ProChoice - you could be describing me.

Ever hear of the absentminded professor? The idiot-savant?

I'm no scientist, but I am a computer programmer and business owner (which is successful when I remember to invoice people...) I am SMART. But I am also so spacey it's hard to describe. And it's relentless. One minute something is in my hand, the next it's not. Just today I caught myself daydreaming while my husband was talking and I tried to refocus, but within a second, I realized I'd started thinking about how bad my attention span is and how I need to pay attention - instead of listening to what he was saying! I'll give a good illustration of how bad it can be below.

BUT... I want to say, please understand that everyone has their shortcomings and just because your wife is super smart does not mean she is deliberately forgetting things. In fact, ADD seems to go hand in hand with being smart - the mind being on things other than what one is physically doing.

One thing I have noticed with me is that stress totally exacerbates how spacey I am. So, I am stressed by personal problems in my marriage, and I get even spacier, which annoys my husband, which stresses me out more, which makes me even more panicked about it and spacier. It's a vicious cycle. (Though my husband sometimes gets annoyed but he never punishes me, he just tries to laugh it off and focus on the fact that my spaciness comes with the blessing that my attention span is too short to hold a grudge or sweat small things in general. He jokes that he could buy a new car and I wouldn't even notice. Which is quite possibly literally true.)

Also know that I feel terrible and embarrassed about being so spacey and I bet your wife does too. Why would she leave the papers behind or leave the door open on purpose? Don't you think she would stop that if she felt she could?

My point is, I know it's annoying, but if you don't interpret her spaciness as "she doesn't care about me" it may be easier for you to not get angry with her over it.

There may be things she can do to improve, I'm trying meditation and exercise, but until she feels safe and loved as she is, she'll probably be too tense and preoccupied for things like this to work.

Here is my worst story just to put your wife in perspective:

I talking on my cell phone with my husband when I was at the dog park. Suddenly a friend came up and wanted to take a picture with me. I said "Hang on" to hubby and slid my phone in my pocket. They took the picture. Then we started talking. And laughing. And talking...

Suddenly I remember I was talking with my husband, but I had no idea why my phone was in my pocket. I felt this horrible wave of guilt and shame go over me. I picked the phone back up and hubby was like - WTH happened? I felt so bad for him but I literally didn't remember why I put the phone in my pocket in the middle of a sentence. I felt like an incompetent imbecile. I didn't know what to say and there were all these friends around, so I liked and said the dog got loose, thinking I'd fess up later. Of course he said "No they didn't. I just sat here listening to you talk with people for five minutes."

I felt so bad and so guilty but I really didn't know what had happened. I thought - who does that? What is wrong with me? Later I kept thinking about it and finally remembered the picture taking incident.

The main point is that I feel horrible and ashamed when I do those things and I imagine your wife does too. But they are not conscious actions/choices. Yes, improvement may be possible, but it is the way your wife is wired and not something she can just "stop doing" overnight, and punishing her will probably stress her out and make it worse instead of better.

Something else to think about - my husband is also sarcastic and used to ridicule me all the time. My "idiocy" was the butt of almost every joke. Like I think you said before about yourself, that is his humor/style, but at some point it went from funny to very hurtful to me. It really started to affect my self esteem. Everyone else thought I was brilliant but I felt bad about myself when I was around my husband. You don't need the point of comparison of an affair to realize you feel better about yourself with everyone other than your spouse... He has pretty much stopped that thanks to MB and I feel great relief and I like being around him a lot more.

**EDIT**

If you can talk to her immediately about it without being disrespectful, do that. If you begin to get angry trying to talk to her immediately about, then do not. Wait until you can talk to her about it without getting angry. Making a big list and then having a once a week discussion about it might make her feel ambushed.

My comment about seriousness was not meant as a cheap shot. You have consistently been combative and dismissive with the members here which makes it hard to consider your approach serious.

Nobody really posts here to make friends, and as I read that I wonder if you think that your wife was posting here to make friends? As if that's a difference between you two?

People come here because they are desperate and their world is falling apart, and they want help. And the ones who are serious accept the help that is given to them.

Also, who is working on identifying your DJs?

You need to notify the moderators and ask to have your thread moved. I doubt they would honor your request, though, because you are nowhere close to recovery.

This WILL NOT WORK.
Follow the program.
Write the DJs down on the worksheet, and share them once a week.
DO NOT discuss them when they happen. This will only lead to disaster.

Do NOT do this.

Ax, you are giving advice contrary to Dr. Harley's program.

