Ya got it girls!!!

I am so fortunate, I have my very own KISA (single) recipient living right next door.

AND she's sooooo cute, runs around the yard, no fences, ya see, right next door, in her bikini top and daisy dukes with her cheeks hanging out.

Mind you, won't come over to chit chat with me, no, BUT let husband be outside working and guess what?

Ya got it, she's over there with her little boobs flopping around being miss princess of whoreville (had numerous affairs that led to marriage downfall- really, I am shocked <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> )

I made the mistake of telling H I wished she would put some clothes on instead of running around half naked- it's disrespectful and what is she wanting- attention- hmmmmmm from whom?

Yeah right, I know good and well from whom.

But, dare me say anything bad about her,

His response:
She's the best renter we have had pays on time
What, don't you trust me? Our marriage isn't going to work until you start to trust me.
etc etc etc etc etc

No, if I knew how to make these men understand how frustrating and disrespectful their actions are to their spouses I would not have to work, I could stay at home and sell "How to mold the perfect man out of a pile of ****) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

He actually told me that what she was wearing was not inappropriate, that most people at the beach wore less. hmmmmmm guess I didn't notice the water her in this old desert <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

K9Love,
You are probably going to think I’m nuts here but I’m sharing with you the attitudes and solutions that helped me turn around the KISA problem with my husband. He is now my very own KISA and knows darn well that being a KISA for anyone else is totally unacceptable.

Seems you have two problems a KISA and the bimbo next door. They can be handled separately.

First the KISA issue.

Women have a very bad habit of going on and on about how stupid/silly/etc (put any word you want in here) men are. We can see it a mile away. Well, with that attitude it’s a no wonder guys end up being KISA’s for everyone but us. It’s important to back up and look at a man’s behavior. Men do not express their needs/feelings in words. They do it through their actions. “Listen” to his actions he is saying something loud and clear.

Let’s do a little bit of MB’ing here on this subject.

This thread establishes that many men are KISA’s and that by doing this they are taking a lot away from their family and spouse. Anyone who is a KISA, to the extent that it interferes with their marriage and family life, is screaming with unmet emotional needs.

We all know that a person who has unmet emotional needs is vulnerable for an affair. The more their EN’s are unmet, the more vulnerable they are. Some of these people will not protect their vulnerability and have an affair. IMHO a KISA is a person who is doing something similar. They are seeking to get their EN’s met outside of the marriage. They do good things, the women fawn all over them, adore them, thinking they are wonderful. In the eyes of a KISA there is nothing wrong with this because look how good they are being. And if their spouse complains then it’s just proof that the spouse is selfish, self centered, yada yada yada.

One of the primary EN’s for a KISA is admiration. If you want your H to stop the KISA behavior you are going to have to give him buckets of admiration, thank him for every little thing he does, tell him how smart he is, etc. Men like talking about them selves, but even with that they’d prefer to have someone admire them.

What ever you do, do not put down any woman that he is being a KISA for. The KISA and the Damsil have an unspoken agreement. The Damsil will see the KISA as her hero and fawn all over him as long as he does things for her. The KISA will see the Damsil and a lady in need of being saved as long as she fawns all over him and build up his ego.

When I realized all of this about my H I decided that he should be my KISA.

I ask his opinion on this then I use it. It does not work if you ask his opinion and than do your own thing.
I thank him for the things he does.
I tell him the things about him that I admire and love.
Sometimes I act helpless and ask him to do this or that because he’s so much better at it then I am.
I brag about him every chance I get.

If you cannot honestly fawn over your husband and tell him that he is wonderful, that you admire him, etc. etc. then there is a sever problem in your marriage and it is not with your husband. And the good thing is that it is sincere. I adore my husband.

Telling your husband that you do not like his KISA attitude will get you nowhere until he is your KISA, until you have become the major source of his admiration and ego stroking. Until then you’re just his wife trying to take the fun out of his life.

Now about the neighbor Bimbo. I get the impression that your husband is having a grand old time needling you with her. That is not to say that things are not inappropriate. She is way out of line as is your husband. One way to handle it is the same way continued contact with an OW is handled in Plan A. Simply tell your husband that his attention to her hurts you every time you see him doing it. But do this in a very low key manner.. with no love busters.

The book “Getting through to the man you love” would really help you learn a better way to communicate with him. Speaking just is not working.. it usually does not with men. Actions speak the loudest.

I also think that you’d benefit from the 180. What you have been doing is not working, so do something else. You may find Carol’s thread about the 180 very useful.. I have a link to it in my signature block.

