No, she told my lawyer yesterday when we were discussing visitation rights for me and DD.

She said that she hasn't retained her lawyer yet, but has an appt. tomorrow (today) at 1pm.

I can in no way initiate any communications with WW. Not even through a third party like a neighbor. If I do...I'm arrested.

She did however allow DD to call me last night to say goodnight. We talked longer than WW and DD did for the total combined time that WW was in Florida and Vegas.

GF:

"I can in no way initiate any communications with WW. Not even through a third party like a neighbor. If I do...I'm arrested."

Well, 2rnabout is fair play (or, in some cases, foreplay).

Don't talk 2 her if she calls you. Talk 2 your DD if she calls, though (obviously).

-ol' 2long

[color:"blue"][/color]

Document this in your journal. Your time spent with daughter .vs your wife's time w/DD.

Jo

pi is needed. he's not a party associated with the ww. he is neutral. a professional to only gather evidence...many times, he's also a police officer too...

times like this you do whatever it takes gf...that means borrowing $$$ or getting a loan to make sure monies and WHEREABOUTS are documented.

this is what sinks her case in court.

intell alert now!

GF,
I've been thinking(always a labor for me <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />) about the Gov monies your WW stole from your account. It appears now, that she did that to have the money to retain her lawyer.
If that is indeed the *********our lawyer could make her lawyer fully aware of this. As an officer of the court, she/he would be obliged to return that money to you or face the possibilty of later being named as a co-conspirator in the theft of these funds. Just a thought, could be all wet.
BTW, I do believe your WW is now being coached by OM for every step she has taken. Especially the phone calls in your face in your own home. They purposely tried to bait you into something violent so as to make a stronger case for full custody. You did well to control yourself. I don't think I would have faired so well.
Keep that battle armour on, I do believe in a short time, the tide of this war is going to shift your way.
All Blessings,
Jerry

Ok, I'm getting really friggin pissed...someone talk me down please!!!

Here's is the email my lawyer sent me:

We will try to get more worked out next week, but for right now, they are proposing that you have time with DD on Sunday at the neighbor's Easter egg hunt/party for the kids. Neighbor will be calling to discuss it with you. She is concerned about your behavior last night-crying and being upset etc. While that is a completely normal reaction, in order to help your case you need to do the following:

Do not discuss this case or any aspect of the case with the neighbor or your daughter.
Do not get tearful or cry when you part from your daughter or say anything to her about the separation.
You have to suck it all in for the sake of your daughter right now. She is not to be exposed to any emotions except the fact that you're happy to see her and that you love her. Do not add any other comments to that.
You must be positive when it is time to leave. Just say something like I love you and will see you later. Do not make comments like I wish I could stay, I will miss you or any other comments that will "bring down the emotions" you need to keep it light.

Next week we will discuss everything else. Also, I suggest that you enroll in individual counseling. Divorce is very difficult and is second only to the death of a family member when it comes to stress and emotional turmoil.

Let me know if you have any questions.

And this is my response:

I'm sorry, but this is not acceptable. There is nothing keeping me from seeing my daughter. The PO is not to keep me from her, just to keep me from the house and WW.

We agreed last night that I would take Emme for Saturday. She has a birthday party to attend.

I don't care what she is concerned about. In her statement she says that she knows I will keep a level head when it comes to DD. She can not refuse me the right to see her.

She is using our daughter, and our emotional bond against me.

There is no more trying to get more things worked out. You need to make it clear that I have every right to see my daughter. I hired you to represent me, and my concerns, not to simply communicate what my wife will allow.

I don't want to have to say this, but if you are unwilling or unable to represent my best interests I will find someone that will.

And then this is her response to my response:

I don't think you understand. Until we go to court, we have to "try and work things out" for visitation. Otherwise you won't be able to see your daughter until after the hearing because there is no current visitation schedule. The time between filing the case and the first hearing is the most difficult time because no one knows where they stand or where they will stand after the hearing. You cannot just take your daughter or you will end up in jail. And you cannot just demand your daughter or they will refuse. It's just the way the system works.

I suggest that you consult with other attorneys for their opinion and approach on the case.


And then I say:

You're right <lawyer> I don't understand. What is giving WW more custody over DD than me? Why is it that she gets to determine who sees DD and when?

Please help me understand.



AAAAAAARRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGG what the f**&*^(*^!!!!!???!!

I'm getting ssssooo incredibly angry!!!

GF:

I know this is hard, but I think that because of the way this was all orchestrated, you need 2 be very careful and calculated as 2 how you respond.

I do disagree with this, though: "Divorce is very difficult and is second only to the death of a family member when it comes to stress and emotional turmoil. "

I think DV is far more difficult 2 deal with than a death of a family member, stresswise. When family members die, they don't usually do so 2 deliberately hurt you or destroy your family.

Your W is continuing 2 be a monster because it's worked so far 2 get her what she thinks she wants.

The more you refuse 2 take her bait, the less successful she will be.

hang in there!

-ol' 2long

Oh, and as for counseling.

You should call the Harley's RIGHT NOW. Remember, it's going 2 take a while 2 get an appointment. You need PROFESSIONAL HELP with a real PLAN.

Let your lawyer (or a lawyer) handle the legal stuff, but follow her advice and get counseling (coaching). But do it with the Harleys!!!!

You will find that good coaching at $185/hour or whatever it is, is a far more efficient use of your money than a whole herd of free or cheap counselors with little or no experience with infidelity.

-ol' 2long

And:

Others should correct me if I'm wrong, but I would calmly, and matter-of-factly, explain 2 the neighbor that your W is having an affair, and that she just spent 5 days in Vegas with the OM, when this all started.

