Do you honestly NOT see the direct correlation between your continued INACTION and the fact that you remain in limbo 3 years out???

It appears to me that you prefer to be lied to by both your WW and YOURSELF. Otherwise, you would have done something about this a long time ago.

PLEEEEEASE ... at least be honest with yourself and see the situation for what it is, rather than what you fantasize it to be.

Do you even realize that TWICE in the above post you COMPLIMENT her "almost" honesty, while acknowledging her continued deception???

Whats the point Zack?

This isn't going anywhere. There isn't such a thing as almost honest. You either make a statement you know to believe is true, know is true, or you know/believe is NOT true.

Lieing by omission is also dishonest.

Keep liquoring her up, and interogating her, let us know if this new kind of therapy works!!

If not, try waterboarding
/sarc

Z,
Now this isn't exactly an above board move but....

You said the other woman friend seemed intereted in you. And we all agreed this womanizing woman should not be around your marriage so maybe...

Tell your wife this friend approached you and spilled the beans about your wife's comment about her past lover's size. And thats how you know. Friend woman was using it to fuel your jealousy and spark a physical thing between her and you but you declined her coldly and after all this comes out maybe wife will get rid of friend.

Kinda underhanded but solves all problems. YOu keep your source, you lose woman friend, you get all things on the table.

comments??

Unflippinbelieveable, BP. Have you even been reading this thread?

Let us know, Zack, if you ever tell your wife HONESTLY about what you heard and how you heard it. You asked 13 days ago what to do. You've been told. If you want an honest, open, and healthy relationship, you need to live it too. I'm a FWW and even I'm telling you to do it. Not next week. Not when she's drunk. Not when the time is right. Not only part-way. Not when you have proof. Just freakin' tell her! Goodness-almighty already!

'Till you handle this the right, honest, and true way, I'm done with this thread.

Good luck.

I would just say... about the conversation you had with the girlfriend, I actually was walking by and heard a key word of the conversation and it made me stop and listen in. I know what was said and you have left out some key parts(No pun intended). Do I have to tell you what they were or will you finally be honest. Something like that. Just get it over with!!!

Unless I missed something, he wasn't home. He intentionally tape recorded their conversation.

I just had to step in and say...


WHAT IS WITH SOME OF YOU PEOPLE???? Trying to confront lying, gaming and scheming with... MORE LYING, GAMING, AND SCHEMING????

"Tell her this...", and "Tell her that..."

Um... How about zach being the kind of person her wants his wife to be? Show her the proper behavior by leading from example. Tell her the truth with total openness and honesty.

"Honey. It kills me to say this, but ever since your past transgressions, I've never really trusted you. Not 100%. Not like a husband should be able to trust his wife. And most especially not when that toxic harpy hosebeast friend of yours is around. So, I decided to record you. It's my house as well and the way I see it, there is no "right to privacy" between married people. I know all about your conversation with her. I know what you said about your OM, about his size, and what you said to her about me. I feel betrayed, lied to, and belittled as a man and as your husband. We've gone round and round in the past about you needing to be more honest and yet it still seems like you either can't or won't get it. I fear for our future together. What are you prepared to do to help fix this problem, assuming it even can be fixed? Or would it be best for us to go one with our lives apart? You can have your Sex in the City lifestyle, and I can eventually find the kind of wife I'd always hoped you would be. Please let me know so that we can both stop wasting our time here."

TR, Looking4, RMX, weld, and MyRev obviously get this. What's everyone else's problem. Geez! What's the point of coming to MB if you're simply going to blow off the tenets that underscore it??? :crosseyedcrazy:

Your right I forgot her used a recorder.

Hey seabird, thanks for the reply. Of course you (and TR,Looking4, RMX, weld,MyRev) are correct about the honesty approach. It just that this is a stressful and emotional event and its tempting to have some fun with it. Thank everyone that took the time to respond. I will update when I can...

you are lying to yourself by calling this fun. if it were fun you wouldn't be here

This situation certainly is NOT fun. What I simply meant was that I am attempting to make the best out of a crappy situation. After being drug through the mud as a BS, it is at minimum, entertaining to image what I could do if I wanted to play around with the scenerio. Of course, its just talk and not a serious consideration. So I know where the other posters are coming from.

believe me... it's easy to sit on the fence and hope things repair themselves but it just doesn't work that way

it took me a few years to learn that lesson and believe me i learned it the hard way.

Thanks MyRev,
About you INACTION statement, I have been putting forward action through out the recovery period. Perhaps not the correct action or full action needed although I'm still trying to find out what that is.
I dont prefer to be lied to by anyone including my wife and we have discussed everything under the sun. We have made agreements to be honest and she has been and I have occassionally checked up on her, and shes even cool with me snooping.

