My husband has hit me our entire marriage. (14 years) Not beat me, but would hit me in the arms/legs or kick me. He was a spoiled child. He continued to act spoiled after marriage. I stayed with him b/c I kept having hope he would grow up eventually. He also had sexual addictions during our marriage (hidden). He promises to never hit me again, says he has truly missed his family, that he wants to make it work, that he loves me and finds me attractive. I keep telling him I am very damaged and that he has killed my love. Although I would love to be a family unit for my children. We are in the same home again but not resumed sexual relations b/c I am not attracted to him. This bothers him as well. He seems to would just like for me to pretend nothing bad ever happened and make love... Advice please.
I am not experienced in this area, and yes it could only be called abuse. Just putting me .02 in, and waiting for someone with exp in how to build love, with a man who seems to take everthing from someone, and not give the least.
You are right that you are damaged, and it is a good sign for you that you are not attracted to him, and having sex with him under that circumstance that you are afraid, would be more like rape. Rape victims can tell you that its violence.
I know you probably want to maintain this for your children, but it will wear you down over time, if you don't seek treatment for this abuse. If H wants to be part of the healing, there must be help out here for him. If you don't do something about it, you are setting your children up for the same treatment. Children know more than people give them credit for.
Hoping someone comes on that has some real practical help here. My heart and prayers go out to you. I don't have sympathy towards a man who physically abuses or threatens a woman or children, no empathy, and only pity for them.
Praying for you and the children, and even for your H, may God handle this for the innocent well.
@MelodyLane. What was your motive in doing that????? @.@ Do you think I posted a second advice seeking post to have you direct me to my first one as if I don't know it's there??? I am searching, I presented at a different angle, to SEEK NEW ADVICE. Omgosh, I can't believe you did that! lol
Introduction: This week, instead of printing the questions of two people, I am featuring a series of three letters, and my answers, from one person. The letters begin with concern for her safety and end with her in a shelter for battered women. It is at this point in her nightmare that her choices may mean the difference between life and death. For more information on this subject, refer to my column, Angry Outbursts.
Domestic violence is not as common as people think. Most of the troubled couples I've counseled have never experienced domestic violence and most couples, in general, go through life without having had a single physical altercation. If your spouse has ever hit you, or if you have ever hit your spouse, you're in a tragic and dangerous minority. But as uncommon as the problem is, whenever it occurs, people are shocked and confused as to what to do about it. My perspective as a professional who has counseled hundreds of violent clients is that these couple should be separated until there is assurance of safety. In many cases that assurance can never be given.
If you have ever hit your spouse, you are a perpetrator of domestic violence and need to take extraordinary steps to protect your spouse from yourself. Most violent spouses are deeply remorseful after sending their husbands or wives to the hospital, and sometimes to their death. But remorse does not make up for the mistake. Violence is one of those mistakes in life that you cannot ever afford to make, and if you've done it once, you're likely to do it again.
Throughout my career as a marriage counselor, I have done whatever I can to save marriages, but when it comes to domestic violence I draw the line. Unless a spouse can guarantee the other's safety from their own anger, I don't believe they should live with each other.
I didn't have any children with my physically abusive ex, so my choice was easy, I left. He SHOT the girl that he was with after me, in front of her kid.
You're not attracted to him for a reason. He's dangerous to you. My ex looked like George Clooney, but boy was he UGLY to me.
@MelodyLane. I have not received an answer to my questions. (not that I am required to, but I am searching). Advice, yes, but evidently not what I am needing or feel compelled to act upon.
And I feel aggravated that you "bumped" my first post when I well knew it was there! lol I appreciate your effort to write and discuss with me, but feel you should have thought I wrote a second post for a REASON! (*.*)
I have a man who wants to be a family, says he loves me and is sorry,who tells me he will never hit me again, who is willing to make it work. (he has personality problems but may always...he also has many good and wonderful qualities) AND I AM HAVING A HARD TIME FORGIVING, OR BEING ABLE TO LOVE HIM IN RETURN. If he is telling the truth, how do I heal and love him? But I also would like to know WHAT DOES HE NEED TO DO TO MAKE ME HAVE THESE FEELINGS, aside from never hitting me again? He has many wonderful qualities, but I don't "enjoy" them b/c of my anger and pain from the past abuse or fear that it may happen again under the right circumstances (though it may never). I question how long am I "okay" to not have sex with him, and what I mean by that is that if he is sincere in changing, how long should he "tolerate" my not feeling compelled to have sex with him? I cannot force myself to want him. I desire sex, just not with HIM!
I feel a repulsed feeling when he tries to hug or kiss me. It's b/c I grew to hate him for hitting me all those years, and other bad qualities. It's like a rut in my brain that I cannot fill in, even though he does good, loving and kind things. He resets me to zero/starting line at times when he does or says something that reflects a pressuring or demanding connotation. Such as "How long do you think it's going to take before you will resume sex with me?" I hate that question. Am I suppose to? Should I have compassion for his concern? I feel it exhibits a selfishness. Thus I am not moved to resume sex. If it were me, I would not be asking that. I would be showing self-control and patience.
So I am still confused as to whether I should leave him or remain until something changes my feelings???????????????? I wish I had married a normal man who never had a bad temper and had experienced the past 14 years in a reasonable measure of happiness! Grrrr!
He repulses you because he is repulsive. Why did you feel the need to differentiate between 'beating' and 'hitting arms and legs and kicking'? Define 'beating' to me.
You advise me to leave and I can see why from your experience (which I am sorry you experienced), but MB Dr. Harley says to not throw in the towel even if a spouse is physically abusive. But I can't find a lot of information on how to forgive an abuser, or how to heal from the pain, how to love again.
You advise me to leave and I can see why from your experience (which I am sorry you experienced), but MB Dr. Harley says to not throw in the towel even if a spouse is physically abusive. But I can't find a lot of information on how to forgive an abuser, or how to heal from the pain, how to love again.
Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
Domestic Violence Letter #1
Introduction: This week, instead of printing the questions of two people, I am featuring a series of three letters, and my answers, from one person. The letters begin with concern for her safety and end with her in a shelter for battered women. It is at this point in her nightmare that her choices may mean the difference between life and death. For more information on this subject, refer to my column, Angry Outbursts.