Your husband is paying too much attention to others and ignoring you. This means that he is very comfortable that he knows exactly how you are going to react to his every move. Become unpredictable. (One thought that comes to mind is that if he likes the scantly clothed look you could start hanging out in your yard the same way. Lol I know, I know you don’t want to do that. But how long do you think it would take him to tell you to put some cloths on? )

I got this off. I hope this helps. DivorceBusting’s suggested 180.
1. Do not pursue, reason, chase, beg, plead or implore!
2. No frequent phone calls
3. Do not point out good points in marriage
4. Do not follow him around the house
5. Do not encourage talk about the future
6. Do not ask for help from family members
7. Do not ask for reassurances
8. Do not buy gifts
9. Do not schedule dates together
10. Do not spy on spouse
11. Do not say "I Love You"
12. Act as if you are moving on with your life
13. Be cheerful, strong, outgoing and attractive
14. Don't sit around waiting on your spouse - get busy, do things, go to church, go out with friends, etc.
15. When home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation) be scarce or short on words
16. If you are in the habit of asking your spouse his whereabouts, ASK NOTHING
17. You need to make your partner think that you have had an awakening and, as far as you are concerned, you are going to move on with your life, with or without your spouse
18. Do not be nasty, angry or even cold - just pull back and wait to see if spouse notices and, more important, realize what he will be missing
19. No matter what you are feeling TODAY, only show your spouse happiness and contentment. Show him someone he would want to be around.
20. All questions about marriage should be put on hold, until your spouse wants to talk about it (which may be a while)
21. Never lose your cool
22. Don't be overly enthusiastic
23. Do not argue about how he feels (it only makes their feelings stronger)
24. Be patient
25. Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you
26. Learn to back off, shut up and walk away when you want to speak out
27. Take care of yourself (exercise, sleep, laugh & focus on all the other parts of your life that are not in turmoil)
28. Be strong and confident and learn to speak softly
29. Know that if you can do 180, your smallest CONSISTENT actions will be noticed much more than any words you can say or write
30. Do not be openly desperate or needy even when you are hurting more than ever and are desperate and needy
31. Do not focus on yourself when communicating with your spouse
32. Do not believe any of what you hear and less than 50% of what you see. Your spouse will speak in absolute negatives because he is hurting and scared
33. Do not give up no matter how dark it is or how bad you feel
34. Do not backslide from your hard-earned changes.

Wow Zorweb, that is an AMAZINGLY informative post. I wish I could've read it four or five years ago when my H first started dragging other women into the picture so he could feel like a KISA when I had started to take him for granted.

Now I wonder why it seems that none of our moms ever took the time to tell us to treat our H's as KISAs?

That's a keeper zorweb, a "print and save" type of post.

MERCI BEAUCOUP!

Jen

<small>[ May 05, 2003, 08:37 PM: Message edited by: Jen Brown ]</small>

Jen,

welcome..

The reason our moms never told us to threat our H’s as a KISA is because they did not know either. Both of my parents took each other for granted. Unfortunately no one teaches us how to be a spouse. There are not classes give…. Not Marriage101 much less Marriage 509. So the only examples we have are our parents. They our parents only had their parents, and so forth.

I see MB as the education I was never given.. and then I only stumbled on it in my darkest hour. It gave me a totally different outlook on marriage.. let’s face it, it saved my married.

The Divorce Buster books I talk about just rounded out the education.

<small>[ May 05, 2003, 10:07 PM: Message edited by: zorweb ]</small>

I hate to break up the "husbands-only" damsels in distress party, but my W can only be called a "savior of men in distress" if you consider she's letting our M end because she is determined to maintain a relationship with a man in prison who needs her help... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Sorry to make it into a male-bashing thread. It absolutely is possible for women to fall into that pattern too. I am so sorry that your wife just isn't willing to stop rescuing so she can devote herself to you and your M. She doesn't seem to know what she's leaving behind.

Jen

PS: zorweb - didn't your reply say "bienvenue" before? es-tu franco-canadienne peut-etre?

Oui, j'ai dit la bienvenue. Mais je ne suis pas Canadien français.

Sono americana-italiana vivendo negli Stati Uniti. Vivo nello stato di Nuovo Messico per essere esatto.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Sono americana-italiana vivendo negli Stati Uniti. Vivo nello stato di Nuovo Messico per essere esatto. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hmmm, ca veut dire: You are Italian-American living in the United States, in the state of New Mexico to be exact?

