Yes, I understand. I told him at the onset that I wouldn't bring it up again. I was absolutely clear that the ball is in *his* court now.

The next few weeks/months have to play out.

He will go on his vacation. He will be back by about the first of August (his plans are still up in the air).

Then the reality of his situation with GF will set in. He wouldn't tell me he's not moving, if he was planning to - so he's staying put. He has no more vacation til next year. Unless he plans to fork over airfare for GF to visit, that ain't happening....sooooooooo after another month or two of phone and/or online "relationship" - one or the other (or both) will likely grow weary of it and move on.

I'll likely know this when I see him withdrawing - likely from me as well as from her. I'd think he'd probably crawl into a hole for a while, yes?

Then he will need time to sort himself out, finish up any residual financial fallout... and maybe only *then* he may sit and reflect upon our conversation of this day.

And at that point, he's either going to come to me, or he's not. That much is up to him, and to God.

How am I doin?

JinGA

OH and I almost forgot.... while all that is going on, I'm going to keep reading, keep learning, keep reflecting, keep improving, and keep geocaching <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

My copy of HNHN should be here in a few days too - that will help me pass some time.

JinGA

One final thought (I think) before I call it a night... (I'm exhausted)...

When we last spoke of possible R, during the fallout that ensued, he spent a lot of time and effort trying to convince me that GF is his soulmate and all that crapola.

Today he didn't mention her name - even when we discussed the possibility of moving and his vacation. I avoided being sucked into DJ, because he brought up my XBF's name (and issues)...

Is it a good sign that he didn't throw all that up at me? Rather, he kept her out of it... I know she's still taking up space in his heart - but he didn't even bother to try to sell me on the notion that she's all that and a bag of chips.

Somehow I think he knows that I'd have called his bluff on that one <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

But he didn't AO saying that I wasn't respecting his R or anything like that. I found that kind of unexpected.

OK... Trying to shut down all the voices in my head for the night *g*!

JinGA

A different perspective from me... Crying is NOT a sign a weakness. Owning your emotions and expressing your vulnerability to him and to others is STRONG! Taking ownership of your emotions, realizing where they come from, and discussing them without shame takes courage IMO. People bottle their feelings up and hide their tears because they are afraid. Afraid of ridicule. Afraid of being taken advantage of. Afraid of violating social convention.

You didn't do that today. On June 23, 2007 you stepped into the breach and expressed your reality to another person who possible has a different reality. That's more than what most people in this world did today. You did well.

Thanks, Seabird.

He always hated it when I cried. I hated it when I cried because sometimes I let my emotions cloud my message.

Yesterday - that did NOT happen.

Today is a new day in my journey. Who knows what the final destination is? I know I'm on my way... God will guide the rest.

JinGA

Well as I wait for His Needs, Her Needs to arrive - I just ordered Fall in Love, Stay in Love.

Methinks that will make good summer reading <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Wonder if I should bring the books to the shop to read and leave 'em lying around? *g*

JinGA

Again, another perspective on it... Not saying that it's right or better, just different.

Why did he always hate it when you cried? Did it hurt his ears? Do you have a wail like a banshee being dipped in hot oil? Or is his discomfort a result of HIM being unable to comfort you and understand? And why would that be? Fear of displaying his own emotions perhaps? Maybe he's afraid of his own, and therefore he discourages it in others as well. Just thinking out loud here.

If he has experienced a woman's tears as a form of manipulation (many men have) ... crying would be a wrong move when you are trying to express your desire for him

I DO agree that tears are not a sign of weakness .... but there are inappropriate times to cry (like discussions with your customers or when pulled over for speeding)

It's OK for you to cry in front of your XH JinGA .... you will know when it's right ... but crying when trying to meet his need for admiration sort-of steals thunder from your message.

Okay, I do agree with Pepperband. I wouldn't advocate the use of emotion as a tool of manipulation. I didn't mean to imply such a thing if that's how it was taken. Moy comment assumed an honest expression of feeling.

Stifling emotion out of concern for how the other person would react is the flip-side of the coin IMO.

I guess there are different ways that it can be taken. Sorry if I muddied the waters here.

I think he hated it when I cried because he knew he was the cause of my pain when I did.

I did not use tears as manipulation.

He never had a problem with tears of joy - only painful tears - touched a nerve.

