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Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
I have trouble saying no and trying to make things work, I guess.

Capitulating and caving to others wants at your OWN expense is dangerous ground to tread.



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Originally Posted by 20YearHistory
Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
Now the dilemma is that DD18's father said that he wants to go. Kiss does not want me around my Ex. He doesn't even like us conversing.

I would feel the exact same way KISS does. Don't blame him one bit.

Can you two sit down and use this situation to practice POJA? Coming up with a solution that you are both happy with can be a bonding experience. I know you can do it.

Remember, you both have to be open-minded and not have your feet stuck in the sand when you brainstorm! We have been recently practicing asking for each other's reasoning behind their thoughts MORE than telling each other our own perspectives. A few weeks ago Dr. H really emphasized this on the radio show and it has stuck with me. Man, this one takes a lot of practice.

Well, I had called kiss and told him that my ex wanted to go and that I didn't know what to do and he just said "I don't know what to say", so brainstorming with him did not go very well. But he did suggest that I ask the forum wink

I just felt that it wasn't fair (correct or not) to tell my ex no, but I understand why I had to.


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Maybe try POJA as to the logistics of the weekend in a way that makes you both happy. Certainly, I would assume that going with your X was totally off the table. You shouldn't feel bad telling your X no when you know how uncomfortable KISS would be. He comes first!

"I would like to take my daughter to school this weekend. How do you feel about that and what can we work out that makes us both happy?"

I would guess he was quite put off by the notion that you were wanting to POJA about going with your X. Do you think even entertaining that idea was putting his feelings first?

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20year, my feelings are that whether kiss likes it or not, my ex and I have a daughter together and therefore we will have to be able to communicate and be involved in her activities and such.

I suck at POJA. I never asked kiss how he would feel...., just that I'm taking her.




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Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
20year, my feelings are that whether kiss likes it or not, my ex and I have a daughter together and therefore we will have to be able to communicate and be involved in her activities and such.
rq, I am dismayed to hear this from someone who has posted on this forum for some time.

You don't have to communicate with your ex at all. Your daughter is an adult and does not need parental swaps and the like. You don't need to speak to your ex about anything to do with her!

And to hear you say "whether kiss likes it or not" is horrifying. You should know after all your time on here that you put your marriage first, never NEVER your ex husband's feelings. His feelings about anything and everything are immaterial!


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Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
20year, my feelings are that whether kiss likes it or not, my ex and I have a daughter together and therefore we will have to be able to communicate and be involved in her activities and such.

Why do you need to communicate with him AT ALL? How do you figure that is any good for your marriage?


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
my ex and I have a daughter together and therefore we will have to be able to communicate and be involved in her activities and such.

Knowing what you know about Plan B, how can you say this?



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I do have to communicate with him as my daughter has personal issues that her father needs to be aware of. We also communicate about how her college education will be funded and are trying to get that sorted.

I never said that I put my ex's feelings above kiss'. But, as my daughter's father, he has a right to participate in her life.

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You know, most people manage to do that just fine without staying in direct contact. My son had some issues after our divorce and I dealt directly with my son and the high school principal. Problem solved.

My son also went to college and I never once needed to communicate with my EX. My current husband sent FOUR kids through college after he was divorced [and we were married] and never once communicated directly with his x-wife since 2001. We have seen his XW a few times over the years............from AFAR at graduations and weddings. We have actually gone to graduations and didn't even see her. I have clapped eyes on my XH exactly 2x since 1999, from AFAR.

Your XH can participate in your daughter's life without you. I was fully engaged in my son's life and my H was fully engaged in his children's lives - never once did we have to communicate with the X to do it. People do it all the time.

It's your life for sure, but it is surprising to see someone who has been here long enough to know better, still in touch with her X.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
You know, most people manage to do that just fine without staying in direct contact. My son had some issues after our divorce and I dealt directly with my son and the high school principal. Problem solved.

My son also went to college and I never once needed to communicate with my EX. My current husband sent FOUR kids through college after he was divorced [and we were married] and never once communicated directly with his x-wife since 2001. We have seen his XW a few times over the years............from AFAR at graduations and weddings. We have actually gone to graduations and didn't even see her. I have clapped eyes on my XH exactly 2x since 1999, from AFAR.

Your XH can participate in your daughter's life without you. I was fully engaged in my son's life and my H was fully engaged in his children's lives - never once did we have to communicate with the X to do it. People do it all the time.

