I'm having mixed feelings about WH coming home for Easter, spending sat. night.
Although initially I asked if he was coming, I now think that I am allowing him to fence-sit, letting him have his "family holidays", while I forgoe making plans to go to my family's or have them over so that he will come. He doesnt' want to be around my family right now.
I think it is important for him and the kids to spend time together, and good opportunity to Plan A. But it is hard for me because I know it's not the real deal "family" thing.
Should I point this out to him or just let it go as part of Plan A?
Am I neglecting to set up boundaries thus entering Doormat territory?
He wants to buy D's Easter Basket, and I didn't object even though our tradition is to leave an empty basket out and the E.Bunnie fills it. I figure it's more important that he's involved, something I always wished he'd do more of. I figure I need to let go of some things that are not so important in the scheme of things.
But.. I don't want to always be letting go and giving in for the sake of Plan A.
But...I do need to pick my battles and this for sure isn't one of them, not a big deal but just an example.
Feedback anyone?

Put all your pros in one column and your cons into the other. You see how it looks on paper and maybe can make a decision that you feel comfortable with. He probably loves the idea to be able to come for the delightful holiday with the family. It takes effort to make marriage good. Are your expectations of him too low? Just a question. Would you feel more comfortable being with the rest of your family. How do you think having him over will end up? Is this what you want. You are in control of what decision you choose. And those are the boundaries you set.

Hi , I have been thinking of you , but have been on my rollercoaster and well doing the upside down thing LOL . (little humor good for the solo)

OK here is rember JMVHO , Your doing good , even with the couple of LB you've had its ok no one I MEAN NO ONE PLAN A's perfect with out a crack here and there . MY take on DOOR MAT!!!

I hate the expresion it makes me as a BS , feel like I am being judged in a low manner and not like someone who is doing what I think best to get M back .

You only feel like a door mat when you think so .(confused sorry ) thats my take .

YOUR plan A is important , you exposed the A and now still run PLAN A , it takes some where to 4 to 6 mon for all the LIGHT that hit A to really reach impact . JMO .

Next , I do think it is good for you and kids he is there for holiday , this gives him the opertunity to see " a FAMILY " that he can have if he chooses to .

You on the other hand need to be strong , fun and freindly , . Ask for fun help in kitchen nothing to earth shattering just away for him to BE APART of the family , the familar part of preparing for holiday . The baskets , was a good thing to let go , showing him you can adapt to change is good , that you don't get flipped if its not your useual thing to do . THese things in my opoin are small and you are right choose your battles wisely . (smart statement )

It is EASTER , you don't have to deal with a holiday for awhile .

SPEND memorial day with family bbq , no you can not sacrifise time with family all the time to be with him just cause he is AVALIABLE , that also is PLAN A doing for you and family fun is important .

This is all a matter of being strong and beliving in your goal . I wrote awile back I do think you need to set up a more stable visitation for him and kids . Also that puts him in position to commmit . and except responsiblity . You have a life to and need to be able to make plans with people and deserve somne free time as well .

well thats all , also think the pro/ con list is always a good thing to do .

And do not have any HIGH expectations of him , do not look for signs from him let things flow .

JUST LOOK MARVELAS DARLING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lISTEN TO LOUD MUSIC BEFORE HE COMES DANCE WITH 4YR. OLD AND GET IN A GREAT SPRING MOOD .

Thanks guys!!
I have no expectations of WH, very unpredictable these days, par for the fog course I guess.
And ya know, I AM looking pretty good these days!
Lost 25 lbs, got some great lookin jeans, haircut today, getting lots of compliments on the weight loss!
Spent the weekend with a group of friends, dancin and drinkin to some great bands, outdoors, first real warm sunny spring day...it was good for the soul!!
I'm hoping that this visit will be a good one. If I can just keep my mouth shut, regarding Relationship Talk. I figure if he's with us, he's not with OW, and that itself is a good thing! If he enjoys this family time then he'll have to realize that he can choose to have this always. At some point my generosity will dry up regarding the visits home.
I feel like all I do is plan or think about the next visit, even though I'm trying to stay busy. It's enough to drive a person crazy! UUGGHH!
Thanks again, just having you guys to vent to helps alot!

Learnin...

My opinion...and remember is that it is just my opinion is that he should perhaps sleep elsewhere....

