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tfc, the best weapon you have to break up the affair is for you to expose it to family, friends and coworkers. This breaks down the walls the WS and OP have put up around their fantasy and lets in the cold light of day. Like cockroaches when you turn on the kitchen light, the cheaters often scramble and scatter when everybody can suddenly see what they are up to.

Exposing the affair is part of Plan A. Are you well-schooled on Plan A? I'd suggest you do a SHORT Plan A and all the while be fully preparing yourself for Plan B.

But be aware: Plan A almost never, ever by itself breaks up the affair. Plan A is just the setup for Plan B.

You say you want the OW out of "our" life. That's good - but the only life you control is yours. How can you get the OW out of YOUR life?

I am concerned that you are still trying to get your WH to do what you want him to do. You can't get the OW out of "our" life without his cooperation and you don't have that right now.

Again: How can you get the OW out of YOUR life? And are you willing to do what it takes, or would you rather stay with a confirmed cake-eater and fence-sitter and have the OW remain in "our" life?

You will see it here countless times: You can only control yourself. You cannot control a WS and you cannot control the OP. Your WH doesn't want his OW out of his life and he will fight you tooth and nail to keep her there. So, are you going to settle for that, or are you going to take steps to get her out of YOUR life even while your WH chooses to keep her in his?
Mulan


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Ok Mulan - So the way I see it, I have to do brief Plan A (currently in effect) and straight into Pitch-black Plan B. I need to begin preparing for Plan B then. But 1st ... I need to expose to MIL, SIL, and more friends. I may go on to the festival (w/o telling H obviously). But what then? What do I say or do when I see them? Casually introduce myself as his W?

As far as getting her out of MY life, the only way I see to do that is to remove myself from HIS life (Plan B right?).

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After confronting him about OW, I felt a HUGE sense of relief! I have a new attitude: I want him in my life (only as H not WH), but I don't need him. So, Plan A has been fun the last couple of days.

I am a better version of the Me when we were dating - nice, peppy and fun to talk to ... not boring, drab, and hanging on his every word. Now I get off the phone first - this has confused him I'm sure (he usually ends the conversation). He sounds so startled that I'm ending the conversation and has now taken to asking if he can call me later. My response? "If you want to call later, you can. Your calls are always welcome." Everything said is said with a smile (no, not a smirk) that I'm certain can be heard on the other end of the line.

I'm so proud of myself for FINALLY realizing that I'll be ok on my own. Don't get me wrong - I still want my M to work out, I really do. And I am still willing to do what it takes to save my M. But right now, I need to just work on me ... and not sit around pining for a WH.

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TFC, listen to Mulan. If you want to break up your husband's affair, expose it to anyone and everyone who can reasonably be expected to be able to put pressure on the adultery. That doesn’t mean you call your WH’s third cousin over in München, Germany, and you don’t call the local newspaper. I can’t figure out if the OW is a co-worker or not, but if she is, her boss and your WH’s boss are definite targets for exposure.

The boss’s ability to put pressure on the adultery is obvious. I don’t know how large your WH’s firm is. If large enough, they probably have a Human Resources (HR) Director (AKA, Personnel Department). A formal letter, email, phone call can all be effective. The best way, of course, is to go in to the director and let him/her know what is going on. Bear in mind, they’ll be interested because it may violate a policy they have, and also because you can show the HR Director your WH has been using company time and resources to conduct his adultery.

You’ll need to be up front about your adultery. It’ll be painful, but necessary in order to establish your bona fides.

Other targets for exposure include professional associates, professional societies, and organizations your WH or OW belong to, pastors/priests, his family, yours, friends, etc. Don’t worry about how they feel toward your own adultery—people understand two wrongs don’t make a right…and you can even make that point.

Now, understand this, TFC. When you do the exposure, your WH is going to be absolutely furious. “Livid” isn’t going to be the half of it. Other wayward spouses have raged for a week and more about how horrible a thing the betrayed spouse has done. Some have left the marital home for a time, swearing they “were” going to work on the marriage, but now…huh uh…now you’ve REALLY blown it. Etc., etc., etc. It’s happened before, it’ll happen again.

