Redwood,


I agree with JL.

Your XBF was satisfied with the state of the relationship - in the fact and condition especially that it was NOT leading to marriage - and that you did not push marriage or appear to want to move in that direction.

Your XBF did something that proved it. When you brought up marriage, instead, he bought a home.

Now, when he is at the point of dissolving the relationship....

what happens to the property??????




Do you see this?



The property was something he saw as the "marriage" between you two. It is now dissolved.


Your XBF was not the marrying kind. Neither were you, truthfully, because you accepted the conditions of the relationship and the concept that "marriage is only a piece of paper". Sure it is - in the case of your relationship, it appears to have been a deed to property and not a marriage license that was the piece of paper......


I'm not bashing you. I'm trying to help you see that the ten years with this man was time spent in a relationship that did not "progress" because the two of you made the choice to leave it where it was. Limbo.

I have a saying that I use for clients that I work with, and ask them if it applies to them - often they open their eyes wide and say, OMG YES. "It seems that you are you content to be mediocre." In the relationship world, that's what happened with the ten years. It was tacit acceptance of mutual purchase of property in exchange for a mutual decision not to pursue permanence or commitment in the relationship.


Now you have awakened in a new world - and I would say that something happened. I'm not so sure that we would agree on what that "something" is.

You think that you cheated on your BF, figured out how much you loved him, and wanted to go back to the "relationship", however that was defined.

Here's what I think:

I think your relationship was waning and dying a death from the lack of mutual interest and shared future goals, of the sense of permanence and commitment that gave the security to you that you needed. The OM came on the scene, and because the boundaries were already vague in your life regarding what constituted marriage, commitment, etc., a relationship developed with OM.

The idea that you "weren't really married" did cross your mind.

You moved out, believing that the live-in relationship terminated at that point. Only you realized that you didn't love the OM, and the move was a bad one.

Only....meanwhile....back at the ranch, your XBF now being free and (for lack of a better word) "single" again, realizes that he is now on the market. So he went shopping. You have all the codewords (he needs space - that is huge!) that tells you that he is NOT committed to the relationship. But what's larger? He never was truly "committed", not from the start, and you knew that.


You wanted a return to the status quo, but then again, you really didn't. You...wanted...more. And XBF knows it.

Because he knew it before - and has known for a long time. He has avoided it, and has worked to instill and reinforce the "piece of paper" concept with you over the years. Because he never was the marrying kind.

Your thoughts moved you to be more insightful, and your adventure with the OM showed you that you neither wanted the fantasy, nor the status quo with the live-in situation.


YOU WANTED MORE.

Now, you are here, and you are evaluating what has happened, how you got here, and wondering about your future relationship. You are grieving the ten years with XBF, wondering to yourself if this was "wasted time". No, not really. You learned much over those years, about what you love and like and don't like in a relationship.

But I will guarantee this: you will learn here that you do not want to go back to your XBF unless and until there is a marriage commitment for you. Why do I say that?

Because your learning curve has just begun, and you are on the rise. And I think your XBF will not meet your new criteria.


But Redwood - - - - - what this means is that the relationship you CHOOSE next, will be terrific, because you will choose it and choose right

because you will be a better person, and one who understands how marriage works.



Just my humble opinion.

SB,
Your humble opinions as always are awesome. I always feel as though I have learned something from your wisdom.
Thanks for sharing!!!

Long-time-no-write, but I'm still here....albeit barely. I have been busy reading and discovering things about myself I never knew, and that part has been really good. Challenging, but good. Steps in the right direction. But everything else going on feels like I am reaching my bottom.

I have been trying to be supportive of my XBF over the past month or so since I last wrote, and up until yesterday, I was still confident that I wanted to continue to try to work things out with him. I have been completely open and honest with him, trying to show him my love and remorse for what I did to him, and unfortunately, he started to withdraw.

He's so incredibly angry, rightfully so, and has stated he's not sure he'll ever be able to forgive me. He's still uncertain that reconciliation is even possible, but has agreed to consider couple's counceling after the new year. So why did I begin to question if I wanted to continue to try to work things out?

He began dating.

He's single. He has no obligations to me. He has no reason not to start dating. A reality that I'm trying to accept. But because I'm still so emotionally invested in him, it's a sick twist, but I feel like I'm being cheated on.

How I found out he's dating is what makes me feel so sick. I was leaving his house after spending my lunch hour hanging with the cats that he kept (I think I mentioned they are like our children and he has been letting me spend time with them about once a week while he's not there). As I was walking out to my car, something in my gut, something so incredibly strong, told me to check the paper recycling box. I think in my heart I knew I would find something, and sure enough, I did.

