Hello there Everybody;
So to make long story short we are from South Asian Background; We are living as a joint family with my parents and bother family;
We had been living in this city for 9 years but only started our acquaintance 3 years ago with this third party guy; when we met his family and started to share our experiences with them; We were sharing Christmas, barbecue and vacation time together with his family;

Fast forward until 12 months ago when I was observing him calling my wife all the time and they are constantly messaging each other; So, I put my foot down as I was getting a gut feeling that something was wrong and I was being played;

Third party does not have to take care of his two daughters until they are 11 the condition he made with his wife; he is detached from his wife emotionally; She only wants him for money and social status and has no emotional connection with him.

She makes a remark that I was not a good husband and she needed him for emotional support when I confronted her about him and why she is abandoning all her friends and cousins and why are we exclusively going to this family alone for activities and celebration. I was going to all the meetings and conversations we were having together in his Minivan up to this moment, but after they start to abandon me and my wife would go meet him alone in the minivan; she denied meeting him even when I used GPS locator to place our car at our old meeting location where we used to meet him.

So I have ended my wife's three years affair which happened three months ago; this was very nasty end as she was going back to him even after No contact rule was established; her reasoning was that because I was contacting his wife and her old friend regarding the affair and she needed him again for support because I was abusing her emotionally according to her; She says that he is her best friend and I am seeing and assuming things that are not there.

I put VAR in our car and recorded their conversation where my wife is becoming way too much affectionate toward him; I opened up their recording in front of his wife and Mom; my wife says that she really hates me for this decision; she asks why I did not tell her and they would have stopped communication if I had confronted her alone; She says this was a close family relation and I have made a big mistake abandoning a good friend who was there in need for us.

Two Years ago I was in a lot of pain and suffering just like her because my brothers wife got pregnant and I was having a low sperm count and we were living together with them as a joint family; I was visiting the clinic and specialist to resolve the issue; Yet, she remember nothing; she says that I was not there for her.

Another concept she throws at me is that she wasted 10 years of life in this marriage, and she taught me what she need in a relationship and I neglected her; She talks about other cousins who are more passionate and intimate toward their spouses and I was not able to provide that thing for her.

She says that I was not ready for marriage as I was busy playing games and using computer and I did not know what it takes to be husband;

I am just trying to realize how someone can flip a switch on some one and completely turn them off from their life; its as if I was her enemy and abuser; somehow I was forcing and controlling her by asking her to stop contact with the third party.

How can I continue to belief and faith in this life when my partner who I though I knew and put all my faith in turned against me; I just do not know what I did wrong to be the villain in all this scenario?

When we met this third party it was both families trying to improve our marriages; Yet, somewhere along the lines it became about my wife and his special connection that was bigger than our marriage. Somehow his wife abused him emotionally and my wife was abused by me; My Regret in all this is the fact that Why we could not simply work in transparency and with honesty?

I would be proud to take steps to improve our marriage and I would encourage him to do same with his wife; But there has to be intent and complete dedication for that action to come about.

I am working full time job; and I do take care of the baby whenever I am home and do all the house chores like cleaning dishes or buying grocery; Yet, somehow it is not enough and my wife always keeps mentioning that I am neglectful and not paying attention; She constantly keep mentioning that I am a selfish person who uses others for his own gain.

She also says that I have no social skills and she is the one introducing us to her work colleagues and cousins to do all the activities;

What do you guys propose to resolve for marriage recovery as my wife is still in denial regarding the affair and says that you have destroyed a very good friendship; she says they were only talking about baby and she was not having an affair; Somehow even with all the cues pointing toward Emotional attachment she denies everything and says I am at fault for making this big mistake out of my fear and insecurity.

I really love my wife and wants to find a better place for our marriage; So, I need your feedback regarding my situation and what is the best thing I can to for marriage recovery.

Welcome to MB.

Are you still in contact with this other couple?

What was on the recording that you heard? Did his mom agree with you that it was an affair? What did the OM’s (other man) wife say when she heard the recording?

Have you read Basic Concepts

Hey there;
So far I have gone to Marriage councilor; Read over almost all the books from great author including Dr. Harley, Shirley Glass and John Gottman regarding the Infidelity and emotional affairs.

So in all I understand what happened and how I can move forward; Only issue so far is that my wife does not accept her role in all this mess; for her I neglected her emotional needs which he was able to meet and provide and this does not make it an affair according to her.

Her biggest complaint has been my nagging mother who stays with us and takes care of our Baby as we are from South Asian Background so we live as a joint family with my Parents and my brother family; in all my wife gets triggered any time some one makes a negative remark as she is perfectionist and does not take people words lightly.

In all my wife has a very good heart and tender soul and she has very good social skills and gets along with all of my family very well.

Biggest complaint from her is that I do not satisfy her emotional needs and I am very judgmental and always gets into problem solving mode whenever she needs me to listen to her; so she has shut down around me over time and I am trying to make her open up once again to rekindle our relationship and connection.

It seems she is distant from most of her family and friends and opens up very little about her stress and day to day hardships; She did all this with the Third party who became a great friend according to her; Yet, over time he took over my responsibility as he was always talking to her over the phone and meetings and she had very little to say when around me.

Over time she would use Gas lighting and Narssistyic tactic to prove that I was no a good husband and did not meet her needs; Somewhere along the line I did not matter anymore even if I took care of the Baby and completed all the household chores like cleaning and buying Grocery; It Seems, she is exhausted from working 11 hour shifts and becomes very negative and triggered as she is not able to relax at home when she comes over; Yet, I comfort her and tell her that I will do the tasks to make her life more comfortable.

So; How do I turn hate to love? what would work to make her recognize my contribution and effort?

Just to make sure i understand the situation, your mother and your brothers family all live with you? You then said: "Her biggest complaint has been my nagging mother who stays with us.."

What is being done to address this complaint?

You also mention that she is working 11 hour shifts and is exhausted. That just sounds like a horrible lifestyle that can't possibly sustain a romantic marriage.

"Biggest complaint from her is that I do not satisfy her emotional needs"

What are her top emotional needs? Do you know? You talk about doing chores, but that does nothing to create a romantic marriage.


It looks like you are all over the place and are only spinning your wheels. Marriage Builders is completely different from any of those marriage resources [which we don't consider successful] in that it serves to create romantic love by eliminating the bad marriage habits that cause couples to fall out of love.

In addition to MelodyLane’s questions, could you please answer these?

Hello guys;
The cusp for all that happened was my baby as she said she became desperate to have a baby after my younger brother wife became pregnant three years ago and we live in the same household.

At that time she decided to use my cousin as a Sperm donor according to her because of my low sperm count; II was unaware of this decision as she said I would not approve of this decision and was afraid that I would judge her after the fact. After that we had lots of activity with this cousins family like going to Christmas, vacations and family gatherings with this cousin family.

She started becoming more and more closer to him during 1 year maternity leave, he would call her and they would talk even late in night; At that time I was unaware of all this emotional mambo jumbo so I did not protest thinking it’s just a family member so what’s the harm in talking to him.

He became the focal point of our life and my wife would make my son call him Pappa while I was called daddy; she said this was her personal decision as he
Loved our son very much.

She starts getting distant from me last year and always day dreaming about the cousin and saying all the great things about him while putting me down; and cousins family still does not know about Sperm donation either.

Thing that still bothers me is was it really Sperm donation if there is no paper trail and only sperm donation form she showed me was on her phone, which she provided 1 week after I ask for it after I got confirmation from my Paternity test I did because I had a doubt in my mind that I was being played.

What would you guys advice in this regard; I want to recouncile and work on marriage recovery, yet still I have some doubts about what really happened.

Could you please clarify for us: Is the "third party" that you wrote about in your first post ...the sperm donor cousin you have just written about here, or are we now talking about two affairs?

You mentioned a paternity test: was this carried out under scientific conditions, and did it show you to be the father of the child? Alternatively, did your wife collect the samples and tell you the result?

