cwmi, just because he says now that he didn't want kids then, doesn't mean that at the time he didn't want kids. You already know
  1. his memory is like a sieve
  2. he has a habit of lying to you about what he thought in the past
  3. he makes up stuff to make you feel bad and or get you off his case
If it helps, I had BTDT, H also told me a few years ago that he didn't think he could get a woman pregnant, and that's why he didn't choose to use protection when I got pregnant with DD14. And that he only married me because I was pregnant, even though we were already engaged before that. He said a year after that, when we were reconciling temporarily, that he not only didn't say that, but he never would have said that. And I remember how painful all that was at the time. But life moves on, water under the bridge, this, too, shall pass. At some point, cwmi, I think you're not going to care anymore. But I'd be happy to support you here in any way I can until then.

So, you said how you handle it is to call him on his stuff. Did you ever hear how LA describes it, lovingly handing their words back to them? Not a shame thing, just reminding them you're not playing that game anymore, "let's pretend to get all upset as if you and I believe what you just said." He's simply doing what he does, because it had a payoff for him at the time. Are y'all working a plan that will address that over time?

I think he may have married someone like you, because he likes to be the rebellious bad boy, and feel like he's getting away with something. Renter thinking, not realizing these patterns are unsustainable. But that's neither here nor there. How can you make a plan of attack that doesn't add to these huge withdrawals this behavior already brings? Or maybe you do already, it's hard to read tone. When you mentioned about that Great Date thing, were you getting exasperated on the inside, or calmly remembering this is just what he does, tries to make you feel bad, because that's more important to him than building a strong marriage? His choice, not about you, you are making an awesome life for yourself and your family, with or without him?

If you were calm, I think you may think, you know, it doesn't matter if we follow the Great Date plan or not. Sure, it'd be nice, but he's not a failure if he doesn't pick up that paper. It's just a suggestion, take it or leave it. What do you think?

Last edited by NewEveryDay; 12/09/10 07:58 AM. Reason: added more

Me 40, OD 18 and YD 13
Married 15 years, Divorced 10/2010