Hi again everyone. Had a nice time out for ice cream with my 15 year old daughter today. Just talked "life" stuff. Precious moments. Good laughs. Tonight I'm with our 9 year old here. Kid just HAS to wrestle every night before bed. Does anyone think I plan to give of 50% of my kids? I don't think so.

I spoke to my lawyer today (as several suggested) to brief him (just an FYI call). He said in a D there everybody loses. Heard THAT before! I'm in Ohio by the way. He will be at my service if needed. Read: Cha-ching!

As for our marital bed, BIG problem is that our small business demands night shifts. This has added to the problem (not enough inn employees who can night shift). So, by default, we have not had much "marital bed" for 2-3 years. THIS is one of the adjustments which MUST be made in 2007.

I'm scheduled to meet with our pastor tomorrow. I feel it's Tough Love time. It's a tough call to determine what is an LB and what is prudent, decisive, loving action! I'd love to expose the OM first, but I need to get names, addresses, etc. It's in the Plan. Just wish I had legal recourse to shock the bum.

My main point at tomorrow's pastor meeting is that as a betrayed spouse and leader of my home, I NEED to have a Truth Session asap. It's been 3 months. No remorse. No sorrow. So, no more games. If she is sincere (as she has led all to believe) there can be no lies, deception, clandestine communication. All contact BOTH ways must end or we are stalemated in the healing process. She's wasting my time and robbing our family of true joy and a nurturing environment. Time to start the De-fogging.

I will state the boundaries. A complete NC agreement. Full accountability of her activities. If she does not agree, she has a major decision to make.

Dr Counselor (whom we meet with next week) may feel that I am issuing an ultimatum. At this crossroad, I'll need to put my foot down and let him know that my "ultimatum" is that my WW must demonstrate sincerity through an NC agreement or all bets are off for my "laissez-faire" position as she continues on her "journey". She's subverting MY journey and shortcircuiting MY progress to meet her needs!

Basically, she needs a push to get through this fog I believe.

Then there's the OM. If I had a reliable way to out him, knowing it would matter, I would do it in a heartbeat.Incidently, the lawyer offered a conjecture - what if my WW is pursuing HIM but I just don't SEE those communications?

I just read a post about using a digital recorder. Good idea. I'll slip it under the bed next time I'm home.

Secondly, does anyone know of a software/cable which can download cell phone data? I think that if I can catch her in the shower, I can grab the phone to download text messages pretty quickly.

Well, I shall proceed carefully, firmly, lovingly. I want to communicate that "I Love You" and will fight for her without doing excessive harm. It' like walking on eggshells scattered around a mine field. ESPECIALLY when one is trying to stay "biblical".

Thanks again. So many broken hearts on this site. Tragic.

There is a thread about SIM card readers and recovery software. It will probably be on one of the first 5-10 pages, but if you can't find it I'll try and bump it up tomorrow.

I totally understand how you feel right now as I am suffering the same faith.

I am in a recovery stage (I hope I am) and sometimes ugly thought clouded my mind and makes me so depress, hurt and pains.

I turn to god to ask for support, asked for an open mind to forgive and ask for the strength to forget.

It is not easy to go thru all these pains and sometimes you asked yourself, what did I do wrong to deserve all this?

Be strong if you want to build this relationship and it takes 2 person to build a marriage. Working on your own won't help.

Thanks for your sticking with this thread! Can you explain your initial thoughts:

"The first thing you need to do is read SAA, and get an understanding of why your WW had this affair. Fill out the ENs and LB questionnaires."

I'm not real familiar with the lingo yet, except for "LB".

Also, I can't locate the SIM reader thread, so that will help too.

Thanks!

Betrayed Hubby

LB = Love Buster

You can't find the thread? Must I do everything? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />
(j/k)

Ahtan:

I really appreciate your thoughts. We need the wisdom of Solomom, the determination of Joshua, and the endurance of Job. Hmm, come to think of it 700 wives and 300 concubines wasn't that brillant for Sol, was it...

After 20 years of marriage, the investment of one's heart, 3 kids, ups and downs, it's pure misery to see an A happen. The Fog is pretty thick still in my W. But I know there's a warm heart in there very clouded over. I must hold onto Hope or I'll crack.

