I'm now entering a whole new phase of life, one which I've been trying to avoid for the past six and a half years. I didn't want our marriage to end in divorce but that is what is now taking place. So, I turn to you all hoping for some wisdom and input in the great question of how to divide a family.

A little backround about me... I've been married for 17 years. I was a teacher when we got married but then retired from teaching so I could stay home with our girls. I've been home full time with them since having my oldest daughter. My H has been unfaithful in the past and is now seeking a divorce. He moved out a few weeks ago. Our girls are 9,11 and 13.

He is wanting joint custody and is wanting to have a situation of two homes where the girls can divide their time equally between us. I am concerned about the lack of consistency and security that this situation could potentially bring into their lives.

However, it has never been my goal to keep the girls from their father. They love their Dad and he is generally good to them. Overall, I think he is a good father, horrible H but good dad. He's been fairly committed to them but has always been a workaholic. So all in all, I struggle to know what scenario is best for the girls.

My H has his own business and travels frequently. He said he will allow me to have first option of having the girls when he is unable to watch them. He also said that he would allow them to come here after school until he is able to pick them up after work.

So, based on your experiences, does this arrangement sound reasonable or do you see potential pitfalls? Any thoughts would be appreciated.

50/50 can work if both parties are good communicators and live in close proximity and both accept equal responsibility for the children's schedules. Only you know if this will work.

However, given "My H has his own business and travels frequently. " I doubt it will work. Early on, he would try, but then if you were available to take the kids, you would likely get them more time than expected. The number of overnights you have the kids would determine child support..

Check with your state, because number of overnights doesn't always affect CS. In my state, it doesn't.

T

Newly,

I agree that the number of days he will want the children will most likely dwindle with time. He has suddenly discovered a way to be home for the last month. This is almost funny to me as he has always travelled a good 25% of the time and worked half the nights and weekends.

Right now he's all about being the perfect dad. But, I do believe in time this will change. Consistency is not one of his stronger qualities. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/crazy.gif" alt="" /> Thanks for your thoughts.

Confused,

I will check with the attorney to see if overnites count toward child support. I'm not sure how that works in this state. Thanks.

I hate to say this, but have you ever considered that all that extra work was actually time he was spending with another woman?

That being said I'll move on to custody. If you are going to be feeding the children dinner while he just wanders in to pick them up for the evening, then you had better consider the fact that you will be bearing the brunt of the homework time and meal expense and after school event shuttling. If you truly think that you will be doing most of the things that cost money like feeding them, then you need to ensure that the child support is coming to you. This may mean that you will have to make sure that you are named primary custodian, and that he doesn't exceed the (usually 140 or so) overnights that would decrease his CS obligation. Why should you let him take advantage of you if he is not going to truly parent those children?

I have custody of three and I'll tell you right now - I'm tired. It is a draining job to be a single parent. It is much easier if you get along with their dad to try and work out an arrangement where he can do half the parenting and you can get a break.

A 50-50 arrangement can be beneficial for the kids if the parents are on very good terms. How will you feel if in the future he has the OW picking up the children while he is still at work?

I think a lot of men become better parents during a divorce, but there are some men who will just pass along the parenting responsibilities to their new partner if their work schedule is such that they would have difficulty taking on the task themselves.

Most of the time custody arrangements require a lot of money to change and it is important to consider all the angles and make the right choice the first time around.

What do you think the situation would look like?

V.

50/50 (or close to it) works well for us. My kids are a little younger. He has them 6 out of 14 days. He has them every Monday and Tuesday and every other Friday through Sunday. Time did change the CS amount here -- an amount that we agreed upon together -- to "even out" the incomes between the two houses and we split all expenses (daycare, health care, activities, etc.).

It definitely requires a lot of communication. The kids adjusted well as we do keep similar schedules and diets, we have similar parenting styles, and let the kids be in charge of their stuff.

I reassure the kids that they will always be taken care of. And to not worry about their schedule as Mom and Dad will make sure that they get enough time with each of us.

Sunny,

Thanks for your reply. Yes, I know part of his "work" time has definitely been invested with OW.

I have thought about how it would most likely play out. I think I will still be responsible for all the after school chauferring. I'm quite certain that the girls will eat here. I'll probably have homework duty. So, I think the majority of actual parenting will fall on my shoulders.

I think this is the point I will bring up to my attorney. I am willing to agree to this arrangement as long as I'm not penalized financially because of it. I want the girls to be with me as much as possible. H wants them too. But, he knows he has a lot of limitations with his schedule. So if he's still willing to pay the needed child support, I can be flexible about working with his schedule.

