I agree with Frog.

You know the answer to that. I'd tell her to expose to OMW. Because OMW deserves to know. And because it would also set the stage for preventing a recurrence of the affair.

BUT...that's not the situation here.

Her H DOES know, and has made his feelings on this CRYSTAL CLEAR. And that DOES change the situation. If she goes against his wishes, she's violating his trust in her, in something directly related to the affair! He'll feel betrayed all over again...related to the affair!

By exposing to OMW now...she's directly betraying her husband again.

In my mind, her first allegiance is to her husband. If she violates her agreemant with him...she's sending him the message that OMW (and possibly OM through extension) is more important to her than HE is. This message to an already betrayed husband? Bad juju!

Like I said...I don't think we'll reach an agreemant on this one.

I agree OMW should know. But I don't feel that she should betray her BH again to make that happen. You might not feel that this is a betrayal...but I'd bet money that HE would. While I would never have asked my wife not to tell OMW (if there had been one, in our case), if my wife contacted ANYONE in his family for ANY REASON today, I would feel that as a betrayal all over again.

OK...so what if you changed the story so that it was at the EXPENSE of your wife? Not only that she didn't agree...but that she would suffer for your choice? Because THAT is the heart of the dispute...if her husband agreed to that exposure, we wouldn't be disputing on anything. ALL of us would tell her to expose now.

Try this angle.

There's a 3000lb piece of steel hanging six inches above the ground. Your wife's foot is under it. So is a complete stranger's. You can only save one. Your wife begs you to save hers. You're closer to the stranger, and have no idea if the weight will drop before you can get to your wife's or not. Do you save the stranger that you KNOW you can save, or do you chance the stranger's foot to save your wife's? Remember, your wife is BEGGING you not to let her get hurt. What's the right thing here?

My thoughts as well.

We can't take her husbands wishes out of the equation Frog. That would go against the four rules of protection and be an independent decision that would hurt her husband.

This is not about disclosure of child abuse, where you have a moral obligation to protect children who are not able to speak up for or protect themselves.

As unfortunate as it is, OPS can do this for themselves. They can listen to their gut feelings, begin surveilance and determine what is going on in their own marriage and deal with it.

Now I don't know why I brought child abuse in as an example that isn't a parallel, but I had a feeling that was going to be the next moral correllation.

It would be better to get a heads up from the other affair partner involved, of course, but it would cause harm to Suzets husband and marriage to do so.

Owl,

I agree we will probably disagree.

My point is a moral point. If I know something to be morally right, I would need to do it.

To be honest I would be eaten alive with guilt knowing there is another person in this world going through what my BS was going through.

I could put them on the path of recovery. Pure and simple.

EVERY BS DESERVES TO KNOW THE TRUTH. They can then put the safety net in place necessary and start recovery.

IMVHO it is very selfish of the BH to ask her to make such a bad moral decesion.

Then why would it hurt her BH to tell the OM wife. Becuase he asked her not to.

So then she should invite him here.

Let him see people on this board who found out 10 years after the fact. Let him see the people who on D day the spouse admitted not one affair they were caught in but mulitple affairs.

This is the PAIN his decesion is causing the OM wife.

Why can't he set that aside and see what pain another person is going through because of her actions.

Let him come here. I am a BS I will tell him if not for the OM in my case I would never have known.

At the very least she could do it anonimously. With her BS agreement of course.

I would save my wife. Sheerly because you have to by shoes in pairs and my wife buys expensive shoes.

She's tried getting him here, I believe.

And if he came, you can bet I'd try to convince him to tell OMW too.

I agree...BS's DO deserve to know.

But its not just a moral "yes or no" question. Who's pain should she have the greatest concern for...her BH's, or OMW's?

Can you see how my analogy followed that?

Weaver,

We can take anyones wishes out of an equation. We take his wishes out and we now know what we agree to be right.

Then add his wishes back into the equation and his wishes are not right of fair.

To me if the shoe was on the other foot he would have different wishes.

To me I have problems with that in society today.

People refuse to put themselves in the other persons shoes and make decesions or wishes that make their lives easier but harm or infringe on others.

Would his wish not be a SELFISH DEMAND if it is hurting her as well or even more then telling would harm him?

What he has asked her to do is wrong. Yes it does affect him. No doubt about that. Not saying it doesn't

I would hope that the decesion not to tell the OM's wife is eating her alive with guilt. So now you have two people with strong feelings.

Him.... I don't know. I just don't want everyone to knwo I guess.

Her.... deep guilt that she is not doing the right thing.

Owl in your analogy with the beam.

If the beam were over both or our feet and when it dropped it would only take off my big toe but my wifes whole foot. I would chose my toe.

If she feels the guilt she should then then her telling would save her foot and only cost him a toe.

Suzet's husband is not causing this woman pain, the woman's husband holds that glory all by himself. First by having the affair and then by not telling his BS about it.

Suzet is having a hard time over this, the guilt probably is eating her alive. Didn't you read what she said?

Owl,

I am making an assumpion of course that Suzet feels the guilt and remorse she should for not telling the OM's W as part of my argument.

If she doesn't feel guilt then my arguments are not valid.

Frog-

The analogy wasn't comparing a choice between YOU taking pain and your wife...I'd bet money that you (like me) wouldn't hesitate to take the pain rather than your wife.