Yes i realize that I appear to compliment her, but I'm just trying to give her credit where its due, so as to not completely overlook her efforts and contributions. What it boils down to is several comments , over a 3 year period, made by her that are disrespectful, which has always been with this friend and when drinking alot.

I appreciate your plea to pleeeeeease be honest with myself to see the sitch for what it is and thats what I am trying to do. Love of course can make things difficult to see clearly and ive been trying to present the facts in the best way i can.

I have a better idea Zach,

Find a bed and breakfast, Examine her schedule.

Take her away from friends/family for the weekend.
If you don't have kids, ditch all cell phones and take her away from any distractions.
While its just the two of you, lay it out.
No games, no innuendo.
State what you know, explain how it feels BUT
Avoid starting sentences off with "You" and try to use "I"
You MUST make her feel safe to be honest with you.

Explain your boundaries, and limit the R talk to 30 minutes max, unless she wants to go into overtime.

Wherever the bed and breakfast is, make sure there is some kind of venue nearby with a festive atmosphere.

You must put forth a honest and calm attitude. IF you find yourself wanting to cough "BS" when you hear a lie. Call her on it immediately, apologize and say your going to get some air, CALMLY.

none of this cat-footing around fishing expeditions... This is your life partner we're talking about. You need to let your boundaries known and then see if she can't OR WON'T respect them.

I fear alcohol abuse might be one of the factors in your situation.

I like your idea, especially the no-nonsense approach, ( which is more my style) and your suggestion on language usage. You are correct about the alcohol thing, as she has even stated she has a problem before. So i might not be able to build the marriage I want without dealing with her alcohol issue first. What a mess, really! Thanks

Well its been eating at me for days now so tonight while having a conversation about our relationship i told her about the recordings. Needless to say she is f******g PISSED! SHE IS FURIOUS I COULD DO SUCH A THING LIKE RECORD A CONVERSATION BETWEEN HER AND HER FRIEND WHO IS GOING THROUGH A DIVORCE. SHE SAYS I BETRAYED HER TRUST!

I'm not sure it was a good idea to tell her, perhaps the timing was wrong. I think its going to be a while before we can even talk about what she said that I feel disrespected me and dishonored our marriage. Shes too upset I listened to their private conversations to address the pain she caused me. What can I do?

She had the affair and can't trust YOU?

You need to do this plan of action now! Nevermind this DA (and I don't mean district attorney) inaction, you need to get up and stand up for your marriage.

Look at her and tell her. " The affair you had changed the dynamics of our marriage. It basically left me with a stranger. That I have had to develope a whole new relationship with. You are not the person I married and I am not the person you married. Trust will always be an issue.

That is why I recorded the conversation between you and your friend. The friend you confided in that you were cheating on me. The friend who has carried on multiple affairs. The friend that aided you in deceiving me. Should your history with this friend lead me to trust you or mistrust you? She is going to be free very soon. You don't think that scares the hell out of me? Your friend has zero morals. Now she doesn't have a husband. What if she wants you to visit her. What do you think she will want to do? Stay home and play canasta? She will want to go out and party. And she will take you with her. She will be looking to get laid, because that is what she does. And she will be looking to get you laid. Do you think I have any reason to be concerned?

During your conversation you answered a question that I asked you when we were reconciling. When your girlfriend mentioned how large her lover was, the man she cheated on her husband with. What was your response? Was it "I don't want to talk about that time". Or "can we change the subject". No, you had to offer up the size of your lovers penis and that it "filled you up". I may have deserved what I got by recording your conversation. But I also found out that you lied to me again. And that you are more then comfortable sharing with your cheating slut friend, with pride I may add, an experience that crushed me and almost ended our marriage. Maybe you didn't understand just how devastated I was. Maybe now that some time has passed, you feel that maybe its OK to look back on that time with found memories. Just understand that my memories from that time are quite different. I hope we can work together to get past this. Because I do love you.

An update:
After last night when she was furious and after getting up today early she mentioned she was still angry, but later we spent the afternoon together and she has not mentioned it once. We spent all afternoon at the park talking but we didnt talk about the recording or what I heard. Shes been nice to me today, so I think maybe she has started to understand that she dealt me another heavy emotional blow. I was waiting for her to bring it up but she never did. I'm thinking this could take awhile to play out.

Last night before I told her, we were discussing our relationship and shes somewhat familiar with Marriage Builders and I suggested we try some exercises and she seems responsive. Thanks to everyone that has helped me over the last couple weeks. I would like to know if it would be a good idea to invite my wife to read my posts on this forum? Is it the right time?