I have been reading posts all over the place and the more I read the more I get really confused. Please help!!!!!

I had a night and day of crying that made me think that my life and that God had left me. The pity was so heavy that I almost gagged myself.

Today though - I am struggling with is she having an A or not. WW filed D in Sept. WW said did not love me. 2 Days ago she said I am a liar.

Talked with a christian friend of her step-dad. He said WW is the victim. WW scared I am going to hurt her. WW filed Domestic Viloence charges off of angry outbursts between us on 2 different forced outings seeing DD's. WW has everyone thinking I am a violent drug and alcohol addicted bi-polar waste. Did confront her with this OM - she said they are friends and she is going over there for oldest D to play with OM son. Refuses that anything happened. Does not want to seek counseling - wants D. Now talking about mediation. I am confused? Do I try to establish plan A? How? I have called her - she refuses to open up or talk. WW denies anger or bitterness. Yet, she is the one hanging up phones in anger. It almost makes me believe she is on her reading stuff yet I know she could not have come across it. WW cut off all contact with local church, christian friends, own christian father, and is trying to cut off all ties with me and children. I went through 2 weeks of no talking with her - she doesnt seem to care about any of it.

What does a H do when the WW spose filed D? Seeing OM everynight with DD's. (5 1/2 and 3 on Dec. 15th). WW living in 1 room at MI house with the 2 girls. She has used DD's as pawns. Setting up meetings and then cancelling. I need help. I have been reading all that is on the site and find myself lost and adrift. Recently redidcated life to Jesus and I am focusing on Him in changing me for me. At first for her. Reconciliation is my desire yet she won't even consider it. help help help help help.

Posted some on here but I think it is was on the wrong board. Not many answers. Please help!

I have atty - filed for a hearing for visitation. 10 hours since Sept. 12 is not enough.
Wife started back in July to start staying at her mothers every weekend takin the girls from me. So they are use to it now.

Hey Joe,

You have the same name as my XH, and since I was once a very long time ago a WS, I really feel for where you are. I suppose it's the guilt kicking in over time. (I am now a rabidly anti-infidelity specialist, but I know how it feels on the other side)

Here are some things to get you started, ok? First take a deep breath and calm down. This is horrendously ishy stuff, but you won't help any by letting your emotions drag you all over the map.

Here's a link to my infidelity pages. There's a lot of good info right on this page - check out the articles but particularly the list of signs that indicate your spouse might be having an affair.It's about half to two thirds down the page. I'm pretty sure your wife is, but I can't tell from the little info that is here.

Infidelity Page


Then go to the Bookstore Link here and order Surviving an Affair. You'll need it - this will become your guidebook to get through this.

While you are waiting for that to come check out the info on Plans A and B

If you are interested in the what it looks like inside the affair you can read my account of mine here

Then BRIEFLY fill me in.

How long have you been married?
First marriage for both of you?
Kids? Ages? Bio or step?
When did you suspect the A?
What have you done so far?

Hope that helps.....

C

<small>[ November 07, 2003, 01:30 PM: Message edited by: cerri ]</small>

How long have you been married? 6 + years
First marriage for both of you? 1st for both
Kids? 2 daughters --- 5 and almost 3 (Dec. 15) Bio
When did you suspect the A? After she filed divorce - believe that it probably started in July. She has a friend at work, female, it looks like this is her cousin. Not sure if he works there or not. Have never met him.
What have you done so far?
Cried. Cried. Cried. Anger. Anger. Anger. Bitterness. Bitterness. Begged for her to not do through with the divorce...story goes:
I called her immediately and she did not call back. She left me a letter overnight in our mailbox after I was served. She filed a day after I had set up a camcorder to try and catch her in the act or on the phone with a guy. Everyone I was counseling with told me that she was having an affair – nobody that has been around her just by her actions.

She accused me of videotaping her changing – she found the video because I have never been good at deceit or hiding things (Dumb Dumb Dumb) – I eventually told her what I was trying to record and not that. First denied it. That weekend I had a chance to talk with her and she said that she did not love me anymore.

I had a guy from Church that was counseling me and he told me to send her flowers everyday and to write her letters explaining why I was wrong and what I wanted to do to rectify the situation. He encouraged me to stay focused on my relationship with Christ. After a week, of phone messages (I did not know what to do so I overreacted and called her with messages of love and encouragement – you know the crying ones where you swear to be better and want another chance) She eventually told me stop sending her the flowers and letters. I told her I would not and that she would have to accept them. She said that it was ok to drop them off at the counter out front instead of bringing them into her group. I did that the next week and then she called and told me that I was harassing her and that I had to stop sending them. So I sent her more letters and then she said that she meant for me to stop sending anything and to stop calling her. I did.