I told my pastor 2 weeks ago that I am now fairly settled and much more stable going into the 3-month period. "I've blended I Corinthians 13 with Frankie Valley" I said. "What do you mean" he said quizically. I replied "Love is patient, love is kind, but 'Walk like a man, talk like a man, walk like a man my son, No woman's worth crawling on the earth, so walk like a man my son". (I quit at the falsetto part!).

Well just a little humor to bolster us up. If I didn't have kids, I'd be relentless. But three tender hearts act as a significant buffer to my actions. This is why I am proceeding with caution.

I sure wish there was an Ohio "support" group!

I do have some trouble sleeping. Anyone consider sleep aids? Sometimes the thought of them spooks me.

Betrayed Hubby

Here are the posts:


[quote]Update: I've had success at reading my own SIM card with the ZIO fonemate SIM card reader/manager ( http://www.amazon.com/ZiO-FoneMate-SIM-Card-Manager/dp/B00062WV18 ) in conjunction with Simcon software ( http://www.simcon.no/ ) and will try on wh's card as soon as I get the opportunity.

Reporting is good, but here's the bummer thing I've learned: at best, SIM cards can only store 30 SMS (text) messages at a time. This can be any combination of inbox, outgoing, or deleted messages. So much for learning the content of his messages with OW from last month-- he's sent and received 30 msgs in the past 2 days alone (several with me!)

Still will be worth the money, and I can use it going forward in conjunction with his cell co's online billing to monitor his substantial telecom activities. Wish me luck

PS, see also http://www.forensicswiki.org/wiki/SIM_Card and
http://www.e-evidence.info/cellular.html<br />
<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

[quote]Here is an excellent article on getting to know everything about your WS' cell phone:
http://www.cyberlies.com/cheating-spouse-articles/cell-phone-spy.htm<br />
<hr /></blockquote><font class="post">

Hope this helps.

Great info. I read the cellphone spy website. Some good ideas. Thanks.

It occured to me that we have Verizon phones which do not use SIM cards. W has a KRAZR. What can I then use to download phone data?

BH

What do I look like, Jeeves? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

Seriously, I don't know what to tell you. Does your phone have a USB port that can hook up to a computer? You might want to call Verizon and ask their tech support people if there is anything that could be done.

I found:

http://www.3gcables.com/Data_Cables-USB_DATA_CABLE_MOTOROLA_SLVR_KRZR_RAZR_V3m_Q_V3_V3.html

http://accessories.inphonic.com/pc-526-9-mobile-phonetools-version-40-cd-rom-with-data-cable.aspx

But neither states that text messages can be downloaded.

Hmmmm...

Call Verizon, stay on hold for 30 minutes, and speak with one of their tech nerds.

"The first thing you need to do is read SAA, and get an understanding of why your WW had this affair. Fill out the ENs and LB questionnaires."

SAA is a book, Surviving an Affair
EN = emotional needs

You can find the book and the questionnaires on this site.

Hang in there, betrayed. You're doing a great job.

I'm feeling good right now. Had a substantive talk with my pastor for 90 min this morning. Over the last two weeks he and Dr Counselor have discussed our A situation several times behind the scenes. We're on the same page!

They feel that my WW is NOT being honest regarding NC. Pastor, in fact, called the OM to put him on alert that we were moving forward in the sitch. (Pastor was at liberty to do this without my permission because I had him witness the in-person "confession".)

He is already in agreement that a Truth Session/Confrontation is needed and it will likely take place the week after next b/c next week is HER session (Monday) and Tues is my counseling session. The real D-day is yet to come!

I dearly appreciate everyone's input! There are SO MANY trashed hearts/family's on this site. Wish I could lob a nuke into the pit of Hades and vaporize Beelzebub. Come to think of it.....that's in the divine script eventually anyway...

As for the cell phone, I'll probably just do a midnight stealth thing and record the contents manually. I'll hold off on cancelling texting because I need the data trail.

I just wish this thing wasn't SO draining emotionally and mentally. It's like being held hostage in a sense. Almost paralyzing when it comes to day-by-day activities.

Thanks again! Keep the support coming.

BetrayedHubby

Jim, Pep and MB partners:

You know, this A stuff is what soap operas are made of. Here's the latest twist on my still-WW who is trying to snow job me, the kids, the pastor, and the counselor.

SO, WW and I were to have our "individual" counseling appointments this week. The C got sick, so it'll either be me alone on 1/9 or we'll postpone until next week.

As a reminder, we both come from conservative Christian backgrounds, commonly know as "born again".

