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#2810213 07/09/14 09:15 PM
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So here is my story. Had a feeling that something wasn't right for about a month, finally confronted my wife on 6/8, and told her that my worst fear was her in contact with her ex-fiance. She admitted that she had been in e-mail contact with him a few times a year from 2006-2011, until he got a divorce and she felt that it would lead to a bad place and cut off contact. I saw some of her old e-mails, and had an AO. Started digging more and more, found out that she had a lot of text & a 90 min phone conversation from 16-23 Apr. She told me it was a week long EA, and she cut him off after that. I was devastated, but by Thursday, started reading SAA, and thought we could work through it, as a lot of it made sense, and I felt that she was neglected for 11 years. On that Sunday, she wrote him an e-mail in front of me, telling him that she wanted no contact and that the memories they shared were mostly bad...Then next day, I got a phone call from him, and then forwarded me a number of e-mails, pictures, etc. Apparently contact did not end 23 Apr, in fact, they just moved it to her work phone & a secret e-mail, he actually flew into town on 4 June, and she had 2 hr lunch date, and later on that night, went and visited him at his hotel for 2 hrs, while she was supposed to be in a work out class, and they did in fact have an PA. And one of the e-mail he sent was sent by her that morning, telling him very nicely that it's over, and don't blackmail her. He also informed me that back in 2006, while I was out of the country for a year, she had 3 ONS. Over the past 3 weeks, we have talked a lot, and she confessed to the ONS, and the reason being that she had gained a lot of weight during that time, was very stressed with school & work, and also was convinced that I was unfaithful that year being out of country, due to the fact that I was in Korea, and there were a lot of stories she was hearing from some acquintances on how guys behave when they are over there. So she went out some, each time, got drunk, and needed that attention from guys, and feeling wanted, etc. This time, when he contacted her out of the blue, she started communication because she wanted to hear how he regretted not marrying her 12 yrs ago, and it was the biggest mistake of his life, and basically wanted to string him along to hurt him, as that relationship ended when he became physically abusive. As their communication went on, she got sucked into hearing how he loves her, and getting the EN of affection and admiration met that I was not meeting (admittedly, she's very correct). She begged me to stay and told me that she always loved me and was just sucked in and didn't know how to get out, and at the time, she didn't know if I was still married to her because of obligation and kids, but she didn't feel like I was in love with her, and thought that I just needed an opportunity to end it.

I whole heartedly believe that she was neglected in her ENs, as was I. I didn't grow up in a family that showed affection at all, and she has tried countless times to get us to go on dates more, to show her that I loved her, but time and again, I failed to do that because of stubbornness and a sense of safety because I was content, and she acted happy most of the time, so there was almost no danger signal. In hindsight, there are so many things I would do differently.

For the past 3 weeks, she has been everything I could ask for in terms of showing regret, apologetic, meeting my EN, answering every single one of my questions, and even told me that on 5/16, she drove 3 hrs to see him in another city, they talked for 2 hrs, but had ajoining hotel rooms and nothing physical happened other than an awkward kiss, and she went to see him to show off how good she looks now, and didn't think anything was going to happen then maybe a kiss. Also confessed in 2007, she drove an hr to another city when he flew through and they had dinner, went on a tour, hike and shared a kiss.

We talked more over the past 3 weeks, and are more open and honest than the past 11 years, and we are both committed to make this marriage work, that is why I'm posting on the recovery page, even though it all happened not so long ago, and I still feel in shock at times. My question is how I can get past her behavior, even though I do love her, the disrespect she has shown me, the humiliation that I feel, the gut wrenching pain that she was willing to do everything, and thought it was ok as long as I didn't know kills me. The mind movies are a bear, and the thought that she willingly allowed other guys to use her like that makes me feel like I can't breath. Pretty cliched, and I'm sure a lot of people on here can relate. I'm just taking it one day at a time, and do enjoy the time we spend together, but the hurt just doesn't seem to go away...We are both in IC now, to work through some of our own issues, will probably do MC after that. We follow most of the MB rules, other than the fact that I can't stop talking about the A & we haven't had full exposure, partially because it doesn't seem necessary as there is definitely NC, and my parents would not be able to forgive something like this, ever. Any advice on how we can move forward would be greatly appreciated, and I wish for some affirmation that the pain would go away...without taking the lessons I learned.

