We hired an Ethiopian full time house maid last night. She is a 6' Amazon woman. This is great. Now I have someone who can spot me on my workouts.

This weekend is WW's bday so I am taking her to Bahrain for fun in the sun and then I have to come back and move the office out of the office and close off part of a wall where the double doors are so maid will have a room to live in. The housemaid was my biggest concern. Now, unless we find a major problem in the next month, we can go to Plan B without too much stress. Everything else should work itself out with time.

TKO = to keep open ...

or

TKO = technical knock out ...

are there more ?

Pep*

Got it right the first time. I am only planning to keep a chronology here for posterity. It might help somebody else some day. Don't know.

Don't get down now.

You're doing very well. You have a good plan, which you've thought out carefully.

Don't make the mistake of thinking everyone's situation is yours. All situations on here have the same "basic" traits and many, many things in common, but we're all individuals - we're not cut outs.

Misquoting because I'd have to get out of this chair to find the proper quote:

"Courage must be stronger as our strength grows less."

Okay I wasn't going to post but here goes. Looks like ToddAC has gone to sleep for his nightly two hours. I have two issues which are closely interwoven.

One is that I think any affair that does not run its natural course appears to be always about to happen. Stanley's unrequited love. It is very romantic and very much part of the fantasy. We all have fantasies of one type or another.Some are just less healthy. A WW can get stuck in her fantasy for the A (not OM - the A) and OM is a requirement for the A. So Om takes on superhuman qualities. OM becomes the cure for all WW's problems.

There is also the self-esteem issue. Dorry said she still wanted OM to basically love her. She explained it well enough so I won't go into details.

Since my WW's affair did not die a natural death, I believe it will never completely die. I have felt that way for a long time BTW - ToddAC and I discussed this months ago.

So my question that is bothering me is this:

My WW had boyfriends before our marriage. She was in love with some of them. Now they mean nothing to her. I am the same way with old girlfriends. What is it that is different about the OM of an affair? Love is presumably love. Why is love from an A so different from married love or boyfriend love? One sight of an old boyfriend does not make WW wet her pants. One sight of OM and she would go gaga.

There is more to the A than love. Maybe it is as simple as Stanley's brain chemistry. I don't know. I am sure that KiwiJ., Suzet* and other have old boyfriends from their past that have no emotional effect on them at all. What is going on with the OM? Or is the soulmate concept really true?

Does anybody want to take on this question? Please?

I am projecting somewhat with Suzet I admit but Stanley is telling the truth. I am ever so glad that gemela and I are separating. I really need time to deal with all of this. Still need a Plan B letter though. I will dig up that thread in a few days.

Pio, I think you are definitely on to something in the A running it's course. Mine didn't but it would have.

I can't talk about old boyfriends obviously because the OM was an old boyfriend but, yes, the boyfriend between the OM and meeting Rob (the only person I'd had SF with before I met Rob) could have fallen off the face of the earth by now and it wouldn't matter one iota to me.

I don't believe for a moment in the soulmate concept (in the context of an A). I never told the OM I loved him and he never told me either. If I'd told him that it would have meant I didn't love Rob and I knew that wasn't true. The only answer I have is that it is forbidden fruit and romantic because it's hidden.

I know FOR A CERTAIN FACT that it would never have survived as a real relationship. I didn't choose him the first time round and I really wouldn't have chosen him again.

It's a complete and utter fantasy based on chemicals and the notion of a Romeo and Juliet star-crossed lovers relationship. It's romantisised in literature and in the movies and if you're selfish and immature like I was (am) it's easy to get sucked in.

I do think there's a lot to do with the Affair running it's course. When they separate "in love" it's scary.

In the movie "Titanic", Kate Winslet keeps repeating "I'll never let go" as she watches Leonardo DiCaprio sink into the depths. Her OM of one night. She lives a long and full life. Has children and grandchildren. When she dies, who does she go back to? Lenny. In his impoverished rags. A man who could never give her anything but true love. A man who said and did all the right things. The perfect soulmate.

This is where Suzet is and this is where gemela is - trapped in a problem of Titanic proportions.

I'll give this a go Pio...

In an affair relationship the only thing that exists is the "good stuff"...ego stroking, light hearted conversation, friendly banter, flirting, teasing, joking, laughing, etc...All feel good fantasy stuff...Kinda like in movies you don't often see the characters go to the bathroom, or at least not EVERYTIME they go...A perfect world, where chocolate has no fat grams and wine has no calories...

There is no "regular stuff"...no bills, no dry cleaning, no sick children, no what are we eating here at home tonight, no broken appliances, no chores...no boring stuff...

