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Jess,

You wrote, How can people get over their affair addiction??

They never do, a former neighbor of mine talked about her alcoholic husband and how he had to face the fact that he would always be alcoholic for the rest of his life. So it is with affair partners the unfaithful remain addicted to them for life. This would also apply to you or I if we had gotten into an affair.

In one of Dr Harleys radio shows he said that the unconditional approval a cheater get from their affair partner is a very very powerful psychological force.

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Originally Posted by JessHopeful
I so desperately want to work things out with my husband. I do not want a divorce, I want his love, I want a united family, and we were also only just 2 months ago planning a second addition to the family. I do not have time on my hands. I am almost 41 and if I have any hope of becoming a mother a second time, I need to do so sooner than later. But I also understand that you cannot rush or push someone into doing something that they do not want to either.

Having a child would be a horrible idea. I hope you are not so desperate that you would bring another child into this nightmare.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by JessHopeful
From the start I felt insecure with him and thus I did and said things which were hurtful.

Jess, welcome to Marriage Builders. I am sorry for the reasons that have brought you here. It sounds like he has been actively pursuing women almost from the start. The issue is his philosophy of marriage, which is that he feels free to pursue other women. So of course you would be "insecure." That is the normal reaction to a playah.

Dr. Harley would advise you to expose his affair and then separate and go into Plan B. He will destroy your mental and physical health if this continues. Please take your time and read up on Plan B.

x 2

I don't see much hope here. For your son's sake I hope you go into Plan B and file for legal separation/divorce if you need financial support.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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Thank you everyone for your advice.

Just to clear up a few things, I'll add some more info. Last June my husband told the OW to leave him alone because he just wanted to focus on his son, thinking it was over for us as I kicked him out. He kept in constant contact with me during the 6 months that we were separated and he regularly came to visit to see our son. We did a lot of "family" stuff together too for my son's sake. It gave me hope that he wanted to restore our marriage and he also started to feel lovey dovey with me too during that time. In December we said let's give it a shot and he moved back in, after we both agreed to try and after a stupid ex-counsellor we had insisted we do it by the end of Sept instead of later that year. The counsellor's advice was "bite the bullet" and move in together and try to work on the marriage. Only problem was we had no specific program or were taught no specific techniques to help us through this transition. We stopped seeing that counsellor and started seeing another, but I've always felt we have never been given any practical advice as to what to do next. We truly were "winging it" so to speak, and that I believe has cost us a lot. We both went back to our old ways, me being controlling and nagging him about smoking and other stuff. Some of the nagging was about people he befriended on facebook and I would ask him why he would do that and he needed to watch his boundaries; or it might be about stuff that needed to get done around the house or . I got upset with him about various things on a few occasions in public and had a go at him (which he hates). I know I need to keep disagreements and deal with my anger in private and I need to control my outbursts. That's the part of me that I want to work on improving to be a beter role model for my son. He also complained that we haven't resolved the affection and physical intimacy that is missing between us. On the other hand though, it often felt to me that although he was physically there with me, he sometimes chose to assist others or think of other's feelings (including his own) at the expense of mine. I think that, together with my doubt that he loved him as a husband should, as well as occasional reminders of the betrayal, just made me feel more bitter towards him at times.


Anyway, with regards to the OW, we have not uttered a word to anyone she knows about our marital rift at this moment. For all she knows we are still together and I would like it to remain that way. Otherwise I know she will be sniffing around trying to get her hands back on my husband. She "loves" him and in my honest opinion, would take him as her partner in a heartbeat! She has three dependent children which are in their teens and she lives with her parents at the moment as she doesn't have any money to go elsewhere. She came out of a physically abusive relationship, so my husband is her "Knight in shining armour" to save her from a life of misery.

My husband just left today...moved all his stuff out this morning and told me he just wanted to be alone and isn't keen on chasing any other relationship at the moment. He needs "time to clear his head". I sometimes want to just let him go to be with this OW so he can see that reality isn't as pretty as the fantasy he created with her. He might soon get sick of her and realise his errors. I worry that I would never want him back if he chooses her first over me - I would feel like I was second best always. He recently told me he wishes she would do something to really stuff up so he could hate her and be done with the positive feelings he has for her at present. My biggest concern though is if he does chase her (which he promised he wouldn't) or if she does chase him and he lets her, what if they truly are suited to each other? Where do I go from there? I'm left to raise his son on my own as I will never ever accept this OW in his life, I know I'll become a bitter woman.

I told him today I loved him and hoped he would return home soon. He said so do I. I know if this were to happen we would definitely need a plan for recovery. How soon do you even begin to discuss this though? I don't know if I'll ever get a chance to but I am hopeful. As for Plan B, I cannot go through a third person. It's just not in me to do so. I can try to stick to Plan B as close as possible but there are things I'd have to omit for my own peace of mind. Also, some parts of Plan B do not fit my circumstances. The OW and my husband have not been communicating at all these last 10 months and when my husband did return, unfortunately I didn't make the changes needed to meet his emotional needs and I also didn't control any Love Busters which I know I was guilty of. So all in all, we didn't follow the traditional Plan A model. I only recently discovered this website and the book I read so didn't have the help I needed 10 months ago. When I did ask my husband to stop seeing her last year he agreed. He showed me any communication she tried to have wither him including voice messages left on his phone. He also changed his phone number on my request. She tried visiting his house several times and on every occasion he informed me of this. It's just he can't shake the feelings he has toward her. He promises he hasn't acted on these feelings since when the affair came to light in June 2014. To be honest, I have often checked his phone history and he was open about his facebook password and email password. It's just that everything I do is another love buster which seems to have completed deleted any potential love points I may have ever had with him. My goal recently has been trying to build those points back up again so he can start showing me some love too. I honestly feel that he is in a state of withdrawal from the affair addiction and it's hitting him badly as I haven't completely and frequently enough met his needs that the OW was fulfilling a year ago.

