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Originally Posted by LongWayFromHome
We have been married for 35 years and our marriage was okay, then awful, then okay, but now, because we both followed MB for the past four years, our marriage is way better than it ever has been! We have a very romantic, passionate, safe marriage now.

And you're in the prime position of drawing your wife back to you. It's much easier for the husband to woo his wife back using MB than it is for a wife to draw her husband back to her.

Man it has been a while since I have wooed. I just don't want to come off like a used car salesman pitching our marriage. I see the benefit of it done in the proper way though. How can she ever "love" me the way she feels she should if we don't connect with each other? I really wish I had seen this stuff years ago.

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Originally Posted by Texan44
Originally Posted by LongWayFromHome
We have been married for 35 years and our marriage was okay, then awful, then okay, but now, because we both followed MB for the past four years, our marriage is way better than it ever has been! We have a very romantic, passionate, safe marriage now.

And you're in the prime position of drawing your wife back to you. It's much easier for the husband to woo his wife back using MB than it is for a wife to draw her husband back to her.

Man it has been a while since I have wooed. I just don't want to come off like a used car salesman pitching our marriage. I see the benefit of it done in the proper way though. How can she ever "love" me the way she feels she should if we don't connect with each other? I really wish I had seen this stuff years ago.


Use us as coaches!

How have you met your wife's needs today?

Are you responding to any complaints?



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Originally Posted by indiegirl
Use us as coaches!

How have you met your wife's needs today?

Are you responding to any complaints?

I am actually eager to make some changes in our relationship and I appreciate the coaching. She is very stand-offish right now. This whole talk and the emotional fallout from it is from 4 days ago. She is still willing to talk most of the time but she is also keeping me at arms length emotionally. It is a very difficult situation because I don't know how I can move forward without her really being on board and she has made no verbal assent to making marital amends together. I'm not pretending that everything is hunky-dory but I am trying to be affectionate (not physically because although she doesn't pull away she just doesn't seem responsive and I don't think bombarding her with unwanted physical affection is a good thing at this point) and responsive. I have been helping her with her homework, cooking meals for the family, helping clean, the usual things to try and show her I am contributing and that I want to provide for her needs. I think she is still relying on her sister for most of her emotional support because of the awkward situation between us. They talk 2 or 3 times a day.

As for complaints the biggest one is her feeling that I was just absent even though I was in the house with her. I have quit all gaming. I have to accept that although it's something I like to do it has become a problem more than once and I just can't use it as a crutch because it excludes my family. Her other complaint is of my physical state which isn't what I want either. I have gained about 50 lbs over the last 2 years and it's not attractive. My doctor told me last visit I really need to lose at least 30 ASAP because it has negatively contributed to my overall health. When I feel like crap emotionally I find it hard to eat, but it's one hell of a bad way to lose weight. I will probably start Weight Watchers or some structured plan to lose the weight. I realize that I need this regardless of my marriage, but hey, it can't hurt to look better.

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Try some non physical affection.

Notes, flowers, her favourite treat?



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Do you think you would both enjoy going to the gym together?



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Originally Posted by indiegirl
Do you think you would both enjoy going to the gym together?

With her being unemployed 2 gym memberships (well 3 because our son would have to come as well he's only 10) is just not possible. I definitely write her nice txts during the day and have been very encouraging and helpful in her school work. I address her with terms of endearment and try to make my responses loving even when we're having awkward discussions. If she has mentally and emotionally disconnected from me, by circumstance or by choice, how can I change her mind? This is the most frightening aspect of what I am going through.

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Originally Posted by Texan44
I have been helping her with her homework, cooking meals for the family, helping clean, the usual things to try and show her I am contributing and that I want to provide for her needs.

You need to make romantic gestures. Doing house chores is not going to bring on romantic feelings of being wanted and wooed. As Indie said buy her flowers or thoughtful gifts you know she would enjoy. Simple notes to let her know you are thinking about her and love her. I would stay away from getting too syrupy. And stop talking to her your relationship vs doing. I am not saying not to talk but don't have endless conversations about the past or how horrible x, y, and z are.

Maybe ask her if she would like to go on a weekend getaway...just the two of you. Or offer to go to a comedy club, a play or some activity you think she may enjoy.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Texan, they have gyms where it costs $10/mo and even $5/mo to add on family members...no contracts. These gyms even have free childcare. Why couldn't you leave your son at home for an hr? Are you in a rural area?