Here's the snow job. I turned in my 500 pgs of printed e-mails to the C 2 weeks ago as a "good will" gesture. He commends me. Now it's time to "trust" in her sincerity. OK, but still I don't believe her, her family doesn't believe her, and her behavior betrays her veracity.

My struggle right now is still balancing "faith and trust" in God to do HIS work, while I act responsibly to "save" as it were my wife from this impending self-destruction as well as family destruction. Oh, yes, the snow job...

Last night I took advantage of an opportunity, being Sunday night, to put a digital recorder in by the bed. Sure 'nuff, as she readys for bed, there is a phone call while I'm gone (I've yet to determine cell or land line - won't be hard). Well, 99% chance it's the OM (I only hear HER side of course) because of the content of her call. Now get this - she has a thoroughly twisted idea of forgiveness from God. It's all OK with Him! He forgives! He heals! He restores! It's all grace! No repentance needed because He so understands our weaknesses and sin! She even talks sincerely to him about looking forward to going to a communion services again one day soon. She reads from some devotionals, quotes Bible verses. Hmmmm....got it all planned out I see.

Forget the destroyed husband, kids, family, etc. It's all about her and him and their warped brand of "faith".

Now, I realize that a recorded call isn't a legally nice thing to do. But, if the trap catches a rat, so be it. It has motivated me to begin the Outing in earnest once I discuss my new info with the pastor and counselor.

I do love my WW and will do my best to force a Fog Lifting soon. But I proceed cautiously because of my kids. When I first learned of this I went nuts. Now, I am more calculating. Depending on the outcme of our planned Truth Session, I am planning to do a royal revelation to his family and everyone in his circles. I do not think it wise, just yet, to expose my wife in order to protect the kids. Don't want to do more LB than needed for the "phase" But as necessary, I will do the deed here. I must also be prepared for the possibility that after 4 years of deception, she is a mental basket case being driven by a fantasy, held together by a blend of denial, compulsive thinking, and conrolled by the OM who himself is desperate to make this work. Amazing how they both talk about caring for each other, praying for each other. It's sick. It's sad.

I'm trying to fight the numbness I often feel. I can't communicate with my wife anymore beyond the immediate superficialities of day-to-day stuff. She's completely undermined our relationship for 4 years. I must hold on to my commitments even if the feelings of "love" have vaporized.

I pray for strength, tenderness,and determination to at least save my kids in this should my WW jump off the edge in a few months.

Anybody have any thoughts to share?

Betrayed Hubby

what's taking you so long to follow the advice given here? I saw your new thread asking about how to handle the OM. you are getting sidetracked...the answers are all here in this thread!

Here's some thoughts man. Take your meekness and flush it down the toilet bowl. It's time for loving agression without fear of consequence.

The Lord steers a moving ship man. EXPOSE EXPOSE EXPOSE! You can hope a pray .. that is good, always positive, always gives results .. I believe that too. BUT, you've got to go to war against this thing if you want to kill it. Meekness in this battle works against you. Ask any BS who's been through this.

I respect your faith, however you've got to step up and rip this thing wide open .. for ALL TO SEE, bring it into the perverbial light. An A occurs in darkness, in secrecy, and deciet. The light (exposure) burns that all away.

Choosing not to expose or puting it off is like standing still on a battlefield and looking down at the grass while the armies of the enemy charge at you. YOU'VE GOT TO LOOK UP, LOOK STRAIGHT AHEAD, PULL OUT YOUR EXPOSURE SWORD AND CHARGE IN MAN, NO FEAR, DO IT, DON'T WAIT, DON'T DELAY. DO IT NOW!

I apologize for my zeal.

fiatflux & inshockman:

Your thoughts and energetic "push" are VERY appreciated. And I understand your points very well. Please understand, I committed myself to a MARRIAGE COUNSELOR provided through our church. My WW and I have gone regularly to sessions for 3 months. 90 days is about the point that other D sites give before doing major actions if there is ANY hint of restoration in progress. He has told me that her heart is in a seriously "backslidden" state (you may know what this means) but that she is making progress.

I have consulted with my pastor in the last week. He and the Counselor have compared notes. Because of some insistencies they have seen, they are ready to go to the next level with my wife next week - it would have been this past week but for the New Year's break and the counselor getting ill. This week upcoming will mark a turning point, and I expect the pastoral staff/counselor to start the hard ball. My acting "prematurely" would be effectively an LB right now.

