paste an update on...

Apropos of nothing....that cat now has a weird habit. It won't jump up on our bed now...except if we are making love. Isn't that strange? As soon as we start going at it, she leaps up on the bed.

If she didn't have that raspy tongue and sharp little teeth...ahh...but that's a different topic. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Good story

Takola sent me this when she first started helping me all newbies should have to read it. It got me through alot of hard times. It was everywhere. The frig, the bathroom, my office.
It is so true.
le

Whew!!! I thought there was some hidden message about how I'm fat and hide from everyone! *LOL*

Mike,

You are good.

I hate cats. I understand the point.

Dont ignore "Heavy Heart"......Help her.

We know Steve Harley is good....but most of us cant afford him.....

Help Heavy Heart..

Thanks Bud

Randy

MikeC2 way to go! With all the abuse of animals by mean people, it's refreshing to read a post like yours, you are certainly to be commended! Like you, my wife and I 'rescue' abused dogs from the local Animal Shelter. Right now, we have 2 female dogs, "Brittany" and "Sweetie Girl" - Brittany had been living in a bitty utility room and had apparently been choked and hit by her previous owners. We took her in, and (though not as long as your cat) we watched her come out of her shell. When we first got her, she was very timid, and was afraid of us. She would walk around the yard dragging her tail. That was this past January. Today, she 'prances' all over the place, and she gets along well with our guests, and especially our other dog. However, she is still timid in some ways, and we doubt if she'll ever change; however, we love her the same. Our dogs are indoor dogs, and we spoil them to death! Sweetie Girl, we got from the Shelter, and she was the most frightened timid dog you ever saw. Not so today: her and Brittany are best buddies and they get along very well, and Sweetie likes to lay on us and have us pet her head, etc. Both dogs have really 'blossomed' and it is a good feeling to know that we have 'saved' another 2 animals from being put to sleep - and besides that, they are so entertaining. Sorry if I sound like I'm 'beating our own drum' but I wanted to let you know that there are lots of others out there who also rescue animals and enjoy watching them be themselves. Thank you for posting, and also for reading this.
Harold & Linda T

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> It won't jump up on our bed now...except if we are making love. Isn't that strange? <hr /></blockquote>We have one that jumps up there everytime too. He just watches. Kinda weird, so I usually throw him off the bed.

Mike C2,

You are one of the smartest people here at MB.

I lashed out at you in my last post ..only because I read a sad post by a lost soul and I wish I could be you in order to help that person.

Im sorry if I seemed to have picked....It was not my intention....

Your storys have always been an inspiration.

Keep up the great work.

Always your unknown pal...

Randy

I am a cat lover. I have always had cats. I find them to be very humanlike. I think cats can read your mind, more so than any other animal.

My son is severly dyslexic. He has had a very rough go of it. Last spring he asked me if I would buy a kitten for him, a cat that would be his very own. I did. I bought a beautiful tiny long haired black kitten for him. The kitten`s mother had been killed by a car and so it needed a new home although it was only six weeks old.

My son up until that point had had alot of trouble being organised. He had trouble taking responsability for ANYTHING. He did not have ANY particular interest. He had very low self esteem.

Well you should have seen him with this kitten. He fed it, changed it`s litter, carried it around ALL THE TIME. He also was very respectful of it, when it wanted down he put it down.

Now this kitten has grown into a huge black glossy behemothe. This cat will have NOTHING to do with ANY member of our family except my son. He will not come when called, he will not tolerate being touched. The only person whose existence he will aknowledge is that of my son. He`s so beautiful and his fur is so silky everyone wants to pet him but he`ll have none of it, except with my son. He follows my son everywhere. He sleeps with him. He comes when he`s called by my son. My son is the chosen one.

We could have gotten my son a dog. But I know dogs. It would have been a family dog. Dogs are not discerning. I am so pleased that we got this cat for my son. My son knows that there is something special about himself because of this cat. He knows this cat has picked him out of all the humans in our house to love.

