This is the first time I post a message here so please forgive for writing too much. I'm in a very desperate situation and I don't know what to do. We have marriaged over a year and I recently lost my newborn son due to his sickness when he was inside my stomach. We cremated him because my husband wanted to move out of state and I did not want to burry him at a place where I can't come to visit in a regular basis. My husband agreed with my decision but got upset that it was not what he really wanted because he wanted to burry him next to his dad.



Anyway, he proposed to me that from now on he wants to be the one who ultimately makes the final decision in all the big decisions. I don't want to say "yes" because I believe we should both make the decision if it involves family and kids. I love him a lot and I used to give in and let he takes control in the past and told him he could make all the decisions. However, after the lost of our son, I have matured and I told him I want to be honest with him that I can't promise him that. I told him I will try my best to sacrifice and let him make all the decisions if I can accommodate it but if he wants me to promise to submit to him 100%, I know I can't. I explained to him that this is not possible regardless how much I love him. My husband told me that this is not what he wants to have in a wife so he wanted us to get DIVORCE. I love my husband and I want to be with him. He is a good husband who takes care of the family, provide for us, and even cooks very well. He is however stubborn and would not change his mind or go to marriage counselor. Also, he believes the husband has to be the one who in charge of the family and so he is serious about being the ultimate decision maker. He loves his mom a lot and this is also partly her belief that has been implanted on him so he will not change it. He told me he will consider my ideas if we disagree on something but he still gets to make the final call no matter what. But I can not say "yes" because I know ten or 20 years down the road there maybe a time which I can't always say yes to his decision and I don't want him to think that I don't keep my promise.



I'm so sad right now because our son just passed away less than three weeks ago. I feel sad because I think if he loves me he would not propose this and put a condition on our relationship. I love my husband very much and I want to be with him. I'm so confused. I'm so sad and depressed over the whole thing. I'm living with my family right now an hour fly away from my husband because initially I was going to have my baby here and get help from my family to take care of him. I'm still recovering from the C-section. Without my family support, I would have done crazy things or suicide. My family said he is a controlling man the way he acts but they told me whatever I decide, they will still love me. This is our first marriage and my husband although 35 now has never had a serious relationship or dated much before marrying me. I did dated but just like my husband, we are both new to relationship when we met each other so I did not know what I was looking for in a man.



Can someone please help me to see it clear? We have a five years relationship including over a year into marriage and I do love my husband. However, overtime his hot temper and controlling has caused me to cried and sad many times and took away some love that I had for him. I still to be in the relationship with him and he promised to be more patience and no longer lose his temper again. However, he said all he wanted is a wife who will let him decide things in the family and that he still loves me. But he said if I did not let him be the ultimate decision maker in the future, he wants me to sign the divorce paper. How can I make him understand that a husband and wife should have equal right sand saying in a family's decision? Should I stay in the marriage no matter what? Will I be happy staying in the marriage with a man who wants to control? How do I know I will not regret with my decision in the future (either say yes to stay with him or he will divorce me)? Is there any alternative? I don't want to get a divorce for something like this... Thank you for reading. Please help.

hello,

I am so sorry to hear about the loss of your son. The grief of this is challenging... plus all of the hormonal "shifts" the female experiences as the result of pregnancy and then no longer being pregnant.

I may have some things to say regarding the situation with your husband... but this is so difficult a time without even the issue arising of your husband's asking for divorce if he cannot control you.

Again, my thoughts and prayers are with you during this time of heartache in the loss of your beloved son. It may be a time when the "worst" of your husband is "coming out"... due to his own fragile state in grieving your child as well.

This is no justification at all... no "explanation" that makes it "okay"... but I must wonder if his asking for a divorce at this time is also the result of his own weakened state in grief and discouragement.

I wonder if it would "work" to tell your husband that this is a very difficult time for both of you... and you do not want either of you to make any major decisions at this time.

Will he "pull together with you" on being there for each other during this difficult time... and "tabling" all matters of large discussion for a year while you give yourselves time to grieve and adjust to this expected child passing away?

To me, "stalling" would be the first thing I would consider. Do you think "stalling" the discussion and waiting for a time when both of you will be more "at your best" to discuss these matters... would be mutually acceptable?

It's very diplomatic. If it will be agreeable with him.

And, not to play games, but if you submissively ask him this... maybe he will not be threatened... nor will you need to "capitulate" the entire game????

