Hi,
I have been with my wife for 24 years married 16 we have 2 son�s and she is 8 years old than me at 47 . My wife returned from a week�s holiday to Turkey and on the 9th of October I found out she had slept with a Turkish barman for three nights while she was there.

I confronted her about the fling and we agreed to work it out, only 1 week later I had cause to check her phone and I was right she was still in contact with him and also in contact with him on facebook and also e-mail at her work.

I asked her to leave the house and she did and went and stayed with her brother for 1 week, I was and still am so hurt and disappointed at what she has done. while she was away I broke into her facebook account and read the messages between her and the Turk, it described how she felt on the first night being just sex and then how she fell in love with him on the 2nd and third time because of the way he touched her and show her more affection and finally expressing that, that is why she had fallen in love with him.

While she was gone I did nothing but text her and tell her I loved her and wanted her home and 1 week later she returned. We tried to talk but I got no real answers from her and it made me feel angry and so we went into fight mode where nothing got resolved at all. She told me that what she had done was wrong and she should not have done it, but she enjoyed it and does not regret her actions. She also went on to tell me that I don�t care for her, I have neglected her and my 2 son�s and I don�t finically support her.

I have a good job and earn good money but over the past 2 years money has really dropped and things are not as comfortable as they once were, I am always out with the boys taking them to there various sports and spend a lot of time with them. Granted my wife and I spend very little time together and have over the past 12 months become more distance than ever. Again in her messages to the Turk she told him of how bad her life had been over the past year. Also in there messages there was talk that he was chatting to another woman that was also in the same resort and at the same time as my wife. My wife was upset that he was expressing undying love to her also and that she could become very jealous and she reminded him that she had already bought her jealously up while she was in Turkey. He gave her a lame answer and just told her if her was to meet somebody my wife would become more private and secret than ever and promised that her would see her again. Which of course she fell for and went on to tell him she loved him and that if he was to meet someone could he let her know so she didn�t want to do anything back home she might later regret.


Well I don�t know if they are still in contact as I only have her word to say that they are not, the trust has gone and I just don�t know if I can believe her. So we have gone 5 weeks since finding out I have moved into another bedroom in the house and we try and make small take but about every 5 days a row erupts and I end up getting no answers from her as to how she feels about me or if she wants to work at the marriage all I get from her is back off and give her space as she does not know what she wants. She also told me that she is no longer in love with me, but she has told a friend that has spoken to me about what has happen that she does love me and can not image life without me but seems unable to express those feeling to me.. I have destroyed the Turk to her and have shown her that he was also a married man, and have found evidence that she was not the only woman that he had had that summer, but she tells me he was a nice man and made her feel happy. My reply was he was a nice act that�s all. He has left her in a worst mess than when she went on holiday which was a present for her birthday and she went with a friend to relax and get away from the pressure of life. I have since, she has been home made extra effort to help around the home and make life as easy as possible for her but have been told by her that I need to give her space and to stop helping around the home. My wife has also rejected one of her son�s and also blames him for the problems in our marriage. Some good signs were it was my brother�s birthday a I posted a message on facebook from me and the boys and did not include my wife. When she got home she bought it up and said to me why would you not include your wife in that message after all that what I am.

I seem to be taking all the blame for her fling and the problems in our marriage and she seems to accept no reasonability for what has happened or her infidelity just anger and blame directed at me.

I am sorry if the text is a bit messed up, it just where I am at the moment messed up and don�t know if I can save my marriage.

Welcome to MB, Wideload.

Are you in the UK? If so, you have chosen an unfortunate day to register to this site, because most people here are Americans and they're with their families and friends celebrating Thanksgiving today!

Have you read any of the articles on this site? You should begin with How do affairs begin? and from there, read every article on infidelity on this site.

The first thing you will learn is that couples should not take holidays or spend other nights apart, because these are open invitations for an affair. you made a basic mistake in trying to do something nice for her buy buying her the holiday without you. Why should any married woman want or need to go on holiday without her husband? he birthday treat should have been a holiday with you, without the kids.

The second thing is to ascertain whether the affair has really ended. If it has, it sounds as if you wife is in withdrawal. You won't be able to make much of an impression on her now by trying to meet her Emotional Needs, but you should try and do so, without annoying her, until withdrawal passes.

Withdrawal should not take more than a few weeks for such a short affair, but your wife seems to have additional reasons for being unhappy with your marriage, and these seem to be at the front of her mind right now. If she will let you talk to her, you could try telling her that you know she was unhappy and that you think that you could both work on the marriage and eliminate the problems that existed before the affair. (You will be trying to sell her the MB programme, once you have read and understood it, but do not mention the term Marriage Builders just yet.)

