I have three kids also so I can relate to your challenges in this situation. I'm concerned that you don't understand the danger you are in. She will eventually tire of being homeless and try to legally get you out of the house and get custody of the kids with you paying child support. People at the shelter may be advising her to do that now.

She is getting food stamps almost 500 month. Our custody agreement relievers her from our home and she does not want it. I am sure if I pressured my lawyer he maybe able to do something - but would that make reconciliation even less likely than it is now?

She obviously prefers being in a shelter more than contemplating returning to you and the marriage at this time.

How much worse could it get?

Get your children into a suitable living environment, ASAP.

LTL

Sir,
I think Dr Harley would encourage you to seek custody of the kids. He places child safety above marital recovery attempts.

Billman,

It is enabling her affair to be lax on the custody arrangements. Your WW clearly thinks she can be highly irresponsible and still be a legal guardian and you shouldn't allow this to continue.

Some of Plan A is trying to meet her needs but some of Plan A (especially for BHs) is allowing the consequences of the WS's affair to fall squarely on their shoulders and not shield them from it. Exposure and all of the rest is designed to show them how irrational and destructive to their long-term interests it is to be a wayward. Plan A is never enabling. She's out of the home and out of contact (and has been for some time now) so all you can really do is express a willingness to meet her needs, and provide a welcome landing spot if the consequences of her affair manage to lead her out of the fog.

This has been going on for several months now with the shelter thing. You need to play hardball on the custody and give your WW a wake up call. Get a new lawyer if you must and listen to Jedi. He has walked this road before and managed to win full custody of his children, he can give you the best advice on how to do this. Your kids already have one parent in la-la land, they are depending on you to be strong here.

I hear you ax. I will speak to my lawyer.

I have spoken to the lawyer and plan to modify the custody arrangement to include Right of First Refusal. Also going to ask for Child Support.

And a Follow up.

My wife stopped by because she was "worried" about our kids yesterday. She looked like she was going to cry. It was only a day. I emailed her and apologized that Abryella did not answer her phone (6 missed calls). This was the reply I got this morning:

"I was scared because I thought you had hurt them. I have thought about everything and put everything into perspective I do feel guilty for my affairs on you, I did not consider your feelings while I was doing them. I see you now a withered person of what you once were and I do feel bad about that. I'm sorry I will not ask for your forgiveness you have to do that on your own in your own time. I am happier without you though. For whatever reason we were thrown together maybe it was to make three beautiful children maybe it was to teach us a lesson. I know how I feel in my heart and know that with you is not where I belong. If you truly love someone you don't do the things that we have done to one another. I have moved on and whether that was because of Michael or not the point is that is my choice to make not yours. You can't control how I feel and neither can I control your feelings because that's not love."

I have not replied.

The thought that she believes I would hurt our children...I am so lost for words. I pray the day she learns that her "perspective" as she puts it - is from within the affair bubble. But remorse - for the first time in 10 months....I want to call that progress, and will remain hopeful.

The Hurting your kids comment is fog BS. Ignore it.

You should seek full custody. It is not safe for your kids to be in a shelter instead of home.

Lots of info on fog babble in that thread.

This could also be why she is says that she thought you might hurt the kids.

There is no remorse in her text, it is fog babble and justification disguised as remorse.

Be very careful, she may be setting you up for something with this hurting your kids comment.

I would recommend full court pressure from the legal side for full custody, child support, supervised visitation, no opposite sex sleepovers, etc.
Living in a shelter, compared to where she was, is a martyr play for sympathy. She is desperate or will become desperate, YOU be on the offensive legally.
When a wayward gets desperate, and tired of their squalor, they WILL get nasty and PLAY DIRTY.

Billman I agree with the others about the text. It is HIGHLY manipulative in the way it is written and it is designed to do what it probably did do...make you feel terrible, guilty, angry and helpless. It may have also been an attempt to bait you and get you to respond with an AO.

There is not a shred of humility in it, only arrogance. Fog babble 101.

Do what you have to do to get your kids and do not respond to anything she says to you from here on out. You have a history of AOs and she probably knows if she can get you to have one at this point it would be valuable to her in a custody hearing.

