Marriage Builders
Posted By: JustinExplorer Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 08:06 PM
Hi folks,
I am wondering what people think of the idea of dating while in the process of divorcing. My stbxw and I have been physically apart for over 4 months and emotionally apart for 6 months.

I feel that I am finally turning the corner and becoming a more confident single man rather than a discarded married man (my wife left me for another man). I never cheated on her and never considered it, but she had a multi-year affair and eventually left me to be with the OM, whom she plans to marry when the divorce is final.

I am not talking about a hot romance leading to marriage or anything big. I am thinking of things like dinner, dancing, hiking, attending an arts fair, and similar companship type things. I am not seeking passion, at least not yet. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Will the fact that I am still married be viewed as though I am disloyal to my vows? I never imagined myself being in this situation, but then I never imagined my wife cheating on me as badly as she did.

Your thoughts on dating during the divorce process will be appreciated.
Posted By: newly Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 08:19 PM
I'm personally against it and wouldn't date someone who was not yet divorced.
I believe everyone contributed to a divorce, whether or not they realized it. Sometimes our choices in a mate led to a D, or our actions within the M.
I believe that I have alot of work to do on myself before I can enter a healthy relationship.
Too many people jump from one bad relationship to another, without realizing how much baggage they carry.
I want to lighten my load before I get into a new relationship. Can you say the same?
Posted By: MyCatsMom Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 08:45 PM
Baaaaaaaaad, bad, bad, bad idea.

I don't mean to sound like a know-it-all, but even tho you've "turned a corner," you aren't out of the maze, by a long shot.

Will the fact that I am still married be viewed as though I am disloyal to my vows?

Yup, technically. You're either single or your married, no matter what process is going on. Yes, there's a difference in motive and intent and I guess that's why people do date before their divorce is final.

That's the one regret I have: I was separated from my x-H for 2+ years and one month from the divorce, and I started seeing someone....only for friendship, not romance...like you said. Really, really wish I would have waited...not for anyone else's opinion, but for myself.

I think you'll be happier with yourself in the long run, if you get outta the maze altogether and give yourself time to heal. Harley and most experts say 2 years from the divorce. It's been 2 years since that relationship (the guy I dated) and honestly, I wish I would have waited until now to start.
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 08:50 PM
Newley, you make some interesting points, but I am not sure they apply to all situations. While I did some things to harm the marriage, nothing I did comes close to justifying the affair my wife had. The marriage was destroyed by her affair, and that was and is something beyond my control. The affair is about her problems, not marital problems.

I am not sure I can lighten my load much further. I have attended a number of classes and lectures concering divorcing and I have spent a huge amount of time assessing my part in the marriage and even in the divorce.

I have no desire to spend the next 6-12 months waiting so as to satisfy some arbitrary standard. Yet, I realize that immersing myself in a heavily romantic relationship is not something I am ready for.

This is all very confusing.

<small>[ May 14, 2004, 03:52 PM: Message edited by: JustinExplorer ]</small>
Posted By: Vee Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 09:25 PM
Justin -

I am in the minority on this issue I think. I don't think it's a bad idea - UNLESS - you can truly say - 1) my divorce is going to happen, 2) I am not in love with my stbx anymore, 3) You are emotionally ready to start a relationship without excess baggage - i.e. don't project your stbx's problems, issues on the other person, and 4) you can recognize any emotional vulnerability you may have.

I remember lurking around this board when I started contemplating divorce. I wanted to see what others were doing - how did they know they were ready for divorce. The best advice - You Will Know. It's true. When I decided to file, I was sick of my H and was ready to live life without him, even if it meant I would be alone forever. Anything was better than being his wife. (I know, harsh words, but I lived toooo much drama!)

When I did start dating, I went out for a few dates - just movies, dinner, lunch etc. Nothing big. I also made it known if these gentlemen were looking for a future wife - it wasn't me. I simply am not ready for that type of relationship. You have to gauge a NUMBER of factors before you just jump out there. I think that's why a lot of people say don't do it until everything is final. There are single people who won't date anyone who is separated because they always run the risk of having their emotions hurt because of a reconciliation.

They guy I am currently dating, while not a divorcee, did just end a relationship several months prior to our meeting, and I stopped to ask him - "If you think there is a possibility you will reconcile, please go the opposite direction. My STBXH and I are NOT getting back together and I am not going to spend time with someone where this may be an issue.

Just be sure to weigh both sides of this argument. I can relate to both sides very easily. I opted to date mainly because I had spent the last 1 1/2 separated from my H.

Vee
Posted By: LoveMyEx Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 09:32 PM
I agree with newly and Mrs. O... very much so. Any expert, not only Dr. Harley, whose worked with divorced people, will advice AT LEAST a 1-2 year healing period. Also, a lot of people jump back into relationships because they think that's what they need to be healed, happy, and whole again. It's much better to first be healed, happy, and whole and to then enter a relationship with another healed, happy, whole person. I believe that most people have that misconception that dating someone is what will make them heal and be happy. That often leads to disappoinment and/or a poor dating choice.

For me, I would not date a man going through a divorce and I would not date a man only 6 mos. out of a marriage. That is not very much time at all. It might seem like it to you, but it's really a short amount of time. I also wouldn't date a man whose wife had left him... unless it's been at least 2... probably more like 4=-5 years so that I knew he'd really worked though adn dealt with all the pain, anger, etc. of the betrayal and the divorce.

To be brutally honest, I wouldn't date a man who said, "I have no desire to spend the next 6-12 mos. waiting" because to me, that sounds as if you just want a woman and want one soon... and aren't willing to be patient and/or to enjoy and experience life without one, which makes me wonder if you view a relationship as the key to your happiness and fulfillment... which is scary because that's alot of expectation to put on a relationship and is one of the expectations that often leads to a bad marriage and/or divorce.