Do not take the blame for her affair, and do not apologise for pushing her into it, or anything like that. Your wife had other options before she chose to get into bed with a virtual stranger, and the blame for what happened lies entirely with her. But dont try to educate her about what she did wrong or how wrong her thinking was. Don't try to educate her at all; you will push her further away and enrage her if you do.

I suggest that you move back into your bedroom tonight, because you have done nothing wrong that warrants your moving out. You should be trying to get closer to your wife (without pushing her into physical contact, if that is not what she wants). By moving out, you are sending the signal that you are to blame for the affair.

How old are your sons? How old is the son that she is rejecting? Can you explain a bit more about how and why she is doing that?

Do the kids know about the affair? If not you should tell them why you and their mother are estranged. Don't give them non-truths such as "we are having problems" because this does not help them to understand what is wrong. Kids often blame themselves for problems when they know something is wrong, but cannot find out what.

Since you found out that this man was married, you must be able to find out some details about his wife. See what you can discover about her ID because you need to contact her and tell her what her husband gets up to with gullible tourists. She is your best ally against this affair continuing in secret.

You and your wife both need to get full STD tests. You can work out that this man is a sleezeball, and it is highly possible that he has passed on some disease to your wife. Don't listen to any protestations she makes about having had "safe sex". Get tested yourself and do not have sex with her until and unless she is tested too.

You need to find a way to keep spying on your wife's phone and emails so that you can be sure when and if the affair is really over. Do not get caught doing this or you are headed for much heartache if she decides to keep the affair going on the sly, while lying to you that it is over.

Do not let you wife know ANYTHING about this site for now. We need to tell you how to keep snooping and how to expose the affair, and if she reads here, your secrecy wil be blown.

Who else, apart form that friend, knows about the affair? What about members of both your extended families? Good friends and close family should be told, and asked to try and help you bring your wife to her senses.

Okay, that's enough for now! Please try and answer all my questions when you get back.

PS: Are you 47, or is she? And you should edit your name out of your first post, for your own privacy. Use the "Edit" button at the bottom of the post, and while you're at it, please put you post into paragraphs so it looks more like mine, above.

Long posts unbroken by paragraphs are very hard on the eye, and people might not read yours if it takes effort. I had to really stick with it to get to the end!

I have read How do affairs begin and have been reading and watching the videos ever since i found this site about 1 month now.

My wife is 47 and i am 39

I thought the hoilday away would do her good both my boys were at school and she and her firend had the time booked. it was the friend that got the holiday as the birthday present not me.

I can comfirm that a physical affair has ended as the are 3500 miles apart,but i can not be so sure about e-mail and text contact.

i am trying to meet her emotional needs but annoying her is just so easy i only seem to have the breath. tlaking just doesn't seem to be an option at the moment she is so withdrawn into herself almost looks depressed. i have asked to seek pro help but she is unwilling to do so and states she want to work things out in her head and not talk to others about it all.

It's not me that does not want to be next to her, i moved out out of anger from the bedroom but it has now become another hurdle to over come to get back into the same bed as her, she just seems to be pushing me away at every oppotunity.

Close friends know of the affair and all parents from both sides, also both our son's know but all are keeping well out of it saying i need to show her what a nice bloke i am and give her the space she wants.

ok my boys are 14 and 15 only 14 months between them my earldest is the son's she is rejecting, he has been a handfull for many years and we have done everything we can to help him but he just seems hell bent in being a rude boy street kid. i have got him into sport and he play's rugby to county level, but he is just so rude and a bullie to his younger brother and tries with us also. the has been physical confrontaion with him and i have had to hold him down to stop his anger and from lashing out. he is also very angry about what has happened with my wife for doing what she has and me for not tuffing her out on her ear.

My wife is such a loving woman and this is all so out of character for her to now be acting in the way she is and to of had the affair. the friend that she went with is single and goes to Turkey in seach of love and i have found out that she also wanted to be with the Turk, and the first night that my wife and he slept together was after a row with her firend who went to bed and lock my wife out of the room when my wife returned to the bar it just moved on from there, although she has stated that she was not drunk and knew what she was doing so clearly wanted it to happen, this information came from another friend who she has spoken to about the affair. We have not had any sex since she has been home so i have no fear of STD's and i have asked her to go have have herself check but protests and states they used condoms, i questioned this as i know my wife does not like such things whislt having sex. We have not had sex for about 12 months and it is something my wife has bought on us and i thought she was going through the change due to her age and never pushed as i thought she would in time reutrn to wanting sex, well she did just not with me.

There is only so much digging one can do and most of what i found out was from the internet and facebook throught her account while they were still friends i know that they are no longer friends on facebook, but i also know that another friend has joined that has the Turk as a friend so there must be contact.

My fear is she is lost to me, although i seem clear in my mind i dont want to lose her, but i also think i am coming across so desperate.

i have not told her of this site and will not as i hope to get the help i need to get through this.

thankyou

Wide, I am just off to bed now, and as I said, today is Thanksgiving for the vast majority on this site. Don't despair if you get no more responses until well into Friday afternoon (UK time). Try to answer the rest of the questions I asked and be assured that your post wil be answered tomorrow.