Is there wisdom, you think, in giving him an inch now... so he won't take a mile later... because you really have not agreed to his terms... and are forestalling the discussion to when you are both better able to negotiate and come to an agreement that is really what is in both your best interests ( the policy of joint agreement).

I would say more,... but please let me know what you think...

Again, my thoughts and prayers are with you.

Thank you so much for your reply. You are very kind hearted and I feel a lot better knowing that someone cares and giving me thoughts and prayers. Yes, I think some of this has to do with the loss of our son. He thinks I don't love him and that he has no control over me since I refuse to come back to be with him unless he changes. He asked me to come back and promised will not be hot temper and walk away the way he used to do anymore. But he still insists on being the Ultimate Decision Maker and as soon as I told him I could not promise him that he proposed an immediate divorce. I really want to move back and be with him and give it sometimes for him to change as we open an new chapter of our relationship. However, I'm afraid this will make him comfortable and things will go back to the old way. Plus, I can't go back if he keeps insists to be the controller because it will not work in a long run. He is very hot temper as you know and so when he proposed that, I think he did not really know for sure what it means and how he would feel being divorced. Therefore, I told him that I'm not ready right now and I need a few months to recover from the loss of our son and consider about the divorce. He told me he would not change his mind so why lingering on only to cause him not being able to concentrate in his work. I insisted that I would not sign any paper or do anything and told him not to call me anymore (I was hurt when I said that due to his divorce proposal.) I'm not sure if what I did was right but this is where we are standing right now. I don't know what he thinks but we have not communicated for the last few days.

What do you mean by giving him an inch now can you please explain to me? Do you think it is better for us to be together or separated for the next few months? How can I make sure that either way he knows I still love him but I will not give in his demand?

Again, thanks so much for your response... I can feel that your empathy and I truly appreciate that. I hope to hear more from you because you are very thoughtful. Thanks again. Happy Thanks Giving.

I forgot to tell you some more about our relationship. I'm 31 and he's 35. The son we lost is our first and only child. We have married for a year and dated 4 years before that. We both did not date much before we married and especially him, he never even kissed a girl so he does not know how to treat a girl very well. He tends to be the one who says "let's break up", or "are you sure we meant to be together" whenever we argued about something. He is very hot temper and other people told me he is too controlling. On the other hand, I like his other qualities like career minded, faithful, good cook, straight forward, and family oriented.

However, I have a feeling that his idea about marriage is different than most other people. I feel like he wants me to not married to him but also his mom. It was partly my false because I accepted that at the beggining like I have to ask him mom before we go back to visit my family. Before we got married, he told me he wanted to take care of his mom so if I did not move to live with him and his mom after married he would not marry me. So I moved to where he lives 8 hours away from my family. There I don’t have any friends or family. I can’t drive freeway so I take the train to work and depend on him to take me anywhere else. I feel like I’m being jailed so I’m only happy when he is home after work but he is usually too tired to even smile to me. He is workaholic (only 3 days off a month) even though we can live comfortably with our income even if we only work 3-4 days a week. We are both dentists but he works hard and makes twice as much as I do and he just likes to see the number going up in the bank account. If I ask him to work less, he got mad saying that I’m demanding. When he is home, we cook and he just fall asleep after that so I’m in a constant state of needing more of him. Don’t get me wrong because it was not the sex I was looking for but the affection. He is too tired after work so we probably have sex once a week and 99% of the times I make the move. Before I used to dream a lot about an affectionate husband but now I have gotten used to it and I don’t mind about the frequency.

He watches everything I say or do to make sure I don’t say wrong things to his mom. The day before my son passed away, I combed his hair but his mom told me “it looks ugly when you do it, let me do it”. I was very very sad but I could not scream to her that no matter what I do to my son he is still beautiful. So I held my breath and just say “he is always beautiful in my eyes”. My husband witnessed everything and said that I was disrespectful to her and made me apologize to her. His mom only complained us about our son and said that our son got water in his lungs because I drank too much water. When the Dr. said there was nothing we could have done or ate or drunk to cause our son like this or change the situation, she said I must had had a bad egg that month, or because I did not do enough good deed. I just stay quiet to what she said and cried on my own. I told him his mom was insensitive to tell me all these when my son was dying in the hospital and I was already in pain to the bottom of the earth. He told me I could not use the word “insensitive” to her and he said as a son/daughter, we have to respect our parents so whatever she said or do, I will have to take it or we may face a divorce. He even asked me why I did not come to sit next to his mom in our son’s funeral to comfort her. I wanted to tell him I was not in the position to comfort anyone that day when I saw my son is in the coffin. I wanted to tell him how bad I felt when all his mom did that day was telling me how healthy her other daughter-in-law’s pregnancy and child was told me it must have been my birth control that caused his death. But I did not say anything because he would not understand all the pain I felt from what she said.