There is no hurry, and it'd be far better to give yourself more time than you need to "recover" than not enough time. You are very, very vulnerable right now and an innocent dinner is not really that big of a deal, but I think it could easily become far more becuase I think that you are really craving a relationship right now... which is normal, but most wouldn't recommend it... ESP. because YOU ARE STILL MARRIED!! At least, if anything, wait until you're officially divorced!
Posted By: MyCatsMom Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 09:51 PM
Wasn't trying to go by an arbitrary number....

Just wanted to share my experience...and give you the perspective of someone who is further down the road than you currently are....and yes, it's not everyone's opinion. However, I bet the majority of divorced/separated people who dated early on, would agree. Most...but not all.

It's totally up to you. You will have to reap whatever consequences...good or bad...that your choice has. Just remember....when you start dating, there is someone else's heart that could be involved besides yours....just a friendly reminder.

Good luck!

<small>[ May 14, 2004, 04:52 PM: Message edited by: Ms.O ]</small>
Posted By: AFS Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 09:55 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> The marriage was destroyed by her affair, and that was and is something beyond my control. The affair is about her problems, not marital problems. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I'd bet your wife thought the marriage was already destroyed (due to the nonexistent marital problems) before she had her affair.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Will the fact that I am still married be viewed as though I am disloyal to my vows? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yes, and it would make you no different than your wife, in my opinion. You are willing to divorce over her disloyalty, but yours would be excusable?

Did you try Plan B?
Posted By: Faith4me Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 09:57 PM
Dating while YOU are still married is adultery. Even though you are separated, some states don't accept seperation. Do you want to be like your wife, and commit adultery?

As for myself, I am divorced since June 2003. I haven't dated, don't want to date until I know that I am able to be myself, handle a relationship with someone special. Like the Harleys said, you should wait at least 1 year after your divorce before dating. I will say, recently, I have been on the internet christian dating sites, and am talking to some guys. Nothing serious, nothing about dating, just to talk. I have a friend that I talk to in person, a male. Nothing about dating, nothing about relationship, just talking. I am not ready to date, just want someone to talk to. Talk to them with ideas I have, help me solve problems that I have with the ex and situations. Nothing more.

I still have some feelings towards the ex, but I don't wish him any harm. He is wayward in his mind, and I know that he is going to get burned. That is going to be his problem.

Wait till the marriage is ended. You never know what could come in the future. Your wife could come back, and do you really want to say to her, I have been with another woman, and I may have to have STD testing, AIDS testing done. This is the situation that I am in. My ex had sex with the other woman while we were married. And he didn't tell me that he had sex, until after we had relations. So my gyn has me check every year. For the next 10 years. My ex of course won't have himself checked, for he doesn't feel he has anything, just the wayward mind. But he has no remorse about infecting me with his OW diseases.

So be truthful to God. Be truthful to yourself. No dating. Find groups to join. Be in a good church, do activites. Find things that you enjoy and find yourself. That is the most important thing for you to do right now.

Read the Harleys books, don't date until after 1 year of the divorce.
Posted By: MyCatsMom Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 10:19 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Faith4me:
<strong> Dating while YOU are still married is adultery. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Adultery: Voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and a partner other than the lawful spouse. (Dictionary definition.)

As well, adultery as used in the Bible, refers to sexual intercourse.

Dating need not include sexual intercourse! Dating while separated may be defined as being unfaithful to one's vows, but it's not "adultery."

And while we may have strong opinions regarding this (whether it's right or wrong), using the wrong word to describe it doesn't necessarily help.

<small>[ May 14, 2004, 05:21 PM: Message edited by: Ms.O ]</small>
Posted By: ThornedRose Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 10:44 PM
LoveMyEx,

--I also wouldn't date a man whose wife had left him... unless it's been at least 2... probably more like 4=-5 years so that I knew he'd really worked though adn dealt with all the pain, anger, etc. of the betrayal and the divorce.

TR--I know some folks who even after 4-5 years past the divorce still haven't dealt with the issues--of why the marriage actually ended--I also know some who after 20 years past divorce never worked through the issue's and carried those issue's into their subsequent marriages--as well other issues that their wife leaving them left them with--like they won't trust their spouses--even same sex friends--they don't want them working or doing anything away from the home that could lead to the spouse actually coming into contact with other people--other than family-because they just MIGHT leave them for someone else--like their previous spouses have done--
Posted By: GnomeDePlume Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 10:56 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LoveMyEx:
<strong>To be brutally honest, I wouldn't date a man who said, "I have no desire to spend the next 6-12 mos. waiting" because to me, that sounds as if you just want a woman and want one soon... and aren't willing to be patient and/or to enjoy and experience life without one, which makes me wonder if you view a relationship as the key to your happiness and fulfillment... which is scary because that's alot of expectation to put on a relationship and is one of the expectations that often leads to a bad marriage and/or divorce.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is pretty key, in my opinion. Even the fact that you view the healing/adjustment period as "waiting" is a bit telling, Justin.

There are lots and lots and lots of things you can do with your time, and this includes social things. If you're at a loss to understand how you can live a satisfying life on your own, then you are not ready to begin another relationship. (Interdependence can only be built on independence.)

And personally, I think that if you're not ready for "serious" dating, you're not ready for "light" dating. Emotions do not always follow one's planned agenda.
Posted By: GnomeDePlume Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 11:04 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LoveMyEx:
<strong>I also wouldn't date a man whose wife had left him... unless it's been at least 2... probably more like 4=-5 years so that I knew he'd really worked though adn dealt with all the pain, anger, etc. of the betrayal and the divorce.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">My wife left me almost four years ago now, and I was definitely not ready to begin another relationship even a year ago. I think I'm only now getting to the point where I am ready, and I'm sure I could still be fooling myself.
Posted By: MyCatsMom Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/14/04 11:11 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by GnomeDePlume:
<strong> This is pretty key, in my opinion. Even the fact that you view the healing/adjustment period as "waiting" is a bit telling, Justin.

There are lots and lots and lots of things you can do with your time, and this includes social things. If you're at a loss to understand how you can live a satisfying life on your own, then you are not ready to begin another relationship. (Interdependence can only be built on independence.)