THE third party is the cousin; in August I last year I setup no contact policy with the cousin seeing my wife drifting over to him as he was asking her to give up other friends and cousins so he can spend more time with her, within 1 week they setup meeting with me again and assuring that there is nothing for me to fear and they are just friends.

He cuts most of the contact with me and mostly talks with me wife, I ask my wife to limit contact with him and tell her that this is affecting our marriage; she says that her connection to him has no affect on our relation.

There is a contact with his wife I made in January to find Out about her assesent on the situation; she says it’s just friendship and she knows there is attraction between them.

In February I setup no contact with cousin again as I see our connection deteriorating and my wife falling more into love fog with him.

She starts hitting me and her because I contacted his wife and was trying to stop her from meeting him; I install VAR at this time, in two week I get a confirmation of recontact with cousin and they were scouting new place to meet after work to avoid detection; she lies for two weeks about meeting him and says that I am insecure and delusional about things.

I put all the VAR recording in front of his mom and wife; This was very narrow recording as she would go to his minivan for other serious conversation regarding the baby according to my wife.

I go for paternity test after that and my wife confessed that she used him as a sperm donor as she finds out that I am doing the DNA test.

We have no contact policy in place with cousin; what would you guys recommend in this situation?

You didn't answer my question about being sure you are the father of the child.

Okay: She is having an affair with your cousin. She had sex with him in order to have a child. I don't know whether you know which one of you is the child's father.

There isn't a no-contact policy in place (as you wrote in another post). She has no intention of going NC with him. She is in love with him and believes him to be the child's father.

If you cannot get her to agree to NC, you cannot recover from the affair and rebuild the marriage. You need to do a proper exposure, ignoring her protests about only talking to him as a friend about the baby - this is an affair, and your VAR recordings and knowledge of the "sperm donor" situation are more than enough proof. You need to read the exposure guidelines that are contained in MelodyLane's signature - she wrote to you above. When that is done properly, and when you have also confronted OM and told him to stay away from your wife, you'll need to see what your wife's attitude is to moving far away where she cannot see OM.

Do you wish to recover your marriage even if the child isn't yours? If it isn't yours and you issue an ultimatum to your wife for her to end the affair and move away with you, she might make the decision to end the marriage and take her chances with OM. Be prepared for that possibility.

Please read Exposure 101

The child is not mine that is already confirmed with Patrnity test that I did; the twist she brought at that time was a Sperm donor theory where she became desperate for a baby and because i would not approve they went into secrecy to solve her problem.

In terms of exposure; that is already done with my family and her family just found out about it from anonymous source. Right now, her family is very tense about the situation; yet they have not asked anything to me about it as they are in India while we are in Canada.

Would you guys recvomend that I talk to her family or not about it?

I keep feeling like I need to confront the cousin should I?

After exposure with my brother, his wife and mom present with VAR recording i have not met him. As I already put no contact policy in front of them and his wife wants nothing to do with us moving forward.

My wife to this day insists that this was not an affair; and I made a biggest mistake of my life by listenning to wrong people from online forums, she said they would have limited contact moving forward if I did not involve other people in our business.

I simply want him done with our life; yet, my wife keeps insisting that we should acknowledge his family if we meet them at an event or family gathering.

What would you guys reccomend for family dynamics in this situation.

I don't really understand your question about family dynamics. Could you please rephrase?

Have you read the exposure thread that Brain Hurts posted to you? You should be able to find the answer to your question about talking to her family.

To clarify: your wife had an affair and a child with someone else, and she insists on keeping this man as "a friend". Have you any idea why she wants to remain married to you? Has it got anything to do with immigration status? If not that, is it a question of money? Do you provide well for her, while he stays with and provides for his wife?

To what other online forums have you posted?

The third party is married and has two daughters of his own; the twist in all this was about hiw my wife would leave with baby alone if i reveal this secret to iutsiders. She says his wife will throw him out if she finds out about the baby. She says that he did a great risk and we shpuld protect him in this instance and no one should know about the baby situation.

He own two houses and is working as manager; he is taking care of his parents and two siblings who are all living with him.

The third party used Plan A which you guys refer to get my wife attention as she will always return the favor ten fold the more favor he was doing by taking us to his christmas party, Bar bq and vacations the more indebted my wife felt toward him; my wife has negative image about my own family so she got attracted to what he had to offer like magnet, and he just kept taking her more and more away from me until i felt like living with stranger in my own house.

This all things are new to me and I find myself in big danger as I thought I would be safe getting involved with cousins.

Issue now is moving forward and what you guys reccomend is a good marriage recovery program.

Marriage Builders is a good recovery programme. It requires that the affair comes to a complete end with no contact between your wife and OM for life. Can you achieve that? Will your wife do whatever you suggest in order to ensure NC?

The thing is, I highly doubt that she will cut contact with this man. She is blackmailing you to keep the child's paternity a secret; what she is really doing is protecting herself and OM so that they can maintain their secret, romantic bubble, while you maintain your wife financially and take care of the baby when she's busy, and while his wife takes care of his daughters so that he does not have to break up his home. If people are married but want to be with other people, what a perfect set-up for them! That's what you're enabling.

It would be perfectly acceptable for you to raise the child as your own, telling nobody about its origins...except for the fact that your wife does not want to end the affair. Your marriage could work if OM knew nothing about the child, and if your wife was enthusiastic about ending the affair and never seeing him again. However, he DOES know about the child and they have been treating this as their private love world, to the exclusion of you, her husband. There is no hope for a marriage to survive if you have to treat OM as a privileged confident who has greater rights to your wife than you have yourself.

You have been asked several questions on this thread that you have never answered. In my last post I asked about your wife's immigration status or other motive for staying married to you. There have been other questions, too. Rather than answering them, you keep posting about your frustrations.

Our questions are important. If we don't understand the whole situation, we can't give you proper advice.

Hello there guys;
We have been married for 10 years and my wife is Canadian citizen just like me; in terms of staying married to me there immense pressure from community as we come from south Asian background where there is great shame attached to infedility.

I was talking to marriage councillor and they said that my wife is under my cousins control and he has narssistic personality; She is threatening to walk out with my son if I reveal this information to outsiders.

Biggest difficulty is letting the third party go; even after VAR recording was played and no contact was created she still wanted me to meet him; she says that no one has to know that we are meeting him and she will not make same mistake again. She says they did nothing wrong and she is not guilty of anything.

The fog is still alive and her biggest comeback is that we will not improve our connection even if we never talk to him but she will try harder if we get in contact with him; she says he has great wisdom and we should keep good terms with him.

She is flat-out telling you that she will only stay married to you if you allow her baby's father to stay at the centre of your marriage.

Are you going to comply with that?

Surely you can see that this does not make sense. If there is immense community pressure to stay married, then revealing the affair to the family would work in your favour. They will urge her to end the affair and keep her family together. That is exactly the pressure that you want from them.

As for her threat to walk out with the child: if you are going to give in to that threat, then there is nothing anyone can suggest that can help you end the affair and build a new marriage.

And I don't understand how she can be on the one hand staying with you because of immense community pressure and wanting to avoid shame, and at the same time being prepared to walk out on you at the first sign that you try to kill this affair.

The biggest issue is that she has fake personality on the outside and only third party was able to connect to her at such a deep emotional level; She is afraid of losing that connection and is trying to keep it alive.

This third party actually replaced her college friend of 5 years; that friend was single and just starting out in career; so her explanation to me is that the third party guy has more wisdom and maturity that comes with age and experience; the third party used to call daily in the evening and would simply keep looking at my wife from his video chat.

On one instance third party mentioned that only thing that matters to him is my wife; that was striking to me as I was rambling about learning new things and advancing myself.

The difficult thing for me is my wife temperament as she starts hurting herself and hitting me whenever I inquire on the matter and her safety keeps me boggle down as I do not wish for her to harm either one of us.

Well, you're not really addressing the points I am making or the questions I am asking.

If you are going to give up on your demands for her to end the affair because of her threats to leave with the child or her hitting you, I don't see what you can do. It sounds to me as if you want to put up with OM in your marriage, being called "Pappa" and being a father to the child that you want to bring up as yours, forever, just so that you don't lose your wife and the child.