When we argue about something even as small as a puppy’s hair color, if he says he does not want to hear it anymore and I keep on saying, he will yell and shut the door and drive away. When he comes back he sleeps on the cough. There was one time we had a fight in the morning and I told him I will have a coworker take me home. He insisted to take me home but in the car he yelled at me and hit the wheel as if he was out the control and he told me if I did not say “sorry” to him he would hit the car into the divider and both of us would die. I was afraid that he would do it and regret later so I said “sorry” to him but I did not think I was at fault or what I needed to say sorry for. Then I cried a lot because I was forced to do it. Then he put his hands over my shoulder and said he loved me and that “it’s over don’t cry”. It happens many times like this when he got mad and drove away. I cried many times after married and especially during the pregnancy I was sad and scared whenever he left me home alone after the fight to the point that I feel scared to go back to him.

It was not that I want to leave him, but I want to take this chance to let him see what he did and change the behavior. In the past I keep put up with it and tolerate it but each time I got hurt, it took a little bit of trust and love that I had for him. When I think of it, I feel it was a torture to live like it. But I don't know how to explain to you... I know he is controlling and some people even say he is mentally abusive... But the point is he DOES NOT know that. He thinks he is right and that he controls because he loves me and wants to protect me, or he got angry because I nag and aggrevate him... So I feel like he is a kid making a mistake without knowing it was wrong so he keeps doing it... Do you know what I mean? Sometimes I feel sorry for him because I can see him mad/sad/struggle but he does not understand that some of his behaviors are wrong and by changing a little bit, we could have a happy life. And that is the reason why I'm still hanging on and want to do everything I can to change it and save our marriage. I want to help him but I can not do it alone. He has to be willing. He refuses to go to counseling or anything because he believes no one should teach him how to live his life. The only one he listens to is his mom who never thinks he is wrong. I hope you see what I mean. Thanks for reading again.

Do you have a different culture than the regular American one? I find his thoughts and actions very strange.

i'd let him have the divorce and move as far away from that narcissistic control freak as i could. he is going to turn abusive towards you eventually, something just tells me this. he has you right where he wants you, huddled in a corner apologizing for things you did not do and threatening death to you and him if you don't? wow. get out and fast.

mlhb

Hi sp,

Happy Thanksgiving! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I can tell you are a sweet and wonderful individual. I am happy to hear that you are a dentist and have your own income.

Here is one practical thing I want to tell you: never give up your occupation and income stream in this relationship (as it stands presently)... or you run the risk of becoming his mother's prisoner (having lost all "power" to control your own life).

As long as you have that job, I am not concerned for your emotionally safety in becoming controlled by these people. You are also very mentally and emotionally stable, imo, in seeing things accurately instead of being controlled by their perceptions. I congratulate you for having a strong center within yourself. Also, I do think it very important for you to remain very bonded and in touch with your family.

I believe, at the present time, that your mother-in-law (MIL) would completely control you if she had this opportunity. In my opinion (imo)... it is the MIL who is the source and center of all the psychological control that is being channeled through your husband. She is the source, also, of his mindset. Were she not present, it is hard to say what your husband would be like... free from ongoing influence. Again, I congratulate you in being safely centered in yourself and not "believing" their unhealthy "spin" on reality. The MIL, in particular, is very controlling.

One thing I was concerned about was physical violence. I don't hear you saying that in a fit of temper your husband has physically attacked you. Have there been any cases of that?

It is very concerning that, in effect, he threatened to kill himself in you through vehicular homocide.

I was heartened to see that he evidences sufficient self-control to just leave when he lacks emotional strength to discuss matters rather than control you. I thought that was good of him... but I am concerned that the mental abuse was evidence of physical abuse. It's the same dynamic of wanting to control someone and inability to bond emotionally while allowing another person to have their own personhood in the relationship.