And personally, I think that if you're not ready for "serious" dating, you're not ready for "light" dating. Emotions do not always follow one's planned agenda. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Amen, preach it! That's it in a nutshell!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Very, very good answer!
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 12:54 AM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by AFS:
<strong> ]I'd bet your wife thought the marriage was already destroyed (due to the nonexistent marital problems) before she had her affair.

You are willing to divorce over her disloyalty, but yours would be excusable?

Did you try Plan B? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You would lose that bet.

I am NOT divorcing my wife. She left me to get her own place so she could be with the OM. I plan A'd as good as I could, did quite a good one, IMHO. She filed the papers to divorce me. I had to go along with it because this is a nofault state and I have no alternative. She is divorcing me so she can be with the OM and marry him.

I think there is a big difference between motives and actions when comparing her and me.
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 12:58 AM
I get the picture.
Posted By: cjack Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 08:27 AM
Another "oldtimer" here...

And I have to add my voice to the chorus of "don't do its" that are piling up.

It depends, of course, on how long you were married, but 6-12 months is not totally unreasonable or arbitrary.

At the urging of some friends who thought I needed to "get back on the horse," I returned to the bar scene about 4 months after my XW moved out, and started dating very casually. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I figured out pretty quickly that I wasn't emotionally even close to being ready for that, so I swore off dating for a year.

Sounds crazy, right?

The thing is, when I finally started dating again, I had a whole different perspective. The year off really helped me figure out a lot of things about myself and what I wanted from even a casual relationship.

In retrospect, taking that year off was a good decision.


As to whether you're being "disloyal to your vows," I'd have to say that yes, you are. By dating other women, you're essentially breaking a promise that you made to your STBX in front of "almighty god and these witnesses," if you had the traditional wedding.

You didn't just make those vows to her, you made them to yourself and to all the other people who were present at the wedding.

It is a small consolation, but if you avoid dating until the divorce is final, at least you'll be able to say "hey, I held up my end of the bargain."
Posted By: cinderella Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 01:27 PM
I think I figured out I was ready to date a little over a year after my divorce was final. I had been separated for about 3.5 years before the divorce became final.

And I chose <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> to date a man who had been divorced no where near long enough. And it showed. Was not a good idea.

Give yourself some time.

Once, I read Terry Waite's autobiography. He was the secretary to the Archbishop of Canterbury and was taken captive in Iran where he was a prisoner for 5 years. The one thing that most jumped out at me was a paraphrase from the writings of Augustine:

To have peace, you must know yourself. To know yourself, you must be alone.

Take some time to find peace.
Posted By: cicada Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 06:29 PM
Well said Cinderella. Well said.
Posted By: baba2 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 06:58 PM
Think of the possible women you would be dating not just of yourself.

These women are dating you and most are looking for MR Right, a long term relationship, maybe sex, maybe eventually marriage, maybe children.

So, why waste thier time when you cannot offer them any of this? Dating them, even casually, can lead to thier pain and hurt due to thier ideas and expectations.

Don't even think of "leading women on" by "friendhip dating".

Just meet some good men friends and do activities with them. What is the point of dating women if you have nothing to offer them at this point.

Stick with your men friends until such time as you are:

1. Divorced
2. Ready for a relationship
3. Ready to get involved even to marriage

It will be better for you and HURT the women less that you date. Women want to date AVAILABLE men and you are in no way nearly available.
Posted By: WhenIfindthetime Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 07:08 PM
would you want to date a woman that is still married, hurting in separation, waiting for a divorce, that is clingy and needy? and then later finds out that she is using you and dumps you were a rebound relationship and a pain pacifier?

its just looking at heads from the tails perspective. . .

wiftty
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 09:23 PM
Thanks for all the input. This is a tough time for me as I am working my way through both the legal matters of the divorce and the emotional matters.

Sounds like at least 6 more months of doing things on my own and with groups of friends. That will give me one year since the time she moved out and left me on my own. Then I can reevaluate.
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 09:26 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by baba2:
<strong> Women want to date AVAILABLE men and you are in no way nearly available. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">True. What I find interesting is the number of women who don't know that.
Posted By: ThornedRose Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 09:49 PM
JustinExplorer,

--I am NOT divorcing my wife. She left me to get her own place so she could be with the OM. She is divorcing me so she can be with the OM and marry him. --

TR--Have you ever read this article by Dr. Harley?


Why Women Leave Men

"I hurt all the time because I feel alone and abandoned."

"My husband is no longer my friend."

"The only time he pays attention to me is when he wants sex."

"He is never there for me when I need him the most."

"When he hurts my feelings he doesn't apologize."

"He lives his life as if we weren't married; he rarely considers me."

We're like ships passing in the night, he goes his way and I go mine."

"My husband has become a stranger to me, I don't even know who he is anymore."

"He doesn't show any interest in me or what I do."

Women tend to be more concerned about their marriages than men. They buy most of the books on marriage to try to improve them and initiate most marriage counseling. They often complain about their marriages to their closest friends and sometimes to anyone who will listen. And they also file for divorce twice as often as men.

Why do women seem so dissatisfied with marriage? What do they want from their husbands? What bothers them so much about marriage that most are willing to risk their families' future to escape it?

The most common reason women give for leaving their husbands is "mental cruelty." When legal grounds for divorce are stated, about half report they have been emotionally abused. But the mental cruelty they describe is rarely the result of their husband's efforts to drive them crazy. It is usually husbands being indifferent, failing to communicate and demonstrating other forms of neglect.

Another reason for divorce reported almost as much as mental cruelty is "neglect" itself. These include both emotional abandonment and physical abandonment. Husbands that work away from the home, sometimes leaving their wives alone for weeks at a time, fall into this category.

When all forms of spousal neglect are grouped together, we find that it is far ahead of all the other reasons combined that women leave men. Surprisingly few women divorce because of physical abuse, infidelity, alcoholism, criminal behavior, fraud, or other serious grounds. In fact, I find myself bewildered by women in serious physical danger refusing to leave men that threaten their safety.