(How'd I do? lol)

Jen

Ai fatto molto bene. (You did very well.) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Bonsoir, goodnight, "buona notte!"

Jen

Well Well,

I was just about to post an hour ago... stopped and decided not to. I changed my mind.

Thank you VERY much Zorweb for examining why us men are so 'messed up'. Honestly. Better route than the post started going. Lets solve the issues with MB principals, instead of bashing the KISA married males.

Yes I like action, but I VERY much like communication.
I like to be told thank you for the little things that I have done right.

a kiss on the cheek,
a hug, a card,
a flower,
a snuggle on the couch in front of the fire;
a beer as I cut the overgrowth of a lawn out front because I've been working for 2 weeks straight without a day off to feed and shelter the family I seeded from my loins, and now I'm mowing the darn grass while all the KISA and their princesses are sitting in front of the tube watching reruns of 'Leave it to Beaver', dreaming of the reality of what a relationship is not.

Your right Zor.. Don't ask your KISA for his advice and then totally ignore any and everything he said and shoot the other way.

NOT all of us are the dumbarse KISA some of you described either.

I think I'm angry from the post and I can't even put it into words at this point in time. Am I angry or just a little offended? Not sure. Its not me your describing.. but is it man bashing?

What are you blaming the men/husbands for again?

Do women want us to pull over in the middle of no where, in the dark, rain, and help that woman change her flat tire, because she looks 8 months pregnant? Then a week, month, year later, your going to get mad when we help someone whose in a more 'attractive' state, in the same situation? Why because we choose to on our own?

What do you want 'us' men to do? Help only the old, disabled, visually challanged women, or help all of them, or help none at all?

Where is the median? Its between the medalors and the maidens?

Tell us where to begin and end.

Maybe one of you should have married a wife? That wasn't fair!

There are plenty of us men who ARE in your shoes...or maybe you are in our shoes. If betting is allowed, us men have a harder time doing the single parenting thing, then you women do. AND its not because of the mothering nature BS that your going to quantify it as. I know LOTS of messed up women with children. You think my boss understands what its like to be a man raising 2 boys? GD, I couldn't get on WIC because I was the father of a 3 year old. A male.

I get ALOT of respect for what I'm doing, all by myself. I don't need a woman to clean my house, buy my groceries, wash and fold my clothes. I do it all by myself with my WS's and my boys, but I'm not about to classify 'women' as being all f'ed up because I'm doing this alone and hurting because of it.

Women flirt equally as bad as men do when it comes to comparison. Your NOT angels either. Maybe my pent up frustrations are with the W and none of you... but please stop bashing 'men' in general.

Wow.. should I leave this as is.. or delete this now by taking direction because I'm just a lowly f'ed up male?

Sorry, I'm just being a sensitive male tonight.

<small>[ May 06, 2003, 02:22 AM: Message edited by: Husband2you ]</small>

Alot of men are afraid to speak out because we do get henpecked by every little thing, over and over again. We can try so hard and everything we do gets criticized inside and out. I see alot of men verbally abused about the littlest things... not trying to nullify the fact that domestic violence is horrible, but there ARE two demons and they are male AND female.

Sorry for speaking already to much.

<small>[ May 06, 2003, 12:21 AM: Message edited by: Husband2you ]</small>

Yep, you speak wise words of wisdom (and that even includes the Italian speaking French- New Mexican).

Okay, lots or praise and honey you are soooooo wonderfuls

What if they aren't?

What if they aren't meeting any of your needs?

Hows this?

1) Oh honey, I noticed that you left the dishes on the counter all day and didn't bother to wash them, thanks a bunch pumpkin. And the laundry- so sweet of you not to have done any of it for the past 6 months or so, I really appreciate you thinking of me, ya know, not wanting to shrink my undies and all <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

or
2) How nice of you to fix the neighbors watering system so she doesn't have to walk around the yard nearly naked to do it, now she can step outside and wala has water going everywhere.

- note that the old wife has to walk around and move hoses and sprinklers, not that it matters, darling I am so proud of you thinking of her.

or
3) You want me to take on additional responsibilities while I am trying to go back to college, cause you are such a good guy and never told me I couldn't go, darn, what a genuine sweetheart, you bet, I am superwoman, I don't need help, I can do it all for you Mr. sweetlips cause you are my hero <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Okay, lots of sarcasm here and I know it- remember, this is the man who told me the chain saw was in the garage. Ya know, the one who tells me I can dig a ditch to cover a pipe that runs across where I have to drive. Ya know, the one who has to run to neighbors rescue when she's trying to move dirt that is just too heavy.