Domestic violence is not as common as people think. Most of the troubled couples I've counseled have never experienced domestic violence and most couples, in general, go through life without having had a single physical altercation. If your spouse has ever hit you, or if you have ever hit your spouse, you're in a tragic and dangerous minority. But as uncommon as the problem is, whenever it occurs, people are shocked and confused as to what to do about it.My perspective as a professional who has counseled hundreds of violent clients is that these couple should be separated until there is assurance of safety. In many cases that assurance can never be given. .
If you have ever hit your spouse, you are a perpetrator of domestic violence and need to take extraordinary steps to protect your spouse from yourself. Most violent spouses are deeply remorseful after sending their husbands or wives to the hospital, and sometimes to their death. But remorse does not make up for the mistake. Violence is one of those mistakes in life that you cannot ever afford to make, and if you've done it once, you're likely to do it again.
Throughout my career as a marriage counselor, I have done whatever I can to save marriages, but when it comes to domestic violence I draw the line. Unless a spouse can guarantee the other's safety from their own anger, I don't believe they should live with each other.
Dr. Harley says to separate from a physical abuser. Did you read what Mel posted?
I'm not sorry about my experience, I learned a boatload! It took many years of no contact to forgive him, not that he knows that! Infidelity is touted here as the #1 bringer of soul-crushing pain, and I believe them, because you can heal from physical abuse, just not while you're with the abuser. You've got battered woman syndrome, I'm guessing, where you still think they can change. If he's been hitting you for FOURTEEN YEARS, I can guarantee the minute you have sex with him, you're back to punching bag.
I did. I divorced him, then we got back together a few months ago to work on things, but all my old feelings got triggered when we resumed intimacy, so I had to back off from it.
He has not hit me since October of last year, so I am now seeking advice on how to forgive and heal. I will research under those key words you gave me: battered woman syndrome. Thank you.
I did. I divorced him, then we got back together a few months ago to work on things, but all my old feelings got triggered when we resumed intimacy, so I had to back off from it.
He has not hit me since October of last year, so I am now seeking advice on how to forgive and heal. I will research under those key words you gave me: battered woman syndrome. Thank you.
Forgiving is very inappropriate unless and until he seeks help for his problem and makes radical changes. You can't heal as long as you are in danger. You are not safe with this man. Your first order of business should be to separate from him and stay separated until seeks help and makes radical, long term changes in his behavior. As you told us in your first post, your H is not a wife beater on a daily basis, but intermittently:
Quote
lol He has been physically abusive our entire marriage, not daily or weekly but he would snap every 4 months or so, hitting me; here
Nothing has changed. It is just a matter of time until he explodes and beats you up again.
It's a choice. Mine was easy because I was held up with hatred and didn't want to live that way, I was ready to MOVE ON. I don't know how to forgive a physical abuser and stay with them. Perhaps disarming them somehow? Gaining the upper hand? Carrying a gun and knowing you are in the power seat? Dunno. I wish I had slit my ex's throat and killed him when I had the chance, before he shot that girl.
How to heal?
Well, forgiveness is needed, but so is safety. If you don't feel safe, you won't heal. I don't know what safety feels like to you. I didn't feel safe until my ex was in prison.
I once counseled a girl, 19, who used to Like the "bad boys", but her hood drug dealing boyfriend was just, " troubled", she said
I asked her did she go to the cops and tell him to buzz off? Didn't she have a father or would her brother stand up for her at home? I think she liked playing with fire and the "poor little troubled rebel boy" thing.
I understood all that, and she seemed to also, heck I was 23 and straighten out a few out of control idiots, oh yeah they were so tough lol.
But I was very understanding and at the same time adamant that this was not love, and to stay away from him, go to the cops for everyones good.
A year later he beat her head in with a hammer in the woods and she died
Wish I was more than a co- worker who just went to work as a dishwasher because I could not stand being still with a cast on my leg or not. Wish I could have beaten that idiot within an inch of his life. He was a piece of garbage.
Then there is the dozens of these damsels in distress, lovers of all the drama, the ones who just are used to the abuse and see it as normal. 1st class in love with the abuse, and the men who love to deal it out. Oh btw, thier life always seems to be so hard.
My sister in law, used to have an issue she wanted my late wife to "talk and help" her with with the company of a six-pack , "I don't know what to do!" My wife would say, " leave him! You know CP will protect you and your kids if you come here and will go to the cops with you!" But of course, she lurved him. No she loved the lowlife excuse to feel sorry for herself, and until I moved our family away, my wife was allways sucked in
But no, there was no reason to go to AA, there were no triggers or anything
This site deals mostly with how to restore romantic love, there is not much of that including a beating that could even help you I am afraid
You do not see how this has effected you luvinlife, you need serious help also hon, this man is not a man, he's a cruel boy, and you are in danger along with the kids
Yes there is help somewhere, and some here I am sure, but I cannot for the life of me, understand why you would give this man one more minute of your presence. Those are the guys who would disappear if the law couldn't straigtsn them out, you need to get away and be protected, maybe if he can't get his abuse fix he will grow a pair, and beating people does not make you a man.
You are an enabler right now, and he is a ticking time bomb who needs to grow up. He should seek professional help, and if he doesn't maybe he should do some time, or just get in a cage like an animal and stay there.
He has no business being a father, and he damned straight ain't no husband.
Get some professional help, house of Ruth is a good source, read here and learn and dream of the possibilitys, but know it's more than dreaming, and wishful thinking, it's actual doing, that gets things done
Please help yourself for Gods sake
Until and while you are getting treatment, get the books by Dr H, and read your bible to find out what love is, and what men are
Praying for you, but really afraid that might ecourage you to sit on your butt and feel sorry for yourself May God step in and help you
I'm back. Been doing a lot of thinking, as always. So please tell me how would I know if I can forgive him for his past abuse? If he took anger management courses, what would I look for as evidence to extend forgiveness?????? Can you present me some signs/evidence to look for????? Thank you.
this is the only thread I have read here in recent months.
