The only way she will get over it is if you put actions behind your words.

You still have not answered my question about changing your cell number. That is an immediate action that can have huge impact.

Like I said earlier, by not changing it, you leave the door wide open. A door OW had already walked through once. If you are sincere, that should be enough reason for you to be beating down the cell phone company door to change your number. Your wife knows you've left that door open, you know it, and so does OW. Knowing a WS is leaving a door open causes incredible pain to a BS.

You have the power to PREVENT your wife from feeling any further pain from future contact through your phone. Do you want to prevent that pain for your wife?

I don't mean to sound harsh, but you have avoided this topic. Why?

If you are unwilling to do this simple act, as a BW, I would turn and run as far away from you as possible.

Oh sorry, I didnt mean to ignore it on purpose!

Yes of course Ill change my number for her, I would do anything in this world for my wife and to make her happy.


On the actions thing. Its tough for me to prove myself to her through actions when shes not willing to even come around me often. She may see me for 10 mins for a week or so. I know I can show actions when im not with her, but I can only do so much there.

Thanks!

Zach, your wife may never come back to you. We can't guarantee you will restore your marriage. If she doesn't come back to you, if you do not restore your love, that is not a failure.

You are making the changes to become a better Zach. If you stop working on yourself because of her reaction or lack of it, the changes are hollow and meaningless.

Why is she friending up with these OW?

1. She is neutralizing them by making them friends of hers, playing on their sisterhood and loyalty to her in hopes you will not be able to return to them.

2. She is getting intel to protect herself in the future, and is checking on your stories to see whether you are lying.

or 3. She is morbidly curious.

You are ACTING, not REACTING, by changing yourself. If she fell off the planet tomorrow, would you go back to your old ways? Stop attending church? Start flirting with women so as to "get some?"

This mess is a test, a test of who you are as a man.

Ahh Bellevue

Your right, I wouldnt stop those things if she left today or tomorrow. I would keep doing things to be a better person, your right. I will continue to change myself for myself.

Thanks.


I spoke with her like usualy on her way to work, she said she was up late last night thinking about our 4 years together. She is feeling a little better now, she didnt seem hateful towards me and she was understanding and listend to me.

Last I heard from her.

You're only a week from DDay#3, aren't you? I'm old and confused...can we work out a timeline? In Surviving an Affair (I think) there's a timeline chart which shows the different timelines for WS and BS recovery.

I like to know where you're at.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

You revealed your pre-marriage infidelities a year and a half ago, is that close? Then you guys got married this year...and only a few months later, you had your last infidelity? So there was DDay #1 pre-marriage...then this summer was DDay#2, only you didn't tell your BW the whole truth of it...you lied for months, correct? Then last week or the week before, was DDay#3...where you came totally clean and owned up to all of your choices.

Let me know if I've got it...because it takes two years to recover from infidelity...you guys didn't recover after DDay#1 or #2...we can't because we don't have the whole truth of our partner's actions...and when we choose to recover, we gotta commit to recovering personally and maritally.

Sounds to me like you're now choosing to really recover...I see you working on your personal recovery...choosing new goals for yourself, new standards and actions...and yes, you'll still have resulting feelings from when you thought differently...slip in and out of feeling new, changed...into old, same...back and forth. Each time you choose to act to your code and let the outcome go, you're retraining your own brain, Zach. Be sure to see it...you'll miss it if your focus is all over her stuff, instead.

In Plan A...which you can be in to amend your actions...you plan on taking her to the movies...you set the time and date, ask her if she'll join you...and if she declines, you go, anyway. You set up great dates for yourself, to care for marriage, and if she declines, you go and do and report, anyway. For the care of your marriage and your half.

To me, this was respecting my DH's choices. Not taking them as signals, unspoken communications...just choices.

Don't replace with friends if she declines. Go and experience for yourself, anyway. Movies, walks, hearing a band...and act as you would if she was with you, right there.

Give gifts from your own choice to give...not dependent on whether she wants them or not...ponder well what you feel a lot of resulting loving feelings from giving...speaking her love language.

Are you informing her of your whereabouts, feelings, thoughts--your stuff? Working on your whys, your code, your remedy for guarding your weaknesses?