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Originally Posted by Texan44
[As for complaints the biggest one is her feeling that I was just absent even though I was in the house with her. I have quit all gaming. I have to accept that although it's something I like to do it has become a problem more than once and I just can't use it as a crutch because it excludes my family. Her other complaint is of my physical state which isn't what I want either. I have gained about 50 lbs over the last 2 years and it's not attractive. My doctor told me last visit I really need to lose at least 30 ASAP because it has negatively contributed to my overall health. When I feel like crap emotionally I find it hard to eat, but it's one hell of a bad way to lose weight. I will probably start Weight Watchers or some structured plan to lose the weight. I realize that I need this regardless of my marriage, but hey, it can't hurt to look better.

Texan, I am just catching up on your thread and I agree with the others. I would approach your wife with a PLAN, though. She has no reason to believe anything will change if there is no plan here. Having no plan is a plan to fail.

I would get the books, Fall in Love, Stay in Love and the workbook, 5 Steps to Romantic Love. Read the book and sell her on this program. You can turn your marriage around by changing your habits, but you have to have a PLAN to do that.

The most impactful, effective thing you can do for your marriage is to start going on 4 - 4 hour dates a week out of the house. That will help you fall in love again and it happens fairly quickly. Dates out of the house are dramatically different from spending time alone at home because you look nice and are more energetic. Dr. Harley recommends sitting down every Sunday afternoon and planning out your week together using this schedule: http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forms/FiveSteps_Time_for_Undivided_Attention_Worksheet.pdf

It will take a radical change in your habits to pull your marriage out of this ditch. I think it is good that you are helping around house, but that will do nothing to restore the romance in your marriage.

Please read this article and print it out and show to your wife: How to Create Your Own Plan to Resolve Conflicts and Restore Love to Your Marriage


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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I would also listen to the radio show every day. You will become very educated in this program very quickly. There is a free app you can download on your phone. I listen to it every day on my way home from work. http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi4200_radio.html


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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For today I am planning to surprise her at home with some lunch. Lets hope all goes well.

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Well I brought my wife lunch as a surprise. She seemed pleased but not overjoyed (I didn't expect her to be). I asked her to think of an activity that she really enjoys, or something that she really wants to do (concert, etc) and basically asked her out on a date. She said she'd think of what to do. It wasn't an energetic YES but hell it wasn't a no either. Hope this is the first in a string of many more developments to come. I've ordered His Needs, Her Needs and will start on it ASAP. Thanks so much again for the inspiration and encouragement.

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If you want a great way to lose weight I highly recommend a low carb/ketogenic diet. You can find everything you need to know online. It would be especially beneficial to you because:
-it doesn't cost anything
-it keeps your blood sugar stable which helps your mood and
-will help you manage stress and resist addictive behaviors
-you can start today

Don't underestimate the power of saying, especially in writing, that you are going to become and be the husband she needs from this day forward. Write about how you know you abandoned her for video games and you will never abandon her again.
Plan a date you think she will like, a specific day, time and activity and present her with your plan using the words "how would you feel about...." Then be positive and enthusiastic even if she doesn't like all or part of your idea.
Don't be mopey no matter how discouraged you feel.
POJA everything!! Say "how would you feel about me..." Before almost everything you plan to do even if you are pretty sure she is fine/doesn't care. 100% eliminating independent behavior is a marvelous way to make deposits with a withdrawn wife.

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Originally Posted by Texan44
Well I brought my wife lunch as a surprise. She seemed pleased but not overjoyed (I didn't expect her to be). I asked her to think of an activity that she really enjoys, or something that she really wants to do (concert, etc) and basically asked her out on a date. She said she'd think of what to do. It wasn't an energetic YES but hell it wasn't a no either. Hope this is the first in a string of many more developments to come. I've ordered His Needs, Her Needs and will start on it ASAP. Thanks so much again for the inspiration and encouragement.

What kinds of things did you used to do on dates when you were trying to win her love? Make sure you eliminate ALL your love busters. Even a "small" one can be disastrous.

What do you remember that she loved about you? Have you gained weight? Lose it! Although Physical Attractiveness is not in the top five for most women, it is still important. And for those for whom it IS in the top five, looking good is essential.

Get a babysitter lined up so you and your wife can get out of the house on dates. The dates can be cheap like a walk in the park and a coffee at the mall. The conversation should be fun and enjoyable, not heavy.

Do you like games? Will your wife join you in playing board games? We love games and use it as one of our recreational activities.

Keep up the effort with your wife. One day, if you stick to the plan, her love bank threshold will overflow and she'll be in love with you.