Sorry, not a good night, real angry- good thing for this forum I think these would be real LBers for the good old marriage <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

K9L,

I'm not trying to be sarcastic, nor am I trying to be condescending, argumentative or shallow.

My needs aren't being met AT ALL, either. None of them as a matter of fact, by my WS. I'm not saying to not come here to MB and talk your emotions out, so as to not LB at home where it counts and causes damage. We should come here and talk about it to get it out.

It just seamed that the context of the topic went quickly to KISA and how wrong we (men) are for being that way.

I guess I'm merely trying to say that us guys put up with alot of the same EN issues that you women put up with. But when we speak of our 'en issues' and nearly all of the time you see us speaking up about SF, we are pretty serious about it. The 'small' stuff most of us men leave out and deal with on a lower level. But those 'small' things GREATLY influence the chain to SF and then unfulfilling the EN of our spouses. Love is NOT suppose to be conditional, but tell that to a man whose, hungry, horny and tired. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Yes he told you that the chainsaw was in the garage. I almost can hear some of you ladies telling your husband where the needle and thread is at also. But heaven forbid that he didn't know where it was at to begin with. How little of him for not knowing where the dishsoap is. Why is it too masculine for a female to pick up a chainsaw, but an equal task for the man/husband to wash the dishes. That may not have been your point, but that's how I'm reading it. How dare he tell me the chainsaw is in the garage.

I didn't miss the point that he was willing to help out the female across the street. He does need to take care of things there at home first. Thats a given. There are obviously reasons why he's 'running' across the street. Be it to ogle, help the female or escape the stresses of ya'll's home. Maybe he needs to feel wanted without demands, rewarded with a smile, not to feel henpecked. I know its all BS. No you shouldn't smile at him and wink as you pick his socks up off the floor. And no you shouldn't have to do it in lingerie or daisy dukes either. He should take the responsibility to help around the house. BUT when he helps around the house and then helps across the street, where is his need for admiration being fulfilled?

Men tend, I believe, in the beginning of marriage and homeownership that the home is a place to come home to rest. A women who stays at home has a duel roll of maintaining more than her fair share, and trying to find rest in the same way her husband does when he comes home from work. A refuge of sorts. His venturing out across the street maybe as simple as avoiding working in the castle. Years into marriage, husbands find that fairytale to be not the case. Denial sets in and he realizes that his castle is also work. He doesn't have a place to rest or work in peace in reality. The wife on the other hand has known this all along. The lady across the street isn't going to have him transplant the same rosebush in 3 different corners of the yard 3 different times this year. His wife is. The decision making process seems to be removed from the male when he gets home. His day at work is structured, by his means; and when he gets home, his boss at home wants things done her way. Territorial speaking, love is conditional. Out of his element at home, alot of times, I believe the male feels like an outsider.

The last thing I wanted to do when I got home at 8pm everynight was stay up to 11pm moving furniture around the house that I moved around the house four days before. Bordom lead to changes in my house. I can't tell you the number of colors of paint we had on our living room wall in a 2 and a half year period. Indecisiveness goes against the admiration that we received the first time for painting the living room. You wanted it pink, now you want it blue?!?!?! After I did it exactly like you wanted it the first time?

That is hard for a man to accept. His work was finished, at least mine was, the first time it was painted. Why should I paint something 3 or four times because my W can't make her mind up on a color.

Its almost as if your saying how dare him tell me where the chainsaw is when he leaves his socks all over the house.

He nearly could make the same rationalization and say something like (I'm speculating here) how dare she tell me where the dishsoap is for those dishes that I ate off of, when she's the one who wants that tree cut down in the back yard.

Couples get into this tug of war over power and things in the domicile. For example, women ALWAYS complain of men that the seat is always in the up position on the toilet when we finish. Males could equally complain that women never 'ensure' that what they drop in the toilet during that time of month, is floating there for us to 'see' when we have the seat up. Have any of you ever thought about flushing ... men could say. We each have our complaints regarding the domicle and the actions involved around it.

Women park the car in the garage and expect it to work each day it they get in it to drive it. And I guess its fair to say that men expect to go to the cabinet and get clean dishes out of the cabinet. Should men was dishes? Yep and we should cook dinner, too. Should men learn how to read recipes, make a pie, and prepare a meal from scratch, other than BBQ? Yep. Alot of women won't let their husbands touch the appliances in the kitchen. Women are afraid of and continually say over and over, don't let my husband wash my clothes, he'll shrink my good blouse. If we can't do one thing right in the house, then why bother to begin with, he begins to think. How many shirts, pants and suits has the wife ruined in the last year? And he tosses one red sock in with your whites and he's not allowed to touch your attire EVER again? If he's made to feel inadequate, he'll go else where to feel adequate.