I have really liked this story (as we have a now 16 y.o. tiny tortise shell cat that we rescued from the wild as a kitten- she's all that! Now she is very affectionate and visits all the members of the family. She now actually allows my kids' friends to pet her- though she is still skittish!). Its application to marriage is so true. We all need time to heal from the wounds that were inflicted -however unintentionally.

As an animal owner (2 dogs, 2 cats, 6 horses, 1 llama)I have seen remarkable changes in scared animals as well as humans when this is applied. I have been reading up for some time about "clicker training" of abused and wild domestic animals and the "miracles" resulting from operant behavioral conditioning. The amazing thing about it is that Harley has it in his marriage books!
Clicker training for humans <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> :
1.) meeting ENs (rewards and positive associations),
2.) ignoring bad behaviour to a certain extent(you can change your self, not the other person- but you don't let yourself be abused physically, emotionally or verbally- just like we would avoid being attacked by a wild animal!)
3.) removing all Love Busters as the spouse defines them- (not pushing them away by your actions, however good your intent)

IT CAN BE DONE!!
Maybe we ALL should read up on clicker training!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Seriously speaking... even my IC says that you CAN influence another person's behavior over a long period of time (Our CAT took us 16 YEARS!)if you consistantly treat them with understanding, validation (without necessarily agreeing- "I can see you are frustrated when _________ happens") and respect.
(But, as all of us have encountered in our lives-- humans CAN still decide to reject our efforts.)

Thanks for the bump up on this. It is very helpful to contemplate actions with this in mind!
Blessings to you all!

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Randy0220:
Mike C2, You are one of the smartest people here at MB.

And you are one of the most perceptive <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I lashed out at you in my last post ..only because I read a sad post by a lost soul and I wish I could be you in order to help that person.

I missed this....I'll go look at Heavy Heart's posts. There are no wizards here, just people a few chapters ahead in the book....

^

^^^^

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Daisy37:
We could have gotten my son a dog. But I know dogs. It would have been a family dog. Dogs are not discerning. I am so pleased that we got this cat for my son. My son knows that there is something special about himself because of this cat. He knows this cat has picked him out of all the humans in our house to love.<hr /></blockquote>Oh, but they are, especially in a case like yours.

Amanda

Dear Ace,

I think some people are cats and some people are dogs. I know I am a cat, so is my son. My H is a dog.

After going through rough times I retreat and become very wary. I want to be shown stability and security but other than that I want to be left alone. I don`t like to be pushed. I will decide if and when I feel secure. Then I will recommit myself. I want proof that someone is worthy of me.

My H is like a big ole puppy, panting and wanting attention. Abuse doesn`t faze him in the slightest, he`ll always come back for more.

We do have two huge dogs. My H loves those dogs. My son and I prefer the more discerning personality of a cat. If a cat loves you you KNOW you are special. Dogs love everybody.

It`s hard to say who the wisest though, is it the cat or the dog?

I think you can figure out alot about a person just by their preference in a house pet.

^

ascending...

Thanks for bringing this back up. It was a great read (kudos, MikeC2!).

I don't recall ever reading it before. And if I did, I didn't have the clarity I have now.

Petals

Yeah, something that happened today made me think of it. It is worth reading/rereading every so often!

That "something" wouldn't be Ms.H would it? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Nope. Talking with a teen who has had a rough time lately...

^

bump

[QUOTE] Dogs! No, cats! I mean dogs! No, cats are best! Oh, rats!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> bump

I'd like to share my cat story.
It happened not too long ago.

My H and I adopted a cat from the SPCA six years ago. Since we don't have any children, the cat is as precious as one to us.

My H moved out after I discovered his past As. I was hospitalized a month after that and during that time, we housed the cat in a cattery at the local animal welfare. My H and I do not like the cattery. Although there was shelther, the cages would get wet when there is wind and rain. The place is not as clean as we would like it to be, and I suspect that our cat would not touch the food or litter box provided. There were dogs housed opposite the cattery, and when they get excited, they bark and howl. But, it had a big cage- almost 12x4 and that was the reason why we brought it there.