Add to all "good stuff", the "forbidden fruit" theory, newness and in my situation, history (OM was my hs/college bf)...I also believe that hormones and chemicals (perhaps dopamine) is involved...I've never shared this on MB, but when I would talk to OM on the phone, I actually got a tingly sensation between my shoulder blades...I KNOW THAT SOUNDS WEIRD, BUT I SWEAR IT'S TRUE...to me that signifies some sort of chemical reaction was going on, but I dunno...Anyway, I'm sure you can see that all that is very addictive...Funny thing is, even in the affair, I KNEW that I would NEVER be able to be with OM...for a gazillion reasons, like I told you before, if I were to ever be single, he would NEVER be my choice...we were just two soul sick individuals that happened upon each other at the "right" time in our timeline...

Ok, now I've rambled and don't think I've really answered much for you...I'm not sure if you may have gleened anything from this or not...I'm really tired and bleary eyed, so, admittedly it's not my best effort...you are welcomed to ask me specific questions if you wish...

Best,

Mrs. W<----A VERY REAL AND SCARY (but not hairy) SASQUATCH!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

I completely get what you are saying. Which is why i ask the question. From my simple-minded way of thinking, the WW is in love with the A more than with the OM.

I ask myself this question because I do have doubts that gemela will ever truly get over withdrawal and will ever be able to commit herself to the marriage. I think we fall in Stanley's "hopeless" category. I am not sure that it matters any more. We hired the Ethipoian housemaid so gemela and I will be officially separated on August 12th.

Well Pio, I think that you are right about the addiction being to the affair and not the OP, I have long said that really OM could have been anyone, even Bozo the Clown...

Affairs are about escapism...Funny thing is, what a sicked out WS doesn't realize is that it is actually themselves that they are running from...But instead of focusing on the inside and looking at what's going on there, they seek happiness from without, where it is NEVER to be found...

For most of my life, I existed in daydreams, it was here on this board that I actually "verbalized" that for the first time, honestly, it had never occured to me before-it was but a mechanism/coping skill for me...my affair was a real life daydream turned nightmare for me...Anytime that I was sad, angry, depressed...any negative emotion, I went inside myself to escape to a fantasyland of "happiness"...I constantly, (and still do this at times-getting better though) would say, "I'll be happy when ________.", rather than choosing to be happy in the present...The difference for me is that I am aware of this now, and I put myself in check when it happens...same goes for all the wasted daydreaming time...I am choosing to be happy, because now I realize that it is a choice-and also that life is a mystery to be lived and not a problem to be solved...

It's wonderful that you be able to learn all this, so that you can understand and be healthy yourself...Sadly, no matter how much you learn and grow, Gemela will have to do that for herself...But you know that...

Are you still in Plan A til August? How's that going? What are you working on?


Mrs. W

I’m not sure “love” has anything to do with an affair. At least not as far as OM is concerned.

What is love? I’ll admit freely that the feelings I have for my wife started off as “lust”. Developed into “love” and are now a combination of “love”, “respect”, “Cant live without you”, “I’ll try to tolerate you” and occasional “lust” (waaaayyy too occasionally.... sigh).

Maybe what a WS seeks in the affair is not “love” but what the WS sees as the things missing from the love equation in the relationship with BS. So she feels you are not fulfilling certain need and tries to fulfil them outside the marriage.

Is this right or justifiable? No! Is this in any way your fault? No! Since “love” is a concept and not a quantified experience then the definition of “love” varies. For you providing and caring might be love. For her candlelit dinners and serenades might be love. It all boils down to communications and people knowing what they want and can realistically expect.

Had your wife had a clear idea of hat she wanted and you not fulfilled her requirements she had the option of divorcing you. Not of having an affair.

I must also say that in your case I’m not sure the affair had any chance of “dying” or even developing. How realistic is it that OM could have supported your WW and the DD’s? Hardly likely. With the “social” options available in your part of the world what are the chances wither would have willingly stopped? The most likely option was that OM’s contract would expire and he would go on home, leaving WW as his “lost and only true love whom he was doomed to be without” (puke). My guess is that the affair would have continued for that time as “lust” and WW would have held onto the romantic image of OM long after he leaves for home.

Basically I think you have done what you could. That is to get WW to realize the gap between reality and fantasy. She still thinks it’s a fissure but doesn’t realize it’s more like the Grand Canyon.

I am doing my best for Plan A at the moment. No LB's. No DJ's. No discussion of the A whatsoever. I have not mentioned MC again. Gemela said she would make an appointment for us. I am waiting. I am very careful how I broach the subject of separation when it comes up. But I do never let her think it is not going to happen because it will. I have tickets in hand. I have not yet written my Plan B letter. Maybe I will work on that tomorrow.