So men come home and see dirty dishes from time to time and women drive cars around that don't have the oil changed in them for months. Neither is right or fair.

What you don't see is a number of posts by us MB males regarding the WW/BW (females) from the perspective of light that is being shed on the WH's/BH's (males).

How many of us males could easily post topics about how irresponsible females in general are. Granted there are more females here than males and the consumption of placing blame is not going to happen from the male point in view here. We are already, as I have always felt, outcasts because we are men. I feel when I read these type of posts like I'm not worthy to be here. I feel not only like dirt because my wife left me, but because being a man is such a BAD thing. So I'm only going to say, its always going to be hard for you to get a 'male' perspective of why your husband is behaving in the manner he is if the 'post' resorts to male bashing of sorts.

I don't know if I've even made any valid points here, and I'm going to probably get flamed and attacked.

I don't necessarily accept the 'views presented' in my post, but I'm capable of evaulating what I've read prior to posting from other men and heard from other males to speak incontext partly for some of them.

I'm not trying to be right here... I'm trying to protect some if not all of the males feelings before we get hurt. AND if any of us males here post anything that is disrespectful or hurtful out of us males validly complaining, about any female, whether she be our spouse or otherwise, I hope that one of you will respectfully bring it to the male posters attention.

Thanks

<small>[ May 06, 2003, 02:14 AM: Message edited by: Husband2you ]</small>

You made your point.

And beings everyone has a right to their own thoughts, feelings, and opinions, I shall respect your position.

But, at the same time this post was not intended to harm "men" in general.

Sounds to me like you have many issues of your own and this particular subject was one in which you could relate. Good, I hope it helped for you to get it out.

To say that any of us were bashing in general, No. I am speaking of only one person, and it just so happens that he was born of the male gender. The rest of the posters were doing the same. Did you hear any of us say, "Oh yeah, and my brother, boss, uncle, son etc etc does etc. etc. etc.?

No, we are speaking of the experiences and the problems that KISA causes in our marriages.

Now that I have given you the opportunity to have your "say" I feel it is only fair I have mine.

I am not married to someone as yourself. I am not married to a man who "wants, or even desires to do ANYTHING even remotely "domestic".

Just as you feel slighted personally, so do I. I have a husband who works at a job half as many hours as I do. I am going back to college, I run the entire house, bills, shopping, laundry etc etc etc.

I have a totally different situation from your own. I am tired of being the "last" person on his list to "help".

Now, I am going to have to take offense at you over this chain saw business.

I mow the lawn more often than my husband, I haul wheelbarrows of dirt, I help with replumbing. I can tape and bed sheetwork. I can paint, I know how to change my own tire, I can fix a toilet that runs over. I even know how to take a toilet off its base secure the wax ring and tighen the bolts to reattach it. Sit in front of the TV watching Leave it to Beaver, I think not.

My point is this, I do whatever is needed to help my husband. He expects it of me. If that is so what makes KISA recipients any more important.

Good point about who and when it is appropriate for our husbands to help out. I have to agree with you on this one. You are correct, some bother me more than others. But, when I have seen a pattern over the years, single attractive women, needing assistance. Well, if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck so be it.

Thanks for your input, and thanks to all the posters who responded.

You see, we all have a right to feel as we do. Our intent was not to offend someone, but rather gain insight on how others have coped with this problem.

Husband2you, I was interested in what you said. Your concerns are valid. This is not fair to make general statements about any group of people. What you said about a wife who doesn't make the home a relaxed place and when the husband comes home, he may still feel stressed like it was just another myriad of work. Where is the reward in living that kind of life. That is when some intervention is needed to begin. Because, if you go over to the neighbor's to escape, that IS what you are doing. They have the same challenges you do. But you are company. So, you get treated more special. Someone once said, "you should always treat your spouse as if they were a guest in your life"