I kept asking to see the kids and had asked her to reconcile or at least consider a 6 month separation. She told me she would and the condition was on me moving out of the house and she would consider counseling. She wanted to talk with her lawyer but he was out of the country for a 1 week. She asked me to not hire and atty and to wait until he got back. When he did she submitted the next step for the divorce and never asked Atty. I asked her why she did not later and she said because she was not in the right mind when she said she would. After that, she told me that she would let me see the girls.

We did get together at a park – where I did tell her again – I loved her and that I was going to change for her and that I had returned to my relationship with Christ. There were a couple of times we did get together that we got in arguments and verbally yelled at each other – in front of the kids twice. I did hire and Atty who filed the necessary response that was 2 days before the deadline. Since then I have called her and tried to talk about where things are and to ask her why she is doing this and why she wont trust God to restore our marriage. She seems to have cut him completely out of her life. I then decided that after bearing my soul before her in complete honesty that I would not call her anymore – she wanted it that way so I thought why not. Eventually filed for child visitation rights which is pending until Dec. She refused to talk with me and often when we do she just argues with me or gets mad and hangs up the phone. I did call her a couple of nights ago and confronted her with what was going on with this guy – told her what made me believe that she commited an affair – she denied it and told me she does not love me and that I am a liar. I called her another day later to see when I could see the girls and that was mentioned in this post. She got angry and said she is not coming back. She did at one time tell me she is 98% sure that she wants this divorce. I did write a letter telling her that we need to keep the girls best interest at heart and that is where mediation is now in the idea. She wanted this divorce over in 2 months. She has also said she wants the house and will sell in in a year. She doesn’t know what is next after that.

I also called - tonite - her work number and got her co-worker and asked if the OM name worked there. I gave her the option to not tell me.

She said " I dont want to answer that."

My wife has not been wearing her wedding ring for a long long time - makes me think this guy might not know. Of course my thinking is not always correct. Has that happened to anyone?

I just read a post from the MB general near the top from new jersey - it was a letter that was to be sent to a WH. Is this something that is part A? I can se my WW going even more ballistic on me. Of course sometimes I don't think it can get any worse... how does the Law come into all this. She has already screamed harrassment for love letters. I bet you can guess where she is getting all this from.

I'm thinking I want to send flowers again.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Today - got to see my children. Wife and I did not talk and it was a great time. The girls love me so much!

Unfortunately, I found out that she is kissing and hugging this guy in front of my girls. I am upset but when in sin these things happen.

Please help...I need to know if Plan B is for me. I did order the books - don't know when they will make it here.

Hi JoeCM,
I relate to many of your feelings and some of your situation.
Please, don't go down the 'I'm desperate-and will-do-whatever-it-takes-to-get-you-back road'.
Be strong for you, the children & the possible reconciled marriage.
Flowers every day won't change a sinning heart.
Much prayer will. So will you showing the changes of righteosuness and peace that come from growing in love with Jesus daily.

Kids see truth better than we think. Your's will thank you forever if you show them the better way.

It takes a while but healing does come.
I am one year post-separation & feeling more peace, joy, and love than ever, regardless fo what she chooses to do.
This is God's gift. Ask him to give it to you & I'll pray for you too.

I don't know what is going on. One minute I am doing great - next minute you would find me living on the bottom of a garbage can.

I guess I know how she felt in the marraige when I would return to Jesus and then would later fall away and become just as selfish as ever. I regret all the negative love bank withdrawals and have a hard time releasing myself from them. I say I will not dwell on her or what she is doing and yet I find myself thinking again and again! I am a trouble shooter and it is very hard to not solve a problem - of course I do no the solution - Jesus! She needs to return to Him!

Anyways - I just wanted to say thanks for the post - I was beginning to think that I was the only one out on MB site. I am dealing with loneliness and everytime I come on and find no help I think that it must be the way I right or it must be my attitude. She must be right about everything she says about me. I am a man that cannot be loved or love. Is all this normal?

I am getting told that all the stuff that I am trying to do on this site (from friends) is not correct and that it will be against the law. Should I call her boss? Should I confront the WMI about that fact that she is enabling my WW? The fact that she says she is not having an A but she goes there every night a hugging and a kissing! How could her own M not know! And they say they are good catholics - my wife says they are a godly example to the girls! I am so frustrated! I had a wonderful time at Church last night - I had a wonderful time with my girls! Didn't get a bit angry at WW! Even when she sat on the bench with her shaved crotch sticking out! Grrr....ok a little upset... hahahaa

I guess the only thing I can ever do is cry Help!