The thing is, it’s all bombast…venting. It’s empty and the wayward one can’t maintain it. It’s really hard work being mad all the time. When the moment passes (even if that moment is a week long), the balloon deflates and the WS must begin facing the consequences of their choices. People get over being mad, TFC. Those of us who’ve been out here for a long while have experienced that anger personally, and have also seen it in other MB clients over, and over, and over again. Don’t worry about “livid.”

Your realization you’ll come out of this sane and whole is an important part of your growth and a crucial beginning for your fight to recover your marriage. Now...as you seem to realize...you can’t let that realization carry you too far down that road. Being self-reliant and confident is good; letting yourself get too emotionally detached from your WH isn’t. Enough said.

Okay, TFC. I think you’re beginning to see how much work you have in front of you to salvage your marriage. It’s going to be tough, but it can be done. Again, I strongly urge you to find a well experienced, pro-marriage couples counselor if Steve Harley isn’t an option.

Hang in there.

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Exposure will be difficult, but I can do it. I'll start with the MIL & SIL. He is sort-of self-employed, but she goes to see him when he's working. It isn't a "normal" career, but I don't want to give away too much info. As I mentioned before, he is a public figure and I don't want to ruin his career (especially since I've supported it all these years). I can call people that are friends in his line of work. Most of them won't answer my calls, but it is worth a shot. My family knows already, and my dad can often be an influence in H's life. They'll get together soon, I'm sure.

What do you recommend I say when I call these people? "Hi. This is TFC. I wanted you to know that WH is having an A with OW. Please don't enable this behavior. I want to save my M."????

I have an appt w/ Steve H on Tuesday. I figured while I'm on vacation is a good time to get my plan into action.

Btw - I picked up "Not Just Friends" today. I'm tempted to leave it out on the counter when he's home, but I really need to read it first! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

So, after exposure, what's Step 2?

Last edited by time_for_change; 03/30/07 02:20 PM.
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I don't know the individuals you'll be speaking to, TFC, so it's impossible to give you a script. It wouldn't do any good anyway because such conversations take on a life of their own after the first few words. The important things are to know your subject matter intimately and then just take a deep breath, open your mouth and start talking. When you do that, the hard part's over. It's like that first day in school back in first grade. Once you started the first small conversation with that young person next to you, the "mountain" became a mole hill, right? Once you do this thing, it becomes a mole hill too.

Good on you. Stay with Steve H's advice. He can get an astounding information from you in a few minutes of telephone conversation and can give you personalized advice.

After exposure, time slows down a little for you. You have time to read Not "Just Friends"and anything else you want to. You do a great Plan A (including setting a time limit for it) and start formulating a Plan B.

Please read Pepperband's "Carrot and Stick of Plan A" thread as soon as you can and remember Plan A is really all about you and making you the person you've always wanted to be. Typically, Plan A folks begin working out to tone up their bodies, they take classes in those subjects they've always wanted to, read the classics they've always meant to, etc., etc. To my mind, Plan A, is a phase that works on the mind of the wayward one and shows them what they're taking a chance on losing. It's also during this phase you learn (perhaps anew) about patience...because it seems like nothing is happening and it goes on "forever."

Stay with it, TFC, and don't forget we're here with you. Bearing in mind you need your anonymity, let us know what Steve H has to say, okay?

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BTW, click on the link below to the "Exposure 101" thread here on MB. Lots more info there.

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Thanks so much! H & I had an appt w/ SH a couple of weeks ago, so luckily he is already aware of my sitch.

Thus far, in my Plan A, I have done more reading, therapy, praying, meditation, and yoga than I ever thought I would in such a short period of time. I am finally becoming the person I always aspired to be (snooping on my H excluded). I have become a much better mother (H even commented on it a number of times) and a bit more patient (never my strongest point). I will continue to work on gaining patience.

