Welcome to the
Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum

This is a community where people come in search of marriage related support, answers, or encouragement. Also, information about the Marriage Builders principles can be found in the books available for sale in the Marriage Builders® Bookstore.
If you would like to join our guidance forum, please read the Announcement Forum for instructions, rules, & guidelines.
The members of this community are peers and not professionals. Professional coaching is available by clicking on the link titled Coaching Center at the top of this page.
We trust that you will find the Marriage Builders® Discussion Forum to be a helpful resource for you. We look forward to your participation.
Once you have reviewed all the FAQ, tech support and announcement information, if you still have problems that are not addressed, please e-mail the administrators at mbrestored@gmail.com
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 19
Hello, everyone. I actually joined this site about 5 years ago, when my wife had her first major affair. We were both in our early 30's at the time, with 2 kids. I was completely devastate, but with the help of this site, and everyone in this forum, I was eventually able to forgive my wife and get our marriage back on track. Thank you for that!

Fast forward 4 years.... sometime earlier in 2015, my wife started drinking a lot more than normal. Her sexual drive also increased dramatically (which I know is what typically happens to most women in their mid-late 30's). And I just found out that for 9 months last year she was having sex with one of my best friends, who was also her best friend's husband.

So, now that I've exposed the affair, and lost another best friend (this is the 3rd one my wife has slept with), I'm on the road to recovery, and trying to figure out what the hell to do with my marriage. She is back to counseling, has quit drinking, is going to AA, is going to a sex and love addiction group, and is definitely going through the motions to gain back my trust and fix her issues. I'm sure I have issues as well, which is obvious due to the fact that she had to go somewhere else for sex, but I'm convinced that even if I was the perfect husband, she would've still cheated.

My issue is that she's proven that she can never be faithful, or even trusted. Why do I stay with her? We have 3 kids now, and I can't imagine making them grow up with separated parents. I feel that my wife has an addiction disease, and that people with addiction are sometimes not in control of their impulses. I do want to stay together, because other than the cheating incidents every 2-3 years, we have a wonderful marriage and an amazing family. She's my best friend and lover, and I can't imagine replacing her with anyone else.

So, my question is, under my circumstances, am I justified in monitoring my wife's phone/computer activities? She tends to communicate on FB, text, and sometimes e-mail. I've always been against this in the past, because I feel that spouses deserve their privacy, and also because sometimes you don't want to learn everything your spouses do in their spare time, as long as it doesn't harm your relationship. But, I think this time is different, because I've given her more than one opportunity to change, she's continued to be unfaithful, and if this was caught early on, then I wouldn't be where I am today.

I would love to hear from people who started tracking their spouses, and if this has worked for them or not.

Thank you!
-Michael

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,362
Likes: 3
P
Member
Offline
Member
P
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,362
Likes: 3
Quote
So, my question is, under my circumstances, am I justified in monitoring my wife's phone/computer activities? She tends to communicate on FB, text, and sometimes e-mail. I've always been against this in the past, because I feel that spouses deserve their privacy, and also because sometimes you don't want to learn everything your spouses do in their spare time, as long as it doesn't harm your relationship.
YES. YES. YES.

I would say that your thinking here has been part of the problem in your marriage -- you never affair proofed your marriage.

People in affair-proofed marriages check up on each other. They have complete access to each other's lives.

Privacy is a breeding ground for affairs.

Markos has never had an affair, and yet I can remotely log into his work computer whenever I feel the desire, just to see what he is doing. I check his email all the time. I pick up his phone and read his texts. And we both think that's great, because we have an integrated life and WANT to be completely exposed to each other.

That's what a healthy marriage looks like.

Quote
I would love to hear from people who started tracking their spouses, and if this has worked for them or not.
Anybody on here who has recovered their marriage has also given up privacy. You cannot have a good, safe marriage otherwise.


Markos' Wife
FWW - EA
8 kids ...
What to do with an Angry Husband

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 20,433
Likes: 4
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 20,433
Likes: 4
What was your posting name before?

Who all did you expose to?

She needs to be monitored 24/7. Can you be with her 24/7?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 20,433
Likes: 4
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 20,433
Likes: 4
Also, please tell us what you've done from this.


From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,362
Likes: 3
P
Member
Offline
Member
P
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,362
Likes: 3
Your wife is a serial cheater. This is going to make recovery extremely difficult, more difficult than average. There is no question that complete and utter transparency is a requirement. You will need to become so integrated that one of you cannot have an affair without the other knowing immediately.


Markos' Wife
FWW - EA
8 kids ...
What to do with an Angry Husband

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,362
Likes: 3
P
Member
Offline
Member
P
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,362
Likes: 3
Quote
She needs to be monitored 24/7. Can you be with her 24/7?
This is essential for recovery with a serial cheater.


Markos' Wife
FWW - EA
8 kids ...
What to do with an Angry Husband

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 20,433
Likes: 4
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 20,433
Likes: 4
Listen to the clips in here.