It takes a big man to bring up another man's child as his own, and I admire you for wanting to do it. However, it seems that you are willing to also accept OM in your life. That is not marriage, and none of us here would support you on that.

You ramble on about her fake personality his narcissism, instead of accepting that this is an affair and working on the things you need to do to stop it. Her personality is no different from anyone who dealt with her loneliness by becoming vulnerable to another man - and that could be anyone of us. We are all capable of forming a "deep emotional" connection to someone who talks to us and flatters us.

And he is no more narcissitic than any other married man who spotted a vulnerable married woman and knew that he could move in on her. He is not special, or especially gifted, or especially evil. Your marriage counsellor is wasting your time by spouting this BS instead of getting you to focus on ending the affair.

Also, I hope there was not an earlier affair. Was your wife's college friend male, or female?

Well there has been no contact to the cousin so far from me and I do not wish for him to ever know my son; the difficult angle is my wife as she is not honest with what she is planning and handling this matter.

Previously they would wotk together to diffuse the situation by sharing critical information and weak point from me or his wife but now i am well equipped to handle their gas lighting and narssistic tendacies.

Their main target is to destroy my confidence and subdue for me to accept their request by making me feel guilty; even while we were doing activity my wife accused me of taking her while it was them who pushed me to say yes in the first place.

Third party has no role to play in our lives moving forward; yet, i need to prepare myself for any difgiculty my wife is bringing and to make her see that I am her husband and not him.

Yes, I understand this. I have already said - more than once - that your wife is in an active affair with him and is determined to stay in contact with him and let him play his role as father. I would go so far as to suggest she is staying with you for financial and practical support while waiting for OM to leave his wife. Her plan is that when he eventually leaves, she had he will form a family with the child, and you will be kicked to the kerb. You will be of no more use to her.

The question is, are you going to do all you can to put a stop to this, or are you going to roll over because she hits you and threatens to leave?

These two statements are contradictory.

My son was 8 month old when she made him call pappa, right now my son is 19 months old and he has not seen the cousin for the last six months.

My wife is using the technique of showing him pictures to make him remember; your feedback regardjng this would be welcome as they are using every manipulative technique to keep their connection going.

My wife even keeps telling me that my son is very smart and compassionate because he has cousins genes; she would use any chance to bring back cousin into the conversation even after I told her that we are done with him.

Do you guys have any suggestion to make her suggestion stop regarding the cousin; i have very bad triggers whenever i hear his name now and my wife would use this to create confrontation on many occasions.

We have told you what to do. Exposure the affair to her family and his wife. Convince his wife that this is an affair.

Canadien, I see you talking in circles and not listening to the advice. You need to expose the affair and put an end to it. Exposure is the greatest weapon against an affair. AS YOU CAN SEE, affairs thrive on secrecy. Exposing it to all will remove that aspect and help you recover your marriage. Once you expose the affair and kill it off, we can help you recover your marriage. Everyone should know about the affair and you should NEVER EVER attend any family event with this cousin. If everyone knows, they will stop inviting you to these events, which is a good thing.

But there is nothing that can be done to help you if you choose to be an ENABLER. You have become an accessory to the crime by helping them keep their secret. Don't be an enabler.

You have been given great advice, are you going to take it or are you going to waste time talking in circles?

The Affair is already exposed to his wife and my wife's family;

I exposed the affair to his wife in January; She was initially saying they were just friends but than she opened up details and said that she suspected them having something going on since two years ago when we went to Club there together and how they were looking at each other; The hard part from his wife is that she thinks Men are made to cheat and he was already talking to other women from his college days and was a womanizer; So, she said ask your wife to stop as she did not want to take any action. In a way you can say that she was enabling affair by not saying anything and simply living in her own world.

His wife did not want to PUT VAR in his car as she was afraid he would kick her off the house is he ever found out; So, then I had to take initiatives to put VAR in my Car; She was interested in money and status he was providing and wanted to keep this Hush hush and was not ready to take actions if required.

For the first two years they used me as a decoy and insurance and took me to their meetings in his Minivan; When his wife call they would pass the call to me and assure her that we are meeting in a group and its not only two of them; Later they used this technique even while I was not there and they would call me to lie that I was with them.

And I leaked the affair information to another important source from her family who has leaked the information to her parents two weeks ago; I am unsure of how and what I can talk to them while they are already devastated and talking to my wife about it; My wife's mom suspected something was up last year when we invited her to come over from India for Baby Shower event to stay with us as my wife was talking quiet a lot to this cousin and my wife forced me to say that I am aware of the phone calls to her mom.

My Brother, his wife and Mom attended the meeting where my Brother threatened to leak this information to our community if the contact was to reoccur; My brother and one of her old friend became my support system as I tried to do Paternity test.

Right Now, my wife is using certain dialogues to trigger my reaction; how would you guys handle this queries?

1) I have wasted 10 years of my life married to you.

2) I teach you how to be affectionate and you learn nothing from me; you are incompetent and all my cousins are so much intimate and affectionate toward their spouses; you have failed as a husband.

3) You were not ready for a marriage, and you do not know what it takes to take care of the spouse.

4) You were not there for me when I was depressed; you neglected and left me lonely.

5) You listen to wrong people and forums; and make wrong decision; you should not have contacted the wife and our friend regarding this matter as its private and we should have dealt with it ourselves.

6) You do not have social skills as I introduce to you all my coworkers and cousins to do activity; We are alone and lonely with you; you do not have any friends.

7) you are Selfish person; you use other people for your gain and do not pay back what you take from them.

8) You do not pay attention to me as you are busy with your phone.

9) I will leave with our son if you reveal this information to the outsiders.

10) I am not guilty and did not do anything wrong; We are in this position because of your insecurity and fear of losing me.

11) I have nothing to leave for in this life.

12) I feel nothing for you and I do not have any romantic feelings toward you.

13) Stopping contact with cousin will not improve our Connection; I will try to improve our connection if you talk to him.

14) I can make connection to anyone as we live in the free country; you can not force me to stop seeing my friend.

15) I am just a friend to this cousin and you do not understand our relation; I am not having an affair with this cousin.

Talk to her again, and tell her your wife is waiting for OM to leave her. Convince her that this is a serious affair. From what you've written, I'm not sure that you've done this.

"Leaking" to an important source in her family who "leaked" the information to her parents IS NOT EXPOSING TO HER PARENTS!

Have you read the Exposure 101 thread yet? Did you read anything in it that sounded like "leaking" followed by someone else "leaking"? I am quite sure you didn't. Why are you resisting doing this properly yourself to her family?

Concentrate on breaking up the affair. If you do not break it up, you cannot save your marriage no matter how much you reverse the things in this list. And as I said before, you cannot let her threat of taking the child stop you from exposing.

When the crap hits the fan when proper exposure is done, you can tell her that you are sorry for neglecting her, for not recognising her depression and for all the other legitimate complaints (i.e.you will ignore the one about taking the child if you expose and the one about contacting the wife). You can't give her back the 10 years she feels were wasted but you will give her a fulfilling marriage from the day the affair ends until death parts you, with attention, affection, recreational companionship, romance, and no phone and no selfishness.

The way for you to learn how to do those things and to behave in a marriage in a way that would make any wife happy is to learn the Marriage Builders programme and practice it in your marriage. Start by reading Dr Harley's free materials on this site.

Hello there Sugarcane;
Can you give feedback on how to respond to her love Busters tactics..

1) she randomly contacts cousins wife about sale going on; and i am like why?

2) she wants me to meet the cousin, yet she will decide when i am ready to meet him; she says I have hurt him dearly by my actions.

3) anything good abput baby like being smart and interative is because of the cousin genes and not our upbringing.

4) showing cousin pictures to my son and telling him thats Pappa.

5) she says we can only improve marriage if we meet the cousin and clear the misunderstanding.

6) keeps checking cousin whatsup status and keeps telling me stuff he is doing.

7) tells me she is in Trauma since from Dday and keeps having triggers related to that and its all my fault.