Wide, did you start dating when you were 15 and she was 23?

Yes that is right i did

Don't even think about getting intimate with her until she has been checked for STD's. It really sounds like she has put herself at possibly serious health risk with this guy who is also married. If the roles had been reversed do you think she would have been as accepting as you have been?

But that's not really the point, is it, Bryanp? How is answering that hypothetical question giving Wideload MB help? If your point is that a woman would not have "been as accepting" of her H's affair as this man is being, well, how many BWs have passed through MB in your time here, seeking help after their H's affairs? I, for one, and trying to rebuild my marriage after my H's 3.5-year affair, and I am far from being the only BW here, willing to try and overcome the damage done by an affair.

Nobody is "accepting" of their WS's affair. If they were accepting, they would let the affair continue and they would not be here seeking help to end it and rebuild the marriage.

The Marriage Builders forum exists to help those who wish to try recovery from an affair. Why do you come here and make your first post to a BH into a post that suggests he shouldn't use the MB programme?

Thankyou SugarCane for your earlier reply.

i must agree that the advise given by Bryanp is not helpful to me he does have a point, and i guess the answer would be she wouldn't be understanding if the boot was on th other foot.

I am not understanding of the 3 nights with the Turk but after reading this site i have to get past that if i want to stay with her.

The problem we are having is not weather i want to stay with her it's more her wanting to stay with me. i dont think i can ever forgive what she has done but in time can forget i hope. The biggest problem at the moment is getting to a point where some sort of normal life takes place and for me stop living in fear that she is not coming home. Her words were she has not go a pot to pee in and this is her home and therefore is she at home out of necessity.

Just for the record i have not had an affair in all the time we have been together.

So, you were 15 and WW was 23 when you got together and you married when you were 23 and she was 31. Were you two romantically involved when you were 15?

That is just a little nugget it would be nice to know to get a picture of it all for consideration of further advice.


As an aside....I am sorry you are going through this.
It is ironic though that you post on the U.S. holiday of Thanksgiving which we call Turkey Day for short and your thread is called Turkey Love. I didn't open the thread for a while thinking it was about Thanksgiving. Of all the places on the planet, Turkey, for your wife to go and cheat.....

Yes i met my wife when i was 15 she was 23, we did become romantically involved, i have always looked older than i am we were both happy and i told her my age and and we did not have any intercourse until i was 16 which is the legal age in the uk which was three months of dating. She is my best friend and we have always talked about everything until about 12 months ago which is about the time she started to go through the change. She is my everything, i love her dearly and honestly thought we would grow old and grey together.(we still may)

I have addressed the EN's and the lack of support around the home. i posted here last night as i was feeling really low, she has went away yesterday for a long weekend at her parents to do some soul seaching and to inform her M+D what is going on as they are coming to us for Xmas.

I dont see the problem with the age thing either then or now, iam 39 and have never regret who i chose to be with. although i am a little confused at the present time and can not understand my feeling, it is like someone has ripped my heart out torn it up into little pices and thrown them away. All i know is i love her and really want to work it out with her.

Yes that does seem a little strange to post here with that tittle. lol Turkey seem to be a popular holiday resort for signle women in England and i am sure i am not the only man to suffer this at the hands of a turkish man

Good on the clarifications. It'll help people move on to their advice as the thread moves along.
Mostly, that a woman would be attracted to a young teen, mature looking or not, legal age in a country or not, is a little concerning, primarily about her way of making life choices. Since it was legal in your country, people will hopefully move on with actual input to put to use for the current state of the relationship.

Since you have been reading and studying up on this site, and are in plan A and hoping the contact is over........have you considered writing the radio show for free advice or using the paid coaching services via the phone?

15 and 23 is a very worrying age range from any parents' point of view, given their job of protecting their child. I would not allow my 15 year-old son (7 months right now to his 16th birthday) to date ANYBODY, and if I knew that a 23 year-old woman were interested in him I would be speaking to her, speaking to her parents...doing all I could to bar romantic contact between that ADULT and a CHILD. That sort of interest in a CHILD from a 23 year-old woman is not right.

Even though you waited 3 months until you were 16 and thus of legal age in the UK to have intercourse, this was still a disturbing relationship and I wonder what your parents were doing to look after you properly.

I am in the UK and agree the age thing is a little concerning, a woman who I imagine would have had a job and an adult life, should never have been romantically interested in someone of school age. It sounds like she might be a little immature or unsure of herself. If she is competing with her friend/another tourist over a barman's attention, I would brace myself for a rough ride with this one.

However there is a family's happiness at stake here, and the point is you did both marry as adults. There have been some miraculous results on here. I would proceed with Plan A for a bit...

if only to know later on you did everything you could. Like all betrayed spouses you want to have no regrets, I am sure.