Serial Cheaters


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by Prisca
People in affair-proofed marriages check up on each other. They have complete access to each other's lives.

That seems to be the consensus. My next question is, should I monitor her activities with or without her knowledge? Frankly, my wife cheating is only half the problem. The other half is catching my friends who decide that going for my wife is a good idea. She is extremely attractive, and apparently, other married men have an issue respecting our marriage, for one reason or another, even if they're great friends of mine. I'd like to be in the position to catch them as well, and I feel like if she knows about the monitoring, she'll find other means of getting around it to communicate with someone if she really wants to.

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818
Likes: 7
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818
Likes: 7
Originally Posted by Michael077
Originally Posted by Prisca
People in affair-proofed marriages check up on each other. They have complete access to each other's lives.

That seems to be the consensus. My next question is, should I monitor her activities with or without her knowledge?

Without.


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
Originally Posted by Michael077
because sometimes you don't want to learn everything your spouses do in their spare time
Why on earth not? Indeed, why would your spouse have "spare time" that is not spent with you?

Spouses have paid jobs, and they look after their children, and they have chores to do around the home, plus things like food shopping. The rest of the time could be called "spare time". Why wouldn't they spend the vast majority of that time with each other? What is the point of being married, if you don't?


BW
Married 1989
His PA 2003-2006
2 kids.
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818
Likes: 7
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818
Likes: 7
I recommend you go read up on Dr. Harley's plans for eliminating and recovering from affairs and then come back and ask questions once you are familiar with the plan.

Get the book Surviving an Affair and read it cover to cover, and also check out Dr. Harley's other materials, such as this video:

[video:youtube]m8QKOUbosNo[/video]


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818
Likes: 7
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 15,818
Likes: 7
What was your original posting name 5 years ago? Why didn't you learn the Marriage Builders plan back then?


If you are serious about saving your marriage, you can't get it all on this forum. You've got to listen to the Marriage Builders Radio show, every day. Install the app!

Married to my radiant trophy wife, Prisca, 19 years. Father of 8.
Attended Marriage Builders weekend in May 2010

If your wife is not on board with MB, some of my posts to other men might help you.
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,362
Likes: 3
P
Member
Offline
Member
P
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 7,362
Likes: 3
Quote
The other half is catching my friends who decide that going for my wife is a good idea. She is extremely attractive, and apparently, other married men have an issue respecting our marriage, for one reason or another, even if they're great friends of mine.
These men are not your friends, and they are certainly not GREAT friends. Cut them out of your life.


Markos' Wife
FWW - EA
8 kids ...
What to do with an Angry Husband

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
Originally Posted by Michael077
Hello, everyone. I actually joined this site about 5 years ago, when my wife had her first major affair. We were both in our early 30's at the time, with 2 kids. I was completely devastate, but with the help of this site, and everyone in this forum, I was eventually able to forgive my wife and get our marriage back on track. Thank you for that!

Fast forward 4 years.... sometime earlier in 2015, my wife started drinking a lot more than normal. Her sexual drive also increased dramatically (which I know is what typically happens to most women in their mid-late 30's). And I just found out that for 9 months last year she was having sex with one of my best friends, who was also her best friend's husband.

So, now that I've exposed the affair, and lost another best friend (this is the 3rd one my wife has slept with), I'm on the road to recovery, and trying to figure out what the hell to do with my marriage. She is back to counseling, has quit drinking, is going to AA, is going to a sex and love addiction group, and is definitely going through the motions to gain back my trust and fix her issues. I'm sure I have issues as well, which is obvious due to the fact that she had to go somewhere else for sex, but I'm convinced that even if I was the perfect husband, she would've still cheated.

My issue is that she's proven that she can never be faithful, or even trusted. Why do I stay with her? We have 3 kids now, and I can't imagine making them grow up with separated parents. I feel that my wife has an addiction disease, and that people with addiction are sometimes not in control of their impulses. I do want to stay together, because other than the cheating incidents every 2-3 years, we have a wonderful marriage and an amazing family. She's my best friend and lover, and I can't imagine replacing her with anyone else.

So, my question is, under my circumstances, am I justified in monitoring my wife's phone/computer activities? She tends to communicate on FB, text, and sometimes e-mail. I've always been against this in the past, because I feel that spouses deserve their privacy, and also because sometimes you don't want to learn everything your spouses do in their spare time, as long as it doesn't harm your relationship. But, I think this time is different, because I've given her more than one opportunity to change, she's continued to be unfaithful, and if this was caught early on, then I wouldn't be where I am today.

I would love to hear from people who started tracking their spouses, and if this has worked for them or not.

Thank you!
-Michael
I think you need to dial right back, first. This isn't altogether a problem that can be resolved by tracking your wife, important though that is.

If you were here 5 years ago, we didn't do a very good job if we didn't speak to you about living an integrated life so that neither of you would be able to have the privacy and distance that allows an affair to flourish.

How on earth has your wife managed to have 3 "major" affairs in 5 years? (And how many "minor" ones has she had?)