Would that be healthy?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Our intent was not to offend someone, but rather gain insight on how others have coped with this problem. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I for one realize that my H would likely not have sought out and helped out other women if I hadn't taken him for granted. I wish I had shown him more appreciation, and made him feel like I valued all that he did for me. My H is not a "dumbarse KISA" by any means, he's someone who put in more than his fair share around the house, that I didn't show as much appreciation for as I should have. So I found him reaching out progressively more to help young, single females with a variety of things that typically their boyfriends (if they had one) should have done for them. It's not right that I didn't show my H appreciation. However, it's ALSO not right that when I a) try to show more appreciation and do more around the house and b) make it clear to him how upsetting it is for me to see him rescuing these damsels in distress that he brushes me off and tells me to stop freaking out, and continues to give them all so much of his attention.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">If he's [or she's] made to feel inadequate, he'll [or she'll] go else where to feel adequate. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Therein lies the reason why some people go and choose to have affairs. I tell you I felt like an inadequate wife. I was told over and over how inadequate I was. OM never told me I was inadequate. He emphasized what a wondeful woman he thought I was. Then fog-blinded Jen made a horrible decision to have an A with OM.

I think this is a worthwhile thread. It can be either a man or a woman who's needs aren't being met at home who seeks the attention of someone other than their spouse. It is something both my H and I are guilty of. He had a string of single young females in his life, that he never fooled around with. I had an OM in my life that I stupidly had an A with. Neither was an acceptable way to fix the fact that our EN's weren't being met. Mine of course was a far graver method to having my needs met, and now leaves me without several of my needs being met because I am alone. I've paid the price.

What's interesting though, when you think about it, is this thread is just focussing on how if some important emotional needs (appreciation and admiration) are not being met (or in other words if you are taking them and what they do for you for granted) and the spouse goes to have them met by someone else that the other spouse will naturally be upset. I think this is it in a nutshell.

Just my take,

Jen

<small>[ May 06, 2003, 07:48 AM: Message edited by: Jen Brown ]</small>

POJA wflower

If KISA is a syndrome then it is most likely a symptom of a variety of ills, a sore throat can be a mild virus, or it could be a raging strep infection that can become systemic and kill you. The seriousness of KISA depends on the root issue. For some, simple awareness is all that is needed, for others KISA may be predatory sexual behaviour. This thread offered a sympton that needs to be addressed, and a variety of "causes". One thing I thought of about the castle thing, and wanting to come home to relax....raising the issue of where does the homepartner get surcease. If possible I think it is a good idea for a homepartner to have a specific place that is all theirs in the home (or on the property)...where they can go and be "out of the castle"....and a set time to do so (acknowledged by the family). A room for their stuff, their hobby, whatever. Make a place in bsmt, or garage, or a spare room, or a shed, attic room, etc. Another solution is a regular outside activity, gym, hobby, etc.

I do agree too that nagging (educateing) is not productive, it sets up a conflict cycle. I think altering your behaviour will be the best way to alter a spouses behaviour. I agree with much of what zorweb said. As for you K9, (without commenting on your actually relationship with H, and whether you are willing to get rough with him), I felt in agreement with your notion of having males over to "help" you, and your helping males in distress....and maybe even (if you can pull it off) running about skimpy in public. In my opinion, you will get your H attention in one heck of a hurry...THEN you can edcucate him, and work on mutually acceptable changes. Right now it feels like a power struggle, not a KISA issue...and it feels like you are not well connected to H, so potentially risk the marriage if you play hardball, just my 2 cents.

JMVHO, THIS KISA syndrome is just another catagory like ,,,,, conflict avoider, cake eater, ect. IT is not a male bashing issue at all I am sure like SPACEASE pointed out women can get it to . IT just so happened that when the thread started it was one persons experence and ended up having common ground with other "women " on this board .

NOW with that being JMO , I to have one of those KISA . OW being damsial in destress and I think it is a pity that any "persons" EN need to be meet by sacrifising our own independence .

I mean if OUR S wanted a women / man who was a HELPLESS B!tch then they should have M one .

What about our ADMIRATION pat me on back for being able to do all and help take the stress off
his back when he is working so he don't have to come home and do to much .

You would think they would see it as a plus, not that there not needed but they have some one who loves and respects them enough to help them with the day to day things so they won't be so over whelmed .

I thought it was a good thing I was doing not being a needy "I don't want to breack my nail" type of women . One who can cook , clean , drive kids here and there and still manage to pay the bills and paint the house and give him a hand building a bathroom .

I had no idea all I had to do was sit around and cry about how broke I am and how I need this and that and he would jump to do it . IT seems to work for OW , cry the hard life , life isn't fare to me I need a car, I need money ,I am a single mom I need some one to take care of me . ECT.

$hit I wish I could have figured out years ago that he wanted some BIMBO who does nothing but pity herself , I could have done that and probbly had a better time then breakin my a$$ to be SUPERWOMEN .