Last edited by Hopeful79; 07/09/14 09:19 PM.

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It would be wise to ask the mods to move this thread to Surviving an Affair. It is way to soon to call this recovery. Affair addictions are very strong, and your wife has been at it for a very long time.

You would do well to read the book "Surviving an Affair". It presents the master blueprint for recovery. Recovery starts with exposure. Who have you told about this affair?


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Read the book, and it was very enlightening. We have seen a pastor a few times. We've each told a few friends, and her parents know about everything other than the PA and her driving to see him, as she was supposed to have spent that night with them, so it would crush them on both accounts, being as devout as they are to their faith.


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You should fully expose her affair

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In addition to exposing her affair. She needs to put EPS in place. Has she changed all her contact information? Have you both been tested for STD/I?


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Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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We are struggling with the exposure due to the fact that people that we currently live about 3 hrs away from family, and will be moving very soon half way across the country for my job, so it doesn't seem like it would help as no one will be in our lives that much. And OM is divorced, lives very far away as well. Another reason is that I do feel like she was looking for closure on that relationship, which she does have now, and I don't think NC is a problem, at least not for a few years. No STD test yet, as the 3 ONS was 8 yrs ago, and the recent A only had one incidents of PA, and she used protection for all of them. But might need to test for STD regardless, understand the need, just hasn't got around to it.


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I suggest you listen to the radio show from yesterday and Dr Harley's explanation about exposure.


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Sorry you are here but welcome. You have some wonderful people posting to you already.

One thing stuck out immediately to me:

Quote
FWW: 34
D-Day: 6/8/14

It is waaaaayyyyy too early for her to have earned her "F".

First, while it's great that you two have "reconnected" and she seems remorseful but she has a long history of a SSL (secret second life) and having poor boundaries with men and allowing needs to be met outside of the marriage. These are things that have likely become a bad habit and she will need to be monitored closely (quietly) for a long time.

Secondly, given the fact that she is a possible ?? serial cheater, this is no time to be cutting corners. Exposure is the first step. Everyone who is supportive of your marriage regardless of where they live should be told about all of her affairs.

Third, you did not answer the post by BH about what EPs are being taken by your W to prevent this from happening again.


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Originally Posted by Hopeful79
No STD test yet, as the 3 ONS was 8 yrs ago, and the recent A only had one incidents of PA, and she used protection for all of them. But might need to test for STD regardless, understand the need, just hasn't got around to it.

Not only would I recommend the STD test ASAP - but I would consider a poly to make sure you have the entire truth.

I am very sorry to tell you that I would not be surprised if there were other men in her SSL that you did not know about. Four affairs, 3 being ONS, is not the normal oops-I-let-someon- meet-my-ENs and don't know what happened cheater - it's a sign that she is a serial cheater.


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Sir,
You need to expose if you want to follow Dr. Harley's plan.
What you are doing is actually enabling by helping her maintain a secret second life.

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This isn't a plan where you pick and choose what you want to follow.
Dr. Harley is very clear that the smallest deviations from his plans often result in disaster.

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We will probably expose to her parents, brother/sister-in-law, and some of her other closest friends. STD test is being considered, and she's agreed to take a poly, though I'm not certain we will go through with that yet. I understanding where everyone's coming from, and probably has seen a million times where someone's on here saying "well, my situation is a little different..." It is difficult, and at this point, I feel like what's best for us is to expose it to them as one, rather than me doing it.

Her EP is deleted her old e-mail which he has the address to, she doesn't have access to the secret e-mail account anymore due to the fact that he opened the account, and shut it down shortly after she sent him the NC letter. She's never on the computer anymore at home, and most of the contact was through the secret e-mail from work place, which she has 2 more days of work left, due to our upcoming move. I am checking her personal e-mail, work e-mail, facebook, etc, as well as her phone. We also agreed that she will not drink anymore, which she hasn't really done for the past 8 years anyways. We are also trying to POJA all decisions, and try to spend time together, getting probably close to 25-30 hrs per week right now.