8) keeps saying that she will not end relation with cousin

9) she said she is in love with two men in her life and she fell in love with him by chance.

10) she keeps going to fun events with her job friends leaving me alone home with baby.

I answered this in my last post.

Bust up the affair by doing a proper exposure

Broken record.

Instead of posting these needless distractions, could you read and take the advice? You are letting your wayward wife drive the car and she is careening off the road. Please stop focusing on this nonsense and focus on the PLAN we have given you to save your marriage.

Canadien74, you are being told to expose the affair properly following the guidelines. Everyone needs to hear the exposure directly from you. It is pretty clear that you did not do proper exposure. You exposed your own way which was not even professional.

Action 1: do the exposure to everyone even to the ones you say you exposed to. You need a fresh exposure. Start again using Exposure 101 guidelines.
Action 2: answer all the questions asked in this thread one by one, please.
Action 3: follow the plan
Action 4: do action 1. You need to get this done and you will be surprised by the effectiveness of it.
Stop posting what you are posting and concentrate on exposing. Do not be afraid no matter what.

BTW, you are even lucky that your community frowns adultery.

Now, your next post to the team here should be your exposure plan(what steps you will taking such as --
Step 1 compiling the list to expose to...
Step 2. I will expose to .........say the relationship
Step 3 by Facebook, email, Whats App
Step 4. where(cafe, library..) and when(tomorrow, tonight, when she doing this and that..)
Step 5 and more.
You will get feedback very quickly and you then expose

Also write the two letters of exposure and post them here to get feedback since your situation needs special; contentt(son/sperm, ;paternity test part, etc.)

The feedback you will get will be critical. for example you may have left out certain people on your list.

FYI, what you call third party(cousin) is called OM(Other Man), his wife OMW, your WW(Wayward) and you are called BS(Betrayed Spouse). Memorize them start using them in your writing here.

Hello there WierdSituation;
The Person who leaked the information to her parents is very important family member from her side; he is like a big brother to her; and only person from her family living close to Us in Canada; and that cousin is also related to OM; He knows the OM family more than us and was concerned and disturbed by what happened; I told him at that time that I would have to do Paternity test and possibly seek lawyer help if required and Played the VAR recording to him; His advice was to have a talk with OM and tell him to stay away from my wife even punch him to the face if required; Issue for me is If my wife finds out about this than she will have complete breakdown as her parents have not given her information on where the leak came from.

My wife suspects that this information was leaked by OMW; she will decide what day and time to talk to OM and OMW regarding this matter and why they decided to leak the information to her parents and I know this is gonna go really bad fast.

This cousin is very important member of her family; Yet, he was concerned about our marriage and he said he feels shame and guilty for what has happened and supports me even if he is from her family; He said he had responsibility to take action and this he probably did by contacting her parents.

Right Now, her father is really ill and not feeling well in India so I could not talk further with them as I am waiting for them to get healthy to start a dialogue regarding this matter.

How would you guys deal with this matter?

EXPOSE THE AFFAIR. Don't WAIT. Don't tell your wife you are going to do this beforehand. Go to the link in my signature and read the step by step instructions. Get this done!

The punching part is very tempting when someone is in your situation. Here is why you should not do it as much as it can be tempting. He or she will get you arrested and your life will go downhill from there on and may never get back on track.. getting you arresting is a way of getting rid of you. They will have plenty of time together while you are in prison. They may even get a restraining order against you - even worse a permanent one or even for you not to see or interact with the child. Punching can leave a mark, break a tooth and this is all evidence that will be used against you. Do you see how bad this can be? This will be a consequence of you taking advice from people who are not professional about marriage. As much as you have respect for this big brother he is not an expert in this field. This is the reason you should take advice from here. Know that Dr, Harley has been practicing this and saving thousands of marriages since 1968. Punching may help and one can get away with this in otter countries but you may not get away with it in Canada. She may even file in court saying you are a domestic violent person. Remember as enticing as it can be to be violent, punching leaves only physical pain. Physical pain dissipates very quickly. Psychological pain is effective. See how painful you feel from their actions. One of the reason you need exposure - for you to heal and for them to realize psychologically that they should stop, etc.

Big brother's exposure is not going to get anyway. It was not effective. As you can see OM and WW are having "fun". There is a lot that is being hidden here and I am sure you know that hiding things is a recipe for life disaster. Also keep in mind that you would want to have your own children one day. Keep in mind that if you do not expose everyone around you will know only lies. Same with your future children and wife if that happens, etc. Your history will be written incorrectly and that history will last for generations and forever. Also know that her children and your children will be prone to affairs if you do not expose.

Expose!
You are wasting valuable time. It needs to be done right away. Wasting a minute is bad news. You also that now she is guessing OMW did leak and you are saying it will go bad very fast. It sounds like you are putting OMW in danger by not exposing

Expose! This cousing is not an important in her family anymore considering what he has done. He is the most evil member in her family. Exposure can help recover the marriage if you want. You need more supporters. More people should feel like what he is feeling and the pressure will be on. Never underestimate the power of exposure.

It matters not. Her father may die without knowing this. You will never leave a comfortable life knowing that you had the chance to tell him and he died thinking this child is your child. Do you see what you are doing? Do you see all the bad things of not exposing? I really hope you do. He may even tell/call her to stop this affair or complain while he is sick. That will have an impact. Also do not wait for him to recover to expose. The reason to wait here is wrong. There is no perfect timing for exposure, It has to be done right away... as Dr. Harley says. The grandparents of my WW died without knowing of her affair and that it led to divorce. It pains to death even though my situation is different/"special". Now WW's father may even die anytime without knowing.the affair and this I do not want it to happen. I would not want anyone to experience this. I am following the guidance from MB(here and Dr. Harley) and sticking to it. No need to read my story now. Read it after you expose yours. I just wanted to highlight this to you.

Expose now!

Just popping in as a newbie here. I exposed his affair far and wide, to his business colleagues, his friends, his family and the affair ladies workplace. The affair ended that day. My BF has not mentioned the OW (other woman). Scary to do but the dirty little secret needs to be exposed.

Hello there Guys;
This is difficult but I also want to own up to my role in creating this whole mess; As it was my motivation to look outward for positive experience as my Parents have very conservative lifestyle that did not gel with how we wanted to Travel and experience positive experiences with other people.

It was me who first took my wife to see the cousin who we confided in regarding our Toxic home environment and how my wife feels bogged down by my nagging mother and unappreciative family. We both opened up to stranger about our domestic family related issues and allowed him a chance to sooth and bring positive experience for two of us. I can not deny that was one of my emotional need to be actively involved with family doing Vacation, Christmas and playing games with kids; This was my expectation and along the way my wife thought that only he could provide the place for us to be happy. He assured me that he would find a way to make her happy whenever I talked to him and I took it as a good gesture from family friend.

He guided us through our toughest time and challenge when she was having hard time getting pregnant; and he took on a role to be supportive and positive influence and make us feel happy along the way; I just contemplate what I could have do to not get the situation in such a dire position and put my own family in such an uncomfortable situation.

Do you guys have any feedback regarding this and owning up to my own shortcoming; has anyone come across such a family related scenario; and how do you not feel guilty from all this?

I am trying my best to be supportive to my wife and to take care of my responsibility; Yet, still my wife asks me if I have the stamina and patience to do what he was able to do and deliver us to that happy place again without help from another.

This is an unusual approach to take, without a doubt. It's almost as if you pimped your wife out.

Didn't it strike you as unorthodox to hand your wife's happiness over for another man to provide?

Hey SugarCane;
Thanks for your feedback; As for the meetings; we were all three of us meeting together for the first two years; We would meet in his minivan and simply talk about day to day stuff and how we would tackle family related issues, we would plan the vacations and other fun stuff we wanted to do as well; I wanted him to bring his wife too at this meetings but she was always busy taking care of children or house chores at the time it seemed; He said she was not a fan of meeting up to discuss stuff.