There is much to discuss, imo, relative to the mother's control.

The term "wise as a serpent but harmless as a dove" comes to me. I see you reflecting these character traits in accurately assessing situations... and choosing your own responses rather than being dominated by the MIL, etc.

How much of your husband's money does your MIL control? I think that is critical in understanding some things.

Here is something I was thinking before. If you have read about Dr. Harley's "policy of joint agreement"... you can implement this pattern of decision-making unilaterally... without voicing what you are doing... and slowly "re-train" your husband without being overt and "triggering" arguments.

He's not going to consciously agree, imo. However, I believe he has not proven that the "ship cannot be turned".

If it does really come down to, in practice, that he cannot relate to you in any other way than total control... and he is not able to grow out of wrong things he has learned in relationship relative the MIL... then the situation would move in the wrong direction, imo.

The key thing, to me, is whether or not he becomes physically abusive.

As long as you can continue to assert yourself without being threatened and he is able to listen to you... it's worth exploring that he may be able to grow and change within your relationship.

My own father was abusive and controlling. My mother stayed married to him. Over the years, he changed.

My father, also, was not raised to understand how to have healthy relationships. He was orphaned very young... as a toddler... and was shifted from home to home.

My mother, though she endured things imo she should not have had to endure, learned how to "teach him" how to have a healthy relationship. Your husband has been "trained wrong" by his mother.

I am most concerned for your physical safety due to your husband's wrong thinking and belief that he (his MIL) "should" control you. It is good that you love him and he has good points and qualities.

The policy of agreement states that you and your husband do nothing without both of you enthusiastically agreeing. I am not expert, but I will do my best because I truly believe it is the "right way" to make decisions in a marriage and have a healthy relationship.

Your husband is not mature enough to agree to it, imo. However, I think it worth seeing if he can be slowly trained - especially since he is not responsible for his mother's wrong training of him, imo. He is responsible, however, for how he treats you now... and you are right to hold him accountable without being harsh towards him. He has a very limited range of ability, imo, in his ability to bond emotionally. But I believe I hear you saying that this will grow. Furthermore, I really would consider waiting until my mid-30's... at least... to consider having a child with him.

I would not want to bring a child into the MIL's house. To be honest, she will take over the child... and push you out of motherhood... and we've already seen how she raises children under her total control as much as possible. Also, we have seen that your husband is likely to "side with" your MIL in pushing you out of central consideration as the child's mother... and trying to make his mother's feelings more important than your own in relationship with him and with a child.

Please don't agree to have another child with him for at least 4 years - I would advise - and then depending on how he grows more bonded to you and "takes your side" against his MIL. Otherwise, I think it's a very hurtful situation both for the child and you.

The MIL is TOXIC.

Toxic.

Toxic.

That needs, imo, to be clearly understood and defined. She's toxic.

I'm going to write another post on how your husband adn you did not agree relative your son and his burial... for your consideration.

I would Plan A in affirming to your husband your love for him and your admiration as you have clearly stated in your posts.

I think you are sweet and wonderful... and I wish you a Happy Thanksgiving. Because I am "coming out" of withdrawal in relation to my "x"... I find myself in a "different place" emotionally for this short season. Personally, I will probably be on these boards here quite a bit for at least a short season, I think, because I am experiencing great change inside myself in my own feelings, processing, and preparing to be vulnerable in restoring a relationship.

I hope to speak more with you and support you in your relationship and life.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Hi sp,

I know this is very sensitive. I had a child born prematurely... and she lived. I suffered and endured as you have the 27 days. Yet I feel that though I was "touched" by the threat of the loss of my child, and I experienced that level... I am completely inept in understanding your loss and how that feels. My heart goes out to you as much as I am able - though I know I do not have the capacity to experience with you the loss of your child from my own experience.

He was blessed beyond measure to have a mother such as you who saw his great beauty and was there for him. I know you will see him again... I believe... and I believe he smiles to you from Heaven. I hope you are comforted.

Your husband is used to being controlled. He doesn't know how, experientially, to relate to others in freedom, imo. He has never learned "how" to relate in the policy of joint agreement.

When you stated your feelings and desires, he was moved by you. He either let you make the decision without voicing his own feelings clearly... and working at a compromise that would work for both of you... or his feelings changed. Perhaps his mother influenced him... and now he wants, in retrospect, her decision to be "the decision".

