Hi everybody:
My story is under this thread...Just a quick summary:
WH had an affair from Jan 06 to July 06. Confessed July 06. Moved out for 2 days and back home. Never was remorseful, but he had been doing a lot of nice things. We felt closer and closer, making plans for the future and taking vacations together. Life was getting normal again. But we never talked about A, couldn't becasue he would be angry and wouldn't participate. Told me he didn't want to stay when we were fighting.
I had been in plan A. He promised NC and was very good at it. We changed all cell phones numbers he used to call OW. He told me about one email contact in Oct. initiated by OW. But it was brief and they went to NC after that. No contact since then.
WH has been doing a lot of helpful things, including helping with kids and planing future vacations. The only thing is that he couldn't initiate any affection to me. Not even a hug or kiss. I initiated all the time and he was gradually getting better at receiving those. On my birthday a week ago, he gave me a beautiful neckless that I love.
Things seemed to falling into places...
But no real affections from his side. I had been doing OK with plan A, except that once a month I would blow up...It runs like a clock.
Last night everything went so smooth and nice and we were loooking forward to our spring break vacation with our close family friends. After we went to bed, I tried to hug him from behind and he said it's not comfortable...I felt so rejected that it hurt terribly. I couldn't sleep and asked him to help me sleep by holding me...And he did so reluctantly and I felt worse...So finally the blow out came...I told him to please find an apartment and leave...I told him how disappointed I was about him not able to help me heal from him...I told him how all these years I felt he was not caring about me and the kids (which was what I felt at that time, but thinking more clearly now, it's not true)...I said some hurtful things about him...He got angry of course, but not terrible angry as other times...
This morning we talked a little and he sounded a little remote but not terrible angry either...I am very calm, which surprise me a lot. I don't think I really want him to leave. I told him also that part of me wanted him to leave and part of me want him to stay and I'm confused. Don't know if he heard me though because he really needed sleep and his work day starts very eary each day and it was not considerate of me to just talk when he needed sleep so desperately...Everytime it was like this. He became uncommunicative when I tried to talk late at night because he said he needed sleep. Everytime after this kind of episode I email or call the next day to apologize, but this time I don't feel like doing that. I haven't called or emailed him yet and he didn't call either. I asked him to try to find a place to stay this weekend...I'm not sure if I really want him to do that and I'm not sure why I said that to him. I just felt so hurt and wanted the hurt to go away and I just wanted to make sure if he would leave if I asked him to I guess. I hate the idea that he stayed out of pity for me and the kids and I said I would be ok if he leaves but I would worry about kids and I won't limite his access to his kids if we separate...
He was afraid that I would kick him out someday I can sense and he kind of convinced himself that I would do this, but I didn't know I was capable of doing this. I told him before that I would never ask for a D. But now I did tell him and I wanted him to leave...
What's wrong with this whole situation and what should I do? I don't think I'm ready for plan B yet and there has been no contact and a lot of improvments, why did I blow up so much good things and why I felt so calm after I did this?

Any help is greatly appreciated. Should I apologize to him again? He said he was tired of being controlled like a puppet, meaning I asked for affection and he gave it to me unwillingly and I talked about separation and then apologizing to him so he never move out, etc, etc...I can see that I'm doing a lot of wrong things, but how do I control my rage when he is not making the right steps to help me heal...

Sorry for the rambling and I truly need help to clarify my mind here...



http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...rt=all&vc=1

High likelihood the A is still on, IMO.

Try to verify this if you can. He may have a second secret phone.

How did you find out about the "one" contact? Did he tell you, or did you find it?

Whether there is still an A, or even if he just won't commit to doing what is necessary for R, the answer is still for the WS to move out, and the BS to go quickly to a very dark Plan B.

But for now, take back what you said about the D.

You need Plan B, not D.

LA,
I'm telling you...our WH's are like "2 pees in a pod"! Incredible! I responded to you at your earlier link:
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...e=5#Post3141213
but I didn't hear back from you. Check it out, someone else posted to you as well!