Wideload, please do not take my comments as indicating that your marriage is undeserving of help. As indiegirl points out, it is a legal marriage, and also, you have been married a long time and have children, whose needs must be considered. You will get help here with fighting the affair and rebuilding the marriage, if that is what you want.

It is so tempting to do armchair psychoanalysis....your boys are the age you were when you starting seeing your WW. I am not a therapist though and Dr. H says dissecting the past is not useful in moving forward.
So.
I will tell you what I would tell any other BH.....simply move yourself back into the master bedroom. Don't push on intimacy with WW but sleep in that bed each night. Don't ask her permission. Don't have fights there. Don't argue about it when she fusses about why you are doing it.
Move back into the room and claim it for the marriage. Play no games about distance.
Plan A.

Am I being criticised in your post, reading? Is your reference to "armchair psychoanalysis" aimed at me?

I know Dr H says "not to dissect the past" but I understand him to mean navel-gazing about unhappiness in one's childhood. He is clear that we cannot solve the problems of our childhoods.

However, understanding the origins of a marriage are sometimes relevant to our advice. An affair marriage, for example, or a marriage that began with living together, or marriage to a serial cheater (whether that was known about or not) is a legitimate focus of our advice.

Wideload needs help with his marriage, as I have said. I thought I had made my views known and drawn a line under them, but you are choosing to bring them up again, so I feel I must defend my comment.

Heck no SugarCane, I am talking about me.

I appreciate the clarification. Thank you!

i dont see how my age and my wife's age when we started has anything to do with what is happening now. i am an adult man and have thought about the age between us many times and how it could of been thought of as incorrect and parents at the time tried to stop the realationship. i loved her then as i do now it seems funny that the man she slept with was the same age as myself.

I am a little over weight at the moment which i am also working on to make myself more attractive to her as her lover was a fit man.

I believe the age range for you two has nothing to do with this happening. Fact is your WW has poor boundaries around men. She chose to commit adultery, and right now you are chosing to save your marriage.

How you do that?

1) Start with Plan A - make yourself the best husband on the planet. If you need to lose weight, then do it. Also you need to EXPOSE her affair to your family, her family, your children, OM's wife if he has one, and anyone else that will hold your WW accountable.

2) Find out what her most important emotional needs are and meet them. Start with intimate conversation, affection, and family commitment if you don't know.

Avoid all Lovebusters and anything that will drain her love.

Ok so I tired to re-enter the main bedroom with my wife who then moved to the bedroom I had came from.

She also just spent 5 days at her parents, when I asked if told M+D what was going on she told she had not told her dad and mum did not want to here about it. So I have them coming to my house for.Xmas.

My wife seems even more distanced from me now than before, I am following the MB advice but she doen't seem to be coming around, but we have had a few LB's over the past few weeks. I am doing my best to avoid them now but you know when she looks at you the love is gone. So what to do ????

That's alright. You've reclaimed your rightful spot, as you should.

You need to call them and tell them what's going on, and ask for their support to help you end your WW's A. I would also get on the stick and track down OM's wife to inform her, as well.

Did this louse work for the hotel where she stayed? Call there and get the name of the Manager as well as any other names of any importance (Human Resources, etc.) You may be able to find the info you need by googling the hotel on the internet. If it was a bar, track down contact info for the owner of the bar and let him know that his employees are compromising their employer's reputation by banging the customers. Your goal is for something to be said to POSOM that might dissuade him from wanting further contact with your WW.

I could be wrong, but he sounds to me like some creep who preys on women travelling alone and not like someone who is truly interested in your WW for anything more than a diversion for a few nights. She was handy. I would shake up his little world by letting as many people as possible on his side know about the affair.

Ok i am back and have messed up some what. i check my wife's hand bag and found a pic and love letter from her turkish lover. i comfronted her aabout it and she said "it was a note which he gave her before she left Turkey and that she had forgot it was there".

Today her mobile had not left her side again aand i took it from her which in turn cause a love buster between us. Upshot is she states she left me years ago and that she now wants to move out and be by herslef she has now taken her wedding ring off and refuses to waer it. She has not left yet but i fear she will, she is claiming that i have not cared for her for the last ten years, which i have tried to argue but to no avail. She is so angery at me and states that all i am doing ie house work and being with her is suffocating her as she just wants to be alone.

i am at a loss as to what to do, do i leave her alone and hope she stays or just let her go.

wideload, I have read this 3 times and am not sure what the lovebuster was? What do you think you did that was a lovebuster?

Did you expose the affair to her parents, your children and everyone else like MaritalBliss advised?


This is all fogbabble that means nothing. You need to stop listening to the rantings of a falling down drunk and start focusing on saving your marriage.