I am still concerned about the effects of bouncing back and forth on the girls. As long as they can handle it, I'm willing to go with it. I just need to know they will be okay. Do you have children that are currently going between two homes? Thanks Sunny for your thoughts.

Cyllanlisa,

Thanks for your response. It's good to know that there are 50/50 situations that work. If you don't mind me asking, was your H easy to work with in marriage?

I guess I wonder how much of a difference different personalities play into this equation. My H tends to be very controlling and manipulative with me. This concerns me as far as working schedules and such with him.

Thanks for your input.

Being a teacher, I see a lot of children that live in different houses during the week. Books are forgotten. They are late for school. And you can always tell when there are differences in parental rules (bedtimes,priorities ect).

I am not agreeing to it in my case. I want my DD to spend time with H, but I disagree with OW always being involved. H spent the first year of her life running around on us and now he wants to be the perfect dad. Since your H has always worked and traveled a lot, what makes you think that will change. And as for you getting first option of watching them, is he the type of get mad at you and not give you that option later on.
Also I agree with the others watch the CS. 50/50 reduces it in most states. Money is often the motivation. I was also advised by my attorney not to give something that I couldn't live with because very seldom is custody changed later.

Luckystar,

I was just reading your post in your thread and thinking about your situation. I saw similarities in us and our situation. Now I read this and discover you're a teacher.

I also taught before having children. So I too am aware of the consequences of different parenting styles and such. Right now, my three girls are all straight A students. They are very concientious and work very hard in school. I'm not sure if they would continue to be equally motivated if they spend half their time with their dad.

I would want something in writing about him giving me first option to have the girls. Money might very well be his motivation with his desired custody. I'm not sure. Also, I think he will begin to travel once all this mess calms down. I think eventually he will go back to what he was.

I have also heard that you want to go for all you want up front because custody is difficult to change later. That is why I'm giving this so much thought. I want to get it right the first time. It's just so hard to know what is right without living it out for awhile.

Thanks for your thoughts. I will try to respond to you on your thread.

My ex-husband and I had joint legal and physical custody of our sons. We divorced when they were 11 and 8 years old.
Our schedule was:
1. Live at dad's house on week days for one school year. Live with Mom every weekend for the same school year. Split the number of Summer weeks evenly.

2. The next school year the schedule would totally reverse in terms of mom having them on week days during the school year..dad every weekend, etc.

3. Our sons spent Father's Day with Dad....Mother's day with mom.

4. We lived close enough that Christmas Day was divided between parents.

5. During the first "round" of their dad having them weekdays, he needed "child care" for them for a few hours in the morning. He needed to be to work before school started. He would bring them to my place....I would give them breakfast and transport them to their schools.

6. During one of the years I had them weekdays, I needed them to be able to ride the bus to their dad's after school. I wasn't on their school's bus route. I didn't get out of work early enough to pick them up at school. I'd pick them up at their dad's and we'd go home for dinner, etc.

Their dad and I had a pretty amicable relationship. Each was open to flexing the schedule if some special event was coming up on the other parent's scheduled day.

We followed this schedule for about 4 years. Then our youngest son started having a lot of school problems. Not getting homework done...getting it done and not turning it in....possible A.D.D. It was easier for him to "get away" with these behaviors during the time frame where I had them weekdays and picked them up at their dad's after my job was done. My youngest would tell each parent that he had done his school work at the other parent's house, etc. The ex and I met and decided to change the parenting schedule in the best interest of our son. (We wanted both sons together, so oldest would obviously change to new schedule, too.) My ex lived within the school district. The boys could be bused from there. So, he had them weekdays and I had them weekends, and we split the Summers as before.

With the change in schedule, I lost $600.00 of child support per month. I could have ended up paying some to him! But, we had determined that our decisions would based on the best interest of our sons, with an active role played by both parents.

We held Graduation Open Houses together, at their dad's. (he had the most room for it!)

Overall, our sons did quite well with this arrangement. They were old enough and bright enough to realize that there were some different rules at mom's and dad's. Their dad and I worked together on consistency in expectations of our sons. We would meet at a local restaurant to review our plans annually...more frequent if needed.

The hardest part for me in the last parenting arrangement, was that their dad often didn't inform me of school or sport events. Or, he'd wait til the last minute. Or, he'd expect our sons to relay the info....which rarely happened! When they were with me, I would make duplicates of all school schedules, memos, etc and make sure to send one to him. I didn't have a computer, so the internet wasn't available for communications. Also, when he filled out the Emergency Contact card at the beginning of a school year, he'd just list himself!!!! When my sons were older and realized this, they made it a point to fill out that section of their cards. I also went to the school and asked that separate letters, communications, be mailed to my house.