It's a kick of reality....
BUT that means that the time that he is there...try to make it fantastic....
so that when he leaves....to go to a hotel room...it's less like he has spent his "time" with you and the family...and now gets to run back to the OW...but more like he would rather stay the night...
less hassle....
more able to rationalize that it is all "good"

Let him see the affect of his actions on the children..."sorry guys I know you are having fun..but dad has to go now...he'll come back tomorrow...."....and NOT that your children are pawns by any means...but because this his the REALITY of his CHOICES....

Be warm be friendly...have fun...but kick him out right when things are feeling at their best....and make sure he knows how much you appreciate him stopping by...see you tomorrow..kiss on cheek...

Also and this does sound like a thin line between manipulation and lieing...but consider while he is there...setting up with a girl friend...a phone call...(cell phone even better...) that you have to take in the other room.....excuse me I'll be right back....

whisper whisper whisper whisper....giggle giggle...
it's a girl friend but he doesn't HAVE to know that....and you certainly can't be expected to be accountable to him for everything while he is off free with OW>....

make him wonder....make him see you in a little bit of a different light...

those are my suggestions learnin...your husband has admitted to his own confusion...
also he is stuck in the things were so bad they can't ever be repaired...
not true...and little bit to much of the martyr role...

ARK...

Ilove Arks idea. Yes I think that the idea is excellent because it removes all of the doubt. You look great you feel great and you can show it.But you do not have to give it away. very best wishes to you and yours...wflower.

There really isn't anyone he can stay with, he's lost touch with any friends he had around here since he's been working out of state for so long.
Financially, things are tough, he's laid off, so staying at a motel is not a good idea.(though he'd prob. spend the $ to stay w/OW!)
He sleeps in another room. Doesn't want physical contact with me anyways.
Last night he called, we talked for a while. He's coming up sat. night and wants to spend a few good weather days next week during April vac. to do some work around the yard. THank God for that, there is so much to do this time of year, huge yard & garden.
I wasn't going to ask him for help, so I'm glad he is taking the initiative to help. I'm hoping that this is a good sign as he has showed no interest in the house for months.
WE then talked about $$. I found out that he recieved our big fed. tax return weeks ago and he never told me. I thought about it for a little bit and called him back to ask why he didn't tell me. He said he was sorry and he wanted to list all the bills that he paid with it. But I said no, I wanted to believe that he was doing the right thing with the $(i'm pretty certain most bills are paid up,no one's been calling the house!)
I'm glad I called back instead of stewing about it. Overall the discussion went well, I was calm and he did not get defensive. There is still money left and he has a couple of things left to pay.
He's pretty concerned about our financial situation. I told him I'm trying to get a better paying job, and really trying to watch spending.
If he gave up his apt., and came home and watched D while he's laid off(saving DayCare$), we'd save over $800 p/mos! It makes me feel like my earnings are just to keep him in an apt. and away from us!
I'm just frustrated today. Why can't he see that we could work out our financial prob. as a couple much easier than with a D. I know that this is a big part of why he's doing what he's doing.
This post is really going nowhere, just venting.

learnin,,

part of me can't help but keep playin the same old tune...

ahhh poor wh spouse...laid off...but lives in an apartment....
not working but makes his children stay in dAYCARE...is he hooked on Days of Our Lives or is it General Hospital that's got him?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

You are getting a better paying job...he gets 800.00 for his pad???

AND STILL gets to come home and play pretend...and stay at home so it doesn't place a burden on him....

and learnin this is not said out of meaness or even out of "what's the matter with you woman" ??!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
But in the sense of don't protect him from HIS REALITY...meaning
he leaves you and the kids hanging...no choice on your part in living in his fogged reality ...and yet he can pretend it's not so and not his doing...

plan A with boundaries is not an LB...not a bad thing...it can be a huge sign of strength and growth...

tell him
"this dear is the reality of your actions...THIS is NOT me being mean or *****y or anything..this is ME deciding what I will or will not tolerate in my life....bat eyes here..."

where does his family live...
do they know what is going on...
so hotel for a night...means no taking oW out for dinner some other night...??? ahhhhhh
also you may consider making plans with your family on Sunday...not telling him till sunday...inviting him with you...ofcourse you are welcome....and go anyways...leave him hanging around empty house....

learnin you are doing well...i know you are hurt and I know this is scarey...