After my stay at the hospital, I spent another ten days at my mother's house recuperating. My H and I could not wait to get the cat back home, but before heading home, she went to the vet for a bath, deworming and de-flea-ing. Naturally, that was a lot of stress for her.

During the next three months, whenever I felt lonely or miserable, I would pop over to mom's and stay for three or four days, or a week. The cat would be left alone in the apartment, and I would pop in every two or three days to refill its food. It was during this time that she vomitted a lot. The vet said that it was getting old, and is having problems with hairballs. He recommended a cream which I had to put on the cat's paw for it to lick off. The cream worked, but the cat hated it. It would struggle and run away everytime it saw me with the cream or reaching for the cream. Soon it avoided me because I was the " Bad Cream Person". I didn't like the cat much at that time. To me, it was another burden that my H had left behind. I had to feed it, clean its litter and nurse its hairball problems. I had my own problems to take care of.

Months past and the cat withdrew itself. She stopped talking to me. She stopped greeting me when I come home, and she would hide herself from me for hours. She stopped going out, she stopped being curious and she stopped eating too.

One day, I noticed that she had a limp on her hind leg. She didn't move around very much. She prefered to spend her time in the back room. If she was up on the footstool, and decided to get down on the floor, she would move around looking for a 'safe' place to jump so as not to injure her leg. Whenever she gets up from her resting position, she would use her leg tenderly. It was painful to watch her, so we brought her back to the vet. He confirmed an injury, but was not certain whether it was the joint or muscle. He gave some supplements for joint maintenance and some steroids to help her with the pain. And as expected, I would be the one who administer the medication. It was another struggle, although this time she cannot run away because of her bad leg. She became more fearful of me and no coaxing will make her close and dear to me.

One day, I was at the homeopath's and saw some remedies for pets. Remedies for emotional upsets like fear, depression, loneliness, remembering the past, uncertainty, self-isolation, letting go, resignation etc. I got her a mix of seven remedies, some fish and liver, which was her favourite, and because I was too busy with my own life, have stopped making for her. When I went home, the first thing I did was put a drop in her mouth and rubbed her body with it. I also put the remedy in her food and water. The results were amazing.

For the first time that day in many, many months she stood on her hind legs and asked me to hurry up with the fish. She pressed her body back and forth against my legs till no end.

The next day, she greeted me when I came home. Eventually, she left the back room. She asked to go out. She caught lizards and other bugs. Her appetite came back. She followed me around. She visits me when I am in the bathroom and talks to me. Her new routine is to jump on the bed when I am in the shower and waits for me there till I go to bed. Sometimes I would go to bed early and read, just to be with her. She sits with me when I am watching tv. She purrs non-stop and asks to be stroked. A few nights ago she hid under the blankets to jump a suprise on me when I went to bed.

So what did I learn from all this? Why did the cat heal so quickly? Because animals do not hide their emotions. When they feel happy and safe, they show it. She displayed her need to be loved, and in her own ways, asked me to spend more time with her without sulking or demanding for it. She waited patiently for me to come home, and when I come home, it was love, love, love, I miss you all day, I love you, cuddle me a little. Look, I caught a lizard, it's in your shoe. She's depositing into the Love Bank ALL THE TIME!!

I am trying to apply these attitudes in rebuilding my own marriage. I try not to LB all the time though it's difficult. I try to give love first and forget the past. And I try to be patient.

What I do wish is that my H would come home, and enjoy me and the cat. She (the cat) has shown me that love is possible, and will always be there.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ruffled:
[QB] I got her a mix of seven remedies, some fish and liver, which was her favourite, and because I was too busy with my own life, have stopped making for her. When I went home, the first thing I did was put a drop in her mouth and rubbed her body with it. I also put the remedy in her food and water. The results were amazing.

That is a nice story. We can all learn from our pets. I suppose a scientist would point to the fish and liver as the change catlyst here, but who am I to criticize? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

star*bump

^

oops, here it is. Context for my update post on The Cat.