I have been attempting to recover my marriage from my A and my husband's violence and the emotional abuse that we have directed at each other.
You can find my thread here on MB (buried).
It came to the final straw: I had decided that I could live a much better life without J. I was ready for D. This was the catalyst for change.
He had a chance to sort his side (which was when I was able to refelct on my side too)
He had conditions: he had to enroll and take part in a perpetrators of abuse course. It was weekly for 32 weeks and has been monthly for 6/7 months and will continue for another 12 or so.
He has totally changed. I honestly don't believe it would be possible for him to have changed that much without the support and education he has received from the group.
He is now loving and caring.
Do I love him?
Not sure.
Am I trying to learn to love him? Yes
Will I ever get there? Who knows?
Use this check list (by Lundy bancroft):
Admitting fully to what he has done Stopping excuses Stopping all blaming of her Making amends Accepting responsibility (recognizing that abuse is a choice) Identifying patterns of controlling behavior, admitting their wrongness Identifying the attitudes that drive his abuse Accepting that overcoming abusiveness will be a decades-long process, not declaring himself cured Not starting to say, "so now it's your turn to do your work", not using change as a bargaining chip Not demanding credit for improvements he has made Not treating improvements as chips or vouchers to be spent on occasional acts of abuse (e.g. "I haven't done anything like this in a long time, so why are you making such a big deal about it?") Developing respectful, kind, supportive behaviors Carrying his weight Sharing power Changing how he is in highly heated conflicts Changing how he responds to his partner's (or former partner's) anger and grievances Changing his parenting Changing his treatment of her as a parent Changing his attitudes towards females in general Accepting the consequences of his actions (including not feeling sorry for himself about those consequences, and not blaming her or the children for them) ____________________
Holy cow! I am total shock that someone has helped me!!!!!!! Thank you very much for your providing me good information! Very sleepy. Just checked this before going to sleep, it's midnight, why am I still up? lol But wow, thank you so much! I will reply this weekend! (*.*)
He had conditions: he had to enroll and take part in a perpetrators of abuse course. It was weekly for 32 weeks and has been monthly for 6/7 months and will continue for another 12 or so.
____________________
Staytogether, can you provide details on this course?
Ruikee, I can tell you that staytogether lives in the UK, as do I. I doubt whether the set-up for such courses would be the same in the USA (if that is where you are).
If you are in the UK, I suggest you start by contacting your local Social Services department.
Sugar_Cane was a great help to me back in those confusing post A days.
Ruikee,
I know that there are such courses in the States. I know someone that works with victims of abuse in the states.
I didn't go through social services. Do a search on such courses in your area.
I actually found out about it when I contacted my women's shelter and had a conversation with them about my options and whether such a course is available. Having been totally panicked that they would want to take over my life once I admitted this was going on, I was relieved to find out that they were very willing to give as much or as little support as I wanted.
The key thing is with this that Anger Management DOES NOT WORK.
The really enlightening thing has been the way that all forms of abuse are categorised and highlighted. It was a great catalyst for respectful conversation between the 2 of us and I was able to see where I had been dragged in too.
I have my first meeting with my women's safety officer in a few weeks time since he begoan the course. Although they have phoned to check on me every few weeks to begin with and then tailing off.
The initial course was split into 5 or 6 modules of 6 weeks, each one looking at different forms of abuse. They assess participants at the start of the course on their beliefs and perceptions and actions and then again at the end of the 30 weeks.
My H decided to repeat the first module, so that he could appreciate it with his new line of thinking which he felt didn't kick in til after the first month, although he had graduated on to the monthly program.
The monthly program can run for as long as wanted - i think typically a further 2 years after the initial one. As well as revising the other topics the guys have been involved in producing material to support the project. J enjoys the support and opportunity to talk - although the men are forbidden from communicating with each other outside the group, he can contact the facilitator whenever.
The course works on stopping abuse by looking at the beliefs that lead to it. J has a notebook (which he hasn't used since the first 3 months) - when he or I feel that he needs a time out he walks to a quiet place (picnic bench in the hills behind our house) and analyses what's been happennning.
This is an example from his book of an attempt he made to control me using intimidation and aggression. It is from his book - and this is called a control log.
Quote
Shoes left in car
I felt guilty for leaving
I was disappointed that the car was left in a mess
I felt like it was me being left to tidy the car
I feel we should empty the car at the time
Blame the kids - you are the adult guide them. Brought up the car seats again.
Trigger: Always dumping stuff, leaving for longer than necessary. Not a problem really - just need to dessensitise myself from it. Feels like it is dleiberate when I am off my last shift.
I got too defensive. I'm upset the car was left like that. I believe I have a right to a tidy car. I'm upset you complained about the seats.
I, upset you didn't say goodbye.
Can we please try and bring stuff in from the car.
I will try not to be defensive.
I think you can roughly pick out and read between the lines, that there are a set of Q's to work through and answer and then they help to find the best way to deal with the situation.
Agencies providing help and support for perpetrators of domestic violence
AVP Britain (Alternatives to Violence Project): 020 7324 4755, www.avpbritain.org.uk - Run workshops throughout the country for anyone who has niggly little resentments that become grudges, anyone who gets upset at being ignored, anyone who has difficulty with anger, anyone who is a bully or is bullied, in fact, anyone who wants an alternative to violence.
Everyman Project: 020 7263 8884 (London based), www.everymanproject.co.uk - National helpline for everyone concerned about violence. Counselling service for violent men who want to change
Respect: 0808 802 4040, www.respect.uk.net - advice and information for perpetrators of domestic violence. Also details of programmes and support services for perpetrators
The Freedom Programme: 01547 520228, email freedomprogramme@btinternet.com, www.freedomprogramme.co.uk - A 12 week rolling programme for any man who wishes to stop abusing women and children. Places are funded either privately or from various statutory agencies. Central location on the Wirral
The TRYangle Project: 020 8854 6906, www.tryangle.org.uk - Domestic Violence Intervention Project based in S.E.London. Project for men who want to end violent or abusive behaviours towards a partner. Women's Support Service for (ex) partners of perpetrators
The Violence Initiative: email admin@tviccv.org, www.tviccv.org - Offering all people who are violent a chance to change. Drop-in, one to one sessions and courses. Free services to perpetrators of violence. Available to anyone who can get to their base in North London
SupportLine Telephone Helpline: 01708 765200, email info@supportline.org.uk - Provides emotional support and details of counsellors and agencies throughout the UK
I'll just add, that I was like luvnlife. I guess I knew I wanted to take some responsibility for what had happened. By doing that I was empowered.
