Recap: I believe my WH was a serial cheater, although he only admits to ONE ONS. I have never been able to get the truth, although I am positive that I have figured out a few more "flings".

About 12 or so years ago, we were at an outdoor party. Because the party was so big, the hosts held the party in their huge barn. They parked their motor home nearby to provide restroom facilities.

It was chilly, so I was sitting around the bonfire with other people. My WH cme up to me to tell me that there had been an "incident".

WH said that he was helping this female guest up the steps of the motor home because she wasn't steady on her feet, when her crazy, insanely jealous husband came up and tried to start a fight, accusing my WH of inapropriate behavior with his wife.
Yeah, I should have realized that WH was doing damage control.

Anyway, there were other things that happened later that aroused my suspicions. I wa already uncomfortable about this woman, because from the moment I met her, she acted like she wanted to be my best friend. She worked back in the office of a store where I shopped sometimes, but if she found out I was there, she would come out specifically to be all chatty with me. A couple of weeks after the party incident, WH and I were at the local sports bar when she came in. WH invited her to sit down with us, and she said that she and her family had moved to another town. WH told her that we wished her well. He also told her that her H was an A-H***, but if she ever needed any help he and I would both be glad to help her. She just sat there, looking down at the table and nodding her head. It was surreal...felt like I was watching him dump her!

Anyway, a few years ago, I tracked her down and asked her if anything had been going on between her and my WH. She denied it. I asked her about the party, and she said that all that happened was that he had come on a little strong, but that he did not make a pass at her. She said that her husband didn't like how they were dancing together. First, I didn't know he ws dancing with her. When I went to sit by the fire, he was talking to a bunch of guys. Second, this does not match my WH's story.

Anyway, WH continued to deny that he had an affair with her.

This week, I found her on Facebook and saw that she is now divorced. I then found her son, and through his list of friends, I found her ex-H.

I messaged him to ask him the truth about what happened at that party.

HE WON'T TELL ME!!!

He told me that it had been a long time and that sometimes we have to "let things go". Oh...and he told me that his ex-W was an alcoholic and bi--polar, so he was sure that she contributed to the situation. As a friend pointed out to me...he told me 2 things about his ex that were none of my business, but he won't tell me 1 thing about my WH that IS my business!

After a few more messages, he told me that he was sorry that he couldn't help me, but it had been a long time.

My last message to him was that I found it hard to believe that he would not remember an incident where he confronted someone over inappropriate behavior with his then wife.

I know my WH isn't cheating NOW, but I need the truth. I cannot leave him because our finances are in the toilet due to the economy and his not being able to work for 6 months last year. I can't get a job because I have serous health issues and no insurance to pay for needed surgery. I am waiting on a disability hearing.

I'm thinking of going to see the XOW and bluffing her to see if she'll crack.

I can do this without losing my cool. I've done it before. What do y'all think?

It is really hard to snoop the past. You can look at old credit records, but I doubt there will be phone records (or email has been deleted).

The longer you plead with these people (who do not really care about the truth) you are putting yourself at a disadvantage.

If you think he is cheating now I would focus on finding out about NOW. Once you know the current situation the past will come out eventually.

Here's my 2 cents.

What are you going to do with the intel you intend to gather?

IMO, unless you are intending to use the intel as criteria to make a separate/divorce decision, it's a bad idea.

If you plan to remain married no matter what the intel is, then .... what's the point? To torture yourself? To fuel your resentments?

Please, think about this.

Make a clear statement (to yourself) what your GOAL is, before you proceed.
If you cannot say what you will do with the intel ... stop yourself from going into this while in a "seething" mood.

"Seething" is not a way to live.

(((( hugs ))))

No, he's not cheating now. I'd know if he was.

I could never effectively snoop before. He worked in construction, so could be anywhere within 100 miles, and most of his jobs were rural residential construction, so a PI would have stuck out a mile and cost me a fortune, anyway. He has never used credit cards, and at that time, our phones did not have itemized billing. I got the itemized billing as soon as it became available. He doesn't even know how to turn on a computer, so no need to snoop on the computer.