I feel like though it's all cheating the 2 incidences are some what unrelated, one being letting herself be in situation when she's depressed & drinking out in a bar, with some folks that weren't the best of influence. And the most recent one being old relationship that she never had closure in, and wanted to get back at him for hurting her emotionally & physically. Know cheating is cheating, and some of her own characteristics is behind it all, but the situations were different...

We are also both in IC right now, 3 sessions for me and 1 for her so far, mainly for me to deal with the situation and for her to understand why she had such a high need for approval/attention from others. She mentioned that year that I was gone was a very dark place for her, gained a lot of weight, sure that I was cheating, stress, lonely, and was very depressed, to the point of being suicidal.



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Do you have the book SAA?

Have you seen this?
From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.

Extraordinary Precaution


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Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Yes, we have the book and read it. And have done all of the above. In fact, we just got off the phone w/her parents and told them everything. We are planning on telling more this upcoming weekend.


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Why hasn't she changed all her contact information?


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Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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She has gotten rid of her personal e-mail accounts, we blocked his phone from our numbers, as well as linked-in, he's not on facebook, and I have access to her facebook account. She's willing to get a new number, but we haven't got around to it yet.

I was actually the one hesitant for her to get rid of the personal e-mail, not sure why exactly, probably subconsciously I thought that if he tried to contact her through that, I would have a pretty good chance of seeing it...But realistically doesn't make sense, as if she wanted contact, she could easily start a new secret e-mail.


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Hopeful,
She should eliminate all forms of contact.

Edit: you dont need counseling to find out why she had affairs. She. ad affairs due to a lack of boundaries around the opposite sex.
At this point, you should drop counseling and focus exclusively on Dr Harleys Surviving Surviving an Affair recovery plan

Last edited by Jedi_Knight; 07/17/14 11:11 PM.
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He has eliminated all forms of contact. We are in IC not to find out why she had affairs. We know already, especially the recent one, being her need for closure & loving to hear how he regret it and thought he had ruined his one chance at happiness, and wanted to take revenge by leading him on. In the process, she allowed him to fill her unmet emotional needs, etc. We are in IC for me to work out some of my issues with this affair, and also to deal with her self esteem; strong need for affirmation; inability to set boundaries; to deal with some of her demons. We are committed to the SAA plan as a plan for recover.


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Originally Posted by Hopeful79
He has eliminated all forms of contact. We are in IC not to find out why she had affairs. We know already, especially the recent one, being her need for closure & loving to hear how he regret it and thought he had ruined his one chance at happiness, and wanted to take revenge by leading him on. In the process, she allowed him to fill her unmet emotional needs, etc. We are in IC for me to work out some of my issues with this affair, and also to deal with her self esteem; strong need for affirmation; inability to set boundaries; to deal with some of her demons. We are committed to the SAA plan as a plan for recover.

Wrong, the reason for the A was poor boundaries with the OS. Everything else is an excuse and a way to rationalize teh A.

Now it is important to meet each other's needs but the boundary issue is what needs to be addressed to prevent another affair.

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Originally Posted by Hopeful79
We are in IC not to find out why she had affairs. We know already, especially the recent one, being her need for closure & loving to hear how he regret it and thought he had ruined his one chance at happiness, and wanted to take revenge by leading him on. In the process, she allowed him to fill her unmet emotional needs, etc.

Her need for closure is not why she had an affair.

She has had FOUR affairs - she has a LONG history of a secret second life and looking to get needs met outside of the marriage. She is most likely a serial cheater.

You need to set up a lifestyle in which cheating will be impossible for her.

And like I told you earlier in this thread, I would be very cautious in trusting that you have the full truth...because I would not be surprised at all if there are other things in her SSL that you do not know about.

When I arrived here, my ex WH had had one EA and one ONS. I was advised to have him poly'd and I ignored that advice. There was much that he kept hidden from me and we struggled on in a false recovery after the honeymoon period ended.

I would STRONGLY urge you again to consider a poly.


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