He & I are continuing to have positive, upbeat conversations on the phone. And I have been cautious not to LB. He just told me that he will be coming home tomorrow night (I must admit I thought he would spend the night out) and asked if he could call me from the road tonight. Believe it or not, as of this moment, he & OW have not talked today (but I'm not holding my breath that it will last)!

I think I will Plan A a little bit longer, and talk to SH about Plan B. I can't thank you enough for your help!

.... off to read "The Carrot & The Stick of Plan A" ....

Last edited by time_for_change; 03/30/07 03:15 PM.
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excellent work time_for_change!

I think the fog is my ww is clearing as well.

Will continue to pray for us all.


Me FWH - 29 WW - 29 2 Kids; Boy 9, Girl 1 year WW - EA/PA Nov 2006 - Current (Approx 16 weeks and ongoing) Me FWH - EA/PA Nov 2006 - February 2007 (Approx 12 weeks, NC achieved) WW Separated 11 Dec 2006 MC Dec 2006 (About 5 sessions, did no good save for a list of ENs) Currently working on saving the marriage. My Ongoing Story of Double Infidelity
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Just exposed to SIL - she will be keeping an eye and ear out for me (her hubby & mine are close). She mentioned her concern about his drinking and other possible behavior (i.e. an AFFAIR). She wants our M to survive.

One down ...

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Good for you. Now you've gotten that first exposure done and you can see what I meant by saying the conversation "takes on a life of its own," right? Keep up the good work.

Tell us more about his drinking. It's disturbing because if he's an alcoholic, it's a problem that will have to be solved before MB principles can be effective. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

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Technically I suppose SIL counts as 3 down ... she'll tell her H and mom before I can even dial their numbers! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

He needs to slow down on the drinking, but I wouldn't call him an alcoholic. He has been going out and drinking a lot more since DDay. It must be difficult to think with a clear head when drunk and/or hungover. He tends to blow off steam with a late night and a few cocktails, but it usually only lasts a day or so. We are just worried that it doesn't seem to be slowing down. (Btw - his OW is a party-girl, which of course enables this behavior.)

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Quote
After confronting him about OW, I felt a HUGE sense of relief! I have a new attitude: I want him in my life (only as H not WH), but I don't need him. So, Plan A has been fun the last couple of days.

I am a better version of the Me when we were dating - nice, peppy and fun to talk to ... not boring, drab, and hanging on his every word. Now I get off the phone first - this has confused him I'm sure (he usually ends the conversation). He sounds so startled that I'm ending the conversation and has now taken to asking if he can call me later. My response? "If you want to call later, you can. Your calls are always welcome." Everything said is said with a smile (no, not a smirk) that I'm certain can be heard on the other end of the line.

I'm so proud of myself for FINALLY realizing that I'll be ok on my own. Don't get me wrong - I still want my M to work out, I really do. And I am still willing to do what it takes to save my M. But right now, I need to just work on me ... and not sit around pining for a WH.

[color:"green"] THIS is a winner's attitude ... very Plan A-ish

good for you

Pep [/color]

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A post from Pep! Yay! I admire you!

I am so proud that I somehow pulled up my bootstraps and got this newfound attitude. I am a more confident and happy woman. I feel so much better about myself and am finally forgiving myself for my A, as I know I am a much better person now. I still have work to do on me, but that's a lifelong journey right? My H seems to notice this attitude too, and is talking to me more. The beach trip w/ DD and the dog should be good for me too.

You know, I always did for everyone else and never for myself (until my A). Now I am doing for me - and in a healthy way. I suppose now I can truly say I am a Plan A-er! And proud of it! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

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I now have proof ... the dumba** left pics of he and a OW#2 in his car. I took them. They are now with all my other proof.

Looks like I go straight to Plan B???

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TFC,

Why would you go to plan B??? Do you understand you only go to plan B after you have done a great plan A? Do you understand you only leave plan A once you start to feel your love bank drain?