Yet, after I made a no contact rule in August last year when I saw that I was losing my wife as he was starting to call and talk to her late in the night; they ditched me and started meeting alone after that; My wife started making an excuse to come pick me up from work but would go see him before picking me up and lied when I put GPS to track her movements.

My intention was not to give my wife to away to him; and I was doing all this because my wife was enjoying this family and she was saying how much light and stress-free she feels around them. Smile from her made me feel like I was doing the right thing; Yet, all this good deed and support backfired because he was responsible for all these good experiences according to her and I was using him to fulfill my responsibility.

What would you guys advice in such situation?

Handing your wife over to another man is not a "good deed," it was a desrtuctive, uncaring thing to do to your marriage. Allowing your wife to carry on with another man demonstrates complacence and a lack of care. What if your wife had a "good experience" shooting up heroin? Would you let her destroy herself because it made her happy in the moment?


We would not have wrecked our marriage by encouraging marriage wrecking behavior.

There's something very odd about the way you see your original interactions with this man as normal.

People have friendly or close family relationships all the time. For me, my very best fun is spent with my husband's very large family. They have been wonderful to me and my kids, and a get-together with any branch of the family, or all branches at once (such as at a wedding) is hilarious and very warm.

But this:

...taking your wife to see your cousin for advice, as if he was some kind of guru (which he so wasn't, as things turned out); talking to him - when it's obvious you had not been close to him before - about your wife's unhappiness and seeking his help; his "guiding you through your toughest time"; his taking on role "to be a supportive and positive influence"; having meetings in his minivan - what kind of get-together is that? It's totally bizarre; getting him to help you plan your holidays...

...This is beyond my experience, and, as I said, totally bizarre. And then when your wife cannot get pregnant, he provides her with a child.

The whole relationship was bizarre from the word go, and the way you are trying to deal with it today is, frankly, bonkers. And when you write to us, you do not listen to what we say, but talk round and round in circles about your wife's attitude towards you, missing the fact of how freakish this all is.

I can only advise you to write to Dr Harley about this, because nothing we say is having any effect.

So you found a cousin that for someone reason you saw as some kind of marriage whisperer, and you set up meetings which took place without his wife, in his minivan, at which you discussed the issues your wife was having with her unhappy marriage, overbearing mother-in-law and uninvolved husband (i.e. YOU).

He calmed you and reassured you that he would make your wife happy. He talked with you both about her problems. And when it came to the problem of her not being able to get pregnant, he helped her out, as he promised you he would do, and gave her a baby.

I cannot get my head around your approach at all. Explain to me again why you thought involving this near-stranger in your marriage was a good idea.

Hello there SugarCane;
The portrayal that he was a good advisor and mentor came from my wife; She said meeting him and doing activity with his family is what give her peace and happiness; she grew distant and started hating other cousins and my own family along the way; He was taking out everybody from her life until I was the Only one left in the end; and until that time my wife assured me that we are doing good and she is so happy that we are spending time with his family until time to throw me came around and that's when I realized the whole mess I got myself into.

They both manipulated me into joining activity and meetings with them because I was a good insurance incase someone asked or doubted their relation; She used me as a shield to protect her as she was able to freely ably to talk to him without restrictions and being close family member I though why not and he portrayed a very family oriented character.

Should I have been more manly and control their interaction from get go three years ago? Would you say no to friendship if your spouse is eagerly enthusiastic about it? How would one know the danger of starting a new relation and where it will end up?

So it was in fact your wife that started the relationship where he became your guru?

We had been living where this cousin lives for the last 10 years; Yet, somehow he randomly popped into our life 3 years ago; My wife thought he was narssistyic and kept her distance up to that point.

He became the Idolized version of what husband she wanted to see as he was working as a Manager and owned two houses, and a great womanizer with great sports accolades as he was a captain of the cricket team; where all the woman flocked to him; He kept making remarks that my wife had to share every detail of her life and should not get involved with others if she wanted to keep him as a friend.

He would visit and be with us everywhere we went weather it be going to Doctor or to the Movies; they were making plans to meet every weekend and I was visiting his house to play games and pass fun time. I would make plans with other cousins or my family but my wife would start getting negative about it and would again bring him in the picture and make more plans to do activity with him.

If My wife is enthusiastic about certain things she likes to do and enjoy what is the best way to handle such scenarios? even now my wife keeps saying that we will be much happier place if we clear up the misunderstanding with this cousin.

No, that's not how it happened. Here's what happened:

Your wife brought him into your lives because she was having an affair with him. She convinced you that he would be a good friend and she had her affair right in front of your face. They had a baby together, and now she wants you to "clear up the misunderstanding" and talk to him again so that she can see him more easily.

He went with you to the doctor's?

Is this story a joke? You can tell me. I enjoy jokes.

canadien74, the team here trying to help and you are not heading its advice.
Why are you doing this?
Can you answer the following questions?
Why are you not exposing?
What is stopping you?

Days have passed.

Do you realize that you have not taken a single action so far? know that WW and OM are planning and acting as you sleep. It has happened before and you are allowing it to happen. Do you want to hear that they are moving to another country, city, neighborhood, he is divorcing OMW, she has taken all the money in the bank or any other thing they have in mind. Know that this is a serious case and they are planning as you blog. Be proactive and you will destroy their plans.

What action have you done so far? Your next action is exposing. All other action comes after that. The team here will guide you and support with anything with exposure and after you have exposed. You will not be alone.

Do you realize that all you are doing is not effective / have done has not been effective?
Do you realize you are blogging(going around and around? This is not going to lead you anywhere.
What you did (aka as you put it owning up to your own role) is not equal to not exposing.

Every BS has to expose no matter what they have done in the marriage even if they have had an affair also.
Dr. Harley has dealt with marriage saving and affairs globally including Indian cultures too.

Hello there guys;
So I finally exposed the affair to my wife parents in India;

Her mom warned me about the cousin when she visited us last year for six months, as my wife was always on call with him.
Her mom is saying that father has big influence on my wife she will leave it up to him to fix the situation; as I said previously we come from very traditional and conservative family; so its catching all by surprised.

I feel a lot of angerness toward my cousin and how he could play such a crucial part in this betrayal; this was the most important person I put my faith on and they have shaken my inner being.

How do I get over the thought of them having sex and god knows how long; how do you guys find courage to recovery if mind is stuck on betrayal and shock from it all? She just keeps mentioning that she did this out of desperation as there was immence pressure for her to get pregnant as my sister in law was pregnant with my younger brother who were living with us.

We are both trying to make things better and the OM is no longer part of our conversation; yet, I have triggers that flates up constantly.

How long does it take for triggers to subside; the whole thing constantly keeps replaying in my head and keeps me on the edge and doubt.

Has she admitted that she had an affair with him, and that the "sperm donor" story was a lie?

How is he now out of your lives? Two weeks ago your wife was saying that she wanted to keep him as a friend, and that you are misreading the situation. She threatened to leave with the baby if you talked about this to anyone. How did you move from that to being ready for recovery?

How far from you does he live? How do you know your wife is not still seeing or talking to him? How can you ensure that you will never cross paths with him again?

Does his wife know yet that there was an affair and the baby is his?

Hello there Sugarcane;
Until they decided to betray me all my actions were the manifestatin of my faith and trust in my wife.

I have now set the boundaries to protect my marriage; its no longer about who is nice to me. I will only move forward with relations that value our marriage and are there to help us to connect with each other.

Every relation in our life has certain quality and purpose; my intention or action were never wrong; I only though about giving best possible way for my wife to be happy.

The ineractilns they were able to create between each other was because I did not object, the christmas party, vacations together and the long calls between them are no longer in the card; as you can see the honeymoon phase of that relation has passed.

The other part was the secret regarding my son for which they no longer hold power over me as I know now and there is nothing they can say or do that will convince me to bring that fake friendship back into my life.

The biggest thing is that I no longer feel shame in my actions; I did nothing wrong and I will not be held resposible for their betrayal; I will hold my wife accountable for every action she takes moving forward in our life.

Do you know for sure if she isn’t talking with him anymore? Do you have spyware on her devices to confirm there is no contact?