Your job is to bust up this affair by exposing it. Stop worrying about making her mad and get to work. The goal here is to save your marriage, NOT to avoid her anger at all cost.

Go read the link about exposure in my signature and get to work on exposing her affair.

In the meantime, you need to sit her down and DEMAND that she end her affair. If she won't end her affair, then she needs to be told this will lead to divorce and will need to move out.

"Honey, I love you and our marriage but I cannot and will not allow a third party in it. I'm sorry if you feel you must go, but I won't stand in your way."

If you haven't done so already, you'll want to tie up your marital money so she can't clean out the accounts. Take everything but a pittance out of your checking and savings accounts and put them in another bank in accounts under your name alone. Take the credit cards. Take any checks that you have for equity lines.

The idea is to keep the marital money away from her so it doesn't fund her affair. Helping her get an apartment is a no-no, as well. She'll have to do that on her own.

Unless she's a pack rat who carries a carpet bag for a purse, she didn't forget those things were in her purse.

Did you remind her that you've not noticed her absence over all those years?

Ok I have exposed it already. I may of miss judge her on the keeping contact,but I can not be sure. The pic and letter of.course she knew they were there.

The money she can not get at and she is unable to support herself. She also.claims I have taken her independence away from her.

I said to her she had not bought up she left me years ago, I have only noticed a real change in her in the past 10/12 months.

Thankyou for your replies.

To WHOM? And what were they told?

Close family, be close and friends. The family have all said there staying out of it. Great help they were.

Your children? Her parents? Have your children discussed their disappointment with her?

Does she know that all your family members know about her affair? This is the STRANGEST exposure I have ever seen!! She is not ANGRY that you exposed it?

What have you done on OM's side? I posted some suggestions to you - did you follow through with any of them?

WL, I think the legs on this affair are weak. I suspect that any conflict you can cause on OM's side will go a long way toward putting the dagger through its heart. I still believe OM is an opportunistic pig who saw a woman alone and figured on an easy score. And he got it. He's still dealing with her because it's so easy to, with FB, emails and cell phones.

Make it uncomfortable for him to do this!

I have told all and my 2 boys 14 + 15, all parties know she slept with the Turk and for how long.

No she seems so angry at me, unable in my mind to explain her reasons. she claims I left her years ago, and I have told her thats what she is telling herself and that I have never left her.

I have told her I love her and I want to work this out and when I said I do I ment it all. I just seem unable to get through. I also told if she stops being angry and just let me back in a little she will find all will grow.

Does she know everyone knows? What was her response?

I"m not trying to suggest that anything you did in the past excuses her affair; nothing does.

But why does she say this? Did you have an affair, by any chance?

I apologise if I'm off here.

No never have had an affair or be unfaithful.

Thanks, and I apologise again.

Marital bliss is right - make his job situation a little hot and he will drop her like shes on fire.

Stop the talking and reasoning with your ww. It wont work - she's wayward. By all means tell her what she can expect if she does not end the affair (divorce). Be affectionate and funny and nice and show her what she will lose. But you have to do it to her, not with her - she wont participate until the affair is dead.

She is addicted until the affair is dead.

1) You have already exposed on her side. It doesnt matter that her family are weak supports either. She didnt want them to know and now they do. This causes her shame and makes the affair lose its romantic tint.

2) Expose on his side.
a)If you can find his family on FB, should be good. Turkey is a muslim country and his family may look very dimly on his interfering in marriages. Of course they may not but he prob doesnt want the embarrassment.
b) Making a fuss through the hotel, travel reps etc should be quite easy. He sees your wife as easy meat and any bother with his job will cause him to drop her.

3) Once exposure starts to work at ending the affair your WW will be hugely angry at you for ending her fun. This means its working. All waywards are angry at exposure when it is effective, Ride out her anger, show her you are James Bond - cool and casual. Meet her needs and Plan A like a rockstar

4) Insist she get on board with the MB plan for recovery. She will be sulky and unwilling - but with her affair dead she has nowhere else to go. No one else to meet her needs except the James Bond - firm but fair character she now sees before her. Say if she wants to stick around, you insist that you both build a better marriage. If she doenst agree, you need to prepare for Plan B.

Carrot and stick. You can do this, mate. The OM is a loser, a coward who is easy to run off. A nasty email/call directly to him would prob do it. It would also show your wife you will stand up to any sleazy intruders upon her honour.

Get to it!

Hi just a small update. I have been calling the OM and texting giving him hell, I emailed the hotel which was a waste of time. WW has been so nice this week, so far, even made plans for what we may do over Xmas. The problem I have I feel like I did on the day I found out about the OM but only worst. I have fighting thoughts in my mind to ask WW to leave but my heart tells me to keep at it after the pic and love note I feel so let down.

Thanks

When's the last time your WW was in contact with OM?