How has she managed to have a third affair that lasted 9 months without your knowing anything? How did she physically manage to get away to see this man?

Please also tell us the circumstances of the second one. This was with another good friend, is that correct?

How does she manage to spend time with these men, right under your and their spouses' noses? Where do they go to carry out their affairs? Do they do it in their homes, or in a hotel? Where do you believe her to be when she is in fact with another man?

If she's going to AA, she must be an alcoholic. How serious did that problem become? How long has she been dry?

How old are your kids? Do they know about these affairs, and the drinking? You must have had another baby after the first affair. How long after? If your wife was drinking heavily, and sleeping around, did you trust her to look after your kids properly?

Have you ever exposed any of these affairs? If you'd exposed the first one with your best friend, I doubt that any women would have allowed her to get close enough to their husbands for a second and third affair with your best friends to take place.

What is she doing in counselling? Does her counsellor have a strategy to change your wife's behaviour? What is the counsellor's goal - do you know? Is therapy mainly a chance for your wife to talk about her feelings, or are there specific actions devised to rebuild your marriage?

Is the sex and love addiction group women only? And again, what is its purpose? Does it have a track record in changing behaviour, and if so, by what methods? Do they recommend that your wife put herself entirely under your care, surrender all her privacy and not go out with girlfriends (much less their husbands)? It will take precautions that are more extraordinary than the standard ones posted to you above, to curb someone who has an addiction. Do they have a radical strategy to end her rampant infidelity, or again, is it a talking shop?


BW
Married 1989
His PA 2003-2006
2 kids.
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985
Likes: 1
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985
Likes: 1
Originally Posted by Michael077
My issue is that she's proven that she can never be faithful, or even trusted. Why do I stay with her? We have 3 kids now, and I can't imagine making them grow up with separated parents. I feel that my wife has an addiction disease, and that people with addiction are sometimes not in control of their impulses. I do want to stay together, because other than the cheating incidents every 2-3 years, we have a wonderful marriage and an amazing family. She's my best friend and lover, and I can't imagine replacing her with anyone else.

I think that is wonderful that you feel you have a wonderful marriage with a serial cheater because this will be your future. As long as you fully accept she will cheat [she will!] and are happy being the standby guy, then why spy? What is the point if you like being married to a serial cheater?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985
Likes: 1
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985
Likes: 1
Michael, by the way, the problem here is not her but you because you are a classic enabler. It is so patently obvious that you don't take this seriously so how in the world could she be expected to take it seriously?

She won't ever take it seriously until you do. And it is very clear that you are an ENABLER of the worst sort.

And even if you did decide to take it seriously, she is very unlikely to come around because you have allowed her to be wayward for a very long time.

She cheats not because of a bad marriage, but because she is trolling for action. NOTHING you do can overcome that.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
Originally Posted by Michael077
apparently, other married men have an issue respecting our marriage, for one reason or another, even if they're great friends of mine.
What do you mean, "for one reason or another"? What reasons could there possible be?

Every one of us is vulnerable to affairs, and if married people hang out with other people and flirt and drink, sooner or later there will be an affair. Also, there are a lot of people who do not respect marriage, but they are not usually married. It is a very unusual situation where a whole bunch of someone's friends do not respect their marriage. I have never heard of such a thing. What do these friend have in common that makes them hold such a view?

Do you by any chance live a swinging lifestyle, or did you in the past?


BW
Married 1989
His PA 2003-2006
2 kids.
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
Originally Posted by Michael077
My issue is that she's proven that she can never be faithful, or even trusted...I do want to stay together, because other than the cheating incidents every 2-3 years, we have a wonderful marriage and an amazing family.
Well, you seem to accept that this is going to happen every 2-3 years. That will be an amazing number of men she'll have had sex with by the time you reach your silver wedding.


BW
Married 1989
His PA 2003-2006
2 kids.
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 19
Thank you, everyone. Yes, she is a serial cheater, and I have no idea if anything she's doing (therapy, addiction groups, etc.) will actually help. I certainly have to take extreme precautions to avoid this in the future, there's no doubt.

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 9,527
Likes: 9
Originally Posted by Michael077
Thank you, everyone. Yes, she is a serial cheater, and I have no idea if anything she's doing (therapy, addiction groups, etc.) will actually help. I certainly have to take extreme precautions to avoid this in the future, there's no doubt.
Do you think monitoring her is going to stop it from happening?

Suppose you bust her the next time, by monitoring. What will she do then? Will she stop doing this, or will she hide it better?

Is her sex addiction group women only?

Is her AA group women only?


BW
Married 1989
His PA 2003-2006
2 kids.
Page 1 of 6 1 2 3 4 5 6

Link Copied to Clipboard
Forum Search
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 1,027 guests, and 52 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Mike69, petercgeelan, Zorya, Reyna98, Nofoguy
71,829 Registered Users
Building Marriages That Last A Lifetime
Copyright © 1995-2019, Marriage Builders®. All Rights Reserved.
Site Navigation
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5