You don't make a big list and then have a big discussion. You just pass the list. The list has all the information that is needed, and there doesn't need to be a discussion about it.

ProChoice,

This self-help approach you are trying is not going to work. Too many years on your part of disrespect, violence and independent (secretive) behavior on your part to change and improve on your own. You don't have to try to convince anyone on here as to your good intentions and give promises that you have changed - the only important people to PROVE it to are your wife and your kids, and of course, yourself.

Tom

I respect you and markos more than pretty much anyone on the board with regards to this particular topic, so the following statement is seeking clarification rather than offering an objection to your comments:

I've heard many times both on the radio show and on here that respectful complaining is a prerequisite for a marriage of extraordinary care and also the policy of radical honesty. I've similarly heard repeatedly if the spouse is an emotional person that they need to remove themselves from the situation to calm down first, and then address the issue when they can do so without lovebusting.

If a spouse immediately complains about a lovebusting behavior without being disrespectful, how is this contrary to the MB program? Is complaining about it conversationally contrary to the MB program even if it is respectful? Or is it more doing it promptly that is wrong?

Very few couples who are going through the program can complain face to face without it leading to a fight. Dr. Harley has provided lovebuster forms for the couple to use. Whenever a spouse lovebusts the other, he or she does not respond immediately to the lovebusting. Instead, he or she writes the incident on the form with a date and short description. Once a week, the couple shares their lovebuster form with the other. They are not to discuss it. It is for information only.

This method protects the couple that struggle with lovebusters from punishing each other. It is a safe way to pass information on.

Even today, markos and I do not discuss lovebusters face to face (rare that they may be now). We stick to written communication. It's safer.

Prochoice is a man who struggles with angry outbursts, disrespect and demands. He is in no position to discuss lovebusters with his wife face to face. She needs the protection of written communication: Dr. Harley's forms. Anything else is just an avenue for him to continue to lovebust her.

And he really can't complain at all until his angry outbursts are eliminated altogether. Nothing else can be solved as long as that problem is in the marriage.

That all makes a lot of sense. Thank you.

I have been doing everything I have been told, no good.

What if I think my wife is currently having an affair but I can't prove it. She stopped texting me, she stopped waking up to have breakfast with me, she started avoiding me, she cancelled our date, she called our baby sitter and asked her not to come and:

She just handed me divorce papers yesterday to read.

I said lets talk about it. She said NO, I'm done. I tried to give her a kiss and she said to stop depositing love units in her love bank. Wasn't that the point? I asked, she said not that way. I don't get it if she isn't clear.

What is your question for us?

I don't know. None, I guess. It is what it is then.

Prochoice,

what is the readon you should think your wife has an affair? She did not make any alarm bells ring in that respect before she stopped posting. It is sensible to want to be on the safe side, but in your case I would rather be very careful to avoid anything that will negatively affect your love bank balance in her account, if you are serious about saving your family.

How are you doing? Have you managed to find a good anger management course yet?

Of course you have every right to take the high road and let your wife go, as the damage to your relationship has been severe in the past. Still, either for you current, or for any future relationship, following the MB program in combination with anger management will be extremely valuable to you.

Do you hear MB radio daily? Although not every program is directly relevant to your situation, you can learn a new way of insight in the situations of other people, that will help you in the long run.

Wether your wife leaves you because of the love busters and your anger problem or over somebody else, the remedy is the same:
You have the privilege to become a better man, who has himself 100% under control. A rock, other people look up to. A person who behaves with integrity and empathy at home where nobody can see him just as he does where anybody can see him.

Regardless of anything else, your wife and your family are hurt. You can find the strenght to heal the situation by becoming a better person. By doing away with the dark side and becoming a true, compassionate hero in this story.
Whatever the circumstances, you can become a person who walks upright, because he does what is right, not what serves himself.

Thank you happyheart for actually posting back. I think it is unfair.
I think she is having an affair because she is acting exactly like she did when she had one. She started avoiding me last week, so I left her alone until I saw she was ignoring me more and more and walking away from me when I walked close to her. She did exactly that 5 years ago, except that 5 years ago, i went after her and moved to an entirely new country, leaving my job and parents behind. I never suspected an affair then, because we were together 24/7 yet she was in full affair. Now she has more reasons. we are no longer together all day. she has access to unlimited computers at the University AND because she is the only female in her research group.

You keep ignoring everyone's question about this.

Are you in anger management? Have you found an anger management program?

That's great but it is more important to find out if the proven cheater is at it again. Why don't we find out if the known tramp is acting up before we kill her husband.

A FWW is a "known tramp"?

So, how are things between you and Trueform, Late?