However it happened, he no longer agrees and is hurt by the decision with which he no longer can support enthusiastically. Therefore, can you renegotiate? Are you able? Without discussing with him the policy of joint agreement... can you "table" the discussion of who will be the "Ultimate Decision Maker" (him, you, or most likely to him the MIL)... and practice the policy of joint agreement in your own actions? This will be practical training for him. Practicing the policy of joint agreement will cause him to grow... as he practices it... no matter what the MIL says. It is this means by which he will change, imo. And it is important, imo, for you to "test" his ability to change so that he grows in his ability to bond with you.

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

He wants the child to be buried by his father. Can you agree, for example, to have the box buried intact (not ashes spread) next to his father... if, for example, you are able to visit the grave a certain number of times a year?

Another possibility, perhaps? Can you agree to have some of the ashes buried intact (not ashes spread) next to his father... and some of the ashes with you always?... if you and he agree that you will visit the grave together in a frequency you can both agree to? (This would allow both his wishes and yours at this time.)

I would not say, "We must agree."

I would say, "I am sorry you do not agree and I would like to agree with you. What decision can you make on this matter?" Then just see if you can agree. And don't make a change that doesn't meet with your true heartfelt agreement.

You will not be debating that he is the "Ultimate Decision Maker"... but you will be making a commitment that you will not take action or make a decision with which he does not agree. (You'll just need to be sure you never agree to take action or make a decision with which you do not agree.)

He wasn't really forthright (or his decision changed) when he agreed with you. I think his heart may soften towards the "Ultimate Decision Maker" position as you set the good example for him of taking his feelings and wishes into consideration in revisiting a decision that was already made.

If you cannot come to an agreement he is enthusiastic about and you are as well, you can continue with the decision that has already been made with which you are happy... keeping your son's ashes with you. Whatever you do, do not agree to anything relative to that to "submit" to your husband's wishes... against your own feelings. Please make certain you really can agree to something... and I guess based on what he has said... he, too, is comfortable with you making suggestions as long as the decision that is made does not contradict his own wishes. (Really, he's saying he wants the policy of joint agreement so that decisions are never made that are not what he wants... he's just not understanding at this time that the decision should not be made without your feelings being taken into consideration equally as well. He just doesn't "get it"... because his mother, imo, has trained him wrong and still controls him.)

So, you can "sidestep" the "debate" of "who" is the "Ultimate Decision Maker"... recognizing you have not capitulated your "no"... and he will not be allowed to force you to agree with him. You will maintain your decision-making power. But you will continue to speak suggestions to him seeking his decision-making. When he "comes up with" a decision you agree with... he has actually done so from within the policy of joint agreement... without realizing it.

That's why I would "stall"... and not even discuss (since he seems incapable of the maturity necessary to acknowledge it at this time) the wisdom of the policy of joint agreement.

I would say to remain "wise as a serpent and harmless as a dove" and train him in the policy of joint agreement... letting him think, if necessary, he is the "Ultimate Decision Maker"... and nothing will be done without his enthusiastic agreement as he takes your suggestions into consideration (as you practice the policy of joint agreement without overtly telling him you are doing it)... as you main control of your own decision-making power and authority within the relatinoship.

Never give it up. You'll be giving up the health of your relationship and your love for your husband if you do...a nd you already know that. Unfortunately, he doesn't. But praerfully, I hope you are able to lead by example... and submssion... in teaching him.

There is nothing wrong with submission. Submission is beautiful and lovely. But only in the form of mutual submission... and not in just one submitting to the other.

No, "Ultimate Decision Maker" does not work and is not right. It's wrong. It's not true "submission". It's abuse, imo.

However, the policy of joint agreement and mutual submission is beautiful and lovely and true. It's right.

If only one practices it... one may still, by being "wise as a serpent and harmless as a dove"... teach the other to live thereby... without "blowing the relationship out of the water" in the process.

It comes down to abuse.

If he becomes abusive physically... safety is your #1 concern.

Otherwise, you may be an angel from Heaven who is one of the very few who is so sweet and wonderful (as my sainted mother is) who can make a silk purse (what he will become out of your training) out of a sows ear (what he is at this time due to the MIL's training)... relative to his wrong ideas abuot control in relationship.