I know many people will rant and rave at me taking that line and the affect it may have on others in abusive situations. I know of a marriage guru who sees the role of the "slave" in abusive relationships.
Thing is my advice is always get out. Get out while the problems are addressed. The time of split is usually the most dangerous - these guys have done that.
I too am looking at my resistance to intimacy and that is emotional intimacy - sharing fears and hopes and dreams and physical intimacy.
It is just now that I am seeking outside help for myself - hence the meeting with the women's safety officer.
Many women don't get to this stage because they don't trust and I think that luvnlife may still be at the unable to trust stage.
I was coached through this by a lovely lady. You have to change your expectations. You have to believe that you are not a victim and you won't be again. You have to expect the best (while still being prepared for the worst - you still have your ending the relationship planse and finding a safe house in place). You still have to believe that you will be fine and have a happy lif without your spouse. But you have to believe in his changes and you have to believe that he is going to act form those changes.
Took me a year to work through that. That not expecting to be disappointed.
This new stage is frustrating. I know he is different, I can see how differently he thinks. But I have put up a wall between the 2 of us. I do feel safe. But there are still some things I need to relearn.
Now some of this is ingrained because of patterns form my childhood. I just hope that he sticks around while I learn to love.
@staytogether. Hi. In the process of moving. Been exhausted. But I also feel very overwhelmed so I find it hard to articulate my thoughts when there are so many. The abuse went on for so long and I wanted to be out of the relationship. When he confessed his sexual addictions, I was not even hurt! B/c he had killed my love. If I were in love with him, it would have hurt me. My main motivation to stay together is in hopes to provide my children with a family unit and I feel if something could make me love him, I would prefer that compared to trying to find another GOOD MAN in this world! lol Then blend two families, get to know someone, ugh ugh ugh. But most of all, I want to be a mother FULL-TIME, I want to take care of my three young ones, protect them, and help them be strong adults, be with them daily, help them see when daddy doesn't handle them/situations properly as well. If I am not there, I cannot help in these areas. (He wants joint custody and I must say he is a very loving father! He loves them tremendously. Which is another reason I feel he "inherited" his anger problems from his mother and father who both have anger problems. He seems to want to love me and love his kids, HE JUST DOESN'T KNOW HOW TO DO SO PROPERLY!!!!!!!)
I see improvement in him, but he still displays traits of selfishness demonstrated in a hunger for sex with me (it's been 4 months since we got back together but we only had sexual relations a few times, which TRIGGERED MY BAD FEELINGS, so that I knew I still had problems with intimacy with him. (while divorced I had one relationship and no problems with intimacy! In fact, it was wonderful to enjoy affection with someone with whom there were no baggage/problems) We ended that relationship due to differences in beliefs/morals. Anyways, it irritates me and resets me to zero when he tries to show me affection b/c I asked him to let me take those steps whereupon he starts asking me how long do I think it will be!??? lol I don't like that question b/c I ask him, "how long will it be before you make feel feel like I can trust you,and begin to desire you sexually?" I tell him to realize that I am angry that I too have sexual desires which are not being fulfilled b/c I am not to the point that I desire him sexually. Ugh!!!! I never hit him. I never cursed at him. I never threw things at him! I never controlled him. I was always a good woman with normal faults, but never these extreme issues he's had. So he desires me. I just want him to respect me and give me time. But he will say, "We had a good day today, we got along, dont you want to have sex?" lol Yes, I want to have sex but I don't feel close to him just b/c we had a good day. He hit me 8 months ago in a bad way. And he threatened me only recently, so I have not had enough time to trust and desire him. Why can't he understand that? I get tired of trying to make him see.
I guess I would like to ask you, what do you feel is your reason for having a wall up after he's been doing well for quite a while and has worked hard with his program? Why do you have intimacy problems at this point?
Look forward to hearing from you. I am still very tired and exhausted, so this is all I am going to share tonight. It's what came to the top of my head first! (*.*) Thank you so much once again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
From what I am reading here, you should not be considering being intimate yet.
The reason to stay with him for the children would be once he's changed. To show them that if they make mistakes they need to work hard to get it back. It is not for you to point out where he is going wrong. That does not make for a good family. Children need to see their parents working well together.
The first real thing you have to consider is ABUSE IS ABOUT CONTROL (NOT ANGER).
Think about all issues with him as being about him attempting to control you. You can work through some of them, think about what outcome he was trying to control.
Until the dynamics are understood then it would be dangerous to consider being intimate.
From what I am reading here, you should not be considering being intimate yet.
The reason to stay with him for the children would be once he's changed. To show them that if they make mistakes they need to work hard to get it back. It is not for you to point out where he is going wrong. That does not make for a good family. Children need to see their parents working well together.
The first real thing you have to consider is ABUSE IS ABOUT CONTROL (NOT ANGER).
Think about all issues with him as being about him attempting to control you. You can work through some of them, think about what outcome he was trying to control.
Until the dynamics are understood then it would be dangerous to consider being intimate.
ITA, until he sees sexual intercourse as something different than he does. (Don't know what is effecting him but I recognize the common frustration and have heard of this before), having sex could bring upon another episode.
I am glad you are seeking counsel and I pray he is too. There is a road out of this if he will take it.
To answer your question... this is a possibility that I am currently working on.
I think I see love as a weakness. To show or accept love means that I am weak or the person I am giving it to is weak.
Being in an abusive relationship is all about control and power....the opposite of things could be coming baout in my head as weakness.
I can not be weak - therefore I cannot be loved.
I was also sexually assaulted 2x as young teenager, stuff that I began to process as an older teenager and was beginning more intimate relationships myself.