Married 1980
DDay Nov 2010

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My wife is definitely not the "typical woman" in all ways. For one she is actually more visually stimulated than perhaps most other women, so attractiveness is actually in her top 5. She is not a "lights out" sort of woman. In the past she overlooked some of the attractiveness deficit from weight gain simply because I was me. I'm guessing when my actions changed her perceptions of me a threshold was crossed and she no longer found it simple to overlook what she previously had? I have already started on a hybrid WW-points/low-carb diet and lost about 8 of the 40+ pounds I need to lose. Just need to keep it going and also get some workout time to keep my muscle mass up while losing the fat lbs.

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Originally Posted by LongWayFromHome
What kinds of things did you used to do on dates when you were trying to win her love? Make sure you eliminate ALL your love busters. Even a "small" one can be disastrous.

What do you remember that she loved about you? Have you gained weight? Lose it! Although Physical Attractiveness is not in the top five for most women, it is still important. And for those for whom it IS in the top five, looking good is essential.

Get a babysitter lined up so you and your wife can get out of the house on dates. The dates can be cheap like a walk in the park and a coffee at the mall. The conversation should be fun and enjoyable, not heavy.

Do you like games? Will your wife join you in playing board games? We love games and use it as one of our recreational activities.

Keep up the effort with your wife. One day, if you stick to the plan, her love bank threshold will overflow and she'll be in love with you.

We used to just sit and listen to music, do artistic sorts of things, visit museums and parks. Lots of things where there were minimal distractions from spending time together. My "Entertainment" preferences are definitely much more digital these days and I need to wean myself from that. Especially for the date or alone time.

My wife is Canadian and unfortunately all her family are there and we are here in Texas. My mother loves to watch my 10 year old and does so often, so that is a plus. I have already bought tickets to a concert I know she is really wanting to see, but that is in May. I will have to find at least 2 good date ideas per week until then I'm thinking. Because of my work and her school schedule I really don't see it possible to leave home for 4 hours more than once during the week and 1 day on the weekend. I sat for 3 hours today and helped her with her statistics homework. I know that doesn't count as romance points, though. I play guitar and have thought of learning some of her favorite songs so I can play and sing to her.

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Because of my work and her school schedule I really don't see it possible to leave home for 4 hours more than once during the week and 1 day on the weekend.
As long as work and school take priority over UA and your marriage, the program is not going to work for you.


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Originally Posted by Texan44
[Because of my work and her school schedule I really don't see it possible to leave home for 4 hours more than once during the week and 1 day on the weekend. I sat for 3 hours today and helped her with her statistics homework. I know that doesn't count as romance points, though. I play guitar and have thought of learning some of her favorite songs so I can play and sing to her.

Then it won't be possible to change your marriage, sorry. frown How do you find the time to go to work? School? You seem to find the time to do less important things. The problem is that you won't ever have a marriage if it is not a priority. As long as everything else comes first, this is a hopeless venture.

When Dr. Harley was in active private practice, he would REFUSE to counsel any clients who would not commit to AT LEAST 15 hours of UA time per week because his program does not work without it.

And thats fine if you refuse to do this step. Just accept that your marriage won't EVER change. EVER.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
Our program for recovery only works when it's followed. The 15 hours of undivided attention we recommend is an essential part of the program because it provides the opportunity to meet emotional needs that cannot be met any other way. There are lots of excuses for failing to follow that aspect of our program, but in the end, failure to follow it results in a failed recovery.

If we saw that both of you were recovering well, I'd say that you are one of the very rare exceptions to the need to spend 15 hours a week together. But, since you are not recovering well, we can only conclude that your failure to spend enough time together, and make good use of that time meeting each other's emotional needs, is the culprit.
here


Originally Posted by Dr Bill Harley
My program of marriage recovery is exactly the same as most weight loss programs. Whenever it's followed, the marriage recovers. I know of no other program of marital recovery that can make that claim. In fact, if you follow the advice of most marriage recovery programs today, your marriage will not recover. That's why a 1995 Consumer's Report survey found marriage counseling to be the least effective form of psychotherapy. Only 16% found the experience to be helpful.

For those who complete my program of marital recovery, 100% find the experience to be more than helpful -- it solves their marital problems. But just like in dieting, the successful outcome depends entirely on motivation. Only those who are not motivated enough to complete the program fail.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Let me put this another way, Texan. Your habit of making your marriage the last priority in your lives is why you are in this bad place. You have clearly not made time for your marriage and you can see the result. Unless you change your lives to make your marriage the FIRST priority, nothing will ever change. Fiddling around the edges will make no difference whatsoever.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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