This all worked quite well until my ex remarried. Step-mom wanted to be in charge of everyone's life. Communication and cooperation was much more difficult then. Luckily our sons were older and functioning more independently.

I can't imagine how a schedule would work with someone who travels alot and is a "workaholic". Or is into power and control dynamics. My ex had always been very involved in parenting our sons. He had always given them priority and time. When married, we chose for him to pass up promotions that would require moving, so our sons would have community, family, and consistency in their lives. I worked out of the home part-time when they were young.

Today my eldest son is 21 and will start his Senior year in college this Fall. He has maintained an all "A" average through all 3 years of college. My youngest son is 19 and just completed his Freshman year at college. He floundered around with grades in high school (didn't care about getting good grades, etc.), but finished his first year of college with a 3.2 GPA. Emotionally, they have their challenges as do all young adults!

I know our divorce impacted our sons. It was a shock and a loss to them. But I think their dad and I did a whole lot better than most parents who try and use their children to get back at their ex-spouse. Their dad and I divorced each other....not our sons!

Good luck in exploring some parenting schedules!

Leah,

I post on a custody board so I see a lot of examples (probably enriched because the board is geared toward parents who don't have custody or are fighting) of times when the ex remarries and a whole new dynamic starts. Even if you come to a "private" arrangement about money know that even though custody is hard to change legally, the money part is pretty easy to change and it doesn't cost you anything in the way of lawyers if you go through a CSA office. All that is needed is a 10 or 20% change in income or if your ex is overpaying due to his number of overnights then he could easily file for a reduction.

Just remember that CSA will not care if you feed them, clothe them, shuttle them, and do all the maintenance. They usually just have a formula based on overnights. (stinks, eh if you want to let dad spend more time with them but end up bearing the brunt of the financial burden)

The dynamic I spoke of earlier may not happen all at once, but generally the ex starts getting shafted by his new SO for not having money to buy a new house, or go on vacation, or have nice things. You, the receiver of that money (and yes, it is supposed to be for the children but YOU will be the target), will be seen as the reason that this wonderful new couple can't do anything that costs money.

The private arrangement you and your ex work out may not follow the guidelines for CS and then it can easily be overturned if your ex decides to get hold of more of "his" money.

CS laws are not fair. They tend to break financially the one paying them. They also tend to follow rigid rules to make them easier to apply in practice but not necessarily practical. Getting things in writing does not guarantee that they cannot be easily changed if the arrangement does not follow the guidelines.

V.

Hi Leah,

I'm going to break the mold here and go in a completely different direction, and tell you what I did.

I went for sole custody, and got it... as I don't believe in shuffling the kids from one household to the other for any extended periods. IMHO, it's not good for the kids.

They need IMO a stable and consistent enviroment, one that they know that they can count on. Being sent off to one household to the other does not really benifit the kids from what I've seen... in fact I believe it confuses them even more.

From what I've seen personally... in most cases 50/50 custody arrangements eventually end up becoming nothing more than more Court appearances, and a bunch of headaches as time goes on. In time many times one of the children's Parents will lose interest, and they will see them less and less as time goes on. Their more interested in what's best for them, not what's best for their children.

In my opinion... I would go for sole custody, and give him visitation rights and leave it at that and hope for the best.

Stay Strong!

Wallace

Right w/ Wallace, only you will know what is best. My and my stbx relationship is very amicable, the kids are #1, and spending as much time with Dad as they are is the best thing for them. He doesn't just visit with them, he is parenting them.

As far as how my stbx was during the marriage - he did have some passive-aggressive tendencies with me, but he was always a great dad. We were always on the same page as far as parenting.

Our "private" CS arrangement will be incorporated into the divorce agreement, as when we filed we were advised to get it in writing in case one of us becomes a jerk. And I do realize that things can and will change, I hope that his commitment to being a good dad will win out, but I am prepared to make changes if not.

It is not easy, I hope that you find the right schedule and plan for you and kiddies!!

Heartmending,

Thank you for sharing your custody plan and schedule. You had some interesting ideas. I've never heard of dividing time that way.

It sounds as if you were working with a very different man than my H. Our relationship is not that good. There are huge control issues with my H. Unfortunately, I don't see things proceeding as nicely as they have for you.

It's nice to hear your sons are doing so well. It sounds as if you both handled the D in the best way possible. Thanks again for your thoughts.

Sunnyva

You shared some excellent points in re: to child support. I will be asking my attorney about all of that in regard to overnites and CS. I appreciate the warning about how new So can effect things and the fact that private arrangements can be overturned.