Simply stated, women leave men when they are neglected. Neglect accounts for almost all of the reasons women leave and divorce men.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8111_leave.html

There is the link to the rest of the article--maybe you should read it---and see if maybe from your wife's perspective--the marriage was over before you even recognized a problem--

most men I know--don't know there is a problem in their marriage until their wives are telling them they want a divorce--


I think there is a big difference between motives and actions when comparing her and me. [/QB][/QUOTE]
Posted By: Enlightened_Ex Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 10:01 PM
TR,

That is so painful every time I read it because I don't think I neglected my wife, I don't believe that I invalidated her feelings, etc.

However, if you ask her, I'll be she will say that I did.

So what is the reality of it all? I took care of her, I earned a good living, bought a house, a minivan for her, took her on the vacations she wanted to go on, etc.

She tells me I don't know her. We are all wrong for each other.

So what is the truth?

Yes, I failed to meet some of her emotional needs. Out of ignorance, and some selfishness. Everytime I read Ephesians 5, I start to bawl, because I know I didn't love my wife with a sacrificial, Christlike love.

So, instead of just telling me in language I can understand how she feels, she "sneaks out" of the marriage an into a relationship with another man.

All the while, I really just want to love her, and want to be loved myself. Yes, I wanted SF, and was upset that I didn't get as much as I wanted. I asked how I could get her in the mood. What did she say, "be romantic" well ok, what is romantic to you, it's different for everyone.

I'm just venting.

I just want a chance to be the husband God calls me to be, and I pray it is with my first and God willing, only wife.

I'm so upset today, and frustrated. Frustrated with myself, frustrated with my wife who didn't just tell me in language I can understand how she feels, frustrated with God that He let me walk so far away from Him, frustrated that He hasn't brought us back together again, frustrated that our daughter has to suffer because of our selfishness.

I'm just frustrated right now, and I could sure use a prayer and maybe a miracle or two. I'm trying to keep my faith, but it is so hard when I don't see any signs of us getting any closer to reconciliation.

I even pray for the OM and his wife, and I don't pray for harm for him either.

I would love to have a glorious testimony of how God did what I thought was impossible, both in my heart and in our marriage.

And, if I have my way, I'd like it to be soon. Our 8th wedding anniversary is 1 June, what a great present that would be for my beautiful bride to come home.

Tony
Posted By: WhenIfindthetime Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 10:11 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">What I find interesting is the number of women who don't know that. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">how many have you sampled? 3, 4?

why don't you conduct a survey at a local spot you hang out. . .

ask them, would you consider a serious relationship with a man that is still married, but whose wife has run off with another man?

i suspect that you are ASSUMING a conclusion from observing women with INCOMPLETE knowledge. . .

its amazing how people draw self serving conclusions. . .

wiftty
Posted By: WhenIfindthetime Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 10:14 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sounds like at least 6 more months of doing things on my own and with groups of friends. That will give me one year since the time she moved out and left me on my own. Then I can reevaluate. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">its not like a predetermined time is required. . . its the time to recover emotionally, and [i][b]to learn what you did wrong, and to correct the biases and attitudes that led you down the wrong path. whether that means personal change or better mate selection is up to you to determine.[/quote]

wiftty
Posted By: baba2 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/15/04 10:15 PM
And another question is:

The women who would date a married man, what kind of women are these anyway? Are they desparate? Are they of low self esteem? Are they nutz?

Hey, if you really want women companionship, and you do not care about the morals or values of women, then go find 'em at strip bars or prostitution hangouts. (just kidding, it is not really funny)

What type of women are you thinking of dating anyway?
Posted By: Topie25 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/16/04 01:33 AM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by JustinExplorer:
<strong> I am wondering what people think of the idea of dating while in the process of divorcing. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I think it varies from person to person.

For ME, I think it's okay to date even when the D isn't finalized. Of course, that's because it's something I have done.

In my case, I went out with a few men for coffee and lunch dates, just to prove to myself that I can still do it. I was an emotional basket case after living through the multiple A's my H had during our entire M. My self esteem was at an all time low. And for whatever reason, I found it easier to build my self esteem from the outside in (getting compliments from others first, before being able to believe them from within). That was last summer, about 6 months after I left my H. Once September rolled around, I quit the dating scene, and MIGHT get back into it again this summer.

Again, in my case, my D isn't yet finalized. According to canadian law (I'm in Ontario), I needed to wait until one full year of legal separation before the D could become final. That happened on November 24, 2003. But I'm still M to the the s.o.b. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I desperately want the M to be over, however, there have been some legal setbacks, and finalizing it is getting dragged further and further. Even when the judge says officially that it's okay to finalize it, it won't be final until the 31st day AFTER he/she says it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> The legal system here is REALLY SLOW. UGH!

Anyways... that was my attempt to point out why I feel it's okay to date while still married, IN MY SITUATION.

For you Justin, I too believe that it is too early. I can totally understand how you are feeling lonely, and longing for companionship. But there are tons of other ways to get that without officially being on the "dating scene". Myself, I joined a local book club (through Oprah.com actually... but we all live in the same town), I joined a new church (and hope to get out to more events now that the nicer weather is here, and the boys are getting better on the bus), I have been working on my (rented) townhouse by gardening & doing some minor decorating, and I've become more involved in my 4 yr old's school by serving as secretary on school council, and a member of the home and school association (PTA). Quite honestly, I have to work on making time to date this summer... hahaha... b/c I've got so many other things to do with my time now. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

You said so yourself, in this thread, that you aren't the one who wants to get a D, but your W is. Then why would you act as though you do want one? There is almost always hope for reconciliation, and quite frankly, if you were to start dating now, your W would simply feel more justified in her A, and recovery of the M would be next to nil.

Karen
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/16/04 07:55 PM
Here's a humorous story form last night. A coworker is in a small band and they were performing at a local bar, so many of us went to offer him some support.