ark.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Ark,
I know what your saying. It's exactly what I'm struggling with.
The $800 savings would be both apt. & childcare costs/mute point I know, and it does get me angry that he has all this time on his hands and youngest is in daycare and all this yard work to do on top of everything else.
But do I want him home because he should feel guilty about these things? Well, you would think he would. But he obviously isn't guilty enough. He needs to come home because it's his decision, not because I can guilt him into it, point out what a selfish jerk he's being. He needs to come to these realizations himself.
Because he's been away so much, I feel right now its important that he be home. And the fact that he wants to be home(despite me being there!)I think for right now is ok. It means he's not with OW! He asked if he could come sat. night and I said yes. No family nearby.
I'm thinking about asking him, when he's here, "Why are you here?". If it's because he wants to be with his family for the kids, then I will point out that it will not always be this way if he chooses OW. And I will also point out that I do not want to give up holidays with my children for something I do not want and for something I did not do. If that's the choice he wants to make, then fine, go for it.
But you're right, I know that at some point I cannot allow this to continue, and he will insist on visitation and the D that he wants. Right now, the only thing preventing him from filing is $$. At least so he says.
I'm hoping that all these visits home will eventually work their magic on the A, and that OW will start putting the pressure on. But who knows.
I'm also hopeful that a job will actually be available in our area(this has been the prob. all along, no union work in our area)and that he will decide to take it. But who knows.
Hoping, hoping, I know, I'll need to get a new plan at some point. But right now I need opportunity to Plan A. I'm doing the part about me as best I can, but I need to be able to make up for all the early "mistakes" post D-Day and pre-MB!
Gotta run. Don't stop with the feedback, I appreciate it, and it makes me think about what I'm doing...and need to do.

learnin...

Know that if I sound devil advocatish...(I just made that word up) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ...it is to empower you to find strength and feel in control of you...

But do I want him home because he should feel guilty about these things?

These are really two seperate issues...and the answer is ofcourse no...but seperate the issues..

YOU should want your husband home because you are worthy of an honest loving relationship that needs worked on....guilt has nothing to with it...and you should not accept home on his guilt

He needs to feel what he needs to feel...his feelings of guilt are not of your concern....especially if they stem from the reality and path he is chosen...

But he obviously isn't guilty enough. While it is not your role to attempt to shove guilt down his throat...it also definately not your role to protect him from guilt of his doing...do not take on the role of protector from himself...

learnin Plan a should empower you to be searching within to find what is tolerable in all aspects of your life and what is intolerable...and i am not here to judge your decision to let him stay...but more to say...think long and hard about what message you are sending...think long and hard about what message you would like to send...and make sure that you get your message...

what about you moving with him??
closer to union jobs....

heck i can do a 180 with ya...and support you even attempting some intimacy while he is home AS LONG AS ...it is clear in your head...that you realize the best outcome and the worst...

Don't take on the role though of protecting him from him
Don't take on fault and blame if his decisions cause him guilt
Don't sell yourself short....to protect him...

learnin it is ALLLLL about YOU....you you you you...
not your old hooked on days of our lives apartmentliving ducking guilt whoosywhatsit ol man.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

you could always accidently drop an egg on his head this weekend ..one that isn't hard boiled yet......

ARK

Thanks Ark,
For making me think and to Laugh!

I am concerned about his guilt and here's why:
I feel strongly that part of the reason he can't turn back on this process is because he feels that it has gone too far, sees no hope of reconciliation in the face of what he's done, and is trying to justify this with the usual fog type blame, anger, etc. He even admitted at one time that he felt it had gone "too far". He also justifies it with the fact that because he has been gone so long, the kids won't be any worse off!!
But see, he doesn't know that it can work, with the right tools, MC, MB,etc.
So my goal right now is to show that we can be in each others company without the anger and hurt.
It works about 75% of the time. The visits are mostly good, easy, but then there is usually some exchange of garbage. But lately we have been able to back down from that and salvage the rest of the visit.
I'm pretty sure that he knows where I stand now. I still love him, I don't want a D, I know we could work this out, we had a strong relationship for a long time.
The time is approaching for the tough love message and I'm probably avoiding it somewhat.
This is the not quite Plan B, but definately smacks him upside the head with, this is what you asked for Mr! Too bad! I'm just not ready yet for the resulting anger and I need to be ready before I take that stand.
(I've suggested moving but doesn't seem a viable option, work(construction) in one area doesn't last. He just needs to come home, stay home and find work however he can) Now that kids are getting older and I can work full time, we could make it work.
I feel like my thought process on this post is all over the place.
I do consider attempting intimacy, but need to be ready for the rejection. I tried it once before and was rejected and it was tough even though I thought I had prepared myself for that.
He was affectionate & intimate at one point until my big idea to expose this tidbit to OW in a letter backfired on me. Oh well. I don't regret doing it.
I'm going to stop here, I think I'm just too tired to think straight tonight. I thought I had a point to make at the start of this post and somehow ended up just babbling.
Later.