I did catch him up at one woman's business repeatedly, but it was a restaurant, and all he'd be doing would be sitting at a "community table" talking to her and whoever else was sitting there. He refused to stop going there because he "was not going to be hen-pecked". I do think that was a one-sided EA on his part, though. He was constantly trying to get her attention, even if I was with him.

As soon as the cafe woman realized that I saw a problem with them talking, I believe that she stopped it. She got involved with someone else. I later learned that she was apparently crazy about one of my WH's single buddies, but the buddy wasn't interested...he preferred much younger women.

It just sucks that it took me so long to even FIND the OW's BS, and then he has the audacity to keep the truth away from me.

I have decided that I am going to try to bluff the OW into telling me the truth, or at least part of it.

... and then what?

Pep, I am stuck in my marriage until something happens so that I can afford to live on my own. As it is, my WH has total control over ALL our money. He cut me off from access to funds after I tried to leave him over a year ago. I believe it's so that he doesn't have to split "his stuff" with me.

Now that my WH has his own health issues under control, I am going to move from withdrawal into conflict.

I don't NEED to talk to the OW in order to do this, but my WH would be more likely to admit it if he thinks I already have all the truth.

I am just totally sick of living with lies.

Are you willing to divorce/separate? Depending on the intel?

What if you discover H has not been lying? What then? Happiness? Peace? Love Bank deposits?

Lies are crazy-making. No doubt.

Lady, my concern for you, is this.
You find out something "bad" ... for lack of a better term.
You go from "seething" to "seething-stark-raving-foaming-at-the-mouth-code-red-hair-pulling-lunatic".

Then, what?
Is there any way you can go about this without the "seething" element???

And my other concern is this:

What if .... You find out nothing.
So, you decide to investigate more, and more, and more, and more, and more ... you dig, and dig, and dig, and dig ... never satisfied.

Are you happy?
Have you decided when it will be time to stop?
Stop searching?
Stop digging?
Stop your marriage?

I am concerned for you.
Don't make this search your life's work.

XOXO

Pep, the reason I'm seething is because this jerk knows what happened between HIS WIFE and MY HUSBAND, but has apparently decided that I don't need to know it.

I will get over it and get to the point of just being disgusted.

I have long accepted that my WH is a liar. I know that I cannot make him tell me the truth. However, I do know that under certain conditions he is more likely to tell me at least part of the truth. When he knows or even thinks I already know the truth, he lets more truth slip out.

I do not intend to go ballistic on him when/if he finally does tell me the truth. I will calmly thank him for finally answering my questions.

The truth cannot possibly be worse than what I already think happened. So, there will be no 'You find out something "bad" ... for lack of a better term. You go from "seething" to "seething-stark-raving-foaming-at-the-mouth-code-red-hair-pulling-lunatic".'

OK.
You know best.
Don't allow this to effect your health.

(((( hugs ))))

Well, my health is already affected. Arthritis is really bad, and I'm making an appointment with a neurologist for another issue.

I know that this situation isn't good for my health, which is why I've decided that I need to really do something about it.

What are your plans to improve your health?

Hi there Lady,

If I were you I would cut things short and ASSUME HE CHEATED WITH HER. Just assumed he did it. He is a creep and he did cheat. He cheated other times, right? Well it is most likely he cheated in some way even if emotionally with her.

So, if you assume that he did cheat, you no longer have to try and get evidence of it. YOu cannot change or control the fact that he did cheat IN SOME WAY with her. Sounds like he did. Asking her 12 years later just makes you look super desperate and almost emotionally unstable, dont hurt your pride like that by asking people about an incident that happened years ago.


If you go ahead and simply assume he cheated, which I would do and from what I know of him I assume he cheated in some way too....then the fact he probabaly cheated with her even if it was one kiss.....theh that is one more thing you have to live with. You cannot control what he did back then.

But the thing you can control now is your precious health. I would start exercising, eating heatlhy foods, and getting yourself healthy and happy.

No matter how many times that creep husband of yours cheated it cannot effect how good you take care of YOURSELF.

My friend, YOU FOCUS ON YOURSELF NOW, PLEASE! You deserve great treatment, from yourself. Since you seem to want to leave him but cannot, just stay and care for yourself.