Does your WH go to IC? I think that is VERY important! My WH is now beginning his 3rd IC with our MC & he is very pleased with him. If you knew my WH, probably very very similar to yours; you would understand that for my WH to go to IC, it's pretty INCREDIBLE! He is not a pill taker, a IC goer or any of the above! Now he is going BOTH!

I think it's issues within that they need to deal with b/f they can even begin to help us to heal, that is why the IC is SOOOO important. If you would like to put our WH's in contact, we can do that. I know we spoke once b/f about that & decided that it wouldn't be best, but maybe NOW my WH could help your WH out with this? Your call!

Again, as everyone says...patience! Are you on any AD? If not, please do so, it will help you to deal with your WH & it will help you as well!

My thoughts are with you! K

Hi Karen:

Thanks for the replies. We were doing very well before last night...On my birthday he bought me a very pretty neckless and when I wear it, I could almost sense that he was very happy...Until last night...

I kind of feel that whenever things get better, I feel the need to explode...And when I sense that he was struggling, I could be very nice and patient. Gosh, I know the pattern, but just can't seem to break it.

I'm so glad to hear that your H is going IC. I so want my H to go also. He really needs a lot of things to figure out.
Maybe I should go to MC first and see if H could come along? I will do some research on MCs. How did you find your MC? Yours sounds to be a really great one.

How do you think we could hook up our Hs? Maybe we could talk to each other through private emails first? Do you have an email account that I can send email to you directly?

I hope we will go back on track soon. We have come so far and I would hate to give it up...

Thanks again for your kind words.

LovingAlong

LA,
So, are you on AD's? They would sure help you out with "triggers". Are the two of you intimate at all? I know that you spoke b/f about the sleeping arrangements & you were not pleased with them, the 10ft space between you?

My email is listed in my signature line, please send me something there. Does your WH have his own email? I really think that my WH would contact him if I asked him.

I think it would be best for you to find a MC first. I did a search online for my area & by process of elimination I found mine! I specifically looked for a male MC, for my WH's sake. I made all of the phone calls in one day & waited for the callbacks. The men MC that did call me back where the ones that I kinda interviewed, not intense but enough so that I got a feel for their practice. Also, so that they knew what I had going & what a challenge it would be & ESPECIALLY if they were up for the challenge. The 3 other MC's that I spoke with told me right upfront if they wanted to take us on or not. I remember one telling me that he was pretty busy & he didn't know if he had the time to devote to us. Another one "just" wasn't up for it. So I eventually got through to one who was & he is working very well for the both of us.

I kinda forced my WH's hand into counseling only b/c I knew that if I didn't he would never take the initiative; he would want to just bury all of this & forget it. Now that he has gone several times it was finally his decision to start scheduling IC for himself & ALSO put himself on some AD's; that was a HUGE step for him! I think it is important to have the same IC & MC also! So that would be a great question to ask when you interview. If he doesn't decide to go with you the 1st time or the 2nd time, eventually as he sees changes in you I'm sure that he will want to change himself as well. At least...I can't imagine that someone would want to spend their days being miserable & not fixing the problems. Heck, don't we all want to be happy?

Send me a note & we'll talk more in depth. Take care. K

I accidentally posted this reply to another poster but I meant it for you.

I hear you and I can relate. We're 3 years into recovery and I still have my moments, but not like at the beginning, especially in the first 6 months. I think the resentment is "normal". I had so many "triggers" in the beginning and it took a long time to get to the point where the pain was bearable and now even gone in some situations. I would get so angry over everything that happened.

For instance, our bed was a biggie for me. I had slept next to this man since I was 20 years old (I'll be 50 next month). While he was gone, rolling over and seeing his side of the bed empty was one of the most painful aspects of our ordeal. I also read a letter he had written where he told her he loved "holding her hand all night while they slept." Ouch! That was something he'd NEVER done with me during our 26 years of marriage.