A lady whose divorce was final about a month ago, recently dumped her boyfriend. They did not get along and he was getting very moody. After telling the story, several of the ladies immediately commented that he was her "Transition Man". They all had a good laugh.

I couldn't help but remember what was written in this thread and had my own good laugh.

<small>[ May 16, 2004, 02:57 PM: Message edited by: JustinExplorer ]</small>
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/16/04 08:07 PM
Topie's story shows why we should be careful about making general statements. She has a long divorce. But I know people who have been in the divorce process for over three years!

How long should a person have to pay for the sins of their spouse?
Posted By: Alone and Happy Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/16/04 09:03 PM
I agree that a person should wait to start dating. It all depends on the issue, reason for divorce etc...But I have another question related to breaking vows by dating.

What about breaking the vows of marriage in the first place by going for a divorce, to have and to hold, in sickness and in health, till death do us part......

I asked my wife to leave because of an apparent mental incapacity that caused her to abuse us both physically and mentally. Should I have stayed no matter what in sickness and in health, until it killed me so I could follow the vows I made to her and get out of a bad marriage by dying?

I really felt like I was dying inside and contemplated ending my life many many times. Going home was inviting sure discomfort.

I am much better since she is gone, I want to be alive now, kids are happier and we just have to figure out how we will live once the D is final. She is trying to take everything we had and turn it into pennies on the dollar. It will only hurt the kids.
Posted By: Alone and Happy Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/16/04 09:05 PM
BTW, 4 months and she is trying to date (find a man). Poor unsuspecting wretch. haha
Posted By: redhat Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/16/04 09:13 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by JustinExplorer:
<strong>How long should a person have to pay for the sins of their spouse? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It is not about the Dv, it is about BS itself. Do they have closure in Dv ?. What are left in Dv'ng process ? (financial ? status ? or all ?). I don't want to drag my new mate into my drama in my life !, she would be my new love and why would I want to drag her into my mess ?. The first few years of R should be full of kodak moments. I don't want to be drag into hers either. I would help her as a friend and no dating.

How many Dv'ng people could compartmentalize their emotions ?

As a Christian is a no no ... as a MBer ... we have been warned but I would not judge people who do it.

You know R is not an addition ... it is a multiplication. It is not .5 + .5 = 1 but 1 X 1 = 1 !. So dating while Dv'ng to me is building R based on 1 X .5 = .5 <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> . Take your time to be a whole person again and/or wait until your next SO to be whole person too ...

-rh-
Posted By: Stone Cold Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/16/04 10:08 PM
Hi I am dating while waiting for my final decree. I think my marraige was over when he said he was done with me. I am a whole person. Always have been. I hope I can find a whole man. Not one ruined by his father. All that hurts is how he is hurting my kids.

It is not a joke. He thinks it is. He never cared about our vows. He has cheated on me I was faithful to him until he said he was done.

I hope to find someone who cares about me not my paycheck. and I will win the kids. His parental alienation is almost over.

I can tell you guys are not taken by his lies anymore either. I can tell by how you don;t respond to him as much now as you did in the beginning. I think in his heart he know also.
Posted By: baba2 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 03:31 AM
Wow, I realize one thing. Hired Help gave me this thought.

The WS "SHOULD" BE DATING EVEN A DAY OR TWO AFTER THEY MOVE OUT IF THE DIVORCE IS IN PROCESS!

BECAUSE THAT WAY, IT WILL PROTECT THE "TRUE BLUE" SPOUSE, THE ONE WHO NEVER HAD THE AFFAIRS, FROM TAKING THE "CHEATING SPOUSE" BACK THEREFORE PROLONGING THE AGONY IN BOTH THIER LIVES!

LET THE "CHEATER SPOUSE" FIND A NEW MAN OR WOMAN TO LAY THIER POISON ON. LET THEM FIND THAT NEW FOOL RIGHT AWAY. LET IT DISTRACT THEM FROM THE DIVORCE AND CHILD CUSTODY ISSUES TOO!

IT IS ALL GOOD FOR THE WS TO DATE AND DATE AND DATE SOME MORE AND STAY AWAY FROM THE LOVING FAMILY THEY CAME FROM. THEY DID ENOUGH HARM AND HURT TO THE FAMILY AND THE FAMILY DID ENOUGH HARD TIME HAVING TO LIVE WITH THAT CHEATER SPOUSE.

LET THE PAIN FINALLY END!
Posted By: redhat Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 06:09 PM
2wrong doesn't make it right ...
Posted By: Chris -CA123 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 06:16 PM
I hope I can find a whole man.
Why are you "hoping" you can find a whole man?
Do you "need" one to be a whole peson?

Don't you think that it would be healthier to want a good relathinship with a good person as opposed to hoping you can find/have one?
Posted By: Stone Cold Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 06:24 PM
That is an interesting thought. And in reality would take more time tothink and answer. Basically I want a great relationship with a whole man.

But what god puts in your path is not always what you want! After all I never thought I would ever date again. Now I look forward to it. I have not really dated yet.

I do not feel the desire to be wanted as myself as a bad thing. I am not a bad person.
Posted By: Chris -CA123 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 07:06 PM
I do not feel the desire to be wanted as myself as a bad thing.
I don't think it is either.
However, if you HAVE to have someone to be happy/whole, then there could be problems later.
Posted By: Stone Cold Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 07:21 PM
I am a whole person. I stated that in my first post. I am very active and healthy. I have many friends. But I am ready to move on with my life.

I understand the point you are trying to make and there are many people that may need this time to discover themselves. Or need more time than I did. I greived for my marraige, faced reality, started living for my self and now I am moving forward.

I feel we as humans desire the company of the opposite sex. And lets face it I am not getting any younger. It will be a hard search in this area. I am picky about who I want to spend my time with. As I feel we all should be.
Posted By: redhat Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 08:03 PM
Do not settle ... as a whole person you know what you want and dare to seek it.