It is UNFAIR 2 the neighbor 2 expect them 2 act as any kind of intermediary without all the facts. Tell your lawyer I said that.

-ol' 2long

I made a request via email for a session with the Harley's. It's too late now, since it's Friday to make the request, so I should hear from MB on Monday.

Ok, so what? I just sit back and continue to get bent over? She made an agreement with me that I would have DD on Saturday.

And that doesn't even address my question as to why WW has all the custody control. Is it because she has control of the house, and hence our DD?

This is just so damn unfair, I just want to scream!

Yes, it is unfair. But she beat you to the punch. This is the fallout from the first round. Make sure you document this as it will help later. As someone told you, he or she who makes it to the courthouse first gets to set the beginning tempo. So, until you can get back to the courthouse, this is the way things are. Use this time to prepare. Get intel. Since you dont have your daughter with you right now, use this time to set up intel missions (dont you go over there). She is probably going to feel invincible right now. So she will make mistakes.

Hang on...this is a long ride. You have to prepare for the next battle. This one you lost. Stop trying to win this one, and prepare for the next one. Find the high ground and begin to prepare for your own counter-attack.

In His arms.

Lawyer's response:

When the court enters an order of protection, rightly or wrongly, the party that gets to stay in the home automatically gets some power over the situation because they leave the children in the home with that parent. The Court does not make visitation or custody determinations when they enter an order of protection, they leave that to the family court. So until we get to the family court hearing on May 1st, everyone is walking on egg shells. Everyone's actions from now until the hearing will be closely scrutinized and presented to the Court. If she denies visitation, that looks bad, if you do something they don't like during visitation, that looks bad. Everyone must be on their best behavior and try and be cooperative until that hearing. On Monday, WW's lawyer and I will be able to talk more in depth about the case and visitation until the hearing. He did tell me today that his client wants to stay in the home because she can afford it, and she wants to be the primary parent. So we know that it's going to be a battle.
"

Mortarman:

Would it be helpful or harmful for GF 2 show up 2morrow 2 take his DD 2 the party? If she isn't there, he could document that fact.

Also, GF. Your lawyer seems 2 know best for the moment. It's probably hard 2 see this, but you do need 2 be very cautious and mindful of appearances.

Can your W really afford the house without your help at all? particularly with all the CC expenses she wanted you 2 help refy the 2nd 2 help pay down?

As part of the LS, I would stipulate that the house be put on the market. If you're going 2 be kept out of your own home, you might as well get rid of it and make a new home for you and your DD.

-ol' 2long

No, she can't afford it...even if she could, she wouldn't have any money left over to fly to virginia ever couple of weeks.

Just my two cents, but I think it would be wise to take your attorney's advice as exactly as possible. That way all your future testimony can start off with the phrase...."On my attorney's advice, I (did this or that)."

I know you're frustrated. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> Heck, I would be too. But MortarMan is right. Your WW beat you to the punch by just a few hours.

That's only for now, though. Your time will come and you'll get your day in court. This ain't over by a long shot.

It would probably be better for you to continue on with your current attorney than to start fresh with a new one....at least for the time being. So, try to work with her. Your wife's a fast mover, and I'm not sure you can spare the time or expense to bring in a new lawyer right now.

p.s. I wonder why she wants you to start counseling. (????) Is that so that she can prove later on that your wife is causing you mental distress? Or to prove there's nothing innately wrong with you? Or to fix you because you're emotional?

I think I'd ask her where she's going with that if I were you. Just a thought.

I think LJ has a point. Stick with this lawyer for now (possibly for the long haul, 2).

The fact that your W is a fast mover on this, and that she's spending money like water, is going 2 catch up with her and probably VERY quickly.

Make sure you've got all your waterfowl coaxial for the day that comes.

I bet she wants you in counseling because you're still so emotional about this (understandably, of course) and because you want 2 save your M when she doesn't think that's sensible (not her area). She needs you 2 keep an even keel.

-ol' 2long

stick to lawyers' advice.

most of this stuff happening to you is about PERCEPTION...not reality. she's just trying to make it seem better for her b/c when in truth, she is not gonna have that good of a case in her favor.

stick to the truth. stay smart..stay informed...and stick to your lawyers' advice. and the advice from the harleys' would not be bad...as this is a very tough situation to be in. you gotta on one hand, figure out what's going on with the affair/marriage but primarily have to secure legal issues...

in the end, I'd call harleys, and tell them what your lawyer has told you and advised you so they can get a plan for you that's in sync with the legalities...

I'm sorry I've been so wrapped up in my own pain and frustration that I failed to respond to this post...

Jo thank you so much for saying these things. It means a lot to me coming from you, and thank you so much for directing me to MB.

GF - let me add my voice to those who have advised you to follow your attorney's advice (except for the part about recruiting your neighbor). You (and possibly some of us) may not like or agree 100% with what your attorney is saying or doing so far, but for the near term - in this fast moving drammatic part - she's probably doing WAY more good than harm.

Yep, this isn't fair. Life isn't fair. If it was fair, we'd be responsible for much of the bad stuff that happens to us.

Please be on your best behavior and think long term. YOU KNOW that the durability of the affair is fragile. YOU KNOW that you are a good Dad and no one can change this. YOU KNOW that OM doesn't give a rat's a$$ about anything other than his short term interests.

Think long term.

What's happened in the last couple days has been a skirmish in the bigger war. You WILL win the war. Stay true to your good character and you cannot lose.

WAT