Don't be concerned about whether exposure is a waste of time. If he's an employee at that hotel, there may be repercussions you don't know about. Any conflict you can cause by exposure is good conflict.

Is OM responding to any of your calls or texts?

Oh absolutely. The hotel management wil prob be alarmed at hearing theyve hired a sex pest but (like a lot of companies on here who have had exposure) they will play it down, act like its no big deal, in case you/your wife pursues them for sexual harrassment.

They want you to give up and go away so they have put up a strong silent front. But they may still have hauled him in for a b)ll0cking - or even fired him. I bet waiters arent so hard to come by in Turkey. If you think there is more you can do to stir things up, then by all means follow up the email with a phone call and make sure you annoy somebody senior.

If you tick them off enough, they'll tell the waiter off just so they dont have to put up with another phone call like that again (Do tell the manager hes seducing a number of married women and that this prob wont be his only complaint from an aggrieved husband).




You're on the rollercoaster of emotions - as we have all been before you. One day you're all about repairing the love, the next its all vengeance. Feelings change daily.

Remember the MB plans are mainly for you. They are aimed at giving you OPTIONS. Follow the plans logically and thoroughly. I promise you that when you are in a position to choose what you want to do, you will be in the strongest position possible to do that. Whether it be divorce or recovery.

Most BSs on here says it takes up to six months to feel like they are in any position to make permanent decisions. So just work the plans in the meantime - they are for you and for your healing, if not for the marriage. God bless.

I think she is still in contact with him, through her work e-mail but the friend I had at her work is no longer taking any risks to check up on her for me. Can't blame her really.


Since Sunday she has been all sweetness and light , not sure what to make of it or am l just looking for demons that are not there. Hell my head is a mess. WW was even talking about our holiday that we have book for next year.

Thanks for your continued support.

ok just thought i would pop back and give you all an update.

After i confornted my wife about the picture and love note from the OM things have got a little better. As you all know Xmas is upon us and we have her Mum and Dad coming to stay with us over Xmas. I can not work out if it is an act so she can get Xmas out of the way.

We have been going out and talking not about the fling but life and home she talks about the future and also she is texting me alot also giving me details about what she is doing.

She has now also changed the passed words on her FB and gmail i can not longer check, i still get the odd look at her phone which is no longer stuck to her side.

My fears about Xmas is making me not respond to her, i have been out and bought loads of presents and a nice card but can not seem to wrap the presents or write the card for her, done everyones else's but keep putting her's back in the draw.

i konw we are only 2 1/2 months since i found out and things seem to be moving in the right direction.

She still can not tell me how she feels about me although you get the odd kiss in a text message.

Can she be happy to allow touching ie hair play, cuddles back rubs and only be acting.

I am still in another room and can't seem to find my way back to the master bedroom, i want her to show me she wants me.

i have become a domestic god, and have done more ironing and washing in the past 2 months thn i have in 20years, i seem to be meeting her EN's but more time i guess is the answer.



She still has me all messed up and don't know what to make of it all.

WL, I would install a keylogger on her computer so you can see what she is doing. A good one is eblaster at spectorpro.com. It will email you hourly reports. You can get her passwords this way. The fact that she changed her passwords indicates she is not serious. I would slap the keylogger on there and then ask her for all of her passwords. Becoming transparent is a basic part of extraordinary precautions.


Why are you doing housework? I would suggest you focus on more important emotional needs such as the INTIMATE emotional needs, conversation, affection, sexual fulfillment and rec companionship. Doing housework is not going to make many lovebank deposits for you.

Wideload, Why do you keep walking on eggshells? The wayward does not drive the recovery bus, YOU do. How can someone drunk on the high of an affair show you the way home? The goal is not to keep her sweet, it is to TAKE CHARGE. (Hint � women like that)

Appeasement and ironing do not work.

Your wife has cast you in the role of the helpful gay housemate. You are not meeting any of her intimate needs. Someone else is doing that on FB or gmail. She probably tells him (and indeed, herself) they are not doing anything wrong because �he sleeps in the spare room� �we both know the marriage is over� �we�re just friends now� �it�s just for the kids� and the classic � �I love him but I�m not in love with him�

Stop putting up with this. Move your gear back into YOUR bedroom. Tell her this is where you will be tonight if she wants to join you. Tell her you can�t stay away because you miss her and this is your rightful place. Tell her that married people sleep in the same room. DO NOT RESPOND TO ANYTHING SHE SAYS If she rants and raves � listen intently with a caring look on your face (think about football or something while you do, as I guarantee it will be all fogbabble), then carry on unpacking your stuff into drawers. Be as deaf as the proverbial post. If she threatens to sleep elsewhere tell her she will be welcomed back with open arms WHEN (not if) she changes her mind.

Keep to a set script. DO NOT give her the �we�re just friends and sleep in different rooms� fantasy. Do not enable. Fight the fog babble.

Wideload, you've got me riddled with questions.