LA

LA Great post!!

We've been together 4 years Oct. 26th. First mess up was about a year into our relationship. Second came about 5 months or so after that and another in Jan. of this year.
I begged for forgiveness and she took me back, no I didnt have time to change myself, she took me back in one night. Then we got married in May on the 26th. I had an affair about 3 months into our marriage. I lied for about a month and a half. And I think its been 2-3 weeks since I came out with the truth. So your pretty much on the spot.


I never thought about going off and doing the things by myself instead of with her if she dont show. Good suggestion. She spends every afternoon with her friend and im sure she would have to drag her along if we did do something.


Yeah im letting her know how I feel and all, and I think she has a good understanding of how I do

Zach,

Would you consider making yourself a sigline here on MB? Putting in dateline info, your goal, owning your DDays...not messes. Owning your infidelity and earning your FWH designation.

This hurt is immense, it's fresh...I think that's why you got shaken to your bones when you did it again and she didn't take you back...she chose to reject and separate. I believe your challenge in this is complex, as is hers...so hearing you say "In the first year of our relationship, I cheated and lied to her every day for the next five months. I cheated again and continued to lie by omission until I cheated again, two and half years later, this past January; after which, I finally held myself to telling her the truth of all three infidelities.

We did not recover...we played like we forgave...her to me, and me to myself...without changing anything in myself.

I looked to getting married as a way to fix three years of lying and infidelity...and now know marriage isn't magic...and there are no instant recoveries.

I didn't hold myself to my vows...I betrayed myself, my wife and my marriage again this past August and since then, we've been separated. Not because of my infidelity, because again, I lied to my wife, by omission...until two weeks ago. Only now am I acting from honesty, by choice, and learning this lesson for the fourth time."

What do you think? Can you see your power in your own language, your choice of words? When you own what you did, why you did it and why you will not choose to do so again, then you can heal, forgive and recover. You cannot if you self-deceive...and that's inherent in a wayward mindset....which is what I see you striving very hard to change.

Expectations have kicked your tushie again and again...setting yourself up, through your own choice, of predicting the future...future responses...reactions...living in fantasy. Would you like to break that pattern of yours? You take a lot out on your BW that is solely yours...your choice to dabble in the future, where you have no power...to act when you will resent in the present, from the past...look at how your own DJs are harming you and your marriage deeply.

Choose reality. What you do not know, can not know, isn't against or for you...it's just out of reach right now. Don't assume about anyone...even yourself...know what is, not what you expect.

LA

Sure LA ill be more than happy to put up a timeline, remember im new around here so a lot of these symbols and all are kinda new to me but I know most of them. Im at work till 6pm est. so when I get home ill work one up!

That was a GREAT post and made me think a lot, ive read it several times.

Yes I can see my power in my words, I do understand now unlike I did in the beginning, and im a Honest person now and not the old lying husband. And im willing to do anything to be here and here to change the present, reality.

Expectations has killed me, your right and now im starting to get a grasp on myself and learning I shuoldnt expect anything out of her. Also, what does DJ mean? I couldnt figure that one out <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />


Thanks so much LA!

I wondered for the longest time what DJ meant.

DJ = Disrespectful Judgment

Ahhh Ok, thanks frozen.



She said she would call me when she got off of work like usual, and of course like usual she hasnt called and its been 1 hour now. Bah


Another boring night I guess



This her and her friend thing is really getting on my nerves at this point, I mean why doesnt she see our relationship and our problems are more important than hanging out with this stupid girl shes only known for 3 months?

Oh? More important to WHOM?

YOU???

Do you hear yourself?

You caused this.

This is a consequence of YOUR choices.

You're expecting that she place value on something that YOU want and you're irritated and angry with her for not doing just what you want her to do?

Can you really blame her, Zach? You caused her a tremendous amount of pain - not just ONCE but several times and you're blaming HER for not desiring to be around you?

Not as much as her not wanting to be around me, I dont blame her.


But for telling me every single day she MIGHT see me that afternoon, and she WILL call me at certain times.


And she doesnt. Everytime. All I ask if you say youll do something, do it, dont say it just to say it.



Your right though, I shouldnt be upset b/c of her, its my mess.