Did she write a NC letter?

I'm not sure if your reply was intended to answer my questions. Could you try again, please, answering each one in turn?

Congratulations for exposing the affair to her parents. Hearing that her mom warned you about the cousin... It is just amazing how people around us can see what we cannot see. Coming from her mom... This is serious. It is interesting that you come from a conservative family and she said that. This is even a good reason to expose the affair far and wide.

I am a little confused about your exposure though. Somehow it does not seem to have been done well. The team here is a very experienced team with great success rate. It can help you navigate this. You will need to be truthful, upfront and forthcoming in devulging information to the team for you to succeed. As you can see the team is trying hard to get information from you to help. It is like trying to milk a bear.

Trust that the team here is better than anyone in your life about these matters.

I would advice you to take some private time and read through your post objectively. This will help you see your thinking that will then help you move the thread to productive. Now you would want answer all the questions you dodged or did not answer. Quote each question and then answer.

Can you list the people you have exposed to?
Whom have you not exposed to?
Whom do you not want to expose to?
Did you follow the exposure guidelines?

When someone replies on this thread take time to understand and answer the asked question or address what they are saying. It is hard because the affair shock has a grip on your whole physiology, chemistry biochemistry, anatomy, etc. but you have to force yourself to focus.

Do not take this in a bad way. I am just trying to help you succeed in your life just like everyone here is trying to also.

You will need to answer like this...


Yes she did admit the affair (Describe in detail how it happened.) We were walking and we .. and she ... then,.. The sperm donor story is true. Explain why you say it is true.

Or
No she did not admit the affair. The sperm donor story is true.....( if it is not true say so.


(answer to best of your knowledge. If you do not know say you do not know and ask, "How can I do it?"). If you do no wa t to answer explain in why. But do do be silent by not answering the question. It is extremely rude and disrespectful to people who are truly wanting to help you. They are putting a good amount of time to help you. Hours. .. and this is beneficial to you that they are doing this in this hardest time of your life. Yes, hardest.


(Same thing here)


(Same thing here)


(Same thing here)


(Same thing here)


(Same thing here)

Just focus and you will be better. Every step you take is progress.

Here you should say how you did it. These are important details because they will reveal what you did wrong and what you did right. It goes like this... I exposed to WW's parents by calling/emailing them and I said this and that. I used the exposure letter. I asked them to... ...How they reacted. How you felt. Whether you should have done differently.

Then the team here can guide you to do this and that. This is how you get value and then act strategically to end the affair, get rid off OM, heal, recover your marriage ( remember you do not want a false recovery. You will be surprised to see them together 1 year from now.

All you are asking here can only be answered or happen if you work with the team here. The actions and recommendations theyvwill give you will help you deal with all this. For example if you say OM is still living with us/in same building then the recommendation would be something close to he has to move away or you have to move away. They will guide on how to do it with all tactics.

Stay at it Canadien! We will be supporting you here and make you do the best things. Good luck. Keep being proactive and take a lead.

Warm wishes. I feel for you.

Can you list the people you have exposed to?
The full extent of affair with BABY information is released to my parents, my Brother and her parents along with her (Male) best friend prior to all this; I have asked that I will handle the matter myself.

Just the Emotional affair details was released to OMW and my wife cousin brother; I did not do the Paternity Test at that time; I did tell OMW and the Cousin that I was motivated to find the extent of the relation by doing the DNA test; Yet, I have cut contact with both OM and OMW after March.


Whom have you not exposed to?
There are other Cousins from my side and Her side that I have not exposed to; I still need help in this regard because of other young children in our family, and he is part of our extended family.

Whom do you not want to expose to?
I do not want to involved my Extended family as they add very little value to our marriage and they are good at gossiping and are not pro marriage after infedility; We do not have serious relation with this extended family its mostly superficial and materialistic relation as they are only concerned about my job stability and if we are doing good with our life.


Did you follow the exposure guidelines?
I started this unknown path in November Last year when I went for Marriage counselling due to deteriorating marriage situation; I joined the forum Surviving infidelity in December and initially got tips to uncover the affair using VAR( Voice activated Recorder); I shared with my wife the Link to the Forum that identified possible secret Physical affair and to do DNA test; My wife and the OM became extra careful and not taking me on their meeting from this period on. My wife became violent and suicidal when I contacted OMW about their secret meeting and about my concern for how close they were getting; She said that I was torturing her by asking her to stop contact with him and I broke the code of trust by contacting OMW.

She seem to know that something was going on between two of them for the last two years, as she saw special connection when we went to Club two years ago and she saw them glued to each other on the dance floor; but she was insistent that they were just friends and asked me to only let her know if I get a proof if they had sex. It seems like she kept warning me occasionally, but her husband is not at fault according to her and its the women who leads men in that direction; it seemed like men have right to do as they please according to her.

OMW was unwilling to put VAR on his car where all the action was happening, she said he would throw her out of house if he ever found out that she tried to Spy on him; So, I had to be proactive and I put VAR in my Car.

I was initially using my Garmin GPS as a location tracker; The Tracker showed that my wife was meeting OM before picking me up from work, and meeting him outside his work place after work; They denied that this meetings took place and said I was insecure and paranoid about the situation.

I than had to move on to VAR recording that I put in my Car to find the Concrete proof without ifs and but from their side.

VAR Uncovered few things I was unaware of:
They were scouting new place to meet after work as I was aware of previous location close to home where they were meeting; They were gone meet before and after work and change timing, so it would be hard for me to figure out.

My wife denied meeting him after "NC" condition was set in February but VAR uncovered first contact after two weeks and my wife it seemed became desperate to meet him; She went outside his home and made a call and started asking for his commitment and why he forgot all the promises he made to her and how he could abandon her like that; Their meeting started back again at that time.

During VAR recording My wife also talked about the great experiences he has given her and how nobody has done such things for her; she says that his words and guidance is the most important thing in this life; and no one else is as important as him.

On March 16 I asked OM Mom and wife to be present while I opened up the VAR Recordings; my wife accused me of abandoning her emotionally; My Brother asked them to breakoff contact and would report to our social circle if they start to talk again; His mom and wife are very proud of OM and accuse me losing my wife to him; his wife is proud that her man is able to fulfill my wife emotional needs and he is really good at this and I should learn some stuff from him.

On March 29th I do my Paternity test and confirm that this is his child that I am raising and my wife confesses that she was meeting him because she was scared about how they would handle the situation if I ever found out.

June she provides the Sperm Donor Form saying that she has voice recording where he is confirming that he had done a sperm donation to consume a baby and he has no legal; right over the baby.


Situation:
The affair thrived in secrecy as they both had a baby without my knowledge; A secret that thrived for 2 years without my consent that made her make choices that would leave me out side my own marriage while he was infiltrating it.

Issue:
They have taken a position that he is a Sperm Donor and nothing more; We have No contact policy since March; I want him out of my life completely;

They are prying on my compassion and if people know he is the father than he will want to start getting in contact with my Baby and my wife out of his Love; My objective is to use their own tactics against them and keep him away from both my son and wife by going with the Sperm Donation Theory and there is no need to keep contact.

How do you guys Propose I move from this point on? I already exposed to most important people in our life and we have no contact with OM and I want to keep it like that; she is recently trying to work on marriage recovery and focusing on US.

Canadien, we keep telling you that there was no 'emotional affair'. Not sure whether you have taken this on board. Your wife had a full blown sexual affair with OM and they concocted this story to cover up the pregnancy. OMW is your best ally. You need to tell her exactly what happened. Of course OM needs to be completely out of your life, OMW will help with that.

Your family also needs the full truth, your son will also need to know when he is a little older. As the person who brought him up he is always going to see you as his father but he does need to know that he has a birth father too. He is going to find out and it is far better that this come from you. Yes some of your family may want to reject your wife but be very clear; you want their help in saving your marriage. If yours is a conservative family, they will see that it is their duty to help with this.