Yes, we are created to have company ... God created Adam in HIS image as a company ... oh, well ... Adam needs someone to be with him ... that is Eve. We want a company but we don't need a company.
Posted By: Stone Cold Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 09:07 PM
Back to my orginal post.....I hope I find him!

ha ha ha ......sorry. Life is funny sometimes.
Posted By: baba2 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/17/04 10:19 PM
Redhat, if either Adam and Eve cheat, then the cheater should be banished out of the "garden of marriage", right?
Posted By: MyCatsMom Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/18/04 01:41 AM
...its not like a predetermined time is required...its the time to recover emotionally, andto learn what you did wrong, and to correct the biases and attitudes that led you down the wrong path. whether that means personal change or better mate selection is up to you to determine.

I think this is a KEY statement. Even if one year goes by, you STILL may not be ready if you don't do the work. Even if your spouse made the wrong choice and left the marriage, you still need to heal and recover.

Time alone, doesn't do this.

To me, it's a combination of time and healing that really brings you to the place where you are ready to be the kind of man/woman who has something to offer a new relationship.

I, for one, wouldn't want to get into a relationship with someone who hasn't done the work....and that requires a fair bit of time, imho.

<small>[ May 17, 2004, 08:41 PM: Message edited by: Ms.O ]</small>
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/18/04 02:38 AM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by ThornedRose:
<strong> JustinExplorer,

Why Women Leave Men

"I hurt all the time because I feel alone and abandoned."

"My husband is no longer my friend."

"</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">[/QB][/QUOTE]

While I was not a perfect husband, I certainly did not fail her that badly, or near so. I am NOT the reason for her affair. And I am NOT the reason for her divorcing me.

She wants the OM and is divorcing me so she can have him. I really is that simple.
Posted By: redhat Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/18/04 02:47 AM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by baba2:
<strong> Redhat, if either Adam and Eve cheat, then the cheater should be banished out of the "garden of marriage", right? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">LOL ...

Yes, the BS has that option to banish WS ... but BS have to be righteuos (no sins)to act upon it.

I am not a bible scholar. Look at how many times the choosen nation (Israel) strayed and broke the covenant. Does HE banished them ?, not really, HE forgave and give them chances to repent and ammend HIM.

-rh-
Posted By: deafjeff Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/18/04 01:36 PM
JustinExplorer-
She might have left you for the OM and she may tell you she wants to marry him but odds are it will never happen. Odds are even greater that if she does marry him it won't last, they'll probably cheat on each other.

Do you care what she does anymore?
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/20/04 04:30 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by deafjeff:
<strong> JustinExplorer-
She might have left you for the OM and she may tell you she wants to marry him but odds are it will never happen. Odds are even greater that if she does marry him it won't last, they'll probably cheat on each other.

Do you care what she does anymore? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I care because what she does affects our children. She did not only leave me she left our children. She had lived at home with her mom for years up through college. She was in the same house with her mom and able to gain from her mom's experience.

My daughters will not have that advantage. The one who has moved out does not want to talk to her mom as she is disgusted by her mom's behavior. The one still at home, sees her mom very little because mom moved just far enough away that a quick to to visit mom is not possible.
Posted By: deafjeff Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/20/04 10:17 PM
Oh yeah! The kids! I tend to get so caught up in my own hurt and anger I forget how this crap affects them. Mine are real unhappy with their mother right now. I was defending her at first, she's on her own now. WW showed my oldest a picture of OM after D-Day and told him she had been on "a date" with him. He cried himself to sleep. She said she told them because she didn't know what I would do. I have been on a scorched earth mission as far as exposure but not with the kids. I went to dinner with a lady that has a son the same age as my oldest. He asked me if I had been out with anyone, I told him yes and who and he was excited about it.
Posted By: cinderella Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/20/04 10:37 PM
But if you are legally married, and I don't know that right now, you are legally married. And it is not ethically ok, in my book, to date. Besides, what sort of example does it set for your children if you are still married to their mother and are willing to go out with other women. Their mother's disrespect for the marriage should not give you license to show the same disrespect.

You want them to be upset about her dating but ok with your dating? Do you see the conflict that would develop in their minds? Do you want to set that example? Do you want them to date while married?
Posted By: rubyb Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 04:32 AM
I am dating a wonderful, caring man. His divorce is not final, but will be in two weeks. His wife, who he dated for four years/lived with for four years and then married three years ago cheated on him. They haven't lived together/seen each other in a year.
When I met him, there was an immediate attraction, but I did have a problem with him not being divorced. He got serious really fast and I cared about him/was attracted to him as well, so I got serious fast too I suppose.
We are both very spiritual/connect on many levels/...even have already talked about marriage. Nothing, other than the discussion forums I've seen on this site...well nothing about him at least is telling me that he's not ready for this relationship. I'm 30 and I have never been married. He's 38 and not yet divorced.
We've been seeing each other for five months now. Has he had enough time to heal or should I give him space? I don't want to over-analyze this. But I care about him and I care about myself and I don't want this to come out later that he needed more time.
Posted By: baba2 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 01:19 PM
I still think that the spouse who cheats (and is not remorseful) should be "encouraged" to date.

Because it will "push that cheater out of the marriage faster" therefore no huge delay in helping the family heal from the infidelity and lies.

I know you can sometimes recover after affairs but if the cheater will not change, and divorce is coming anyway, then "push that cheater harder" toward thier goal. And toward YOUR goal of getting them out of your life..

But as for the non-cheating spouse, well this is a hard one. I would say that this would take a lot of deep thought to figure out. Basically NO except in certain rare circumstances.