Because I gave MY WORD to place myself under their authority for the time being, and to allow my WW to gather her thoughts, emotions, seek God, and put some time in between herself and the OM, I have elected to step back. This is integrity. She HAS gone to counseling faithfully. My kids and business situation act as buffers to hold her here and give her pause.

SO, ergo, I am not so much showing "meekness" as much as I am trying to maintain my integrity,commitment, and honor. If the church leadership wasn't in the picture, I would have tripped the trigger weeks ago. I would remind you that "meekness" is not to be confused with "weakness" - meekness, biblically, is "power under control". Christ was meek. But oh, what power he had! A person with a violent temper is demonstrating weakness, not strength, right?

At this point, I will be meeting one-on-one with the counselor this week (my WW meets the day before I do). At my meeting I will lay the cards on the table. "Turn the heat up now" or I will set in motion my the Exposure plan, and let the chips fall.

When I act, it will be a relentless attack of Truth and Consequences on the OM. God knows my intentions and I am trusting Him to show me this week if I am to proceed. I know it sounds flaky to some people, but God is FULLY capable of resolving this in His own decisive, miraculous, and awe-inspiring way. Unless I am convinced that our Counselor is ready to activate Ephesians 5:1-15 very soon, I will light the fuse myself.

My WW is still at home, she is not hostile, and she appears to be trying to get herself stabilized. The pastor SPOKE on the phone with the OM last week to put him on notice regarding the screws getting tighter. But there are still some doubts that pastor, counselor, and I have.

This week I should find out my pastor's/counselor's plan of attack. I am at the limit of my laissez-faire stance, patience, and grace to my WW. The day of reckoning is before her, and I believe it will occur very soon.

This week I am planning a meeting with the OM's former employer who fired him (for some reasons I don't know) and we are in the same business. He also knows me. I will ask him in strictest confidence and secrecy to provide me with some information. I will gather "intelligence", names, address, phone numbers, social circles, pressure points the OM would feel, his church name, etc.

I will visit the church with my very open "prayer request".

I will meet with his Pastor, e-mails in hand.

Letters will be sent to family members.

I will visit his parents, e-mails in-hand.

I may also have a Cease and Desist letter prepared by my lawyer. Maybe it doesn't have teeth in Ohio, but I doubt OM would want to spend buckets of money to defend himself in this. Local newspaper coverage might impact his business after I prepare the press release.

I'm a pretty creative and energetic guy, so when I move to engage the plan it will be the OM's tsunami.

For now, I'll hang tight because, "Love is patient, love is kind"...etc. 1Cor13

If you have any other thoughts, PLEASE make them known. You have energized me.

Thanks.

Betrayed Hubby

Betrayed H.... YOU GO MAN!!! You and I are at approximately the same phase right now. I understand that sometimes the ducks dont line up just the way they are supposed to, and I know that I dont want to mess up what God has planned either. Sounds to me like you are doing right if my opinion matters...(and it probably shouldnt)... Just let HIM and HIS word guide you as best you can. You ARE fighting the good fight!! GO FIGHT WIN!!
SAS.

Betrayed,

I am so sorry you are going through this and I completely understand your current emotional state as we have all been there.

I feel the need to point out something though. The OM is divorced and got divorced while he was having an affair with your wife. They are in very deep. As I see it, it is all part of their plan. You wife is planning RIGHT NOW on divorcing you to be with the other man. That is why there is no remorse, why she is complacent, etc. You are in way deeper that you can imagine and she has already written you off. She is throwing you under the bus.

I would follow the advise being given but do not underestimate the seriousness of your situation. Have you checked the books for your business? Any money missing? Any easy way to squirrell away cash from the business without you knowing?


Can you contact his exwife and ask the cause of their divorce?

Good luck to you. Also, don't blame yourself. It is good to acknowledge where there is room for improvement in ourselves, but it was your WIFE's shortcomings, NOT YOURS, that landed you guys where you are today. Don't you ever forget that and don't you ever blame yourself for this mess.

FYI

any number of months going through marriage counseling while one spouse is active in an affair on any level is generally a complete waste of time

the WS uses MC sessions to bolster their mental affair-justification-scaffolding

they say: "SEE ... this marriage was not meant to be. We tried MC for 3 months and our M did not improve"

it is a conscience-reliever for the adulterous

don't buy it

Pep