Hey there living_well;
Yes, I already know that this was a Physical affair; She admits this by not providing the proof from Laboratory for supposed sperm donation;
My immediate family and her family has been directed to this information already;

I am talking to her parents right now over the phone and laying down details on what, when, where and how this whole thing unravel in front of my eyes; her parents were visiting us for six month from India when She fell in "love" with the cousin; So, my wife parents Now understand the context of what happened and why the cousin was involved with us on so many activities and why my wife was constantly on call with him.

The Issue now is the moving forward as my wife is clearly trying to work on Marriage Recovery and the OM is out of the Picture as I have not talked to him since March; In part of our religion folklore a King asks his wife to walk through fire to prove her purity after she is abducted by another king and rescued later; How would that play in todays context.

The affair went as far as it had out of fear; She made a terrible choices and OM took advantage of the situation; they both continued to go on an infidelity's path until it was too late to come back; My wife said that she really wanted OM to be the father if we could not conceive and she went and completed that resolution; The secret in it self allowed her to get eaten up by the OM stories and fell into limerence with him.

The OM wants entry back into our life; Yet, I will have none of that nonsense to mislead me again; I have learned my lesson and now is the time to apply without giving him chance to get back into my life.

My wife's mother is cautioning me against opening the details to other cousin as this could have psychological affect on my wife; they are scared for her safety because she has suicidal tendency; and we do not know how to get through this without triggering her;

Her mother is assuring me that this issue will be dealt with and they will get to the bottom of what transpired and why the betrayal took place and ask her about my Son and why it happened like that; They say they will support me no matter what and try to get things right.

Canadien, YOU need to be the one who does the exposure. You do not want to trust anyone else to do this. Your wife has already shown herself to be ready to spin herself as a victim rather than telling the truth which is that she was a willing partner. Her mother is likely to do the same.

Eliminate love-busters in your marriage and focus on your wife's top emotional needs to restore romance to your marriage. That is by far the best way to protect your wife's mental health. We can help you with this.

Hey there living_well;
Thanks for your feedback; My wife it seems is exhausted from long working hours and walking constantly on the Job and cooking after work as my mom is doing a baby sitting for two babies in our house; We live in a joint family, and my sister in law is not good at cooking; So my wife ends up getting exhausted from cooking. I try to watch over my son and help out cleaning after I come from work and I also do Grocery shopping to help ease on the work; Yet, She keeps blaming me for my easy working hours, but is this my fault for getting a job with good hours and less demanding physically?

Yet, She gets triggered very strongly when I ask that we need to spend time together; She becomes defensive about baby and how she wants to be with Baby when she is home. How do I go into Dr. Harley teaching when she does not want to hear any books telling her what to do; She says that you learn by doing and not listening to audio books.

This is what started the her emotional affair with my cousin; as my wife was getting exhausted from work; so, she started meeting him before and after work and they would simply talk for 2 hours, and I would be waiting home with the baby; that's why I am telling her about why she can not do that with me; That's what I am trying to resolve right now.

This will end once she falls back in love with you. Address her complaints - we call them love busters. If you sit down in front of the television when you get home leaving your wife to cook dinner for 6 people every night after a full day of work, she will never fall back in love with you. If the others in the household are taking advantage of her, protect her. SIL can learn to cook (as can you).


That is because she has not yet fallen back in love with you.


Educating your spouse is very disrespectful. However, there is nothing to stop you from using the tools yourself. Listen to her complaints and address them. Work out what are her 3 most important emotional needs and meet them. Most women have affection and intimate conversation close to the top so listen to her with your full attention when she is talking to you. That is how OM won her heart.


THERE WAS NO EMOTIONAL AFFAIR she had a bog standard sexual affair right under your nose. If you think affairs start because someone is exhausted from work, I have a bridge I can sell you. She found 2 hours every night to talk to him, she can do the same with you if she wants to. Start working on it.

Hello there Living_Well;
I am listening to her complaints and she is saying that I am now doing all the things she wanted to see me do from the beginning, she is seeing a great positive change in my action and how much attention I give her; Yet, on other instance she makes a remark about how I have changed so much that I have become more controlling by asking her to stop going to party and other fun events with her Work colleagues. She says that she has extraverted personality and she should be allowed to have fun with her friends from work.

Another, quirk is the OM family became a safe heaven place for her where we celebrated Christmas, and other social events and went on vacation with them; She does not get along with may parents and brother family; She says you should have a good company when you go on a vacation and I have taken that away from her; How would you guys fulfill this requirement?

I have lots of things that I need to discuss regarding the affair; Yet, She gets triggered every time and we lose focus on healing and start hurting each other by the words; How do I convey my feelings and what and how we can avoid certain things that made it possible for her to pursue another men?

She had her most important needs of belonging and acceptance fulfilled by the OM; How do I make her understand that I am not her enemy and I only have good intentions for her? She says that I judge her when she is talking and go into problem solving mode while I should be listening. How do you not convey your feelings and message when in a dialogue without inconceivably hurting her.

That is very worrying. She wants to go out to parties without you? Neither of you should be spending recreational time apart, that is how affairs happen. You are perfectly entitled to ask her not to do this, you should never do this either. If she wants to party and have fun, make this happen but do it together. Invite friends over.


Hang on, you are in a joint family but she does not get on with them? That is a problem. You will have to move out unless they treat her better. This is your family and it is your job to make sure they behave respectfully towards her. If your beloved is not happy, you will have to get your own place.


Dr Harley says you must have one honest conversation where your questions are answered and then never discuss the affair again. Of course she gets triggered, you do too. That is why it must only happen once.

Affair proofing a marriage can be done if you are both open and transparent which means both of you have full access to each other's devices and you avoid spending recreational time apart. You will need to install spyware on her phone without her knowledge. Be sure to make sure this transparency works 100% both ways.


This is very valuable, it is exactly the kind of complaint you need. I hope you thanked her. If she says that she feels you judge her when she is talking then immediately apologise and STOP DOING THAT. If she says you should be listening START LISTENING. This is not the time for you to convey your feelings, it is the moment to listen to her feelings.

Don't feel bad, most men fail to understand when they need to listen and think they are being asked to solve a problem. She is talking through a problem both to release the emotion and to work through the problem. She needs your undivided attention not your problem solving skills.

This was something she started doing last month where she went on a camping Trip; She was blackmailing me at the time by saying that she will only join to come to beach with her cousins if I let her go to this camping trip with her work colleagues; I went to pick her up and stayed next night at that camp because of heavy rain; it was in a rural area and guys were getting wasted drinking Boos, At least I got to see what was happening back there and confidently say that this has got to stop.

Next time a colleague was leaving a Job; She asked two weeks in advance if I accompany her to restaurant with my baby and wait in a car while she has dinner with them; I said Yes, I have no problem if this dinner with work Colleagues makes her happy; a day before the Dinner her story changes and now they want to have house party where they will be dancing and getting Drunk; I had to put my foot down again and say no you can not go. She said they will think I am insecure and they will judge her too.

This are the instances she is telling me to stay like I was before; She is saying that she liked the way I was before I got insecure about OM; She is asking me to trust her judgement.


My Mom is babysitting my Son as he is just 20 months old and we are saving a lot of money staying together to buy our own separate house; If we leave now, than we get nothing as my brother wants to wait two years before selling our house, and we need the money from Sale to buy another house separately.




She still has not admitted about having Sex; She keeps saying it was Sperm donation and she has Video recording and Sperm donation as proof but goes quiet completely when I ask for Laboratory result or Contact information to verify the Sperm Donation.



Affair proofing a marriage can be done if you are both open and transparent which means both of you have full access to each other's devices and you avoid spending recreational time apart. You will need to install spyware on her phone without her knowledge. Be sure to make sure this transparency works 100% both ways.


My Wife is getting paranoid over my tracking; How can I trust her fully when she gets triggered over this subject? Should I Ask her to do this or make a request?

We keep telling you to the expose the proper way and to the right people, and you being very stubborn by not doing it. It has been many weeks.