I think the whole lot has got all tangled up and confused and I need to pull it apart and relearn about love and how to love.
@staytogether. I have read that 5 times and I am trying to relate to your feelings. Hard for me since I have never been sexually assaulted. But I am trying to put myself in your shoes. Here I go. I would think that if someone overpowered you/sexually assaulted you, then you are in a weak position physically, and possibly even emotionally (unintentionally, by not having enough knowledge per say) BUT........ if you are in a mutually consenting relationship, then you have just as much power as they do. If your husband is taking steps to fight his abusive nature, and has made progress, then I would think you might be noticing qualities in him that you find attractive at this point. Sounds like he has been working on things for a while now. I'm not sure how long. So what would help? Maybe tell him that you feel like you need to be the one in most control during your intimacy????? Or ask him to be very gentle and asking in his movements? I don't know. lol I'm just trying to think about how you can NOT FEEL WEAK but endeavor to resume intimacy with normal feelings. He may need to treat you very delicately for a time. Explain to him that you are in the process of attacking your sexual delimmas due to your past and that you need his help in an experiment to see if it will help you. When two people love one another- that IS a gift from God as a way to express your love for one another, right? So to love is not weak but a way to demonstrate you care for someone. Do you have a pet? Do you feel you are weak when you do things for your pet? e.g. stroke it, hug it, kiss it, feed it? lol No, you are just showing it that you like it. So if you like your husband, then you can show him you like him. But just talk to him about what you feel comfortable with, as I said, maybe you need to establish what you feel you are comfortable with, to maintain a feeling of control of your being, control of your feelings, and not feel like you are being overpowered. I am not a professional, but I am trying to think of what would help me. I hope I said something that helped your thinking process. One last thought is that to love is really a strength, not a weakness, b/c it takes strength to overcome your barriers to show love, so when you demonstrate love you are a strong person. It's take strength, effort and actions to show love. To NOT show love is easy. Did you ever watch Little House on the Praire? You may have seen something similar, but there was a hermit on this one particular episode who was afraid to love, so he secluded himself. My point is that is much easier to just seclude yourself and not show love. Be strong in the other direction. Much love to you. LaRhonda (*.~)
Ok, but I am only citing what I have seen before, and the common frustrations I have felt before also, as a man who felt inferior at times
Notice that's it's the inferiority that is what triggers the anger response
It's the feeling of a lack of performance quality that he might possess that causes the inferiority issues
Many times the man creates a self fulfilling prophecy of sorts, when he is abusive, and the woman runs away, and finds love somwhere else. He feels he cannot perform, and it does not have to be in the sex department only, but this fear of failure is so strong, that at the time of sexual union, instead of feeling like alpha male after sex, there is still a lingering fear of inadaquacy. The most intense and emotional experience of bonding most men can experience, and it doesn't fulfill them somehow. Very frustrating at the least
In times when things were not good, I can remember the frustration, when after sex, I still did not feel like I had done all to please her, and it didn't even have to do with sex at all
Sometimes it was because I did not do enough in real life, buy her a house, take her to the Bahamas, give her what would make her happy, and that was even before her A and waywardness
But bringing that frustration to bed and expecting it all to go away is like using sex like a drug, when it's over you blame the drug, and pour out the rest of the bottle, but in your case, take out on you physically, and blame you.
I knew the issues we had might never be solved, but I also knew that she loved me, and sex wasn't the issue, her mindset was, but also that she had past issues with abuse, fear and confusion, and rejection. The answer to her issues, was for her to lose her fear of total submission. Something she never quite did, but I knew it was closer with me than any other, and I appreciated her letting me be with her Yes in the throws of passion, dominance took over sometimes, but it was with gentleness and patience that we got there many times also, unless she initiated. Sometimes you can just see it that she was willing, and sometimes she told me, but I never felt inferior, and it was just sex, in the big picture
She did hold back sometimes, and one time in particular, when she was getting very excited, she stopped me and said, "I promised God I would never let anyone get to me like that again". I was pretty upset, and asked what was wrong with her thinking, but she refused to get into it, and I knew she was holding back. No she would not go with me and talk to somebody, and for the most time things were great, so I did not push her, because patience and tenderness were very important to us, and she allways believed I was the best lover she ever knew
Yes I was waiting for the day she would let herself go, but I was happy with what we had, even though she was scarred somewhere emotionally. I never felt like I was missing anything because I loved her
Now when the affair was out in the open, my confidence was shot, and it was all hysterical bonding. The drugs had changed her, and she was more aggressive but no more leg shaking climaxes now she was a mess, inside her head was where it all happened, and she really was not in contact with her body anymore, it was all a show for her mind
See I was lucky enough to know the difference, and that most of what happens sexually starts between your ears. If a man does not feel adequate and complete in other areas, and he tries to use sex to make up for them, he will blame sex if it's not a magic bullet. Then if like most men the desire leaves for sex after and he is not still in awe of the lover and in a type of afterglow and appreciation, you can feel tricked, even by yourself, and be angry for your weakness in your need. That you needed anything. If they go as far to blame the one they needed, then resentment, and even violence, can erupt
In short having sex with him will probably disappoint him and confuse him. He will expect it to fix the problems, some that are deeper and personal, and after he could get violent again. Get him some help because he can beat this, and his sexual experience can change for him, once he takes it off the pedestal,
Hope this helped, I am not a professional, but have seen frustrated and fearful men before have to deal with this when got real extreme, and the violence is allways fear driven, allways. The greatest fear is that of inadequacy and to feel like that they might be inadaqute in bed is one thing, but if they have sex with the wrong expectations, thier fears become real.
Yup sex is a powerful EN to men and it gets to us in many ways.
Pray you get good help and like Dr Ruth says good sex
@ConstantProcess. Thank you for writing. I do appreciate it. I just don't know how to handle him always asking and demanding for me to have sex when I am not at all attracted to him, don't want to have sex with him, it repulses me b/c it triggers how awful I felt when he was abusive during our marriage (before separation and divorce for 13 years). For him to touch me just triggers a lot of bad feelings. In fact, I wonder if I can even overcome them. I wonder if it went on for too long. And yet a part of me wants things to be right. But he grovels and begs and interrogates me daily to have sex, asking when will I resume sex, that he cannot wait much longer, which only makes me feel like running from him. I don't know how we can get help. I don't know how I can get help for my feelings and I don't know how to get him to be patient with me in the process. It's very aggravating.