No...the question was, would you choose between your wife taking the pain, and a complete stranger? How would you choose, if all other things are equal? Is your choice 'moral'? Is it selfish? Selfless? How would your wife feel if you chose to save the other person, rather than her? Especially if your wife (selfishly, I'll add) asked that you save her the pain rather than the stranger?

These are all directly relevant to Suzet's dilemma.

Agreed. Very much. But she has to honor her husband on this. And more importantly, she feels she must honor her husband on this.

Quite frankly, I feel sorry for Suzet in this whole mess, because she must live with what she has done, and she is not able to first disclose to OMW and second not able to say she is sorry.

I agree with you here Frog.

But I don't want to see Suzet's marriage fail. Do you?

Weaver,

True the OM's wife was/is caused by her H.

I believe that Suzet could ease some of the pain by telling her.

I agree the OM should tell his wife as well but the chance of that happening without proof is slim to none.

I think her telling OM would be a temporary discomfort for her BH but the guilt of not telling will last a lifetime for Suzet.

Now what?

No I don't want to see her marriage fail.

But at what cost should a marriage succeed.

I am not the judge of that but if I felt as guilty as I think I would then I would be stressed.

Stress leads to early death and all kinds of nice stress related health problems.

Now maybe my point comes from my wife being in AA.

Where making amends is necessary except in one situation. that was if doing so Harmed the party you are making amends to.

If she were in AA and wanted to make amends and her BH said no because it would embarass him what would everyone here say.

So let me start a thread saying My wife is in AA and wants to make amends but I don't want her to.

2x4s would be flying.

Or if I said I need to make amends but my BS won't let me.

I could only imagine.

There's a difference between being embarassed, and feeling betrayed in relation to an affair...no?

I don't think Suzet's husband's choice is due to embarassement...I think that he feels as though ANY contact with OM, or anyone to do with OM could result in resumed contact. I can say that this would have been a concern in my case as well. Remember, Suzet's affair has been over a good while now...its not the same as if this were a JUST ending affair either.

Is it a selfish choice? Yes.

But does that negate her need to honor his choice, given the weight of her betrayal to him to begin with? Not in my opinion at least.

I too feel for Suzet. She wants to expose...but she also doesn't want to betray her husband again either.

You are right frog, with the AA and making amends analogy and the 2x4's flying.

Suzet has no choice but to honor her husband or betray him again. That's my take, until he changes his mind.

She has been on this board for a very long time trying to learn about marriage and to live in accordance with her belief system. She is Christian, so by her own religion she must honor her husband, as well as by MB.

She does not deserve to get nasty, hateful, DJ's thown at her. She deserves respect. She is not lying to her husband, she is honest with him, she is repentant. (not that you were doing this Frog)

And I was trying really hard not to stick my nose in here because of another thread where people felt they wanted to fight their own battles, but dangit I just couldn't not step in and give her some support.

MEDC, your opinions grow louder and more filled with DJ"S the more I read your posts. What's up with that?

Weaver... I just do not wish to hear from any (f)WS about the words I use to post...and imho, Suzet is choosing to hurt someone everyday... a BS and I identify with a BS. I really don't give a rats butt to hear from the likes of her, LG or anyone else that feels a BS should be kept in the dark because their spouse doesn't want them told.
Bottom line is there is no betrayal to her spouse by informing the other BS...what is the betrayal...he doesn't want to??? There is no betrayal...heck, he can do it himself.
Using Suzets logic and those supporting it...a great number of people are hurt by the FAILURE of others to tell them what happened. It is not just her H that is hurting her... Suzet, her H and anyone else keeping the info is also responsible for hurting that person. It is a very simple matter and I am sick and tired of the pathetic excuses for hurting someone else.
And yes, my opinions are growing louder...and most likely will continue to do so. I am no longer willing to sit back and watch people be victimized by others without raising my voice. My suggestion is, if you don't care to hear it, ignore it.

let me ask you all a question....
If Suzet has HPV and the failure to tell the OBS would put her at a health risk... would you have a different opinion???

If so, why?

The betrayal is that HE ASKED HER NOT TO.

So if she does it, its AGAINST HIS WISHES.

I'm not a (f)WS, but you don't like it when I raise issues with your word choices either. Its not that you don't value their opinion because of their status...its that you don't value ANYONE's opinion that doesn't match your own.

BUT...you do raise a good question at the end of your post...I'm going to think about that one before I respond.

on some issues you are right Owl... I do not value any opinion that advocates hurting another person.
Other than that, I will listen....

Weaver,

Suzet has a choice. Please do not enable this situation.

She has a choice.

The minute she acted with the OM she was an active part in hurting his wife.

Yes the OM hurt his wife and yes he should tell her. That does not relieve Suzet her responsiblity.

Now her BH says no. At what cost to all involved.

Again I would say what he has made is a selfish demand.

If I was over ridden with guilt and my wife said don't tell I would tell her I don't want to hurt her but in order for ME to be a whole person I need to do the right thing.

We all know what that is.

Enabling the situation may be harming it.

If everyone disagreed based on what is right she couldn't hide behind her husband.

She would be going back to him saying right is right.

Honoring your husband does not excuse not doing the right thing.

She hurt him. She hurt the OM's W. Om's W deserves an apology.

Heck maybe if Suzet wasn't around the OM would never have strayed. Who knows.