Well, I hope that helps. Please know that when I speak, I am respectfully making suggestions... yes, giving counsel or advice from my perspective, but I yield of course to your better knowledge of the situation and, most truly, how you think and feel and therefore what works for you.

Deferring to your better judgment.

I repeat my continued sincere condolences relative to your beautiful son.

sp...

This is an individual who has divorced a spouse. This person now advocates "ditching" a spouse... out of her own pain and inability to heal, I'd believe. Please take every word this person says with a grain of salt. I have experienced her voicing what I believe to be profound contempt in another thread for the sanctity of marriage and working on covenant marriage relationships to preserve and restore them.

Sometimes people who divorce become "champions" of advocating divorce... and give advice out of their own unhealed hurts.

Misery loves company.

Divorce is no solution... though, I would agree, it is sometimes necessary.

The fact that she sees nothing but doom and gloom in the future for you in your marriage is not an unbiased opinion but rather reflects her own experience and current emotional makeup.

Please be very careful of her counsel... and don't receive it innocently. It's based on her own current condition of justifying divorce and remarriage like it's musical chairs or something.

There's something holy about marriage that doesn't make a husband dispensable. There's a love more powerful in marriage - a true bond of holy matrimony - than is comprehended by those who rebel against the bonds of holy matrimony - the bond of which, imo, is God Himself.

People who quickly advocate divorce and quickly label husbands as incorrigible and irredeemable... and easily "dispensable"... like divorce is a "cure-all"... are dangerous.

They do not respect the bonds of holy matrimony - and encourage others to break them through divorce.

Be very careful of this person's counsel, sp.

Your husband cannot be replaced so easily... nor the bond of the love between you be erased through divorce.

IT's a very serious matter to consider divorce... and I don't think you should be pushed into it by someone who has already gone over the cliff and is justifying herself at the expense of the bonds of marriage.

It's a world of pain to divorce.

Don't let anyone fool you.

And somethings cannot be healed by human willfulness... meaning that we can't change what happens inside of us when the bond that doesn't change has been broken.

That hurt doesn't "heal"... just because we deny the reality of an unchanging bond of marriage in our hearts.

Don't buy into the "throwaway society" of "divorce solves everything".

It doesn't.

If this marriage can be saved... save it. And be very careful of this person's advice.

Hello everyone,

First of all, Happy Thanks Giving. Thank you everyone for write your responses.

BELIEVER: Yes, we are Vietnamese. As Vietnamese we do have a great respect for the in-laws. My husband’s actions probably be okay 200 years ago but it is no longer accepted now. Plus, he was raised in the US since he was 8 years old. I wonder why his mom teaches him to control me but she is not herself. In her family, she was actually the one who made all the decisions before his dad passed away. Also, she is pretty Americanized in a sense she can speak English adequately, had a Fillipino daughter in law and Hispanic son in law, both of whom came over to her house and lived for a couple years before actually married to her children. I’m the only one who can speak her primary language, help her with the cooking, cleaning up and Dr. appointment. The other ones only said “Hi” or “Bye” to her. Behind them she told me she did not like them. But when she is with her son, she told him the a good wife listens to her husband completely. The thing I realize is the problem also comes from my husband because he wants to be controlled. She did the same thing to the other daughter in law but it did not work but her husband did not cooperate. Therefore, I would have to change my husband’s mind, not her…

MLHB: Thanks for your response and I understand you are concern about my well beings and safety. I will consider your advises. However, I also agree with Back to give it a try if my husband is willing to show improvement and change. My husband has never physically touched me no matter how mad he was. He has all the other good qualities and I know he loves me, and I think I should give him a chance. But if the limit is reached, of course I’ll know what to do. Thanks so much and please know your advise is as important as any others.

BACK: Thanks so much. It is very kind of you all to take your valuable time to write and give advises to someone who is not your friends or family members. I appreciate a lot and I hope God bless you. Thanks for the constructive advises. Yes, the love that you described where husband and wife are submissive to one another is exactly what I want. I tried to tell my husband that but I think it will be a while before he understand. By the way, he has never physically hit me whenever he got mad. The worst, he slamed the door and drive away to cool down.