Has this been exposed to her parents? To everyone? Why isn't there a keylogger on that machine? Why no spyware on her phone?

Why are you doing so much housework? Is this something the two of you agreed to?

And why the heck can't you find your way back to the master bedroom??? It's right there, down the hall where it's always been!

While you should not be aggressive, Wideload, neither should you be a wimp. Why are you sleeping in another room?

My H had an affair, and I can't IMAGINE how he would have got me to move out of MY BEDROOM because of his affair.

Can't you see how ridiculous it is for you to have moved out?

Wideload, you need to man up here, my friend. Take off the apron and get back in room. Your wife needs a man, not a girlfriend.

Hi Guys

I moved back into the bedroom just before xmas, there was no fuss. I stayed laying awake for about 2 hours with mixed emotions until I finally got up and when downstairs not being able to sleep. My WW followed me down about an hour later and asked why I was downstairs, when I told her that I was still upset by the whole affair and that she could not tell me her feeling towards me, she said I must love you because I could not sleep and I had to come and she had to come and find me. In the back of my mind the only reason she came.to find me was that her parents were coming to is for Xmas.

So I collected her parents and bought them to our house. We had a really good Xmas fun, laughter and dancing. I felt close to my wife again, and her mother commented how happy we looked. For a few days it felt great.

After her parents returned home I took my wife for a drink to the local pub, and she dressed up looking fantastic, we had a good time and returned home and I made a pass at her which was totally rebuffed, I went to kiss her and she turned her face away so that no contact could be made and made it very clear she did not want me in that way. I told her that I such a fool now for making pass at her, and she tried to reasure me that I wasn't and she just does want me in that way.

So I am so confused we now we have cuddle while watching tv together, hair play some touching but I am unable to get her to interact with SF and I have noticed that she will not undressed in front of me either, she also does not like any contact in bed, ie the cuddles she happy with while watching tv.

I text her at work yesterday and she replied she was on facebook and I pointed out that it was her other life and asked.if I had anything to worry about. I got no reply. I text her again to prompt a reply. What I got back was "what has brought this on again" So I asked her again and pointed out she had avoided my question. The reply I got was "No I am not in contact with *edit* " she again asked me why I asked. I told I was scared of losing my wife and asked.to to tell me how she feels about me and to be honest with her feelings. She failed to reply.

I tried to continue it with her when we were both home from work but all she did was to say nothing, she has the inability to tell me how she feels.

So I tried to explain to her that all she is doing is to continue to reject me and it make me feel resentful , I asked for her passwords which she refuse to give me. She also has stopped using the computer at home and only goes on FB and gmail via work.

I am somewhere and no where really, she talks about future events and even our wedding anniversary which is in weeks we are arranging to go away for a long weekend without our two boys.

wideload,
If your wife refuses to give you her passwords she is having an affair.
I went through the same garbage from my wife.
Have you read Surviving an Affair?
You need to protect YOURSELF from her.
I'm a novice to the MB program but it seems that you need to start preparing for Plan B.

Tell your WW that those that have nothing to hide, hide nothing.

Time to expose WW behavior to her parents and siblings. Include the remark that she is breaking NC, refuses to share passwords so you can verify NC. That WW said trust me before and we all know what happened then. That she must be in an affair she will not let you touch her.

She is still in the fog and asking for space, because she is still fantasizing about the affair. Domestic god? More like domestic goddess. She is acting this way, because she is still in control. What she needed is to be able to envision life without you. But instead you pamper her, clean, cook and wash. So she does some scummy turk barman, and you become a domestic goddess. Let me enlighten you. Your wife continues in the fog because you have basically rewarded her for cheating. You need to realize that this happened because she lost respect for you. You have not demanded it, so she remains in control. Your wife has continued to lie to you about the turk and contacting him. She isn't loving you, because she doesn't respect you. You can have respect without love. Like a policeman. But you cannot have love without respect. Tell you what maybe if you are real lucky your wife will let you exfoliate her tootsies tonight, before she blame shifts more. THE FACT IS YOUR WIFE IS NOT CONTRITE ABOUT HER CHEATING. You want her back. Take back your testicles, calmly tell her that she doesn't deserve you, that you are not going to put your life on hold, while she fantasizes about some POSOM. Tell her you are contacting a lawyer, separating finances, canceling credit cards. YOUR WIFE ACTS THE WAY SHE DOES BECAUSE YOU HAVE BEEN ENABLING HER AND HER ENTITLED ATTITUDE. The more you chase her, follow her around, tell her you love her, the less she respects you. A woman needs to respect her man. Sorry.

You do need to man up here, Wideload.

You aren�t going to �nice� your wife back into love with you. She wants you as a buddy and to have nasty cybersex with the Turkish loser on the side.

That is the set up you are supporting.