<small>[ May 21, 2004, 08:20 AM: Message edited by: baba2 ]</small>
Posted By: deafjeff Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 01:31 PM
If that was for me Cinderella, yes we are LEGALLY married. I felt emotionally divorced shortly after D-Day #2. Perhaps me going to dinner with another woman is morally wrong, I'll take my chances on eternal damnation. If I go to hell for that I think my WW will burn brighter for her A seven years ago, starting an EA/PA before moving out, continueing it while married by spending one weeknight every week, every other weekend, 10 days during spring break, etc. with him, destroying our marriage, and tearing our family apart. I didn't mean that I wanted my kids to be happy with me dating and upset with her dating but that is the way are. They know I am willing (sometimes more than others) to start over with their mother and I'm not the bad guy.
Posted By: Chris -CA123 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 03:09 PM
If that was for me Cinderella, yes we are LEGALLY married. I felt emotionally divorced shortly after D-Day #2.
If your wife felt "emotionally divorced" prior to her affair, why is it wrong for her to "date" while married?

I didn't mean that I wanted my kids to be happy with me dating and upset with her dating but that is the way are.
This simply teaches them it's okay to date while married if your unhappy. And this is coming from both parents, so it is more than reinforced.

They know I am willing (sometimes more than others) to start over with their mother and I'm not the bad guy
But neither are you the "good guy" (as far as the dating goes).

<small>[ May 21, 2004, 10:21 AM: Message edited by: Chris -CA123 ]</small>
Posted By: redhat Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 03:52 PM
rubyb,
You know the risk and I can't tell anything since I don't know that man. However I have a link for you to check rebound R

baba2,
I agree w/ you on WS. My exW was very presistent on making her A to be R with OM. It actually helped me to move on quickly. I feel sorry for BS when WS is a cake eater.

How could BS justify their action after pointing finger at WS that breaking M vows then turn around and date ?.

Deafjeff,
Definition of fog per SH ... "to rationalized or justified one's action by unrational reasoning.

Chris,
Are we sure we live in the same state ? ... I love your response but it is like hit me now, east coast guy type <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> .

rh

<small>[ May 21, 2004, 10:54 AM: Message edited by: redhat ]</small>
Posted By: deafjeff Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 06:06 PM
C-CA123 I see a difference between emtionally divorced and going to dinner with someone and emotionally divorced and all but moving in with someone. I take responsibilty for the wrong I committed in going to dinner but in a world of black and white it seems a little grey. Perhaps not the exactly right thing to do but I don't think it compares to destroying a marriage and tearing a family apart. If it helps I will hang my head in shame and promise to never do it again.
Posted By: deafjeff Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 06:10 PM
Redhat- Am I being irrational?
Posted By: Chris -CA123 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 06:22 PM
I take responsibilty for the wrong I committed in going to dinner but in a world of black and white it seems a little grey.
I think it's only as gray as you want it to be.
If it is something which you would not do in a "happy" marriage, it is not something one should do in a crappy marriage.

Perhaps not the exactly right thing to do but I don't think it compares to destroying a marriage and tearing a family apart.
We weren;t compring it with anything. If it's not the right thing to do, then it's not the right thing to do, REGARDLESS of anything else that happens.

If it helps I will hang my head in shame and promise to never do it again.
If that's what you want.
Did you tell the kids it was wrong and you made a mistake? After all, you are trying to raise them to do the right thing, right? Making a mistake & owning up to it is the best way to teach them.

<small>[ May 21, 2004, 01:23 PM: Message edited by: Chris -CA123 ]</small>
Posted By: 2long Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 07:04 PM
redhat:

"2wrong doesn't make it right ..."

No, but 3lefts do!

Also, 2long does make a right, or at least he tries 2.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

-ol' 2long
Posted By: redhat Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 07:20 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by deafjeff:
<strong> Redhat- Am I being irrational? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">yup, at the time you were out w/ checking out this M-lady and justified it that you were emotionally Dv from your W. Now you are good <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> .

2long,
2long doesn't make it right ... it drags everybody in the name of "saving M". 2short doesn't make it right either. Just right is the answer <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> and you have 2 decide ... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> .

-rh-
Posted By: deafjeff Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 09:12 PM
OK Redhat, maybe a little irrational. If by M-lady you mean MARRIED lady- hell no. I would never have gone out with a married woman before this crap started raining down, I damn sure wouldn't now that I know how it feels. I wouldn't even wish this on her OM and he ain't real high on my list of favorite people right now.
Posted By: StopTheSelfPityParty Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/21/04 09:26 PM
Justin--

I know you have had a lot of advice already, but here is one more.

I saw one respoonse that sadi technically you are still married. True. So technically you would haveing an affair.

My wife (soon to be X) had an affair and served me with papers a month ago. The one thing that I know now, that I was unwilling to realize before is that "WE" broke our marriage. I see that now. I want to do whatever it takes to make sure that I am not in the same postion again in my next marriage (if I get married again). Before I am going to go out into the field and "play ball" I want to make sure that I know exactly how to treat and respect my partner. Before I thought I knew how to do it, but I didn't.

So I guess what I am trying to say is that the thought of dating again is kind of exciting and scary at the same time, please wait until you have healed. People do some very stupid things when they are hurting. Please be patient.
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/22/04 04:24 PM
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by cinderella:
<strong> You want them to be upset about her dating but ok with your dating? </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Whoa! Hold on one minute. My wife is not just dating. She has had a 5+ year affair with another man. (EA and PA) She lied to me about it repeatedly. She left me and and broke up our family so she could be with the OM. She filed for divorce so she could marry the OM.

I do have great reservations about dating while married and have decided against it . But I do not believe it is logical to equate a dinner with a woman to my wife's long term affair.
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/22/04 04:34 PM
Stop,
As is often said in this site, we are 50% responsible for the state of our marriage. Given that truth, I accept repsonsiblity for the flaws in our marriage. But, there weren't that many flaws, and nothing that could not have been fixed by us, IF SHE HADN'T HAD THE AFFAIR AND LEFT ME.

An affair is not a proper response to marital problems. As I read in another place: Having an affair because of marital problems is like burning down the house to get rid of the termites.

I have taken many steps to examine my behaviors in our marriage, to understand them, and to improve or elimate the troublesome ones.

I am really getting upset at people (not meaning you Stop) who somehow want to get me to take part of the blame for the affair.