Its a do-over. Have you given him the books offered here? His needs Her needs, and has he went to counseling?
You have the right to never want him again. this is personal? I don't care how much great and good things he does, or how sorry he is, you do not have to accept him back in your bed. "But honey I make 100K a year, doesn't that make up for it?"
It is obvious he does not know how to respect your feelings, but will he learn is the issue.
Sounds like a plan B with some pretty steep requirements is in order, unless he can stop the begging.
"Oh yes dear of course I am sorry, and it doesn't matter you see, if you ever really want sex again, because to tell you the truth, I just need to get my nut off"
He thinks sex will fix something, and it doesnt work when you are forced, its desire from both H and W, that makes it work, but its more than,"Candy is Dandy but liquor is quicker" mentality, he is setting himself up for failure.
Sorry you are going through this, but the physical abuse factor MUST be fully addressed before you can even start building romantic love. Does he ask what would make you "feel" loved? Do you even remember anymore?
You both are gonna need some counseling and time, sex is the least of your needs right now, and this forum only has a few who can help you understand, that he needs serious help from professionals, along with the Man upstairs.
I have waited around to see if my husband would work on his anger problem. I just cannot bring myself to trust him or give myself to him. I still see he has anger issues and given the right environment, he would hit me still. We have been very distant. Tension in the air. He would never fear to converse with me or tell me his feelings b/c I am not aggressive. I do not feel this way about him. After much meditation and dread, I finally decided I cannot heal here with him. I have to move out. I am so sad to divide my time with my children. I have to share them b/c he is their father and they deserve a relationship- I just wish I could be their mother every single day of their life!!!!! Full time mom, not part-time. I mean hands on, I realize I am still their mom when they will be with them but still not there. But I have a question for you advice givers: (and I do appreciate all of you and your advice. Thank you) WHY DO I FEEL LIKE I WANT TO WORK THINGS OUT EVEN MORE WHEN I DECIDE TO END THE RELATIONSHIP? WHY DO I FEEL AN ATTRACTION TO HIM AFTER I MENTALLY SEPARATE MYSELF FROM THE RELATIONSHIP? IS THIS NORMAL? I DON'T KNOW. Very confusing to myself. lol
It's probably because in preparing to move, he no longer has power over you so that's exciting. It's your own empowerment, likely has nothing to do with him.
I would be cautious about the child situation.
When are you leaving, where are you going? Be very careful moving out, have someone (preferably a big someone) with you. Are you married? Can you just file and ask for residence of the home you're in and get him out?
Thank you for writing CWMI. Yes, I do feel free and empowered just anticipating the move. But when we divorced before, and I was not exposed to his control, I felt attracted to him. I wish he could prove to me that he would never be physically abusive again. I would like to be a family.
He has never been physically abusive toward the children. They are small and malleable. I don't think there will be issues until they are older. He spends good quality time with them. Where he has failed would be in his bad temper and abuse toward me. They are definitely prone to do whatever he says to make sure dad is happy. They don't want to meet his disapproval. But he gives them attention, cares about them, and takes good care of them. So that's good. I think he takes solace in them since I started strongly expressing I would not continue to endure this marriage. I think they make him feel better.
Now to answer your questions: I am planning to leave this week. I have an apartment I will be moving into. My family will be here to help me. We are married. Married 13 years, separated for two, divorced him for 4 months, then tried to work things out again. Remarried in April, and now separating again. Ugh! Exhausting!
I cannot stay in the home b/c I will not be able to afford it.
Sorry I missed you luvnlife, I haven't visited this site for ages.
I hope that the move was successful and that you are settling in OK.
Like CWMI, I believe it is about your empowerment....you no longer feel that you have to be with him....you now feel you have a choice, instead of being trapped and resenting the entrapment. As you have identified - the relationship would still be toxic.
I found the questions in this test interesting and highlighted a few things for me to think on. It may be of interest to you as you move on and focus on yourself. ***EDIT***
Been a long time. But this is the only place I have schpilled feelings or sought advice. Since it was a successful place to receive advice, I am back! Hello everyone. I see in amazement that it has been a year and a half since I posted. In that time, things basically continued stagnant. We remained separated. I was enjoying my single life. And he was continuing to ask me to try again. The past 6 months I was really leaning toward that. It had been 4 years since I first left him for abuse. I believe that was the right decision. I do not believe I had solid basis to return for the first 2 years for sure. But then he began getting active in church and the kids began to love him. And I noticed this as of recent. But I had an affair and slept with one person while we were apart. I did so intentionally b/c I did not feel I would reunite with my ex but to avoid mega problems during that time, knowing the woman he dated while we were divorced the first time, I just felt like I was going to keep us STILL MARRIED FOR AS LONG AS I COULD TO KEEP THIS WOMAN OUT OF MY CHILDREN'S LIFE. But then I couldn't refrain from tellin him the truth. He still wanted to forgive me but a part of me was just reluctant to do so. B/c I was not willing to risk abuse again or controlling ways. WE divorced our second time 4 months ago. And yep, just like I predicted, he married that lady (our mutual "friend" of a decade) as soon as the 60 days of waiting was up!!! And I was crushed! I am miserable. I wish now that I had walked through hell and high water to keep my family! Two weeks before he married her, he told me he still loved me and that he still wanted us to be a family. As I stated, I was leaning toward that, so I told him we would talk and work on things. But a few days later, I heard he had went out with her and my children and I got mad and never called him as I said I would. Then BAM two weeks later, they are married. My kids are fine with it so far. Everyone is living on adrenaline and excitement. And I am now only remembering GOOD MEMORIES of being a family! WE had lots of good times and good memories and I would rather be there than HER IN MY PLACE! What if he had changed for the better? and put on a new personality from studying God's word? The kids say he acts happy and that they get along. So maybe he is different now. But I didn't want this. I didn't want to share my children with a woman I do not respect or like!!!! They are on a trip right now, and I want to be the one with my family! She is driving my Denali! And in my home DOING MY KIDS LAUNDRY! It's eating me alive! So I need advice please? All I ever wanted was my family but I back slid and lost out. We traded places. I became selfish and enjoyed my freedom while he was working on himself in church and moved on so he could have a family. Thank you for listening to me. Ask me any questions if I left pieces out so that this is incoherent...