He's not one to cry much himself - but I have seen him cry. He cried the day he called me to tell me that his GF announced she was moving back home. He also told me later that *he* was the one crying and she was the cold, unemotional one... a real switch.

I didn't cry yesterday, because he didn't hurt me.

I did cry last night because Pep made me do it <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> Hearing her kind words after all the stress and crap just kind of hit a switch for me, and it was like a "stress release"... had my little cry, got over it. It's therapy for me. Crying can sometimes be like a "valve" for me - let off the steam by crying.

I don't cry often. I used to cry at the drop of a hat at times, but usually privately. I hadn't cried in months before last night.

Life goes on... time to just carry on and let things go as they will.

I'm just back from a morning of geocaching with DS. We were only 1 find for 4 hunts... not so good... but we had fun!

Time for me to hit the rain locker before I head in to work.

JinGA

Well today was a good day at work - nothing has "changed" - at least not for the worse. I feel better knowing that I've said what I've been keeping inside all along, and maybe he's feeling better just knowing - no more tension. I don't think he was "tense" before but if he sensed how I felt, he may have been waiting for the other shoe to drop, and for me to say something.

Conversation was easy - he did his thing most of the day in the back room (he's working on a project) but we took a couple of breaks together and just chatted about nothing.

He bought me a coffee at the start of the shift (that's not unusual - we buy for each other - usually he buys but not always).

BTW - he'll still take a sip of my drink without thinking it's "cooties" LOL!

I'll be able to just keep doing what I have been doing - more or less a Plan A with the 180. I did tell him about my morning adventures with DS geocaching - sometimes I think he might actually be interested in joining us - I'm sure he'd like it, he laughs at my anecdotes about it and sometimes he asks questions - but I'm not inviting him - nope, he'll decline anyway, and if he wants to go - he can ask to join us (which isn't likely anytime in the immediate future, but that's OK).

I have a sneaking hunch that despite his vacation plans, things may be winding down with the GF... just call it intuition. It will still have to run its course, and that's fine... I'm not going anywhere <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

When I think of where I was during my R after M, and how long it took me to get over it even though I knew it was doomed from the start... I can see that he might well be in the same mindspace I was in 6 months ago. 6 months ago I wouldn't have thought it possible to even consider R. After a few months on my own, my heart changed, as I worked on myself - but I did nothing as GF was still very much in the picture at that time. I really only started *demonstrating* the potential and my own changes, 2 months ago.

It may never happen - I'm not kidding myself, but at the same time, I do think that perhaps when he's moved along the learning curve a bit more, he may consider it. After all - we are still good *friends*, and that's a darned good place to start over from, isn't it?

Once GF leaves a void, he's going to want to fill that somehow. He may start looking elsewhere - and that's his right as we *are* divorced - but he may also find that what he's looking for is standing right before him.

Letting go and letting God - just doing what I can for myself from here on. Repeating that to myself too - to remind myself.

And you know what? Since I have started making a real effort to change certain things - the habits are sticking and it becomes second nature. The good "side effect" is that I feel a LOT better about me - and I think that's showing too <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

JinGA

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

OK Pep what is behind that cheshire cat grin? You can't just tease me like that - tell me your thoughts (please <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> )

JinGA

Jin,
I don't think I have posted to you before, but I have been following your thread. I am keeping my fingers crossed for you, I also think that I would like to reconcile with my ex. But we have reconciled before, and it didn't stick.

Be patient, if he comes back, you want him to be 100% sure. He has to run this GF into the ground so he knows there is nothing there. But you don't want him "settling" for you just because GF doesn't work out. I think that is what happened in my situation. My ex was alone and he didn't like it, I was eager to reconcile and it was just easier for him to have me back instead of taking a chance on someone else.

I have also let my ex know that I am open to reconcilation again, but I won't say another word about it. It gets on his nerves when I mention it, so I won't. Maybe it makes them feel bad to have it so obvious that they threw away a decent woman.

Keep working on yourself, it will all turn out like it should.

I am STILL proud of you !

But I don't wanna make you cry again <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

It's OK, you won't. I'm past that now <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> But feel free to try (yep I can be an attention ho at times LOL!)

DS and I just came back from another geocache outing. We were only 1 for 4 this morning, but we were 3 for 3 tonight! We've got 50 finds now! Woohoo! DD has a phone surgically implanted in her ear these days (first BF...) so she never wants to go hang with Mom lately... kids, eh?