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It doesn't seem like you are here to follow Marriage Builders so I am not sure what you are asking. Do you have a question for us?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by JessHopeful
Anyway, with regards to the OW, we have not uttered a word to anyone she knows about our marital rift at this moment. For all she knows we are still together .


She knows - the A has been on this whole time and your H has moved out to pursue it.

While laughing down his sleeve at how low your standards are. He knows the more he removes himself, the more you will chase.

How can you honestly consider meeting his needs when he is abandoning you and your son?


Come back when you are serious.



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Your husband is addicted to having his needs met by two people and he is delighted with you because you are on board with this plan. You can't get any love bank deposits in as an individual - because you are now part of a blended bank account. Whenever you meet his needs it goes in the 'BW and OW' bank account.

He gets a family life with you and the thrill of side action with her.

Oh he has to move in with you/separate from you periodically to keep you both happy - but you are both on board with this plan.

The key to this plan is getting you to act 'secure' when he treats you like a concubine he only needs to visit regularly.

It isn't possible for you to make any love bank deposits as an individual and as his wife until he is home every night, has changed his contact details and is on board with recovery.

He is addicted to her for life and he knows it. A recovered wayward knows how to avoid the addiction - an unrecovered one knows how to keep it going. Being out of the house he is free to contact her whenever he likes and of course he will do so. It also makes you desperate and willing to accept crumbs. Win win! As an addict it will be impossible for him to avoid this temptation to have both women and he has no intention of trying.





What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Are you going to act happy, pleased and delighted when he visits you like a concubine? Do you have any idea how ridiculous and weak you are going to look trying to meet his needs while he is abusing you?

If you want to look attractive let him have ONE more piece of cake and make it good. Let him put your son to bed and then sit down to dinner with him looking your best. Talk about your best memories. Slide over your conditions near the end and tell him you have a plan for restoring the love in your marriage and it involves him being in the house. He will say no and you will gracefully accept his no.

That should be the last glimpse he has of you before Plan B. Not demanding, but not a doormat either. And certainly not his concubine.



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Originally Posted by ]

When an affair is discovered, the BS suffered tremendous shock and pain. What I wanted was a plan. I looked on the Internet searching through forums until I discovered MB. I liked it at first, because, after reading through Dr. H's Basic Concepts and articles and seeing how most of the posters here post his guidance, it seemed the place to get the kind of help I was looking for.

Have you read through the Basic Concepts? Have you read through the sticky thread at the top of the SAA forum?

Here is a checklist from SAA:

[quote=Dr. Harley, Surviving an Affair
From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.


[/quote]

From your description, you haven't committed any lovebusters. All you've done is tried to get him into marriage recovery. But the only way to do that is to step away until he decides to do so and let him face the consequences of his actions on his own.



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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You should also insist on the elimination of social media.


What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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Originally Posted by JessHopeful
She "loves" him and in my honest opinion, would take him as her partner in a heartbeat!

And so would you from the sounds of it. You have let your WH dictate everything and he knows you will accept crumbs.

Quote
I worry that I would never want him back if he chooses her first over me

He has chosen her over you and your marriage...more than once. Sorry if that sounds harsh but that is reality.

Quote
Where do I go from there? I'm left to raise his son on my own as I will never ever accept this OW in his life, I know I'll become a bitter woman.

If you become a bitter woman that is your choice to be so. Again you are letting your WH dictate your life which is very sad.

You don't need to Plan A, you need Plan B. Since you aren't willing to do that and will accept crumbs there is no hope here. This is Plan Doormat and marriage at all costs.


BW - me
exWH - serial cheater
2 awesome kids
Divorced 12/2011




Many a good man has failed because he had a wishbone where his backbone should have been.

We gain strength, and courage, and confidence by each experience in which we really stop to look fear in the face... we must do that which we think we cannot.
--------Eleanor Roosevelt
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I will echo what others have already told you:

You need to expose the affair and enter plan B.
also, he has probably been having sex with this OW the whole time.

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After 3 weeks it's no longer Plan A anyway. This poster has been in Plan C for months - the plan likeliest to lead to divorce.

Dr H frequently warns about Plan C.



What would you do if you were not afraid?

"Fear is the little death. Fear is the mind-killer" Frank Herbert.

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What is Plan A?
Being the best person you can be, in a challenging situation.
Not love busting and yet being firm.


What is Plan B?
Closing the door on being involved with the toxicity of your spouse's affair.
Creating a life for yourself and any children that has some joy and optimism for the future.

What is an IM? Someone who is agreeable to being the communication tool regarding finances and issues with children.

Why can you not do these things? Your situation is not unique in any way.
You are not unique in lack of ability to implement it all.

You implement the plans when you choose to have the best life possible given the circumstances.

Bravery to act like you can do it is the main trait you need to do it.

It is your life to live yet Marriage Builders plans will help you survive the mess.







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Thank you everyone for your support and advice.

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I agree!

Bringing an innocent child into the world as a part of your broken marriage is not the solution.

Tom

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Originally Posted by JessHopeful
Thank you everyone for your support and advice.
What is your plan?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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