Read the Carrot and Stick of Plan A thread -

I think you need some coaching on your Plan A because Plan A is not Plan doormat. You are doing the carrot part right by meeting her need for affection etc, but you aren�t doing any �stick�

The Stick of Plan A involves the following

Exposure to everyone concerned � her parents should have known �you should never have allowed the fake family Christmas � expose to them and anyone else whose opinion your WW cares about without delay. She should have no support or group where it is possible for her to lie to gain support for her poor choices so thats her friends your mutual friends etc.

Shake up the OMs world � Heard nothing about exposure here. Have you made trouble for him in his job/family? Your WW needs to see you fight for her. She won�t like you not being buddyboy any more but she needs to see a husband not a lacklustre friend who is not fighting for her out of love.

Tell your wife her continued secrecy WILL lead to a divorce and you will not be her friend afterwards. Met her needs for now, but let her know it is a limited edition deal and her time will run out. Insist she gives you all passwords and accounts for her time.

Tell your wife her failure to meet your needs and failure to commit to the marriage will see you divorced � bust up her fantasy of a �happy divorce� too where you stay friends and you aren�t a bit hurt

NC letter? I forget if you did this � again, make it ultra clear that failure to comply will lead to divorce.

I would be making serious preparations for Plan B because she is not serious.

Men have to do a much better Plan A than women. Be unshakeable. Be James Bond. Act as if you are the best thing she could ever imagine and it is only a matter of time before she comes around.Tel her the consequences for not agreeing but also add that you are sure she will do the right thing Be confident.

You have to appear strong, even though you do not feel that way.

Dark days are upon me I feel lost with what is going on we are three months in and although I have listen to the advice given here there appears to be no change to my WW emotions towards me or am I just getting it wrong.

We have arranged our weekend away for our wedding anniversary which is two week she seems happy that we are going, we had a LB the other night and I said things that really I should have kept to myself with the way I am feeling, and she enquired if I was going to cancel our weekend away. Which of course I said no I would not as I thought it was what we needed to get away for a couple of days.

I asked her if here feeling where changing towards me and this is the reply I got,

"As I have said before my feeling gradually went over ten years. I can not suddenly turn them back on and can't guarantee they will ever be back and the way that I am behaving is not make me feel very positive"

So I have thought about the way I have been behaving and I don�t see what I am doing wrong other than showing love and helping around the house all the things you would expect a husband to be doing. I think because I have asked about her feeling and I also asked her to be honest with them. I also bought up the way she speaks to me never with any manners always like an order and no please or thank you for anything.

Again she replied with negative vibes, "I think we are reaching the end the way things stand"

I thought three months in and I would start to see a change she does seem really depressed of late and unwilling to do anything, and seem to complain about anything and everything.

I am 99% sure there is no longer any contact.

Anybody please give me a life line as I am loosing the will to carry on with her at things are.

Wideload

You were told to ACT to kill the affair. Not sit around listening to her drunken ramblings.

Your entire post consists of �she said..she replied� when it doesn�t matter WHAT she says � you shouldn�t be listening to her!

Waywards are addicts and only talk nonsense. You would get more done listening to the local town drunk. If you sit around talking, feeling, sharing and hoping, with your drunken �dont have a clue� wife things will just continue to get worse and worse.

You were supposed to do the following:

Exposure to her family her friends and your family and friends
Exposure to OM family/friends/job
Insist radical honesty and transparency from your wife
NC letter


Is it done?

Earlier you were talking about your overweight problem:

How much do you weigh and is your weight a lovebuster?

Being overweight is not a lovebuster

Plus this is a distraction from the job at hand. He needs to expose and kill the a, he can't meet any needs until these jobs are done.

Of course he should say he is willing to meet her need for PA should she bring it up but he can focus on needs meeting when there is a marriage to save.

Hello Wideload.

I have experienced somewhat similar situation like you and therefore I think maybe I can help.
It means that the affair is still ongoing or there is a new affair.
Based on you described above and based on what I have experienced personally I will assure you - there is contact.

How can you be sure? What kind of independent information does back you up?
MB is a life line. Plan A and Plan B - have you read about them here?

The main problem is that your WW has succeeded to convince you that her affair and the current state of marriage is somehow your fault. She doesn't have to change herself at all.

But this approach does not solve any of your problems or increase her love towards you as you are witnessing.

The withdrawal from that kind of short affair (without contact of course) cannot last months. The affair is still out there. Kill it. Show you are not tolerating this kind of nonsense your WW is giving you. Execute MB plans and you have greatest possible chance to get back the respect and the marriage.

Excuse me, which of theses suggestions did you try? None, as far as I can see. Since you failed at every turn with her, how about trying my suggestions now? Go see a lawyer, separate bank accounts. Cancel the trip. File for divorce. Look you have tried everything else. You might as well try my advice. Maybe if you take charge and do this, it may clear the fog. What's the worse case?