IF you truly want to leave him someday, figure out why you want this and start making concrete plans to leave. But first you have to get better healthwise.

Start today to baby and care for your precious self! You are precious, do you realize it?

Thank you, Bubbles. You are so sweet.

I have always assumed that he cheated with her. I don't care what she thinks about me. She is the least of my worries. I'm just going to tell her that I have some informtion about what happened that night, and that she needs to tell me the truth. I will assure her that I mean to do her no harm. Anyway, she was still married when I talked to her before...might have been scared that I would tell her husband. She shouldn't have that worry anymore.

I will have to have enough money to live on before I can leave. IF I can get enough money to live on and leave, the ONLY way I would stay would be if he agreed to a polygraph and MB counseling.


Pep,

I just made an appointment with a neurologist for March 1. This is to deal with half of my left hand going numb, my arm aching, and something going on with my neck. Yesterday, I had a headache that I could only alleviate by bending my head over so that my chin was on my chest. Bending my head over also helps alleviate the aching in my arm. I believe that I may have a lymphoma near the top of my spine. I had one on top of my left shoulder years ago that caused problems with my left arm, so it's possible that I developed another one. Anyway, I'll find out on March 1.

I was diagnosed with lupus about 15 years ago, so I'm pretty sure that is where the arthritis problem is originating.
The arthritis is in my hands, knee, hip and spine. The knee is still running well, due to a cortisone shot directly into the joint about 18 months ago. The hip and spine are giving me great difficult at the moment. It's hard to exercise when you can only bear to stand up for maybe 10 minutes at a time.

I do try to move around as much as possible. It's irritating and frustrating, though, to go put a load of laundry in and have to sit back down, wait a few minutes, and get up to load the dishwasher and then sit back down. I can never get my whole house cleaned at once, the way I used to. I've always been the one to do the painting and wallpapering, so it's frustrating that I can no longer climb a ladder.

I HATE going to Walmart and having to use a motorized cart; but, if I don't, I will be in pain for the next couple of days.

I need replacement surgery, but currently have no insurance, thanks to our financial issues. It will have to wait until I qualify for Medicare.

Right now, I have nearly cut out all gluten to see if that will help my arthritis.

I take my meds religiously. I also think that if I can finally get to the actual truth (or part of it!), that will alleviate the stress I've been living under for all these years.

I hope you are right.
But, open one door and there is usually another door beyond that first one.

Take care.
You are such a blessing.

Oh, and I TOLD him that I was making the appointment, that I want him to go with me (because he doesn't appear to believe that I have any SERIOUS health issues), and that he needs to bring plenty of cash, cuz I'll likely need an MRI.

He said OK! I nearly fainted! LOL!

Thank you, Pep!

Why does she NEED to tell you anything? If you came at me questioning me about an event that happened 12 years ago, I'd tell you to take a hike.

Your NEED to know doesn't mean squat to her.

It didn't back then....and it doesn't now.

Well, maybe she doesn't NEED to tell me the truth, but I would like for her to tell me.

I don't think she'll tell me to take a hike, but if she does..oh, well! I won't be any worse off.

In my humble opinion, the above strategy will not work. First, by saying that you mean to do her no harm, you actually put the thought of you doing her harm in her head. Second, if you truly had "some information", what would you "need" from her? She will know that you are bluffing. Anyone with half a brain would.

IMHO, if you really want this information, your best bet is to do it with kindness, though it may disturb you to do so. The old catching more flies with honey than with vinegar saying applies here.

Just my .02.

pk

Well, when I talked to her before, she would not look me in the eye. I was very nice to her when I talked to her, and I can be nice to her when I talk to her again.

As to not meaning to do her harm, I intend to tell her that I am not there to cause trouble in her life, but that I need the truth and hope she will finally give it to me. I am still working out what the best approach would be. I'm not sure if telling her that my H finally 'fessed up and that I want to hear her side of it to verify his story would work or not.

In the possibility you didn't see Lexxy's post to you, it's worth repeating...

After 12 years I'd tell you to take a hike.