Joe please follow Cerri's advice for she knows what she speaks of. Right now what you are doing is obviously not working, so it is time to consider doing something else, and if you do what Cerri recommended to you, you will have your best shot at saving your marriage.

Thanks. I have followed so far...once the book get here I will try to take this impatient body of mine to a nice place to read it. Like I said before I have cracked the covers on so many books only to bounce off the walls. Tonite - was the first night that a married couple had me over for dinner! Man is that ever helpful! It helps you feel loved and right now - I don't know what love is! All I want is a hug................is that vulnerable?

((JoeCM))--I can relate to what you are feeling. I tried to give H a hug the other day, and he just froze. Since I've not told anyone about the sitch, there's no one to comfort me but myself and what I read here. Hang in there.

I guess I didnt put briefly. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Ok, so you ordered the book. Did you read all the things I linked for you?

The first thing you need to do is get a handle on your emotions. I know this is probably the most horrifying thing you will ever go through, and most likely all you want to do is crawl in a hole and die. But, generally speaking that's not an option. So, take a deep breath, get calm and then let's get to work.

I need you to check out the love busters links here (while you are waiting for your books to come) and then I want to know which of those things your wife would say you are guilty of.

Love Busters

I want to know what you know about the person you suspect she is having the affair with. Have you talked to him?

Have you told anyone? Family, friends, pastor?

If she says to back off on the flowers then do so. You're just annoying her. Generally you can't meet her intimate EN's at this time, possibly some of the less intimate, but that depends a great deal on being able to control your love busters.

Check out those things. Answer my questions and then we'll talk some more.

In fact, you know what - don't just read the Love Busters section - go to the Basic Concepts

Be strong, you can do this. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

C

Disrepectful Judgments is by far the one that I can see. This problem is one that is evident - I would start talking and she would tell me that I am lecturing her. She hardly ever shared but I can say that I do know that I have cut her off before because I could not wait till she finished to give her an answer. That is so selfish...it is something that I have been working on for years - thought I had gotten it nipped but I can think back and see I did not.
I do not remember yelling at her - angry outbursts - but I do know that I did change my town when I do get mad. She has accused me of being arrogant over and over again. Definately independent behaviour - I got to the point where I would be in bed and just play games on the laptop. Or when she went to bed at night I would stay up and watch movies or play games or watch sports. We would come home from church and I would plop down on the couch. What a jerk I have been.
I always told the truth.....of course that can be as I see it.

The little I have found out about the guy - remember that she denies it still - is that he coaches pee wee football and if I have the right one is 33 04 34. He has a son. That is it.

I have not confronted him because I do not know for sure which one he is. There is a choice between 2 guys. I think she met him through a lady at her workplace.

I do not know her new friends at work. I did not call her boss. I am worried about the legal issues of all this.

Ahhhhhh..... now we're getting somewhere. I would doubt very much that you have been honest, and suspect more that you've done a good job of telling her what you think, what you want, what you're going to/did do, but very little about how you FEEL.

Ok.....now talk to me about your legal worries.

If I contact the guy - she might use it against me as stalking or harrassment. This would apply to anyone I might call. As I mentioned, she has requested a restraining order - which only goes into effect when it is delivered. I am asking for the DD's as Primary residence and so is she. That is when she filed the Domestic Violence reports and had the temp order done. My atty says to not call.

Yes. Emotions are a very difficult thing for me. I struggle with them and for most of my teenage years I was a stoic. I believed that emotions shown are emotions that are used against you. Some of this changed when I became a believer yet in my marriage - I ran and hid at the first step. All the crying has been hard on me but I think I am learning to allow it to cleanse me. Instead of the loud pitiful sobbings I have had. I really miss her and love her and regret so much that I was not there for her. Now she has gone and found herself a man that she seems to believe will take control and be the leader. My desire and prayers are that she will return to Jesus first. If she chooses after that to come to me then I will be a very joyful man. I know that HE can cleanse us and give us the strength to make this marriage work. I am wearing my emotions tonite so I should stop. I might have already shared too much and it wouldn't suprise me to find out that she is on here and has followed the advice her to the point that she has wrote me off...... hahahahaha

Help! Help! Help!