He is not as changed as you think, for he would have worked to give you just compensation, but instead married the OW as quickly as he could. I agree with BrainHurts: Plan B so your heart won't get jerked around.
One of the main reasons people recover after an A is for the kids.
However since your H is abusive to the kids, a separation is really the best way to go for them.
As a mother you need to do all you can to put distance between this abuser and your precious family.
I say this because I am totally APALLED at the behaviour you describe between your XH and kids.
Originally Posted by luvinlife
He has never been physically abusive toward the children. They are small and malleable. I don't think there will be issues until they are older. He spends good quality time with them. Where he has failed would be in his bad temper and abuse toward me. They are definitely prone to do whatever he says to make sure dad is happy. They don't want to meet his disapproval. But he gives them attention, cares about them, and takes good care of them. So that's good.
You can't possibly have known a loving father if you think this is one.
A dad who makes them afraid. Hits their mother. Abuses their mother. One who can't be displeased. One who has an OW.
A loving father is one who hasn't hit them.. YET? Not to me.
I have a really good friend whose father was angry and abusive. Never physically, but who cares about that when you have an angry dad? He still gets upset about it in his thirties though he voluntarily hasn't seen his father since he was young.
But at least his mother didn't normalise it for him. She got him out of there. If she hadn't, he'd be doing the same thing to his kids today, thinking it was normal, instead of being the gentle loving person he is now.
What I'm getting from Plan B is very little contact. Which has been my situation for almost 2 years. It did not help. Just caused him to deviate from any convincing me to forgive and believe he was different, to deciding to move on. Therefore, my question is what is the long term purpose of Plan B? I do not see in anything I read of how it's going to help me "not get my heart jerked around..." My heart is hurt that my children are in the presence of a woman I greatly dislike and disrespect. I do not want to share my children. I do not want to see HER personality shining through in my children. I guess I have to do my best while I don't like it, just deal with it. I just wish we had both walked through hell and high water to keep our family intact and done whatever it took to fix things. He asked me repeatedly for 4 years and I was reluctant. The first two years did not merit reconciliation, as he was NOT good marriage or father material. But now I feel I could have made things work. And it would have been better than a step family with THIS WOMAN! GRRR.
Alis is totally right. Plan B is NO contact, and not just that - it is no information, not even third hand.
I don't waste any of my precious time thinking about my WXH, because I have no idea who he is. He could have joined the circus, or decided to devote his life to the poor in the two years since I saw him last. It would be like pondering the fate of a complete stranger.
To be honest with you, I have no idea if he is alive or dead. The last I heard he had moved to the Philippines, but when the disaster struck there recently, I didn't even remember about that. It was others who reminded me.
That's Plan B. It is the gift of indifference which allows you to focus entirely on YOU.
It takes time, and is harder to achieve complete darkness with children, so Plan B mothers typically take a bit longer to heal than us childless ones. So you should probably get started.
Originally Posted by luvinlife
My heart is hurt that my children are in the presence of a woman I greatly dislike and disrespect. I do not want to share my children. I do not want to see HER personality shining through in my children.
The best thing you can do is build an amazing Plan B world for you and your children in which waywardness is entirely shut out. They need you to come home to, and for you to be happy and whole.
I know a few grown up people who had wayward stepmothers. None of them took on her personality! They ran far from it as soon as they could.
Originally Posted by luvinlife
He asked me repeatedly for 4 years and I was reluctant. The first two years did not merit reconciliation, as he was NOT good marriage or father material. But now I feel I could have made things work. (
No you couldn't have, and you know it. He is his own problem, not yours.
Plan B does not help me. I see him all the time when we exchange the children. And her with him. And an intermediary is not possible. I have no family here and neither does he. And I have to see them together at events concerning the children and it breaks my heart!
Luvin, I have a good friend who went though physical abuse with her ex. Those folks have years of practice in manipulation. What my friend did was arrange so she would drop off her kid at school and her ex would pick their kid up, or vice versa. And they only communicate through email. Abusers don't want others to see their tactics so he will be more guarded in email than face to face.
Plan B does not help me. I see him all the time when we exchange the children. And her with him. And an intermediary is not possible. I have no family here and neither does he. And I have to see them together at events concerning the children and it breaks my heart!
I have one of those situations with my ex. Please at least read up about how to properly plan B-you can do it!
1) Your intermediary can be a person around the world. Their job is just to filter information. Literally, if they have a computer and a cell phone they can do this job for you. They can email your ex or text him if something comes up- not you!!! So go find one!
2) Police stations, some library's and other locations all do child exchanges for you in every city in the entire USA. Call and find out how to do this so you drop kids off, he picks them up & vice versa and you NEVER have to see him or her again.
3) If anything changes, your schedule, use the intermediary-emergencys-intermediary. EVERYTHING!
4)Look at the parallel parenting plan. It will take a huge load off your shoulders. Basically, if your kids has a game you trade off on nights to go so you both are never there at the same time. Brainstorm... look at the parallel parenting or google it. There really are NO events you both have to attend at the same time until they get married
5) I asked my son to not talk to me about his dad (unless he hurt him or he was scared) for 6 months to give mommy's heart time to heal. It hurt to hear about him. He hugged me and did it. From that time on he barely talks about him unless it is serious and this many years later doesn't bother me anymore.
All that to say, it will take some practice, some planning but please do it for yourself and your kids. You will heal so much faster and feel a million times better!