I am spending more than 15.5 hours per week with WW. I am taking her to Bahrain this weekend to suntan by the pool at the Ritz Carlton and yes we will both drink alcohol. It is her birthday. I got her a subscription to the World Cup so she could watch Mexico. Sadly they are out.

We are getting along extremely well. It is like a second honeymoon. The only fight we have had lately is that she wants to lie to her mom and dad about the reason for the separation. I have told her I won't lie and if I get the opportunity I will tell all but it would be better coming from her. She has to stop running from the truth.

hey bigger.

Piojos.....what do you think you will accomplish by making Gemela leave? Is she going to fall back in love with you long distance? If she is so willingly letting her daughters behind to go to Mexico, you must be making her life "de cuadritos". Mexican women almost 100% of the time are very protective of their children. And she is so willingly leaving her two little girls with a complete stranger, a six footer ethiopian woman? But you say you are having a "second honeymoon" with her? If she was, she will not be leaving come August!

I don't expect her to do anything. I have no idea what she will do but that is all her choice. I can't take this any more. The lasagna incident crystalized that for me.

I think gemela is stuck in love with OM. I don't think she will ever get over that. I believe we will probably end up divorced. At the moment I feel quite sad and I think it is because I am now grieving the loss of my marriage.

Gemela has been insisting from the beginning that she "take a break". She tells me the MC says it is a good idea too. SIL also insists she needs to go to Mexico. I am just finally agreeing with all of them. Our plan is that she goes to Mexico in August and I fly her back to visit for Christmas. We will talk then about what our future desires are.

You yourself said my marriage was over a long time ago. We are only trying to do what is best for the DDs at the moment. She will not be separated from them permanently. I have never ever said she would be.

BTW, I am going to Abqaiq right now so I am not ignoring anyone - I am just out for a little while.

Pio - you are paranoid about Gemela being in "love" with OM. I think Stan-ley is wrong when he thinks this kind of affair is hopeless. - the spate of relapsed FWW's notwithstanding.

BK,

That may or may not be. But since we are not allowed to talk about the affair in any way, I have no way of knowing up from down. Yes I admit that all the FWW's failing (i.e. getting an "F" in FWW which ironically makes them lose the F to become WW) has had its affect on me. I cannot imagin going through all this only to find a love letter a year from now from WW to OM. I do agree with Stanley that I will not remain in that marriage. Okay so maybe I am cutting off my arm just in case it might get broken.

But the facts are that gemela has never shown any remorse for the A. Has never said anything other than it was an error. I have difficulty knowing that she screwed OM in my bed while I was away and my DDs were in the next room. Not exactly my idea of a responsible mother.

If I stay together with gemela any longer as things currently are, I will have no love left for her. I have no idea what she will do in Mexico. I have told her she is free to do anything she wants. She can go to OM, she can have another affair or, if she decides, she can come back here. It is all her choice. I simply need to give myself the opportunity to heal some of the pain and she refuses to help me do that. Lasagna, French riding instructors, hidden money stashes, etc. are hurting - not helping - me.

You know that funny noise your stereo or PC speaker makes when the cell phone sits too close to it and it gets polled by the repeater? Just for a few seconds you here some pings? I had the world cup hooked into the surround sound the other day and I heard that. I haven't found a phone yet but I am looking. We don't own any cell phones. Where did that sound come from?

The lack of remorse sure makes a case for an ongoing affair.

Just wondering if you're allowed to talk about the state of your marriage (let alone the affair itself)?

Hope you don't mind my butting in to your thread. I've been known to "cop a 'tude" especially when I've felt misunderstood, so I don't hold it against you. Adultery sucks for everybody.

Please feel free. I am not sure what you are talking about with the attitude but it is probably something I posted to you so I am sorry about that. Yes I have been a bit on edge lately. There are several triggers for that. Some are well known and others are not.

Yes adultery is not fun (except for those doing it).

No we are not allowed to talk much about the marriage. The dialogue we are permitted is something like "how are you doing lately?". Answer has to be vague and somewhat cryptic. Acceptable choices are: "okay", " I'm having a rough couple of days but I'll get better". We are allowed to ask how the other is doing in general terms but no discussion of how we as a couple are doing.

These inquiries are really just to help each of us put the other's behavior in context. For example, if I drop kick the cat out the back door while screaming "go get your own food!", she will ask how I am doing lately. If I say I am having a rough day, she does not need to ask about the cat kicking as she knows why I did it.

I am joking BTW. We don't actually have a cat - not since the drop kicking incident anyway. No, no just kidding. WW is allergic to cats or I would have 10 of them.