Again, it sounds as if your relationship with H is more amicable than ours. I have to proceed very cautiously. Thanks again.

Wallace,

Hi there! That's an interesting thought about sole custody. H would be soooooo mad if I ever tried that. He's already warned me that he'll fight me in court over anything less than 50/50. He's also said he guarantees he'll be paying his attorney far more money than I'll be paying mine. He would fight hard and dirty. That would be a scary proposition. But we shall see. I just want what is best for the girls. That has yet to be determined. Thanks for writing.

Cyllanlisa,

It does sound as if things were different with your H also.Its great that your kids were #1 with him too. I'm afraid H is #1 in his book. That is why he'll be good to them as long as it serves his purposes but things could eventually turn around with his priorities being what they are.

We will have any "private arrangements" written up officially in the divorce papers also. I wouldn't trust H to keep his word on anything without the courts backing it up. Thanks for your input.

My ex started out threatening me with sole custody. He reminded me that he had greater stability, better job, more money to hire an aggressive attorney, etc. He didn't want the divorce. I hung in for quite a long time fearful of this. I just got more depressed and physically ill.

Finally I had it! I told him that if he was going for sole custody then go for it! But....HE was the one who was going to have to explain to our sons now and in the future about why mommy wasn't in their lives more! He finally agreed to divorce mediation...finalizing our custody plan with individual attorneys and the court.

Hi again leah,

Concerning your children, and whatever you decide to live with... let me add one thing.

This is from personal experience as I'm living it right now, and getting ready to go back to Court to amend, and extend. If you think that there is any possibility of your children wanting to go to College after they graduate from High School... then you must, and I mean must put in a stipulation that after the Age of emancipation that your "H" will contimue to pay CS, 1/2 the College tuition on any or all the children that are attending College, plus half of all the medical, as well as dental.

Many people leave this out or don't even consider it, but when the time comes for this situation to arise... guess what? That's right! Your going to be starting all over again and heading right back into Court to do just exactly what I'm doing.

I did not figure my kids going to College... at the time... it wasn't even a consideration. It was a huge, and I mean huge mistake. College tuition alone out of pocket is pretty spendy.

Leah, In your sitch, I would most definitely consider sole custody... as your probably going to have your children most if not all of the time.

Yes, your "H" is a controller... but your talking about ending the "M" here. That aspect has to stop, and you must take control of your situation, for both you and your children.

You know in your heart that he's not going to be around. So why give him the comfort level, as if he were going to be.

You would be surprised at what a Judge may rule, especially considering the type of situation that you have going here.

Think about it, and don't let him bully you on this. If you do, I can just about guarantee you that you will be making multiple visits to the Court House to get everything straightened out.

Some people get lucky, and they have an ex-spouse that they can work with. IMHO, you don't have that type of situation unfortunately.

Stay Strong!

Wallace

Thanks Heartmending and Wallace,

I have a question for both of you... Did either of you ask and consider what your children wanted for living arrangements? Did their opinions have input in your decisions?

Wallace, I have thought about college and insurance and all that for the future. That was all written up in our little private agreement. I'm not sure how much of that "agreement" is still viable. It seems everything is up in the air now. But, thanks for the advise. I'll be sure to make sure they are covered in the final, official divorce documents.

Unless your children are well into their teens they are not capable of deciding what is best for them. That is your job as a parent - to decide what is best for your children.

I guarantee that if your stbx is as controlling as you portray him to be, then he will work on getting the children to "decide" that they want to be with him. Manipulative, self-centered people don't care about fair.

V.

Hi Leah...

Private agreements... mean just that... private agreements!

You must take your "Private Agreement", and present it to the Courts, if it is in fact an agreement that you can live with.

If you don't submit it in as evidence... in most cases it's not worth the paper it's written on.

A Court can change and overrule a private agreement as well... if they feel it's not in the best interests of the children.

You asked if I had asked my children how they felt about a 50/50 custody arrangement. I in fact did, as they were all in their teens at the time.

They in fact wanted nothing to do with being shuffled back and forth from house to house, and testified the same in Court.

Long story short... I was granted sole custody by the Courts, and my exW could set up visits to see them as long as she wanted. Any overnights with my exW were at my children's discretion, and if it met with my approval.

Good luck with your Attorney. Say a long prayer, and do what you already know is the right thing to do.

Stay Strong!

Wallace

Leah
Read my post on TL. I'll be praying for you to have clarity, understanding, and a quickening in your heart tomorrow as to what to do. And also for confirmation if you should do exactly what the lawyer says or make your own offer. Love ya!