It's your life for sure, but it is surprising to see someone who has been here long enough to know better, still in touch with her X.

I honestly don't see how that is possible to not have contact with the other parent and put a kid through college.
I also see no reason why 2 parents can't communicate about their children. I get along with my ex and there is no animosity between us.


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Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
I do have to communicate with him as my daughter has personal issues that her father needs to be aware of. We also communicate about how her college education will be funded and are trying to get that sorted.

I never said that I put my ex's feelings above kiss'. But, as my daughter's father, he has a right to participate in her life.
Your daughter is old enough to communicate her personal issues to her father herself. If she does not want to do that then he simply won't know about them. It is not your job to tell him!

You ex needs to support your daughter through college just as you do. There should be a legal agreement to deal with that. Over here, parents are financially responsible for their kids until they leave full-time education, and a divorce settlement would have to deal with the long-term support for the kids before the judge signs off the divorce. Even if you decided that you needed to talk about a particular expense there would be no need to communicate on a regular basis.

Of course your ex has a right to participate in your daughter's life! Nobody here is saying that he doesn't. Are you wilfully misunderstanding, or wilfully misrepresenting what we have said? He participates by talking directly to her and you do the same. Neither of you has to talk to the other about such things as taking her to college.

You may not think you are putting your ex's feelings about kiss's, but it is clear to me that he is uncomfortable about your friendship with your ex, and you should seek to end this friendship and deal with business matters only. There should be few to none of these at age 18.



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Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
I honestly don't see how that is possible to not have contact with the other parent and put a kid through college.
I also see no reason why 2 parents can't communicate about their children. I get along with my ex and there is no animosity between us.

Are you kidding? crazy What do you need to talk about? One of you helps the kid pick out the courses - if necessary because most kids know their degree plan and know what they need - the kid takes the bill to you and you pay your part. She takes the bill to the father and he pays his part. In my agreement with XH, made entirely through my son, I paid DS's tuition and his father paid for his books. I told son "I will pay your tuition if dad pays for your books." That was established in year 1 and was the template for the next 5 years.

And the same thing with my H's 4 kids.

What was there to talk about??

Quote
I also see no reason why 2 parents can't communicate about their children.

Because that is how affairs start. That is just your basic EP 101.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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In all these years whenever one of my DH's kids needed money for school, car, medical/dental etc, they just sent him an email with the request and the bill. He just paid the bill! They didn't need their mother for that.

As far as participating in his life, my son lived with my XH all through college - 1200 miles away - and I spoke to him 5-6x a week. I SAW him 2-4 times a year. I took him clothes shopping 2x every year. I knew everything he was doing. I was very involved in his life and never spoke to his dad.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Sugarcane, There was never anything in our divorce papers about her college education. I am unable to pay for her education. She took out a student loan and her father is paying the balance for this year. Who knows how we will pay it next year, but that is a separate issue.

I will have my daughter be more responsible for her college stuff and communicating with her dad about it.



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Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
I will have my daughter be more responsible for her college stuff and communicating with her dad about it.

RQ, you will find that she takes more of an interest in her education if she does. When the kid has to go asking for school money and shopping for her own books, they seem to take more ownership of the process.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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How does kiss feel about you communicating with your XH?


FWW/BW (me)
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Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by Rocketqueen
I will have my daughter be more responsible for her college stuff and communicating with her dad about it.

RQ, you will find that she takes more of an interest in her education if she does. When the kid has to go asking for school money and shopping for her own books, they seem to take more ownership of the process.

Thank you, I will try to relinquish so much responsibility.


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Originally Posted by BrainHurts
How does kiss feel about you communicating with your XH?

He doesn't mind it, as long as it pertains to our daughter and its not personal stuff.

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To be clear, we only communicate via text. Not face to face. I haven't seen my ex since my daughter's graduation.

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I can't help but wonder what kind of a positive impact both of you becoming experts at POJA and PORH would have on your M with KISS.


Will you consider really digging into these policies and allowing them to become the cornerstone of your marriage?


Rocketqueen, these 2 policies have had the biggest impact on my relationship with Clearmind. We use it for literally for almost everything! It really works. Do you think that there is a possibility the absence of these are stunting your R?



Last edited by 20YearHistory; 08/27/13 12:02 PM.
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