I know I need to be paitent. I havent heard anything from her since like 3pm today and its 8:30 now. For all I know shes at a bar with a guy.

Of course when I open my mouth, she finally sends a txt.



"Im eating and just got done shoppin, thats why I havent called"

I get the strongest sense of entitlement from your posts. Do you think she owes you something?

No, she doesnt. I just worry about her.
Im not use to being without her or not knowing where she is.

I dont want anything from her or want to think she has to do something for me. I dont ask anything out of her.

I just get built up and shot down when she tells me she will call me and doesnt, but hey? Im the one who betrayed her. She feels 100xs worse im sure. I think its more jealously from her friend that shes known for such a small time and its like shes the "greatest".

I dunno whats wrong with me tonight? Im having one of those nights where I feel imma have a panic attack. Why does this happen to me every weekend.


Shes at her friends house painting and shes going to stay with her tonight. Then go to a model thing tomorrow most of the day and she said I will "probably" see her tomorrow afternoon.

I asked her if she wanted to go out and see a movie or something. She said "i dont know about going out, maybe talk". I dunno what else really to talk about or say. Im having one of those really bad nights, I dunno why.

Feeling a little better today.

Kinna hard to go on a date when shes not willing to go out in public with me I guess. She would rather sit at home and talk? Im sure when she says that it means, "I would rather sit at home and talk about how bad youve treated me"

Any suggestions?


I did have plans to go out with a few friends from work, but I would cancel them to be with her.

Zach, the prevalent theme of your posts is that you expect certain things from your BW and then feel upset when she doesn't respond they way you hoped she would.

We've been trying to tell you that you have to stop expecting anything from her. STOP monitoring her activities! Ironically it's your expectations of some sort of pay-off that is keeping your BW doubting that your efforts are sincere; when you stop expecting a positive response from her then maybe your efforts will be believed by her. There are things you need to say and do BECAUSE they are the right thing and they will help repair the damage you caused - not because you hope it will get the desired result for you.

When you refer to your BW's behavior as 'hateful' IMHO you are making a Disrespectful Judgement of her. Your wife has every right to be extremely upset and angry with you! Describing her words and actions as being 'hateful' is based on your false presumption that your BW owes it to you to hide her hurt from you so that YOU won't feel so bad about what you did to her. She's not being 'hateful' Zach - she's HURT and YOU are the one who hurt her. You have ZERO right to demand that she pretend that the immensity of that hurt is smaller than it is.

"Im sure when she says that it means, "I would rather sit at home and talk about how bad youve treated me""

You know what Zach? I think I will stop posting advice to you until I see you drop this self-pitying attitude and sense of entitlement. I'm beginning to doubt you have the integrity to do what's best for your BW and marriage. You still seem too focused on yourself IMHO.

Ahhh, your right. I apologize for acting like that, I guess its kind of an instinct to me to act like this, I tell myself and try to change and then I start doing the old habbits again.

Your right, I deserve it.

Sorry, I shouldnt expect anything from her, your correct, I shoudlnt be whining because she didnt do something, thats selfish and immature. Thanks for waking me up to reality.

I have to remark because you said this with absolutely no irony.

Zach...did your marriage vows include one or two things you PROMISED to do...like love, honor, and cherish..and forsake all others?

Considering that you have broken every single one of those vows...considering that your wife has physically LEFT you...has made you no promises to return to the marriage whatsoever...and you are sulking because he didn't call and would rather spend time with people who have NOT personally gutted and betrayed her...somehow you are offended?

See...your WORDS insist that you "get it" but your behaviors and expectations clearly say that you don't.

In essence what you are saying is.."Hey, I've been a lousy husband and I have lied to and betrayed you several time...whaddya mean you don't want to spend more time with me and recommit?!"

There is no "our problems" to fix. She left you. She opted to NOT fix them. The marriage/relationship as it previously existed is OVER.

Not only does she not owe you her time and attention it would be frankly very WEIRD if she just couldn't wait to spend her birthday with you and couldn't wait to call you and couldn't wait to see you and couldn't wait to forgive you all over again mere weeks after discovering that you have been lying and cheating during your marriage as well as before it.