He just emailed me yesterday but I have not written him back. The last time we talked was on Monday when he proposed divorce and I told him to give me three months to think. I did not call or email him since. He told me in the email his phone was dead since and it was a great thing because it made him write to me. On the phone we often can not communicate well and only try to say things to satisfy our ego. I wrote him emails but he was too busy or stubborn to read. This time, I think he reads my emails and so he wrote me back. This is part of it:

“Nowsaday, I really look forward to going to work because it's only work that makes me forget about everything in life. I really hate coming back to apartment because, once I am there, my brain is flooded with thoughts that made me sad. Anyhow, in our last conversation, you also agreed with me that I am not a suitable person for you since I don't meet your standards. Since you dated more than me, you should have taken your time to find that person that fits your needs. Thank you for being honest with me after 5 years. My life is now filled with sadness!!! I only wish that you would have been more honest with me 5 years ago so that way we're not stuck in this situation. I really am sleepy now. You have a good night and a happy Thanksgiving tomorrow. Make sure you take your meds and eat healthy. I can't write anymore.”

After reading his email today, I feel there is hope but I’m not too excited or respond to his email immediately yet. But I can see the different in him this time. Usually, he only writes no more than a couple sentences but this time his email was over a page long. Usually, he often complained or showed that he was mad at me or what I said or did. Usually he never told me how he felt but in this email he open up to tell me how sad he was. I don’t know how to describe to you but I can see a big difference in the way he carries out his thoughts today.

I can tell he still love me, and the fact that missing me has mellow him down. I wanted to tell him the lonely feeling he has now was exactly how I felt every time he left me after a fight, only that I felt worse for having no friends, no family around or even a car to drive away. I wanted him to know I did not want to come back because I did not love him but because I need to know that he has changed. I wanted to tell him I did not mean he was unsuitable for me. I simply told him I could not stand his short temper and accept his demand to be the Ultimate Decision Maker. When he said I was not honest, he means that in the past I promised to let him make all the big decisions but now I change my mind and he feels I’m a liar. I will try to explain to him this.

I can see that he still care for me and love me. I can see that he is in pain. I will give him more time to think about his decisions. I will stand still on my ground not to agree with him to be the ultimate decision maker. I agree with you Back… Even if there is a slight chance that our relationship can be saved, I will still take that chance. I will let you all know more…

Thanks again. Happy Thanksgiving.

sad,

thank you for your nice comments. i DO NOT BELIEVE MARRIAGE IS DISPOSABLE. back, although she has said very kind things to you, is also posting on the after divorce/dating board (which i have no idea why since she is NOT dating but trying to win her husband back) and seems to have issue with those of us who have chosen divorce and choose to date after our marriages are over. i apologize to you for her ugliness towards me. just ignore it.

i was married over 10 years. i did EVERYTHING i could to save my marriage. i stayed with a man who for 4 years had affairs, slept on the couch and told me to my face he never wanted to touch me again and did not love me. he was verbally abusive to me in front of my children and then physically at the end to where i had to have him arrested. i gave until i had nothing left to give. i had my inlaws trying to help me save my marriage right to the very end. and finally, in the end, my inlaws even told me to leave. when it comes to my safety and my childrens I DO NOT TAKE THAT LIGHTLY. yes, my marriage ended. i can look in the mirror and say i did everything i could. i do not appreciate being told by posters that i think marriage is disposable. i far from believe that. and i don't have to explain myself to anyone.

sad, i support you fully do what you can for your marriage. i understand your heritage now and know that that makes things different for you. HOWEVER, i fear this control and manipulation he is using on you. i am afraid he is going to suck the life out of you. the things you describe are unacceptable and horrendous! i feel for you tremendously.

we are here for you however you may need us to.

back, back up off of me. you do not know me and i don't appreciate being attacked on someone else's thread. i have been on these forums for over 2 years now and i care a lot for every person who finds themselves on these boards. i may not agree with your choices but i have not attacked you on them. i wish for you as i wish for everyone else here, to find the help they are looking for. i have never in 2 years of being here had to put a poster on ignore, but sadly i think i may have to.

mlhb

I don't really agree with divorce unless the relationship becomes abusive...and this one will be, don't wait for him to hit you or put you down emotionally to control you. Whether or not he knows how to treat a woman doesn't mean he shouldn't have a basic understanding of do's and don'ts.

Although given the circumstances of just losing your son, this might just be his way of grieving, he couldn't control whether his son loved or died, and he now wants to control you because for some reason, if a guy loses control of anything, they need to gain it in other places.

Please do not go back to him if he still wants to control you, it will never end well.