My wife called me this morning and said that she is willing to go through mediation. I told her that I am not sure what I want and that I need to pray about it. She asked what do I hope to gain in the courts and I told her I don't really know. I did tell her that I am not sure what to do because I do not believe she is telling me the truth about the OM. She did not answer on that. I asked how sure she is that she wants this divorce and she said pretty sure. She then told me that she would be willing to try a 6 month seperation. I asked how we would do it and she said she would move back into the house and I would have to move out. I told her that I would rather live in the girls playroom and then see what we can work out. She got mad at that and told me that would be to close.

Help me! I do not trust her or believe her. My thoughts were that she has to break off all relations with this guy, she would need to show me good faith before she moved in by talking with a counselor, she would need to sign something saying that she will not sell the house and would move out at the end of 6 months if she does not want to work on this marriage.......I am worried about doing LB's.

Help!!!!!!!!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

If you are going for custody of the children, then the worse thing you can do is to move out of your home and let her move back in because many courts would consider than abandonment. Respectfully decline her 6 month separation 'offer' which is nothing but a raw deal for you and the kids.

Whoa Joe..... calm down....you're scarin' me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Ok so she really wants to have her cake and eat it too, huh?

My wife called me this morning and said that she is willing to go through mediation.

Mediation for what? For divorce settlement? For seperation agreement? What?


She asked what do I hope to gain in the courts and I told her I don't really know.

You really don't want to get into the legal system, what you want to do is drag your feet and see what happens with the A.


I did tell her that I am not sure what to do because I do not believe she is telling me the truth about the OM.

Ok, there's a differnce between confronting - which is good - and accusing which is not. What you are doing here is accusing her of lying. Now, we all know she very may well be and probably is, but you can't call your wife a liar and hope to save your marriage - it doesn't work that way.

So what you need to do is a couple of things. You need to tell her what you know, how you know it and how you feel about it. I'll bump the list of feelings words for you - print them out and use the format I have in there.

Then you need to tell her how you feel in generaly about this thing she is doing. Not what you think - and certainly not what you think about her and her choices at this time. HOW YOU FEEL. Ok?

I asked how sure she is that she wants this divorce and she said pretty sure.

Alright, next tactical change. Do not ask about the dv. Do not mention the dv. Do not acknowledge that the possbility of dv exists. If she brings it up, tell her that you do not want a dv and that you don't want to talk about it right now. (and the shut your mouth and say no more about it)

You have to think through this unemotionally - if you ask someone if they want something they have indicated that they might want - and that you do not - OF COURSE they need to defend their position and tell you they're pretty sure it's what they want. And in doing that, they solidify that thought in their own minds. When you bring it up and force her to talk to you about it, you are making it more real for her and more likely to happen. Don't go there, it's not in your best interests or that of your family.


She then told me that she would be willing to try a 6 month seperation.

You're already seperated, that's not what she's asking for. What she's asking for is for you to enable her choice to abandon you and the marriage by letting her live with as little disruption as possible.


I asked how we would do it and she said she would move back into the house and I would have to move out.

As our former first lady said - Just Say No. Tell her that doesn't work for you, sorry. If she wants a sep then she needs to stay out of the house.


I told her that I would rather live in the girls playroom and then see what we can work out. She got mad at that and told me that would be to close.


And there is your clue about the A. It is "too close," because she wants to be able to come and go and do her own thing without you A) knowing what she up to - and B) Holding her accountable for her actions.

Once again - just say no. She's welcome to come home and work on the marriage, but you are not leaving. And as CoffeeMan says it's really a poor legal step to take.

I do not trust her or believe her.

Good. At this point you shouldn't.

My thoughts were that she has to break off all relations with this guy, she would need to show me good faith before she moved in by talking with a counselor, she would need to sign something saying that she will not sell the house and would move out at the end of 6 months if she does not want to work on this marriage.......I am worried about doing LB's.


Yes, she needs to verifiably end all contact with OM. She needs to agree to other conditions for recovery and she needs to be willing to make amends to you by working on the marriage.

She can't sell the house unless you agree and I wouldn't even go to the 6 month place. Your position is that you want to save the marriage, you know where to get the tools to do so, and you are determined to be the spouse she needs and wants.

C

It is nice and sunny out today...cold but sunny...

I have been praying over what she said and what I have read. Thank you for your kindness.

I am going to try and get her on the phone today. Going to ask what she means by working on the marriage. After that, I am going to tell her that I need more time to pray. I want to be sure that she doesn't cancel my time with the girls tomorrow. I really cannot stand another moment without seeing them.

I got the books in the mail - finally! I am going to start reading them today. I hope that they do help. SAA........

Telling her how I feel...I am not sure I understand how I feel. I am hurt. I am lost. I am grieving that she has walked away from Jesus. I am hurt that she does not let me see the girls.....so much more crap!