Unfortunately you have cherry picked your exposure targets. And the ones you have picked are enablers. Do you think her parents are nit going to enable her just like when she has provided them with a grandchild? The number does not even pass the exposure number threshold to kill the affair and save your marriage. You need to expose far and wide. People will make OM and WW accountable and it makes it impossible for them to hide and carry on the affair, communication, etc. People will help. You cannot do this alone. Remember it did not work when you were alone. Remember your efforts are not going to be fruitful if you do not expose properly.

You have not exoosed to
1. your friends
2. WW's friends - are you telling us she has only one friend and that friend is a cousin?
3OM's friends
your friends
3. WW's aunts and uncles
OM's aunts and uncles
your aunts and uncles
4. relatives of all sides extended it not
5. WW's/OM's/your former high school and college classmates and friends
6. WW's/OM's/your close friends from work
7 all WW's/OM's/your siblings and cousins of both sides
8. any peole you can think of.
9. if you hesitate on exposing to someone it means expose. Your hesitation is telling you it will be effective and you are ignoring that. You can say who you hesitate and folks van tell you whether or not to expose

Therefore write your list here and you will get feedback.

Yes, you need the gossip to happen. The more people who talk about it the better. This is your weapon. You, family and your marriage can survive gossip but cannot survive the affair. Gossip kills an affair. It is actually good if WW and OM get to know that these people know about the affair. Their little value and not pro marriage after infidelity do not count here. Also you never know how many will come to help/support. Remember your expose letter is asking for support and they will hear this. Remember many people will want to tell someone to ditch someone after infertility. They are not exoerts.

You need to expose to the Cousins. Theses are old enough. Right?

How old are the young children?

Canadien74, you have not followed the guidelines. Do you know where they are?

Your reaction is perfectly logical. We are all wired to have affairs if circumstances permit it. In your case you have evidence of a prior affair so all the more reason for you to be vigilant. Insist you have one another's phone/computer passwords. Then slip spyware onto hers without her knowledge so that you can see exactly who she is communicating with and what is exchanged, keystroke loggers are best. I suggest you do this on your own phone/computer first so that you are confident that there are no notifications going out.


You are going to be wiped out by a divorce which is where this goes. You cannot afford not to sort this out. Repair the relationship with your family or rent your own place.


Tell her you know the full story and then drop the subject.


Your wife should not know about your tracking. If she knows, there are too many ways in which she can circumvent it so it becomes totally pointless.

Hello there Everybody;

I am waiting for her father to have a proper conversation with my wife regarding the affair before I can asses on the situation; as she gets triggered each time I ask her questions and I am not able to get a good picture on what happened and how it happened; I will wait 1 week to see what information is revealed from this conversation.


1) She seems to be in withdrawal stage as being affectionate and intimate is her strong Traits; Yet, she seems totally numb and without any feelings even as I kiss her or pamper her; What would make her drop being in Withdrawal?

2) She keeps saying that she is no longer interested in happiness, and her only concern is our baby; She keeps saying that there is nothing to look forward; How do you motivate someone who has given up on life?

3) OM was the Alpha from his Friend group; they were daring him to approach random girls when we went on a beach party; and they were all talking about how they were cheating and having sex with other woman; Is there any value to exposing to OM friends?

4) Yesterday She admitted that she said all those horrible things about me and our marriage because she was triggered and she did not mean any of it; She wants me to become normal again and not hold grudge against her. She said that I am important to her and what I do matters to her; What do you guys think about this?

5) She keeps saying that she is afraid of the "New" me and she wants me to become my old self; At the same time she says that I am doing all the right things now and I no longer neglect her like before. How would you guys respond if she asks that you become like your old self?

Canadien, are you reading anything we are posting to you? Of course she 'gets triggered' - she is still lying to you and does not like it when you try to catch her out. We can see that. What 'information' are you looking for? Just tell her you know the truth, that she had a bog standard sexual affair and THEN DROP THE SUBJECT.


Falling back in love with you is the way she will come out of withdrawal. To get there, you will need to address her top 3 emotional needs and get her out of your toxic current living situation.


She is lying. No woman wants to be married to a doormat.


Good for you, I hope you thanked her for the feedback.

Hello there guys;
Need your assesment on this that Happened in March, my last encounter with the OM.

The thing keep repeating in my mind is, when I played VAR recording in front of OMW and OM mom; they all said that OM understood what my wife required and he provided, and his mom was especially proud of his son and told me to learn from him about how to take care of my wife; and he bragged during the conversation that he keeps his wife happy, the OMW was really quiet during this conversation while I was losing my composer while my brother was trying to keep the conversation civil.

His wife was contacted about possible affair in January yet, she only wanted to know if the sex was involved, somehow emotional affair was not a big deal for her, she even supported their story about being friend on one instance.

In December my wife and OM were saying that someone has put black magic on me and they took our son and me to the vodoo magic specialist too, somehow OM gave contact to my wife and she was visiting this person before.

My wife was saying that she fell in love with him because of how much care and effort he was making in helping us and all the favors he was doing; Yet, all this was possible because I put a trust in him. Does that give him right to take my wife away from me? In most practical sense he has two daughters and a wife; so, why pursue my wife?

I am just trying to put piecies together of what happened and why I became the villain in this story.

You became the villain because you allowed your wife to control the narrative. Exposure has to be done everywhere, only by YOU and with the full truth, not a half baked story about sperm donors.

We are all for saving marriages in the most dire circumstances here, but are you surethis relationship should be saved?
You have not been married very long, your wife has a child with your cousin, she wants to continue marriagewrecking behaviour.
What is there to save? You are not obliged to save this marriage at any cost. You could marry a person that loves you and have children of your own, without a meddling cousin/OM.

Hello guys;
So, I made a request to her father to call my wife and he is assuring me that there is no more contact with the OM after the call, and he has asked her to cut all future contact from OM; Her father asked me to relax and not stress too much, Yet still keep watch out for her behavior and report back if I spot any discrepancy again; and he told me that her mom has a medical condition so do not get her deeper in the situation as she gets tense about these things very much and is not able to handle it very well.

So, Yesterday my wife was asking me about who else I have shared with and how long I have shared this details with and what details have I passed on to them; Her father told her that our whole community knows about the affair she should stop whatever is going on. She warned me to stop sharing this kind of information with our relatives or she will stop working on marriage recovery. I told her that her parents know about this situation for 1 month and they also know about our son; I told her that I did it for her own safety because she was hurting herself and me physically whenever we talk about it; She asked about the details I discussed and I stopped at that moment as I told her that I myself am not sure about the details as things do not add up about Sperm donation Story.

What do you guys think I should do when she gets triggered; I warned her that If I learn of future encounter with the OM again than I will Expose to all our family group. For Now it seems there is no contact with the OM as far as I know and she is working on marriage Recovery and is staying composed; Yet, certain things do not add up and she is not giving out full details.

Is it better to work on marriage recovery or to keep digging for information even if this will trigger me or her?

She says that she will not discuss or cooperate if she does not see progress from my side; How would you react to that?

Canadien; you have been advised to STOP TALKING TO HER ABOUT THE AFFAIR. The only digging you should be doing is via spyware on her phone THAT SHE DOES NOT KNOW ABOUT. My hunch is that the affair is still active especially as she is trying to blackmail you. That is a red flag. Nobody can force you to do a proper exposure and see this fellow off but do not be surprised if one day she simply walks out on you taking her son with her.

Hello there Living_well;
Can you list what motivation OM have for pursuing my Wife? He is a married men with two daughters; Last Year, He kept insisting that he became emotionally detached from his wife, and wanted to reignite that fire in his mariage by doing activity with us; Yet, it only became about him and my wife.

My wife kept insisting that he is a great person and has great understanding of what woman want and need; If true than would it not imply that he would have that much stronger marriage and relation with his own wife?

He was doing all the things highlighted in Plan A; Yet, he was doing it to my wife and not his Own wife; The Question I keep pondering is why you would put so much effort in another person who is not married to you while your marriage is dying.

I have a clear intention to save my marriage and do Recovery work with my wife; So, I will have to put in the work with my wife and get through this together with her; What would I achieve by going to another woman? Is there some core understanding I am missing of why someone would go to another woman?