She's got clutter on her side of the street with keeping the kids in a shelter and behaving the way she has with the OM. You need to keep things on your side as professional and classy as possible.

My ex sent me this type of garbage when she was in court going after the RO against me, and I do not think it was an accident. I think that's the case here too. Don't respond to any of it emotionally.

This is very likely. If she can establish a narrative about being fearful for her safety or the children's and you respond to her with outrage/sarcasm/disrespect, it will make you look like an abuser to an outsider.

If she brings up any of this crap about the safety of the kids, you should ignore it. Don't justify it with a response, it's a lose-lose.

I did not reply to it, as much as I wish I could alter her perspective; I have realized over time that I cannot. I am speaking to the Lawyer this morning and plan to update hi with all the prospects. Here are my thoughts.

1. Temporary Full Custody, so long as she has no established residence.

2. Continuing refrain from non blood opposite sex sleep overs

3. Right of First Refusal

4. Child Support - Largely due to the fact that our custody schedule is currently 50/50, I have our children on days she works that are her days which makes it closer to 70/30.

5. She currently receives food stamps and has our 3 children on her case. I was denied because I could not add the to my case so long as they are on hers. She refused to remove either of them from her case. With mortgage and utilities, food is a difficult spend.

Email this morning:

"I'm sorry for how I've acted toward you through this separation I was wrong. I felt threatened by you and your actions. A lot of my actions toward you stemmed from the physical and emotional abuse you had put me through all the years you may not see it but I do I see it more since I've been away from you all the things you did. I see a possible difference in you. I hope you are being genuine in your efforts with the children and if so thank you."

The only physical abuse I can think of that she refers to:

12 years ago during our first year we horse played. I was rough, did not know when to stop. I was a bully. That stopped. I never physically laid a hand on her since save for two occasions. 1. 5 years ago during our previous separation, we were arguing, she got up to leave, I tried to push her back into the chair - she landed on her but in front of the chair. 2. I threw her purse at her during this separation within the first months. Nothing beyond that.

Billman, it's just typical wayward wife speak. They all without exception accuse their spouse of abuse and by putting it in writing she is hoping to establish it on record in case she needs to forcefully get you out of the way of her affair. False accusations are common.

Pleeease tell me you haven't responded in agreement or apologized in any way.

I would just say you are happy to address any and all complaints - but verbally not in writing! Then start wearing a recorder around her.

The examples you state are historic, and are not the reason she is leaving. that said, they're not acceptable. You simply can't push and throw things no matter what.

A wayward wife will often try to provoke anger when she is in an affair - and she will use any loss of temper against you.

Are you sure you can keep your cool?

I've just been riveted reading over your entire thread. It was heart-breaking. You're a better man than I. You have bent over backwards for her. Financially supported her affair, let her treat you really badly throughout and came back with a smile on your face. To be honest I think she views you as a guarantee. A guaranteed safety net to catch her if she falls so that there are no repercussions from her actions. She can do whatever she wants, screw whomever she wants because you won't do anything about it but keep smiling, keep loving her. I've read everything your wife has said that you have quoted. She is in need of serious counseling. She seems to have the emotional maturity of a 6 year old. From joy to tantrums. Very BP.

Have you been working on yourself throughout this? Don't let your own health and self-esteem suffer because you want her back so badly. Focus on your health too. Every therapist worth their salt will tell you that. You can hope for reconciliation but work yourself toward moving on. After the things she's said you're a saint that you still want her. You seem like a good man and I can assure you there are a lot of wonderful women in this world that would never say things like that to you. You have to really understand that that is an option. My former wayward wife's selfishness disappeared in a millisecond the day I realized, and I mean truly realized, that I'll be just fine without her. I made full plans to move on to something better and that snapped her right out of it.

Good luck with your life, I'll be reading your updates and rooting for you.

Yes, after all my bad emotional reactions, after all the stupid emails I have sent trying to change her mind and convince her. I have just recently come to a place where I can hold back a response - knowing it will serve no purpose. I have not replied and will not. I can keep my cool. And I am not angry, I simply miss her and hope that this babble turns into some semblance of reality for her.