<small>[ May 22, 2004, 11:46 AM: Message edited by: JustinExplorer ]</small>
Posted By: StopTheSelfPityParty Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/22/04 08:26 PM
J--

In no way is the affair your fault. It was her decision not yours.

I as well get frustrated with everyone telling me that it is 50/50. Drives me crazy. It is my opinion that someone can "confide" in a friend without sleeping with them. Apparantly my WS thought otherwise. I just choose to not hear that and choose not to believe it --- yet.

After I posted my response to your question last night, I got a call from a woman that I met while looking for a place to live. She asked if I would like to come over and watch the BBall game. As much as I wanted to, I passed.

I just know that I want to fix my challenges before I embark on any other adventures.

Just be patient. No one else can undertand what YOU are going through. They can just tell you their experiences and then you can choose to do what you want to with that information.

Good luck -- It is going to be a long journey.
Posted By: laura_lee Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/22/04 09:28 PM


<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:33 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>
Posted By: laura_lee Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/22/04 09:59 PM


<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:33 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/23/04 04:54 PM
Marriage is an intersting institution. It is a contrast and a covenant and I think that is why so many people view things differently at times.

First, marriage is a covenant. That is it is a deeply personal commitment between two people. For many religions, the covenant also includes God, so it is between three people.

But, marriage is also a contract. We get a license from the state. The marriage has to be performed by a recogzided person of authority (justice of the peace, clergyperson, ship's captain, etc.) We sign a form and have witnesses sign the form. All very legal like other contracts. But unlike many contracts, it is not enforceable. You can't force your spouse to stay married or stay faithful. One side can violate the contract at will and in many states there are no consequences.

For most of us the most important view of marriage is that of a covenant. We see it as far more than a contract. When the covenant is broken and the perpetrator has shown by WORD AND DEEDS that he/she has no intention of honoring it anymore, well... The marriage is over in the eyes of many people.

The contract may still exist on paper, but the convenant has been broken.

This is all very difficult since our marriage covenant no longer exists, but he marriage contract does.

Thoughts on this??
Posted By: laura_lee Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/24/04 05:14 AM


<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:34 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>
Posted By: laura_lee Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/24/04 05:27 AM


<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>
Posted By: JustinExplorer Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/25/04 09:51 PM
I have decided not to date until the divorce is final later this year.

It's the right thing to do.

Parallel with the divorce, I am also working on my own healing and getting ready for dating. I have taken several classes sponsored by local churches on divorce recovery. And I have also taken classes to brush up on my dancing skills, joined a cultural association and done other things that will make meeting other single people easier.

When the divorce is final, I hope I will be ready on all levels, the Good Lord willing.
Posted By: Chris -CA123 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/25/04 09:59 PM
It's the right thing to do <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
Exactly!
Posted By: laura_lee Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/27/04 10:41 PM


<small>[ August 09, 2004, 08:35 PM: Message edited by: laura_lee ]</small>
Posted By: meremortal Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/28/04 02:41 PM
I am waiting for the my divorce to be final before dating.

And if my WH & the OW had done the same, my WH and I would be back together now.

Also, I would not date a married man, no matter how long he's been separated, who filed for divorce, whatever. If he's married - he's married.

In fact, after the divorce is final, before I would date a divorced man I would want to be sure his ex-W doesn't want him back, that there's no chance of their marriage recovering, ESPECIALLY if they have children. It would have to be a situation where the ex-W left him, and she had already remarried. And even then, I would want to know why their marriage broke up. There's no way I would take his or his family/friends word for anything. I would want to talk to his ex-W and HER family/friends first.

To tell you the truth I'd rather not date or remarry than to end up with another loser. Not that I'm paranoid - just VERY picky AND I am quite happy by myself so I don't exactly need a man to make me happy. It would be nice but not necessary.
Posted By: Chris -CA123 Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/28/04 02:57 PM
And if my WH & the OW had done the same, my WH and I would be back together now
If they had waited, the affair would have never occurred & you would have never separated to get back together.

There's no way I would take his or his family/friends word for anything. I would want to talk to his ex-W and HER family/friends first.
I guess you never plan on dating anyone who has ever been married then.

If I were to ask someone out and they wanted to question my ex (and good luck finding her) and her family before we even went out one time, that would be a date that doesn't happen.

After a few dates and it starts to get "serious" (do people go "steady" anymore? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> ), then I could see asking the more important questions.
Posted By: meremortal Re: Dating while Divorcing??? - 05/30/04 02:52 AM
You're right Chris, I probably won't remarry then LOL,

OK, I guess I would have to know the guy well enough and/or his family/friends well enough that I would have heard the divorce story form several sources. If he had kids I certainly would want to hear what they have to say about their parents' divorce (but not sure how/if it would be appropriate to bring it up - easier if they were grown). And if he still had any contact with his ex-W at all (because of kids) then I would want to meet her and talk to her.
I realize she might just tell me bad, untrue stuff about him...

I guess my best bet is to just not get involved with somebody who had been married in the past. It's difficult for me to picture dating anyone because I really think if there's kids then you should try to save the marriage so I would want to be really sure he can't patch things up with his ex-W someday, somehow. I'm sure I should have left my WH about a decade ago but didn't want to because of this belief. For the last few years we lived together and the first year after separation I was sure I would never date or remarry. (Ironically, WH's insistance that I couldn't was part of reason I began to consider it as an option after divorce.)

Also, if the guy is willing to admit HE made some mistakes in his previous marriage, that the divorce was not all his wife's fault AND that he did try to save the marriage, that would make a difference to me.

I would also be extra cautious about avoiding serial adulterers or guys who haven't yet had their midlife crisis. And oh yeah - Momma's boys are dangerous.

I guess it's a good thing I'm OK with being by myself, huh? LOL

Anyway, I will not be man-hunting - never have - think it's not natural behavior for the females of the species. I believe in letting the man do the chasing. (I do like to do the fixing though... need to let the man take more responsibility and not try to carry the marriage by myself next time.)

<small>[ May 29, 2004, 09:55 PM: Message edited by: meremortal ]</small>
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