It was like I had this mental list of things that he had done during the affair(s) that I needed to have healed for me. Sometimes I felt like I was just plain ole crazy and I'm sure he agreed when it would seem like I was overreacting to something simple... like sleeping together at night. Talking to a counselor didn't help me because I wanted HIM to know what was going on (although MC did help some). I finally figured out that he needed to know WHY I would get so upset. So I told him:

PM: I know that you are home and I love that. I HAVE forgiven you. I'm not trying to punish you or make you feel guilty. I just need to work through some leftover issues and I can't do it by myself. There were many things that happened that still come up unexpectedly that trigger bad memories.

FWH: What are you talking about?

PM: Like when we're laying together in bed and I need you to hold me. The reason I need you to hold me is because while you were gone, sleeping alone was very painful to me. Knowing that you held her hand all night while you slept is painful. Or when we drive down a certain road in town or by a particular restaurant. Or when I see a flower shop. See what I mean.

FWH: I hear you.

PM: Please give me time to work through these things. I'll make you a promise. I'll tell you when I'm experiencing a trigger so that my resentment doesn't build up and explode without you having a clue what just happened. I'm not looking for justification from you, just understanding.

FWH: Deal. I'm so sorry I ever hurt you sweetie.

That list has dwindled down to almost nothing now. The things I described above don't hurt anymore. Nearly everything on my "list" has been overcome and replaced with our own memories now. It just takes time. But I think you need to tell him what's going on with you (calmly).

Thank you so much PM.
I copied your email to my H and apologized for the angry outburst...I know I have a lot to learn to communicate better...You are a great help. Thanks.

LA

Glad I could help! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Summary:

BS (me) 39
(F)WH (him) 39
DD:9 DS:7
Married 17 years.
Dday: July 06
Promised NC: August 06
NC broken twice (not volenteered by WH, but admitted by him when asked and later confirmed by other sources of my own):
1) Sept to early Oct 06 ( initiated by OW )
Comfirmed that WH was telling me the truth about their C from later emails (I found out myself). The last email from OW was a closure one. OW never initiated or responded after that last email (see the item below).
2) End of March. WH attempted to call and email OW. Told me about it when I asked. OW never responded.

It's work place A and OW changed job during their A when they tried to break up. A lasted for 9 months.

Ending was tramatic. WH confessed to me and wanted to move out. I begged him to stay and he got confused. Told me he expected me to kick him out right away because I had been very cold to me for couple of years ( partly true ). Exposed his A to his parents who confronted him right away and cried and begged him to stop. He stayed with OW in a hotel for only two days. Decided to come back home but lied to OW telling her they were to move to an apartment. While she was waiting for him to pick her up to go to their new place, WH called and told her he would come back home instead. Of course WH promised to "love her forever" and asked her to forgive him, etc, etc.

After WH came home, he had been in intense withdrawal. And I was basically doing plan A. He couldn't initiate any affections and had difficulty receiving mine. Now I think I actaully was not doing a good plan A. I was too needy and wanted help with my pain at a time that he couldn't deal with it.

He mained NC from October 06 to March 07. Most of the time he was miserable, but was going along with my plans of vacations and time together. Was doing better but finally broke down and tried contact when I caugt him doing porn and was very mad at him again. Actually porn was not a problem before and I think it's one of his ways to deal with his withdrawal. During this whole NC time, I had to deal with my pain by myself, but sometimes I needed his help a lot and I did expode almost every month due to the pain I felt that he wouldn't help me and told me he was not capable of helping since he was in pain himself.
But things did get much better during that time.

About the March attempted contact, he said he was hurting too much and he wanted to know how OW wad doing ( she had heart problems ). He wanted to find some closure for himself. What he got was more pain because OW wouldn't respond in any way.

After that, he seemed to finally pulling out of his long intense withdrawal. He started AD by himself and was getting so much better. He started to participate with family life a lot and was laughing and having great fun with us. We started to get intimate and SF improved dramatically also. I still need to initate most of the time but he seems to get along very nicely.

I do feel safer with him day by day because of his actions. He accounted for his time very well. I installed filter from internet and was monitoring his computer and it came out all clean. He noticed my changes and started to look at me in a way that I didn't notice for so long now. He took good care of me when I was feeling not well and he helped with every chance to stay with the kids.