(For anybody that wonders WTH geocaching is... http://www.geocaching.com )

JinGA

Not much to talk about today... DD went to an amusement park with her BF... he helped us carry in groceries as we all arrived home at the same time - *he* is a keeper! LOL

DS and I went geocaching today. Monday is my "closed" day at the shop - I did as much of Monday's work that I could do on Sunday, and so I just had a bit of stuff to do this morning, then DS and I were off to play.

We had storms and the power went off (XH, my house and the shop are all on the same grid)... so I called XH about 6-ish when the power went off - he had planned to go by the shop to check on things anyway - so he took care of making sure everything came back online when power was restored.

My employee called later because he needed something, so I arranged to meet him at the shop, and while I was waiting outside, XH called to ask me if the power had gone off again (I didn't know, I was waiting around back!) I opened the door, sure enough it was off. XH takes medication at night to help him sleep and he'd already taken it, so he told me he couldn't come out - but fortunately my employee arrived and he helped me get everything up and running again.

Beyond that - normal day - nothing new.. just thought I'd check in and let you know I'm alive and kicking <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

JinGA

Another day. XH came in as usual, stayed longer than usual because it was busy and there was lots to do. Thanked him for staying "late".

DS and I kicked some geocaching butt this morning - we were the "first to find" a new hide, and we beat one of the old farts that's retired and has nothing better to do than be the first finder on new hides - we looked for an hour but we found it about 5 minutes before he arrived! There's no prize for any of this game - just "bragging rights" and we did the happy dance all the way back to the truck <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Actually the "old fart" is a really nice older man - presumably retired. I've met him a couple of times before on these hunts, and he's a good player, very helpful to others. We chatted a bit before we headed back - and DS and I saw a huge doe deer jump across the trail.

Great way to get exercise - walk a mile or so before breakfast! And I hate exercise - but the game is fun and the exercise is a side benefit.

I told XH about our escapades this morning. He laughs and seems interested - it would be nice if he'd like to join us one day doing this - I think he'd have fun - but at this point I'm not going to invite him.

Part of that 180 I'm doing is to live life and have fun... and let him know I'm not sitting stewing in my own juices the way he appears to be doing <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Maybe sooner or later he'll get tired of living like a hermit and decide to live life again - and darnit we're pretty fun to be around <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Somebody once said that living well is the best revenge!

Another thing somebody commented to me about today - a friend who knows my situation...

When I mentioned what Pepperband had said - that I have planted a seed - not a tree, so the fruit is not visible yet...

They added - some seeds need to be burned in order to germinate. I thought that was rather profound - and it may apply.

After all, when XH's GF dropped the bomb - he came to me. Maybe when he finally does get burned, once he's had some time to germinate....

Time will tell.

Keeping the faith. One way or another it will all work out as God intends it.

JinGA

Sounds like you are doing an excellent job. Keeping busy and enjoying life is very helpful. I wish I'd done more of that and spent less time obsessing about my ex.

I'm sure I do way too much obsessing too... believe me. But I do find that if I can get motivated to get out and *do* something, it takes my mind off my stresses - including my business etc.

Geocaching is something I do with one or both of my kids (whomever wants to join me) and I can do it alone too. When I was out of town for a social event, I found a geocache before I returned home.

I'm not much into exercise, but I know it's good for me. If you plopped me in a park and told me to walk a mile or three around the trails, I'd probably tell you to get stuffed.

BUT... stick a GPS receiver in my hands, give me a paper with co-ordinates and a goal - and I'm on a mission. They call it the sport where you are the search engine <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I'm sure I walked over a mile this morning - in fact another player who found the hide later, posted in his log that he walked 1.25 miles (he clocked it) and it was a pretty straight shot there and back - in other words we probably walked the exact same path.

But I digress... I love geocaching <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> I bought my little GPS used on Ebay last year after a customer told me about the sport, and we started caching in September.

I don't get much time off from my business - and I suppose I should spend a bit more time working around the house - but I'd rather have a bit of clutter and a happy family, than a pristine house and all of us moping. Housework will still be here when I get home, right?

If there's one thing I've learned - and I imparted this to XH during our talk - all work and no play makes JinGA a dull girl. I don't get a lot of play time - but I LOVE my play time! And yes - it does wonders for self-esteem, health, and general well-being.

I *FEEL* good!

JinGA