I'm back. You can sure see that this is a long process. He married our mutual friend and employee 7 months ago. I have very hard feelings about that, but even more so I am having a hard time with my children being with her. It is wearing a hole in my head that is awful feeling. He has money and they have vacations planned. I cannot now afford to take them on vacations. I have to visualize HER ENJOYING MY SWEET BABIES EXPERIENCE THINGS THAT I SHOULD BE THE ONE EXPERIENCING!!!!!!
And I really do think he changed after taking the anger management course and hitting rock bottom, plus getting active in church. I was just beginning to get to the point of trusting and willing to try (after 4 years of separation/divorce/separation/divorce). B/c I could tell that he acted different, that the kids loved him. But I was too late. So not only did I endure 14 years of physical abuse but now I must endure a woman I dislike and disrespect enjoying my sweet children. A mother should never have to share her motherhood with another woman. It's not right or natural. It really hurts me. I wish so bad now that we had worked harder and saved our family.
Plan B does not help me. I see him all the time when we exchange the children. And her with him. And an intermediary is not possible. I have no family here and neither does he. And I have to see them together at events concerning the children and it breaks my heart!
I have one of those situations with my ex. Please at least read up about how to properly plan B-you can do it!
1) Your intermediary can be a person around the world. Their job is just to filter information. Literally, if they have a computer and a cell phone they can do this job for you. They can email your ex or text him if something comes up- not you!!! So go find one!
2) Police stations, some library's and other locations all do child exchanges for you in every city in the entire USA. Call and find out how to do this so you drop kids off, he picks them up & vice versa and you NEVER have to see him or her again.
3) If anything changes, your schedule, use the intermediary-emergencys-intermediary. EVERYTHING!
4)Look at the parallel parenting plan. It will take a huge load off your shoulders. Basically, if your kids has a game you trade off on nights to go so you both are never there at the same time. Brainstorm... look at the parallel parenting or google it. There really are NO events you both have to attend at the same time until they get married
5) I asked my son to not talk to me about his dad (unless he hurt him or he was scared) for 6 months to give mommy's heart time to heal. It hurt to hear about him. He hugged me and did it. From that time on he barely talks about him unless it is serious and this many years later doesn't bother me anymore.
All that to say, it will take some practice, some planning but please do it for yourself and your kids. You will heal so much faster and feel a million times better!
Will be thinking of you!
This is all great advice to help you implement a good No Contact policy with your ex husband. Why don't you give it a try?
Thank you all! But any advice about my main meat of distress??? How to not feel destroyed to share my children with this witch?! I hate it. No mother should have to share her children jointly with a woman she dislikes and disrespects! Its awful!
Well, ideally you would have addressed this in your divorce. For example, i have a court No Contact Order between my kids and OM. But absent such an order, and considering that they are now married, there is nothing that you can do..UNLESS;
THEY ARE UNSAFE AROUND THE KIDS Do they drink? Use drugs? Domestic Violence, etc? Adequate housing? How many bedrooms is their home? How often do the kids stay with them?
Thank you all! But any advice about my main meat of distress??? How to not feel destroyed to share my children with this witch?! I hate it. No mother should have to share her children jointly with a woman she dislikes and disrespects! Its awful!
Did you have it written in your divorce papers that he wasn't allowed to have the children around her?
Thank you all! But any advice about my main meat of distress??? How to not feel destroyed to share my children with this witch?! I hate it. No mother should have to share her children jointly with a woman she dislikes and disrespects! Its awful!
Ultimately your children are going to have to make their own decisions about who they allow in their lives. Frequently they will decide not to include someone who wrecked their home with an affair. I have no contact with my mother, who married her affair partner about twenty years ago - and in fact I had virtually no contact with her through my teenage years.
See your lawyer to see what can be done about keeping the affair partner away from your children. ALSO, implement Plan B. It will help your emotional state.
Thank you. I have some food for thought. And I think my emotional trauma will continue with no solution. Just part of life that sucks!! Lots of that in ppls lives! But always plenty to find joy in as well!
Thank you. I have some food for thought. And I think my emotional trauma will continue with no solution.
luv, please see your doctor about prescribing some short term antidepressants. This will help you to see solutions. Depression prevents people from taking obvious solutions that present themselves.
Yes, I read Plan B and implemented as best I can. We have children and have to have some communication. I see her and him both in a small town, in same religion. Things cause us to see eachother.
I will inquire about short term anti-depressants. lol What's the difference in short term and long term? Will I get addicted or feel I cannot function without them? I know SHE is on anti-depressants and sleeping pills plus she drinks wine daily. So she takes advantage of coping skills!!!!! ha ha Does it change your personality or who you are? I don't know! Just asking, as I have never taken anything before. Thanks for the advice.
Yes, I read Plan B and implemented as best I can. We have children and have to have some communication. I see her and him both in a small town, in same religion. Things cause us to see eachother.
I will inquire about short term anti-depressants. lol What's the difference in short term and long term? Will I get addicted or feel I cannot function without them? I know SHE is on anti-depressants and sleeping pills plus she drinks wine daily. So she takes advantage of coping skills!!!!! ha ha Does it change your personality or who you are? I don't know! Just asking, as I have never taken anything before. Thanks for the advice.
Yes, I read Plan B and implemented as best I can. We have children and have to have some communication. I see her and him both in a small town, in same religion. Things cause us to see eachother.
The affair needs to be fully exposed to your religious leaders, and you need to tell them that any contact with your wayward husband or his affair partner is extremely painful to you. It is their job to protect you - they should prevent your wayward husband and his affair partner from attending any religious functions where you are present. If your religious leaders do not perform this duty, I would encourage you to look for a new church.
I strongly recommend you move to get away from the site where all the trauma occurred to you.
My heart is hurt that my children are in the presence of a woman I greatly dislike and disrespect. I do not want to share my children. I do not want to see HER personality shining through in my children. I guess I have to do my best while I don't like it, just deal with it. I just wish we had both walked through hell and high water to keep our family intact and done whatever it took to fix things. He asked me repeatedly for 4 years and I was reluctant. The first two years did not merit reconciliation, as he was NOT good marriage or father material. But now I feel I could have made things work. And it would have been better than a step family with THIS WOMAN! GRRR. 
You'll feel a million times better, LuvnLife.