But, here is a big but. He doesn't show remorse. He doesn't say sorry when I'm obviously hurting over his A. He would avoid talking about the A completely. He wouldn't tell me the details of the A.

Other things were going great. Memorial Day weekend we had a little vacation and he was very attentive and he said we should do this more often.

Since I'm feeling safter and safter with him, my desire to communicate with him in a deeper level grow and grow. I needed to know more about his A. Actually when he confessed (still in the A but already decided to move out) he was very honest and told me everything I asked. So I know the basics. But he shut down after he came back home and didn't really open up to me yet.

The night we got back from our vacataion, I felt the urge to ask questions and he instantly withdrew. I felt so hurt and I didn't control my anger very well. I drove out in the middle of the night because he left our bedroom saying that my talk was making him not able to sleep. He was so inconsiderate and my pain was unbearable. I just had to leave the house. He got even more angry when I came back in half an hour. I was just out of mind and I has such a rage outburst and I grabed his arms...He didn't resist at all. Afterwards, I cried and talked about how hurt I was because he couldn't help me with my pain and he got defensive whenever A was brought up. He was silent during the whole night after that, not even a word. My heart grew so cold and I thought about leaving again. Yesterday I didn't communicate with him. I wanted to toughen up and stopped being needy. My work required a conference call at night and he was all nice and took care of the kids when I was busy at the conference call. Last night finally I apologiezed to him about the rage outburst. I didn't say a word. I then told him since both of us were so unhappy (well, not true. We already built up a lot of happy moments after his A) and didn't know how to communicate with each other, maybe we shouldn't stay together. I told him I loved him but didn't want him to feel trapped because of my love. I said me and the kids would be ok. I said I wanted him to find happiness. And that he is free to leave.
He wouldn't leave. And sounded pretty happy actually this morning and tried to engage in longer conversations.

I just feel very tired in the whole situation. This same explosion happened many times before. This latest one happened after such a great period of time that we cared each other so well I can't believe why I said all those things to him. I felt that he stayed out of pity for us and wanted desparately to snap this out of his mind, I guess.

Today I feel much better and I can think more clearly. I know he has been putting a lot of effort lately to rebuild my trust. I know he wants to stay with us. I just know it. But he won't tell me. He seems like is trying to hold his last ground, basically he was sacrifising his happiness to stay with us, but actually he has been enjoying my company a lot ( he actually wants to go with me whereever I go during weekend just to stay together). I know he loves me, I can see that in his eyes, but he wouldn't tell me. He even wouldn't respond when I say ILU, so I stopped saying them. He wouldn't initiate affections, even if I can clearly sense that he enjoyed them and wanted them.

What's going on this this man? He is noncommunicative (actually never good at expressing his feelings all his life) when it comes to feelings. He gets so defensive and feels attached no matter what I say about his A.

I sometimes think about doing a 180, but I know his deep fear of me leaving and his deep belief that if I want to leave, even if he would hurt tremoudously, he wouldn't fight for me since that's his belief that if he loves me he should give me freedom. Plan B doesn't feel right at all at this time since he is truly trying I can feel it. And I'm sure NC is in place. There are just something that's blocking him to be able to communicate his feelings to me. And I don't know how to go from here.

I haven't been consistant and probably sending him mixed messages. When I feel hurt and rejected, I bring out leaving him or having him leave the home. I did feel the need to say it for some reason, but I know it's not what I want. I just want him to open up and to listen to me when I'm hurting. I guess my mistakes in doing this got him more defensive and shut up more because he didn't want to get hurt either.

We didn't have a perfect marriage before but in my mind he was alwasy the responsible one and the one who was always going to protect me and our kids. Now everything is changed and I think both of us are at a loss how to really enter each other heart again.

I know there are more urgent cases that need help for, but I would really appreciate if somebody can lend a helping hand to us. My H seems to respond to soft things much better than but I feel like I'm so short charged and my patience is running low.

Thanks in advance.