Plan B is not to affect him, although it might. It is to protect what love you have for him so that you can endure until the end of the A.

TFC, how long did your H work to try and save the marriage once he found out about your A? Did he just up and leave? Did he give up? You have really only started plan A a few days ago. You are starting to get the hang of it as Pep pointed out. What is the message you want to send him?

It really is your call, but if you go plan B without a good plan A, you might just lose him. Perhaps that is what you deep down want, I don't know. You did head off with another man already during this marriage.

You need to look in YOUR heart and decide what you stand for, and what you can stand. You then need to set some goals. If it is continued plan A, you need to get a plan. If it is plan B, you need to get a plan.

Heck Harley even states that a DIVORCE should be POJA'd. Think about that.

Knowing he is an A and having proof, does not automatically throw you out of plan A.

Must go.

God Bless,

JL

Last edited by Just Learning; 03/31/07 12:23 PM.
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I like your style on exposure! Good for you. But I also see that you are talking about going to Plan B. I for one do not think that any spouse should put up with cheating. But I do have a question for you? I have not read your whole thread but what was your husband like before your affair?

I ask this because if I got the story right you had an affair and not only that you had it with his friend? If I have all of that right I cannot imagine anything to be more devastating to your husband. I know my wife’s affair was the worst thing to ever happen to me but if it would have been with one of my friends I just can't imagine that.

In his mind now he may want to know what it was like. Why were you willing to throw everything away for another guy. I am sure he is tormented by the thought of being with you a woman that he loves but would betray him. If he just forgave you then you would have had all of the fun and just come back to the marriage with no consequences. And then he thinks what about the next time you cheat. I know you would never do that but I bet you said that before your first affair.

Let me just ask why should he choose you instead of the OW? All I want to say is there has to be a good reason. If you already did a great plan A then OK maybe he would see a reason to choose you.

But if his thoughts are of you with his friend then you may be making a mistake. Otherwise I agree with you I would not put up with him cheating. Also for a man the worst thing I thought could happen was for your wife to sleep with another man but the worst thing would probably for your wife to sleep with your brothers or friends. That would be even worse.

Again, I am just asking the question. I divorced my wife for cheating so I can understand where he is at but then he should maybe have just divorced you. He is not entitled to have other girlfriends.

Just wanted to throw those questions out there.

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I feel like he left them there on purpose, like he's been trying to push me away these last 3 months. He never really tried to work on the M after finding out about my A.

I thought everything was going to be ok ... he called me from the road last night to keep him awake. We talked again this morning. He even asked why I keep doing nice things for him when he does nothing in return.

When I dropped him off this morning, we took his car. He kept commenting that there were all sorts of things in the car for me to get pissed about. Its like he WANTED me to see them!

I don't want to lose my M. I don't want to go into Plan B ... but I don't think he wants in it at all. I just don't know what to do!

Tell me ... please?

Last edited by time_for_change; 03/31/07 02:38 PM.
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no advice from me but I have a comment......

So what is the photo evidence? is it a OW riding in passenger side of vehicle or more?

You are starting to reap some benefits from Plan A by bringing the H home to you while you try to save ur M. Or am I missing something from previous posts. I dont get this up and down bit.

You hv started exposure to those that can help u restore ur M. SIL was a good move on your part.

Plan B would entail some one being forced from the home. Total communicaton blackout.Seems counterproductive at the moment. Have u confronted the OW per Harley advice?

Plan B might be what the B(W)H just needs to move on with his life. JMHO.


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Photos are of them kissing on the face (not lips), laughing, him grabbing her breast, her exposing her breast and him leaning in to it, etc. This is the OW#2 - out of town woman, not the one I confronted him about. I thought OW#2 was gone ... obviously not.

The up & down is just my emotions ... I need to grab hold of reality here and figure out what to do. I am trying to remain calm (very difficult).

Do I tell him I have the pics? Do I ask him to come home when he's done today so we can talk?

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