It was a piece of paper crumpled at the bottom that had his writing on it where he was basically practicing writing what he was going to say in either a letter or a Christmas card. Words about how hard this year has been but that he's pleasantly surprised at the recent evolution of "their friendship" and that he looks forward to what the new year holds for them. I lost my chit.

So this is what it feels like. This is what it feels like to be on the other side of the coin. No, he's not betraying me; I know it's NOT the same thing as what he felt finding out about my betrayal, I don't mean to imply that. We're no longer together and he's free to date. But it doesn't mean this doesn't hurt like hell. Especially this time of year.

I confronted him about it, and he admitted that he's been out on a few dates. He says he's not doing this to get back at me, though his extreme anger at me makes me question that statement. He says he's just trying to stay busy and keep his mind off things. Rebound? He said he's still not sure if he can get over what I've done to him, but that he's giving himself one year from D-day to figure out what he wants.

Whatever. Does it matter? I've come to the realization that while I still cling to the hope that we'll do couple's couceling soon (he agreed to consider it after I confronted him about his dating), I feel like I really need to start the process of detaching. To protect myself. To heal. To move on. Eventually I'm going to cause myself more damage than good if I continue to watch him date while he knows I'm waiting for him to decide what he wants.

I don't know how to do this anymore. I feel like giving up. Am I giving up too soon? Am I over-reacting? Am I just depressed because of this time of year? On Chistmas Eve, I am alone. This is just another consequence of my decision to cheat. Yeah, I'm pity-partying myself; I know I'm not the victim here. But I just don't know what to do or how to let go. I don't want to let him go.

I don't really have any questions for you guys; I just needed to vent. Thanks.

Merry Christmas...

If you give up now then he will know that deep down there was no such thing as reconciling with him, if the first sign of him dating you run off??? Then he will know that waiting to reconcile with you was the right choice and that you were not worth it.

BUT!!!

If u don't give up and you are still there even if he is dating and you stick to the plan then the waiting, the pain, the hurt, will all pay off!

But giving up now will for sure for sure not getting the the love of your life back.

Good luck and don't give up!

I know, I know. I really don't want to give up, I don't. And I told him I wouldn't. That his dating hasn't changed the fact that I want to get back together; told him I'm going to wait for him because I love him entirely too much to do anything else.

But he won't let me meet any of his emotional needs right now. In fact, ever since I apologized for hurting him and starting trying to show him my love and remorse, he got even angrier. Perhaps it was easier for him to feel like he was the one who stopped meeting my needs and my betrayal was his fault. Yes, in my wayward fog, I blame-shifted my cheating on him early on after D-day, but have since REPEATEDLY apologized for making him feel like it was his fault and have told him over and over how nothing was his fault, that it was entirely my own. He seems to accept this now, thankfully.

But since he's come to understand that I want to help him heal and recover and "fix" what I did to us, it seems like he's either completely withdrawn from me or he's expressing extreme anger towards me. I don't know what to think of that. Would actually like a BS's point of view on this....

He knows he's in the driver's seat and has the chance to give me the greatest gift of all (reconsiliation), and maybe this has brought him out of thinking he needed to let me go, and now that he knows he doesn't have to let me go, maybe it's brought him back into pain because he knows he has a choice to make? I don't know; that's probably an unfair assumption of me to make, but when I mentioned this to him (that he seemed nicer toward me before I started professing my love and apologies), he agreed but didn't have an answer as to why. Just said he's so angry and that I have no idea how angry he is....wants to kill the OM. Yikes.

Anyway, thanks for the encouragement not to give up yet. He is SO worth waiting for. And I hope he can see, by my actions, that I'm worth it too. In the mean time though, I need to read more on this forum on how to try to meet his needs when we're separated and he just wants to be "left alone". Left alone so he continue dating?! Sigh, that hurts....

Thanks Sapphire~

Hi Redwood,

I am glad you are back. Have you read School Bus' post? If so, read it again, in my opinion she has nailed it.

Let me ask you a question that has been asked many times on this site. "What would you do if you were not afraid?"

A lot of your responses is fear. Fear of being alone. Fear of losing something, even if you don't really value it. Fear of not being good enough. Fear of...

If you have been reading the books and articles are starting to get a glimpse of what a good relationship can be. Your exBF is not the only man who can, could, and will love you. BUT, first you must learn to love yourself and be proud of the things you have learned and the goals you have in your life.

What are your goals these days? Do you need exBF to achieve them? (Please ask me, please, I know the answer. He says jumping up and down. )

You have apologized, you are learning, you are growing, you have admitted you know what you really want and that is a real marriage with real depth to it. Your exBF is not offering you that. Indeed, he is dating someone else. She may be better for him, she may not. She may get a commitment out of him, she may not.

Really none of that matters. You are learning that the "feelings" of love are not necessarily the "actions" of love. And Frankly you need a man that loves you and his actions show it. You need to find a man that you love and your actions also show it. You and your exBF did not do this, and perhaps never will.

You are not "giving up" if you move on with your life and let him move on with his. If in the future, he can meet your needs and you can meet his, then perhaps something deeper will happen.

One last thing I thought I would offer you to as a Christmas gift. Consider what you have learned, consider what you know about yourself, and then reflect back on the marriages you know that failed. Did those people KNOW what you now know and are learning? I doubt it. Just as you realized that your affair with OM was "textbook", you will come to realize that a good marriage is also "textbook", it is not luck. People that know and understand what is on this whether they got it here or elsewhere have successful marriages.

That is your gift for the year. Knowledge that a good marriage is "textbook". It can and very likely will happen to you if that is what you want and seek.

God Bless,

JL

Long-time-no-reply. Just a quick update for anyone who may have been following my thread.

After several very difficult months of reflection and therapy, I finally came to the healthy decision to cause myself no more pain. My ex was clearly not interested in reconciliation, and my actions were doing nothing other than to keep my head suspended under a weight of guilt and frustration. It hit me one day like a ton of bricks to simply.....let go. And just like that, I did. I guess I was finally ready.

Shortly thereafter, I took a solo vacation somewhere peaceful and beautiful to allow myself some time for well-needed healing and peaceful reflection. I enjoyed 10 days of solitude and felt as though my recovery, my personal recovery, was finally here. It was such a wonderful feeling of freedom, such a happiness that I didn't realize had been missing from my life, my own self-imposed prison. A deep sigh of relief and contentment, and I was ready to start a new chapter in my life.

Such is the way the universe works, I met a wonderful man on the plane and we have become great friends and are well on our way to a storybook romance. Instead of allowing myself to fall head-over heals, I had learned enough about myself this past year to know that I needed to revisit Dr. Harley's books on how to have a great marriage. If this relationship continues to build and grow, I will be ready this time. And I think that may be the best gift I've given to myself. However, let me state for the record, that the wonderful folks here at MB played an integral role in my personal recovery; thank you from the bottom of my heart.

As a final parting twist to the story, my ex contacted me when I got back from my vacation and told me he misses me and wants to see me. Irony, no? Or is it simply testament to my new-found confidence and happiness? Regardless, I was open and honest with my ex and told him that I have met someone. And if things don't work out with this new man, I know fully well that I can stand on my own two feet....that I don't need my ex or any man to bring me balance and peace. I am my own light. My own breath fuels my life. And my smile is back

Thank you MB for helping me through an anormously difficult time in my life, as well as helping me to build a foundation for the next chapter in it. Cheers and best wishes to you all!

Ok, so you're still NOT divorced and still cheating.

NOT SO FAIRYTALE. Or maybe it is, because fairy tales are just that.

How is it that you jump from one to another so quickly? I don't get that. If you proclaim that "I don't need a man" then why don't you simply part ways with your bh, DIVORCE HIM, then work on yourself and date when you are properly healed?

After I divorced I worked on myself, didn't date for a year or two, and even then decided I wasn't yet ready to date for a little while longer. HEALING AND BECOMING WHOLE was priority. Not jumping onto some other guy or having an affair myself when I was separated. That IS NOT PROGRESS. In fact, it's downright dirty.

Peachy not to lessen what you said in any way but they are not married they have been together 10 years but not married so what timeline is advisable in this situation before dating if there is no divorce because they never got married?

Met someone on the plane? Wow. It is nice to date new guys for sure.

It is a good thing you and your boyfriend were not legally married so you are ethically free to do so.


I do hope you find a good guy who you want to tie the knot with and who wants to tie one with you.

Peace.

The fact that I never married my ex and yet posted asking for help from a marriage building website was a realization that I certainly took some 2x4s for, believe me. But I think that's the beauty of this program; it enabled me to understand why a marriage between my ex and I would never have worked, as hard as I might've tried. However, that's where the real beauty comes in: now I know what lies ahead for when I am ready to marry.

God Bless!

Good luck.

wow you took some 2x4's

Good luck on creating the new you......

Respect honey

Just wanting to say then, if you're not married, GLAD you're letting the long term BF go so he can find somebody he can marry and maybe you'll do the same.


Hopefully this was a huge learning experience for you.